Could we attract aliens by this?

[sjastro]

Most of your mass (and mine) comes from the binding energy of quarks into nucleons. The quark masses are something like 5-10 MeV each out of the 900+ MeV for each nucleon.

When it comes to weight reduction every little bit counts.

 

[Hans Blaster]

When it comes to weight reduction every little bit counts.

Or you could go to a lower gravity environment.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Without the LHC I wouldn't know the mass of the Higgs boson. That impacted the quality of my life to know that the Standard Model works.

All the starving people in Yemen said amen. I don't think.

 

[Shemjaza]

All the starving people in Yemen said amen. I don't think.

Do you have the same complaint for every church and monument to Creationist vanity?

 

[Ophiolite]

All the starving people in Yemen said amen. I don't think.

That is a sick, insincere, dishonest, conceited, irrelevant, ill-conceived response to a post celebrating the ability of humanity to cooperate on huge projects to advance human knowledge. Your reply does nothing to encourage, or develop such cooperation in dealing with global political and cultural conflicts.

 

[Aussie Pete]

That is a sick, insincere, dishonest, conceited, irrelevant, ill-conceived response to a post celebrating the ability of humanity to cooperate on huge projects to advance human knowledge. Your reply does nothing to encourage, or develop such cooperation in dealing with global political and cultural conflicts.

While those scientists work in their ivory towers on projects that are no help to the real problems of mankind, I'll stand by my remarks.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Do you have the same complaint for every church and monument to Creationist vanity?

I do think that way too much money has been spent on building and maintaining church buildings. At least they are something concrete that can be used for other purposes. As for Creation research, something has to be done to counteract the fallacious arguments of those who would relegate the human race to the status of glorified apes. I'd be interested in the relative amounts spent on creation research compared with the LHC and its ilk. And I'd be equally interested in the source of those funds. I doubt that too many governments fund creation research. The same can't be said for the LHC.

 

[Ophiolite]

I do think that way too much money has been spent on building and maintaining church buildings. At least they are something concrete that can be used for other purposes. As for Creation research, something has to be done to counteract the fallacious arguments of those who would relegate the human race to the status of glorified apes. I'd be interested in the relative amounts spent on creation research compared with the LHC and its ilk. And I'd be equally interested in the source of those funds. I doubt that too many governments fund creation research. The same can't be said for the LHC.

On what grounds do you dispute the data presented in post#46 that each Swiss $ invested in the LHC generates $1.8 of societal benefit?

 

[Hans Blaster]

All the starving people in Yemen said amen. I don't think.

Starvation in Yemen is a more recent phenomena than the building of the LHC. If you want to stop killing and suffering in Yemen, then demand that the murderous crown prince of Saudi Arabia stop his war their and that certain governments and government official stop helping him.

[This is a little disorienting as I spent part of yesterday in a conversation with an ultra-libertarian who eschews spending tax money to relieve the sufferings of people apparently because they can't all be relieved, so we shouldn't try.]

 

[Aussie Pete]

On what grounds do you dispute the data presented in post#46 that each Swiss $ invested in the LHC generates $1.8 of societal benefit?

Starvation in Yemen is a more recent phenomena than the building of the LHC. If you want to stop killing and suffering in Yemen, then demand that the murderous crown prince of Saudi Arabia stop his war their and that certain governments and government official stop helping him.

[This is a little disorienting as I spent part of yesterday in a conversation with an ultra-libertarian who eschews spending tax money to relieve the sufferings of people apparently because they can't all be relieved, so we shouldn't try.]

Sure, I think that the Western world's dealings with Saudi Arabia and the other Gulf states are a disgrace. Likewise with China. However, the dollar has always been the priority. South Africa was destroyed as a functional democracy because of apartheid. I'm not defending apartheid, but the evils of Saudi Arabia and China were just as bad if not worse. Where was the world's outrage over Tiananmen Square? A few muted criticisms then business as usual. The reason is obvious. China was worth more monetarily than South Africa.

The main problem with the developing/third world is corruption and war. Solve that and the average man in the street would have a much improved lifestyle. Science has no answer to the problems of the human heart.

 

[Ophiolite]

Sure, I think that the Western world's dealings with Saudi Arabia and the other Gulf states are a disgrace. Likewise with China. However, the dollar has always been the priority. South Africa was destroyed as a functional democracy because of apartheid. I'm not defending apartheid, but the evils of Saudi Arabia and China were just as bad if not worse. Where was the world's outrage over Tiananmen Square? A few muted criticisms then business as usual. The reason is obvious. China was worth more monetarily than South Africa.

The main problem with the developing/third world is corruption and war. Solve that and the average man in the street would have a much improved lifestyle. Science has no answer to the problems of the human heart.

You quoted my question to you in this response yet completely failied to address it. Was my question unclear?

 

[Hans Blaster]

Sure, I think that the Western world's dealings with Saudi Arabia and the other Gulf states are a disgrace. Likewise with China. However, the dollar has always been the priority. South Africa was destroyed as a functional democracy because of apartheid. I'm not defending apartheid, but the evils of Saudi Arabia and China were just as bad if not worse. Where was the world's outrage over Tiananmen Square? A few muted criticisms then business as usual. The reason is obvious. China was worth more monetarily than South Africa.

The main problem with the developing/third world is corruption and war. Solve that and the average man in the street would have a much improved lifestyle. Science has no answer to the problems of the human heart.

This is getting quite serious for an ultimately silly thread.

I largely agree with you, but I think you may have underestimated the reaction to Tiananmen Square in 1989. (Things may have been different in your country being much closer to China.) In North America and Western Europe there was a lot of reaction against China for Tiananmen Square. Trade with China was much lower then and wasn't particularly important. (I would guess, but don't know for sure that US trade with Hong Kong and Taiwan were both larger than with China in 1989.)

After a few years of "international condemnation" the US switched to a policy of "engagement" hoping that bringing China into the international economic sphere would promote better human rights in China. (They were wrong.) So China was given "most favored nation" status and let into the WTO. I want to say this was all around 1994 or so. (It's my contention that the North American Free Trade Agreement [NAFTA] didn't succeed in the way hoped with Mexico because the low-cost "offshore" manufacturing migrated to China from Mexico and this drove economic drivers for migration from Mexico.)

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Well, kinda. We had some things that explained most things, and then we found inexplicable forces making some things not agree with our explanations. We don't like it when the universe disagrees with our explanations, so we called the disagreeable part Dark Matter.

Because Dark Matter Matters, the DMM movement was started and we research it. We tried ignoring it earlier but it picketed our equations and messed the results up. Apparently it demands to be considered and heard!

Like Einstein's cosmological constant, dark matter and dark energy are just what is left over when bad equations based on false assumptions don't add up.

Dark money is everything I don't have in my bank account, that I assumed I would, based on my equations this time last year!

 

[sjastro]

Like Einstein's cosmological constant, dark matter and dark energy are just what is left over when bad equations based on false assumptions don't add up.

 

[The happy Objectivist]

Let`s say you wanted to create some sort of a distortion in nature so it`d spread and eventually hopefully, be picked up by some aliens far away, would a big clock where you set the second-hand in a strange position be enough, so eveytime it moves it creates a strange distortion, would they pick it up eventually with some very sensitive and delicate instruments quicker than the normal method of sending messages?

I don't know but I do know how to chase them away. Just get out a camera. Seriously though, I don't know how setting a clock in a strange position would cause any distortion in reality.

Last night I saw my 19th UFO by the way. Nope didn't get a picture again.

I'd say all the nuclear blasts we set off in the 50s through the 70s would be about the best way.

 

[The happy Objectivist]

Dyson swarms are purely speculative.
How is building from pure speculation, in any way, 'a good idea'?
Get real!

I've always thought the idea of a dyson sphere to be rather rediculous. I would think that a race capable of building one would already have to have the ability to create vast amounts of energy just to mine the raw materials it would require not to mention moving it into place. I think they would have a way better than collecting solar energy. Imagine the amount of mass it would require to actually block the light of a sun enough that someone would notice it. You'd have to dismantle a whole planet like Earth.

 

[Jonathan Walkerin]

I've always thought the idea of a dyson sphere to be rather rediculous. I would think that a race capable of building one would already have to have the ability to create vast amounts of energy just to mine the raw materials it would require not to mention moving it into place. I think they would have a way better than collecting solar energy. Imagine the amount of mass it would require to actually block the light of a sun enough that someone would notice it. You'd have to dismantle a whole planet like Earth.

Nothing says you can’t have habitats on the surface of Dyson sphere.

Although even with automated construction with efficient robots it would probably make way more sense to go for something like Dyson swarm that consists of clouds of platforms orbiting the Sun instead of going for solid sphere.

Still alway funny to imagine the scale of such mega projects.

 

[The happy Objectivist]

Nothing says you can’t have habitats on the surface of Dyson sphere.

Although even with automated construction with efficient robots it would probably make way more sense to go for something like Dyson swarm that consists of clouds of platforms orbiting the Sun instead of going for solid sphere.

Still alway funny to imagine the scale of such mega projects.

Yeah, that makes sense. Ever read Live Free or Die by John Ringo? A guy gets mega-rich selling Maple syrup to aliens and then creates a swarm of mirrors to bounce sunlight around the solar system to create exowatt range beams to mine asteroids and defend against invading aliens. One of my favorite sci-fi books.

 

[Jonathan Walkerin]

Ever read Live Free or Die by John Ringo? A guy gets mega-rich selling Maple syrup to aliens and then creates a swarm of mirrors to bounce sunlight around the solar system to create exowatt range beams to mine asteroids and defend against invading aliens. One of my favorite sci-fi books.

Sure, Troy and Malta thrashing some Rangora imperial ambitions. What’s not to like.

 

[The happy Objectivist]

Sure, Troy and Malta thrashing some Rangora imperial ambitions. What’s not to like.

He left that series hanging. I wish he would add to it. Cracking mammal.