"Contradictions" with the sovereignty of God?

[Achilles6129]

There are a couple of passages I'd like to look at:

"16 And this woman, a daughter of Abraham as she is, whom Satan has bound for eighteen long years, should she not have been released from this bond on the Sabbath day?”" Lk. 13:16 (NASB)

If God is sovereign over all things, then how could Christ say that Satan has bound her? Was Satan allowed to bind her by God? If so, then wouldn't God be partially to blame? Yet Christ seems to blame the devil. Also, the book of Acts:

"38 [ab]You know of Jesus of Nazareth, how God anointed Him with the Holy Spirit and with power, [ac]and how He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him." Ac. 10:38 (NASB)

Same concept, again. Here's another passage that may also present a "contradiction":

" 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the [c]knowledge of the truth." 1 Tim. 2:4 (NASB)

If God desires all men to be saved, and some are not, then God obviously was not sovereign over them not being saved.

One further "contradiction":

"21 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, “Go down, warn the people, so that they do not break through to the Lord to gaze, and many of them [j]perish. 22 Also let the priests who come near to the Lord consecrate themselves, or else the Lord will break out against them.”" Ex. 19:21-22 (NASB)

God clearly does not want to kill the people, because if he did he could just strike them dead at the foot of the mount. Yet God tells the people not to come up, or else he will kill them. This indicates that if the people do come up, God will have no choice but to kill them. This means that there is something uncontrollable about the nature of God.

What does all of this mean? Thoughts?

 

[Der Alte]

Man has autonomy. We are not robots.

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

There are a couple of passages I'd like to look at:

"16 And this woman, a daughter of Abraham as she is, whom Satan has bound for eighteen long years, should she not have been released from this bond on the Sabbath day?”" Lk. 13:16 (NASB)

If God is sovereign over all things, then how could Christ say that Satan has bound her? Was Satan allowed to bind her by God? If so, then wouldn't God be partially to blame? Yet Christ seems to blame the devil. Also, the book of Acts:

"38 [ab]You know of Jesus of Nazareth, how God anointed Him with the Holy Spirit and with power, [ac]and how He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him." Ac. 10:38 (NASB)

Same concept, again. Here's another passage that may also present a "contradiction":

" 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the [c]knowledge of the truth." 1 Tim. 2:4 (NASB)

If God desires all men to be saved, and some are not, then God obviously was not sovereign over them not being saved.

One further "contradiction":

"21 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, “Go down, warn the people, so that they do not break through to the Lord to gaze, and many of them [j]perish. 22 Also let the priests who come near to the Lord consecrate themselves, or else the Lord will break out against them.”" Ex. 19:21-22 (NASB)

God clearly does not want to kill the people, because if he did he could just strike them dead at the foot of the mount. Yet God tells the people not to come up, or else he will kill them. This indicates that if the people do come up, God will have no choice but to kill them. This means that there is something uncontrollable about the nature of God.

What does all of this mean? Thoughts?

Our Father withdrew from mankind because He is Holy. Sin(rebellion, disobedience) cannot abide in the presence of His holiness. His holiness is so pure that it will eradicate sin and the sinner. That is why Lord Jesus came in the flesh, so mankind could be in the presence of His Holiness and not die.
The woman in Luke was a sinner, a prisoner of satan. She met God in the flesh and He delivered her from her bondage. But His Holiness was shrouded by the flesh. The same thing with your other examples. Once you understand His Holiness, IMHO You will discover the answer to your questions.

 

[Monna]

God is love. (Perhaps you will see the "contraditions" between this and the fact that the Sovereign Lord 'allows' so many unlovely things to happen?)

True love is preconditioned on free will - i.e. the willingness, the desire, to love in return. Love also does not force itself on the loved one. No direct force ... that doesn't preclude "wooing" though - i.e. trying to get the loved one to want to love in return - freely. So love respects the decision of the loved one, regardless of what that decision is.

God created us in and with love. That included free will.

Wherein is God's sovereignty? God put into place all the principles and 'laws' that govern the interactions of physical, chemical things (gravity, thermodynamics, etc.). And he has also instituted the principle 'laws' governing social relationships, and spiritual relationships. Therein is his sovereignty at a very basic level. He has played with open cards. He has shown us what to do and what not to do to have good relationships at personal, as well as at national levels. He has provided over a 1000 years of history of a chosen people through which we can see the workings of his social and spiritual principles. And he has demonstrated in his Son, how we should be living our lives.

If you and society around you don't play by the rules, you get the consequences of your actions. Unbiased governance. We are all Adam; we are all Eve. As Eve we swallow a lie and allow our eyes, ears, pride and reason to decieve us. As Adam we also sin, but we blame someone else, even God (or Satan). We have all chosen to go our own way and try to flout those basic social and spiritual principles he laid down. And we get the results he said we would.

Then, in his mercy and love, he provided a way to get out of the mess. He broke the power of the devil, he defeated death itself. This is him enticing us to return and start again - be born again. But it is ultimately up to us to choose to respond to that love - again in accordance to the principles of salvation he has told us about.

Even today and daily life, the fact is we accept authority. In the deepest sense authority in our societies and nations is never forced upon us - we accept it with the conditions that go with it. We cannot blame anyone else. We can choose what to do, but we cannot freely choose the consequences. They come automatically with the choice. That is the sovereignty of the order God placed us and the universe under. No contradiction.

 

[SkyWriting]

If God is sovereign over all things, then how could Christ say that Satan has bound her? Was Satan allowed to bind her by God? If so, then wouldn't God be partially to blame? Yet Christ seems to blame the devil.

According to Job 1, The Father gives Satan permission to work
his ways, so that people can stand up to his efforts.

 

[1stcenturylady]

There are a couple of passages I'd like to look at:

"16 And this woman, a daughter of Abraham as she is, whom Satan has bound for eighteen long years, should she not have been released from this bond on the Sabbath day?”" Lk. 13:16 (NASB)

If God is sovereign over all things, then how could Christ say that Satan has bound her? Was Satan allowed to bind her by God? If so, then wouldn't God be partially to blame? Yet Christ seems to blame the devil. Also, the book of Acts:

"38 [ab]You know of Jesus of Nazareth, how God anointed Him with the Holy Spirit and with power, [ac]and how He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him." Ac. 10:38 (NASB)

Same concept, again. Here's another passage that may also present a "contradiction":

" 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the [c]knowledge of the truth." 1 Tim. 2:4 (NASB)

If God desires all men to be saved, and some are not, then God obviously was not sovereign over them not being saved.

One further "contradiction":

"21 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, “Go down, warn the people, so that they do not break through to the Lord to gaze, and many of them [j]perish. 22 Also let the priests who come near to the Lord consecrate themselves, or else the Lord will break out against them.”" Ex. 19:21-22 (NASB)

God clearly does not want to kill the people, because if he did he could just strike them dead at the foot of the mount. Yet God tells the people not to come up, or else he will kill them. This indicates that if the people do come up, God will have no choice but to kill them. This means that there is something uncontrollable about the nature of God.

What does all of this mean? Thoughts?

1. About Luke 13:16. When Satan deceived Eve, and Adam sinned also, they inadvertently gave rulership of this world to Satan. Christ's crucifixion and resurrection bought it back.

John 12:30 Jesus answered and said, “This voice did not come because of Me, but for your sake. 31 Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out. 32 And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself.”

God created man in Their image. God is sovereign, BUT in making man in Their image, He made man sovereign over himself and gave him free choice.

2. About Acts 10:38. While living on earth Jesus healed all who were oppressed by the devil. Satan was still ruler of this world.

3. About 1 Tim. 2:4. Same answer. God is sovereign, and supplied the way of escape - His Son. However, man's free will God will not overrule, because God gave man sovereignty over his own life.

4. About Ex. 19:21-22. God is so Holy that only the pure can be in His presence. Even the priests had to consecrate themselves before they could approach.

It all has to do with God's power and holiness. Moses, God sheltered with His Hand, so Moses could view His back. For no man shall see His face and live. God's warnings are to protect us, not punish us.

I hope this gives you a better view of God's nature, because right now yours is pretty judgmental and negative of Him. You seem to have been under Calvinist teachings, otherwise these verses wouldn't present a contradiction. Now I must say, that noticing the contradictions between Calvinism and the Bible was well observed!

 

[Butch5]

There are a couple of passages I'd like to look at:

"16 And this woman, a daughter of Abraham as she is, whom Satan has bound for eighteen long years, should she not have been released from this bond on the Sabbath day?”" Lk. 13:16 (NASB)

If God is sovereign over all things, then how could Christ say that Satan has bound her? Was Satan allowed to bind her by God? If so, then wouldn't God be partially to blame? Yet Christ seems to blame the devil. Also, the book of Acts:

"38 [ab]You know of Jesus of Nazareth, how God anointed Him with the Holy Spirit and with power, [ac]and how He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him." Ac. 10:38 (NASB)

Same concept, again. Here's another passage that may also present a "contradiction":

" 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the [c]knowledge of the truth." 1 Tim. 2:4 (NASB)

If God desires all men to be saved, and some are not, then God obviously was not sovereign over them not being saved.

One further "contradiction":

"21 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, “Go down, warn the people, so that they do not break through to the Lord to gaze, and many of them [j]perish. 22 Also let the priests who come near to the Lord consecrate themselves, or else the Lord will break out against them.”" Ex. 19:21-22 (NASB)

God clearly does not want to kill the people, because if he did he could just strike them dead at the foot of the mount. Yet God tells the people not to come up, or else he will kill them. This indicates that if the people do come up, God will have no choice but to kill them. This means that there is something uncontrollable about the nature of God.

What does all of this mean? Thoughts?

The problem is that Christians have adopted an erroneous definition of sovereignty. I believe it's come from Reformation thinking. Sovereign doesn't mean one controls everything that happens. To be sovereign simply mean to be the ultimate authority. America is a sovereign nation. Yet, the government doesn't control everything it's citizens do. American's commit crimes, they do what is unlawful. The government determines what happens to those people who commit those crimes. God is sovereign which means that every person will answer for his deeds. That is what it means to be sovereign. It doesn't mean one controls everything that happens.

 

[1stcenturylady]

The problem is that Christians have adopted an erroneous definition of sovereignty. I believe it's come from Reformation thinking. Sovereign doesn't mean one controls everything that happens. To be sovereign simply mean to be the ultimate authority. America is a sovereign nation. Yet, the government doesn't control everything it's citizens do. American's commit crimes, they do what is unlawful. The government determines what happens to those people who commit those crimes. God is sovereign which means that every person will answer to Him and He will determine what their end will be. That is what it means to be sovereign. It doesn't mean one controls everything that happens.

I remember one alcoholic that believed in a warped sovereignty of God. He claimed it was God's will that he drink because God is control of what this man did as he had no free will of his own. So every sin he committed he claimed God made him do. That is a very dangerous doctrine. In prophecy, the church of Sardis of Revelation 3 was called the dead church age. That church age directly followed Thyatira, the Roman Catholic Church, the longest church age.

 

[Butch5]

I remember one alcoholic that believed in a warped sovereignty of God. He claimed it was God's will that he drink because God is control of what this man did as he had no free will of his own. So every sin he committed he claimed God made him do. That is a very dangerous doctrine. In prophecy, the church of Sardis of Revelation 3 was called the dead church age. That church age directly followed Thyatira, the Roman Catholic Church, the longest church age.

That's definitely a dangerous doctrine.

 

[Achilles6129]

1. About Luke 13:16. When Satan deceived Eve, and Adam sinned also, they inadvertently gave rulership of this world to Satan. Christ's crucifixion and resurrection bought it back.

So then why does Satan claim authority over all the kingdoms of the world in Lk. 4 and Mt. 4, and why is he in authority over all the kingdoms of the world in the book of Revelation?

John 12:30 Jesus answered and said, “This voice did not come because of Me, but for your sake. 31 Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out. 32 And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself.”

Cast out from where? Heaven? The human heart?

2. About Acts 10:38. While living on earth Jesus healed all who were oppressed by the devil. Satan was still ruler of this world.

I'm just trying to be clear about what you're saying: are you saying that prior to Christ, it was Satan's fault that people were disabled, but after Christ it is now God's fault?

3. About 1 Tim. 2:4. Same answer. God is sovereign, and supplied the way of escape - His Son. However, man's free will God will not overrule, because God gave man sovereignty over his own life.

Right, so there's something outside of God's control.

4. About Ex. 19:21-22. God is so Holy that only the pure can be in His presence. Even the priests had to consecrate themselves before they could approach.

It all has to do with God's power and holiness. Moses, God sheltered with His Hand, so Moses could view His back. For no man shall see His face and live. God's warnings are to protect us, not punish us.

There's a contradiction: if they come into God's presence, God will kill them. But God obviously doesn't want to kill them, or else he would strike them dead at the foot of the mount. So when they come into God's presence, God has an uncontrollable reaction. This means that there's something uncontrollable about the nature of God.

Unless you're saying that God wants to kill them when they come into his presence? Even so, there must still be some sort of reaction, since he didn't want to kill them when they were at the foot of the mount.

 

[Achilles6129]

The problem is that Christians have adopted an erroneous definition of sovereignty. I believe it's come from Reformation thinking. Sovereign doesn't mean one controls everything that happens. To be sovereign simply mean to be the ultimate authority. America is a sovereign nation. Yet, the government doesn't control everything it's citizens do. American's commit crimes, they do what is unlawful. The government determines what happens to those people who commit those crimes. God is sovereign which means that every person will answer for his deeds. That is what it means to be sovereign. It doesn't mean one controls everything that happens.

Here's the question: does the Bible really claim that God controls everything that happens? We have a few passages:

"11 The Lord said to him, “Who has made man’s mouth? Or who makes him mute or deaf, or seeing or blind? Is it not I, the Lord?" Ex. 4:11 (NASB)

"The One forming light and creating darkness,
Causing [f]well-being and creating calamity;
I am the Lord who does all these." Isa. 45:7 (NASB)

"If a trumpet is blown in a city will not the people tremble?
If a calamity occurs in a city has not the Lord done it?" Am. 3:6 (NASB)

"‘See now that I, I am He,
And there is no god besides Me;
It is I who put to death and give life.
I have wounded and it is I who heal,
And there is no one who can deliver from My hand." Deut. 32:39 (NASB)

If God controls everything that happens, then how could Christ lay the blame for the woman's disability at the foot of Satan?

 

[Denadii]

There are a couple of passages I'd like to look at:

"16 And this woman, a daughter of Abraham as she is, whom Satan has bound for eighteen long years, should she not have been released from this bond on the Sabbath day?”" Lk. 13:16 (NASB)

If God is sovereign over all things, then how could Christ say that Satan has bound her? Was Satan allowed to bind her by God? If so, then wouldn't God be partially to blame? Yet Christ seems to blame the devil. Also, the book of Acts:

"38 [ab]You know of Jesus of Nazareth, how God anointed Him with the Holy Spirit and with power, [ac]and how He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him." Ac. 10:38 (NASB)

Same concept, again. Here's another passage that may also present a "contradiction":

" 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the [c]knowledge of the truth." 1 Tim. 2:4 (NASB)

If God desires all men to be saved, and some are not, then God obviously was not sovereign over them not being saved.

One further "contradiction":

"21 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, “Go down, warn the people, so that they do not break through to the Lord to gaze, and many of them [j]perish. 22 Also let the priests who come near to the Lord consecrate themselves, or else the Lord will break out against them.”" Ex. 19:21-22 (NASB)

God clearly does not want to kill the people, because if he did he could just strike them dead at the foot of the mount. Yet God tells the people not to come up, or else he will kill them. This indicates that if the people do come up, God will have no choice but to kill them. This means that there is something uncontrollable about the nature of God.

What does all of this mean? Thoughts?

There is no contradiction. Christians like to have the privileges with no responsibility.
The fact is God is not sovereign in the Earth. We as Christians are sovereign. We are in charge. Yes. God owns the store but He put us in as managers, if I may put it that way.

Genesis 1:28

And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.


Psalm 8:4-8 (KJV)

4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him?

5 For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels, and hast crowned him with glory and honour.

6 Thou madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands; thou hast put all things under his feet:

7 All sheep and oxen, yea, and the beasts of the field;

8 The fowl of the air, and the fish of the sea, and whatsoever passeth through the paths of the seas.




Psalm 115:15-16 (KJV)

15 Ye are blessed of the Lord which made heaven and earth.

16 The heaven, even the heavens, are the Lord's: but the earth hath he given to the children of men.

 

[1213]

...
What does all of this mean? Thoughts?

God has given freedom and this lesson that people wanted in the beginning. In the garden of Eden, people wanted to know evil and that is why they were expelled to this first death. We are here to learn what evil means and that is why it is possible to see evil things.

Can God be blamed for that people have used their freedom and rejected God? I don’t think so. God is extremely good, because He has given freedom. Most rulers don’t allow people to have freedom.

But because God is good and righteous, it means he acts also in good and righteous way. And that means for example that He doesn’t allow evil to continue forever. Goodness and righteousness “requires” one to act accordingly. I think no one forces God, but He has chosen to be righteous and it leads to certain solutions. For example, I think it means God doesn’t allow evil people live forever.

This means, God wants everything good for all people, but if person becomes evil that brakes all good things, it has to be ended.

 

[SBC]

There are a couple of passages I'd like to look at:

"16 And this woman, a daughter of Abraham as she is, whom Satan has bound for eighteen long years, should she not have been released from this bond on the Sabbath day?”" Lk. 13:16 (NASB)

If God is sovereign over all things, then how could Christ say that Satan has bound her?

Because the truth is, Satan bound the women.

Was Satan allowed to bind her by God?

Of course Satan was allowed. Satan was given freewill, just as you have freewill to question Gods Sovereignty.

If so, then wouldn't God be partially to blame?

No. It wasn't Gods action, it was Satan's action. Nor would I credit any blame to God, because "you" question Gods Sovereignty.

Same concept, again. Here's another passage that may also present a "contradiction":

" 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the [c]knowledge of the truth." 1 Tim. 2:4 (NASB)

If God desires all men to be saved, and some are not, then God obviously was not sovereign over them not being saved.

God clearly desires one thing, but so what? Men have freewill to decide and do what they desire, without consideration of Gods desires.

How is what a man exercising his own freewill, Gods fault?

One further "contradiction":

"21 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, “Go down, warn the people, so that they do not break through to the Lord to gaze, and many of them [j]perish. 22 Also let the priests who come near to the Lord consecrate themselves, or else the Lord will break out against them.”" Ex. 19:21-22 (NASB)

God clearly does not want to kill the people, because if he did he could just strike them dead at the foot of the mount. Yet God tells the people not to come up, or else he will kill them. This indicates that if the people do come up, God will have no choice but to kill them. This means that there is something uncontrollable about the nature of God.

Uncontrollable? That doesn't even make sense.
If a person is told not to do something and warned of the consequence if "THEY" decide to do it - It is not being "uncontrollable", for God to follow through with the consequence, should the person have decided to do what he was warned not to do.

What does all of this mean? Thoughts?

What it appears to mean is, you purport God is accountable for men and Satan exercising their own freewill choices.

I totally disagree.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[Butch5]

Here's the question: does the Bible really claim that God controls everything that happens? We have a few passages:

"11 The Lord said to him, “Who has made man’s mouth? Or who makes him mute or deaf, or seeing or blind? Is it not I, the Lord?" Ex. 4:11 (NASB)

"The One forming light and creating darkness,
Causing [f]well-being and creating calamity;
I am the Lord who does all these." Isa. 45:7 (NASB)

"If a trumpet is blown in a city will not the people tremble?
If a calamity occurs in a city has not the Lord done it?" Am. 3:6 (NASB)

"‘See now that I, I am He,
And there is no god besides Me;
It is I who put to death and give life.
I have wounded and it is I who heal,
And there is no one who can deliver from My hand." Deut. 32:39 (NASB)

If God controls everything that happens, then how could Christ lay the blame for the woman's disability at the foot of Satan?

None of these passages say that God controls everything. He doesn't. If God controlled everything then it would mean that He controlled the sin that happens. He doesn't. That He doesn't can be seen from Scripture.

45 But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy, and spake against those things which were spoken by Paul, contradicting and blaspheming.
46 Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles. (Acts 13:45-46 KJV)

49 Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest?
50 Hath not my hand made all these things?
51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers: (Acts 7:49-52 KJV)

 

[Ron Gurley]

God is SOVREIGN. (AMONG MANY OTHER ATTRIBUTEs)
He created. He intervenes. He controls.
He is perfectly all-everything.

BUT His spiritual gift of "free will" was given to Mankind and angels.
Everyone...and...Everything... is "OF GOD"..."FROM GOD"..."SUBJECT TO" ...God.

Sovereignty of God: (all NASB)
His absolute right to do all things according to his own good pleasure,
(Daniel 4:25,35; Romans 9:15-23; 1 Timothy 6:15; Revelation 4:11).

1 Chronicles 29:12
“Both riches and honor come from You, and You RULE over all, and in Your hand is power and might; and
it lies in Your hand to make great and to strengthen everyone.

Lamentations 5:19
You, O LORD, RULE forever;
Your throne is from generation to generation.

Ephesians 1:21
...far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and every name that is named,
not only in this age but also in the one to come.

BUT the "buck" does not stop with God
because His PERFECT SOVREIGNTY
allows SOME to operate within, ALL to His mysterious GLORY.

1 Corinthians 10:31...Whether, then, you eat or drink or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.

Psalm 19:1 {A Psalm of David}
The heavens are telling of the glory of God;
And their expanse is declaring the work of His hands.

Psalm 79:9
Help us, O God of our salvation, for the glory of Your name; And deliver us and forgive our sins for Your name’s sake.

Acts 7:55...STEPHEN: first Christ-following martyr
But being full of the Holy Spirit, he gazed intently into heaven and saw the glory of God,
and Jesus (God the Son) standing at the right hand of God;(the Father)

Romans 3:23...for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,...

Ephesians 1:17
that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give to you a spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the knowledge of Him.

THREE things are the proximate and intervening CAUSES of the UN-HOLY state on planet earth:

1. existing "world" (kozmos) chaos which was allowed after EDEN as discipline,
2. Man's "sin nature", part of "free will", the innate spiritual tendency to turn away from God
3. the attack on Man by spirit-beings by devil/demons

 

[DeeDee79]

But because God is good and righteous, it means he acts also in good and righteous way. And that means for example that He doesn’t allow evil to continue forever. Goodness and righteousness “requires” one to act accordingly. I think no one forces God, but He has chosen to be righteous and it leads to certain solutions. For example, I think it means God doesn’t allow evil people live forever.

This means, God wants everything good for all people, but if person becomes evil that brakes all good things, it has to be ended.[/QUOTE]

So the person who is treating me maliciously online will be put to a stop by God?

 

[1213]

… If so, then wouldn't God be partially to blame?

If we would blame God for giving freedom and this lesson, we should then also blame all gun sellers for the murders that are committed by their guns? No, and God also should not be blamed for works of others.

If God desires all men to be saved, and some are not, then God obviously was not sovereign over them not being saved.

Yes, God desires people to be saved. However, He seems to want also that only righteous have eternal life and that people have freedom. So, if people want to reject God, God allows that, even though He would like to see all people to choose wisely.

…God clearly does not want to kill the people, because if he did he could just strike them dead at the foot of the mount. Yet God tells the people not to come up, or else he will kill them. This indicates that if the people do come up, God will have no choice but to kill them. This means that there is something uncontrollable about the nature of God…

I think God has given to Him limitations, like righteousness, truthfulness, justice, goodness. Those are things He seem to want to keep. He could choose otherwise, therefore that is from His free will and not a limit that comes outside of God and would make Him not all powerful. So, I think God is not uncontrollable, He just has chosen to act in good way.

 

[DeeDee79]

I think God has given to Him limitations, like righteousness, truthfulness, justice, goodness. Those are things He seem to want to keep. He could choose otherwise, therefore that is from His free will and not a limit that comes outside of God and would make Him not all powerful. So, I think God is not uncontrollable, He just has chosen to act in good way.[/QUOTE]
....
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.
.
.
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So if someone is being offended constantly over and over how does God respond with justice and righteousness in a good way for the offender that will lead him to repentance? Because if you keep letting the offender off the hook then they never learn anything and will just keep committing their crimes.

 

[1213]

...
So if someone is being offended constantly over and over how does God respond with justice and righteousness in a good way for the offender that will lead him to repentance? Because if you keep letting the offender off the hook then they never learn anything and will just keep committing their crimes.

I think, if it is clear, as I think it is for God, that the person will never repent, the person doesn’t get eternal life. I believe it is good that eternal life is for righteous, and God doesn’t give it for evil people. If evil people would get that, they would make it eternal suffering for all.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46