Conservative 'Squad' to fight socialism

iluvatar5150

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TEA partier here. As expected, the alt-left lies kick in before page two.

You know very well that the classical liberalism we espouse recognizes the reality that the more bloated a government becomes, the more corrupt and less well-functioning it becomes.

Yeah, that's the claim, but IME, there's rarely any data given to support it. The "smaller government is better government" argument has devolved into blind dogma and supports @DaisyDay's comment about the Tea Party opposing functional government.
 
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SimplyMe

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Yeah, that's the claim, but IME, there's rarely any data given to support it. The "smaller government is better government" argument has devolved into blind dogma and supports @DaisyDay's comment about the Tea Party opposing functional government.

The real question, where has the Tea Party gone under Trump? Debt levels are increasing at close to the highest rates of the Obama administration -- with the difference being we were in a massive recession when Obama's big deficits occurred (when the income of the government was greatly reduced). You would think the Tea Party would be fighting Trump tooth and nail to get the deficits reduced.

Instead, he seems to have "bought off" the Tea Party with the tax cuts, even while he is increasing the size of the budget and making our debt issue much worse.
 
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Albion

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Yeah, that's the claim, but IME, there's rarely any data given to support it.
Say what? The inefficiencies of bigger and bigger government are all around us and also testified to by the experiences of governments throughout history.
 
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miamited

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Hi mathetes,

Thanks for your response:
Actually not. Under younger Bush's presidency in 2002, he launched his 'faith-based initiatives.'

That's right. However, nothing much changed. In fact, it was the evangelical 'christian' who worked to thwart the initiative. Here's a piece from Frontline:

This action expanded on the "Charitable Choice" provision, passed as part of President Clinton's 1996 welfare reform bill, that allowed smaller and more overtly religious groups to receive government funding for providing social services. [Editor's Note, 1/5/05: In 2003, faith-based social services grants totaled $1.17 billion]. Critics of Bush's action -- including some evangelical Christians -- warned that it will lead to the entanglement of the church and the state, hurting both. Supporters said that the president is reversing years of discrimination against religious groups.

You can read the full article here:
President And His Faith - The Faith-Based Initiative Controversy | The Jesus Factor | FRONTLINE | PBS

There are interviews espousing several ideas that Bush's 'Faith Based Initiative' brought to light. So, while we do have a president who did make some attempt to bring faith into helping the poor, it wasn't successful. Further, the initiative just changed who the federal government's help would go to. Under the initiative, faith based organizations became eligible for federal funding for 'help services' that they might provide. As you see in the above blurb, in 2003 federal social service grants totaled $1.17B. Now, I don't know where you live, but when the federal government decides to give faith organizations that kind of money, I don't care what the underlying issue is about, it isn't likely to be accepted without a pretty big fight. And so it was and so the 'Faith Based Initiative' today, is just a shell.

So, I respectfully disagree that President Bush took us back to the days when the government wasn't supporting the poor. For that brief period of time, the government still helped the poor, they just wanted to do it through the 'church'. It didn't work.

As for your understanding of the New Deal legislation of the 30's, you are correct. That's where most of our 'government aid to the poor' really began to take hold. As to your understanding that this idea of governments globally seeking to help the poor makes us into some kind of socialistic world order...I'd say that's a good think in most cases that we care more about others than about ourselves.

As to their ever being some 'one world government' I don't find that the Scriptures prophesy such a thing. That's some understanding that gained widespread popularity through the 'Left Behind' book series. However, if there were to be one, you can bet your bottom dollar that it will be the U.S. that is in charge of it. We are the beast of the Revelation.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
 
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KarateCowboy

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Yeah, that's the claim, but IME, there's rarely any data given to support it. The "smaller government is better government" argument has devolved into blind dogma and supports @DaisyDay's comment about the Tea Party opposing functional government.

RULE #2: SJWs always double down. You're literally saying that they oppose functional government because they support functional government.

There's mountains of data and historical evidence out there that bigger governments waste more. There's also the reality of human nature that more power means more corruption. It's also just a common sense thing. I mean, look at our government spending, wasteful programs, and $160,000,000,000,000 in debt. Even if it were blind faith, that doesn't translate into a desire for functional government. That's just irrational garbage. "They want dysfunctional government because they want more functional government". That's double-think right there, dude.

Research Shows that Small Government Is Efficient Government

Did FDR End the Great Depression?
 
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iluvatar5150

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The real question, where has the Tea Party gone under Trump? Debt levels are increasing at close to the highest rates of the Obama administration -- with the difference being we were in a massive recession when Obama's big deficits occurred (when the income of the government was greatly reduced). You would think the Tea Party would be fighting Trump tooth and nail to get the deficits reduced.

Instead, he seems to have "bought off" the Tea Party with the tax cuts, even while he is increasing the size of the budget and making our debt issue much worse.

Don’t forget that the official start of the Tea Party was an on air rant by a commodity trader against a relatively tiny program designed to help struggling homeowners. It was never about true financial responsibility. It’s always been about denying services to the wrong people.

Say what? The inefficiencies of bigger and bigger government are all around us and also testified to by the experiences of governments throughout history.

And yet you don’t produce any data....

RULE #2: SJWs always double down. You're literally saying that they oppose functional government because they support functional government.

There's mountains of data and historical evidence out there that bigger governments waste more. There's also the reality of human nature that more power means more corruption. It's also just a common sense thing. I mean, look at our government spending, wasteful programs, and $160,000,000,000,000 in debt. Even if it were blind faith, that doesn't translate into a desire for functional government. That's just irrational garbage. "They want dysfunctional government because they want more functional government". That's double-think right there, dude.

Research Shows that Small Government Is Efficient Government

Did FDR End the Great Depression?

See? That’s not so hard. Of course, I don’t have time to go through it right now, but I will.

ETA: Prager? Really?
 
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Alabama candidate's ad goes viral as she calls for a conservative 'Squad' to fight socialism

"We need somebody who can convince my generation and others that more government is not the answer. More government is the problem," Taylor told the "Friends" hosts.

"We are small-town Alabama and looking forward to representing the people of this district. [Socialism] concerns me greatly and that's why I'm running," said Taylor, arguing that the "country was founded on small business, and private citizens who can make a difference."

Taylor joined the race to replace Rep. Martha Roby, a Republican who announced in July she will not seek reelection.

full
 
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I have always wondered what americans do to their children to trigger this rote response of immediate fear and anger at the word socialism. Do your wetnurses honk an air horn at babies every time that word is said?
 
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iluvatar5150

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RULE #2: SJWs always double down. You're literally saying that they oppose functional government because they support functional government.

There's mountains of data and historical evidence out there that bigger governments waste more. There's also the reality of human nature that more power means more corruption. It's also just a common sense thing. I mean, look at our government spending, wasteful programs, and $160,000,000,000,000 in debt. Even if it were blind faith, that doesn't translate into a desire for functional government. That's just irrational garbage. "They want dysfunctional government because they want more functional government". That's double-think right there, dude.

Research Shows that Small Government Is Efficient Government

Did FDR End the Great Depression?

Ok, so I’ve read the report on which that Cato piece was based:
https://www.ecb.europa.eu/pub/pdf/scpwps/ecbwp242.pdf

And it’s interesting. I’m gonna shamelessly commit an ad hominem and dismiss that PragerU video out of hand because I’ve had such bad experiences with them in the past that I don’t think they’re worth my time, except for the time required to dump on them whenever the opportunity arises. :sorry:

But the paper is interesting and I’ll concede that, after reading it, I’m less confident in my prior attitude that right wing anti-government boilerplate is completely unfounded. That said, I can see a couple possible holes in their case.

First, the paper is just kinda old. Their data is from 2000, which is right at the peak (or beginning of the crash) of the dotcom bubble, before 9/11, before the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, and way before the 2008 crash. The US came out pretty good on most of their metrics, but those events all have the potential to really skew things. They may not make any difference at all, but either way, I’d be interested to see an updated study.

Second, government size correlated to efficiency but not to performance. Efficiency is a good thing, but it’s not everything. In many things in life, there’s a law of diminishing returns, where the marginal improvement gained by each additional expenditure is smaller than the last. Sometimes, achieving peak performance requires spending gobs of money. Moneyball doesn’t win in the playoffs. And while my Mazda is orders of magnitude more economically efficient than an F1 car, I’m not winning the Monaco Grand Prix.

Third, there are ways to skew these numbers without making any real world difference. If, for example, the US decided to nationalize our entire health care and health insurance industries, but otherwise maintain the status quo, then we’d tank our efficiency numbers because our ratio of spending to GDP would skyrocket without any effect on people’s real world experience. That may be an argument for offloading health care to the private sector, but it would also be possible in this situation for the government to outperform the private sector while still showing worse efficiency than before. In that case, we would be better off nationalizing everything, while these metrics would suggest the opposite. IOW, this only compares to efficiencies across governments, not efficiencies across the combination of government and private sector.

Fourth, I’m skeptical that the weighting is optimal. The US performs terribly on performance metrics for healthcare (last place) and income inequality (next to last), which are hugely important to a ton of people, but that gets weighted about the same as red tape, which... eh?

So, it’s interesting, but its far from airtight and it certainly doesn’t provide a solid basis for the often-dogmatic assertion that we must always shrink government more.
 
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