Confusion

[llywelyn]

Hello.
I am new to this forum and come here for advice. Please excuse that this post is long. This is because it concerns something that I'm not able to discuss with anyone at all for reasons detailed in the post.
My name is Nicholas Milton. I am a teacher, living in Vietnam. I am from the UK and have been living in Vietnam for over 3 years. I am 32 and married with a daughter who is 7 months old. I am a Christian. I was raised by a Christian mother and a secular father and attended church as a child and inconsistently as a teenager and adult.

I don’t have any friends in this country. I am friendly with my colleagues but don’t spend any time with them outside of work. I also have a baby daughter, giving little opportunity to socialize without leaving my wife alone with the burden of her care for too long. I would also find it difficult to talk about issues such as the following with any of my colleagues or anyone else I know because I’m not aware of anyone that I think would be able to relate to any of it. This is why I’ve written this; as an appeal for advice and as a means of expressing what I think and feel every day.

I was taught by both the church and my mother that god has a plan and a purpose for the lives of individual disciples. I have always prayed for his guidance in my decisions. I have prayed about education and jobs as well as other big decisions. To be honest, I was rarely aware of any kind of clear answer. There was a time when I believe god tried to guide me, but I only became aware of that in retrospect as at the time I was too stubborn to listen, clearly to the point of being beyond even able to hear him. Since leaving school I lived with a sense of purposelessness in my life. I still do. I’ve often reached out to god in prayer to give me direction or purpose in life but I’ve never been aware of his answers. There’re times when I put a lot of effort, time and care into seeking him through prayer, bible reading and fasting and there’re times when I back off from those things and don’t practice them because they can be exhausting and seem so futile. The times when I do seek god in these ways are usually prompted by something that’s ‘stirred up my faith’, such as interaction with another ‘holy spirit’ filled Christian, as you might say. Those stints of god-seeking have often lead to an even greater sense of frustration, confusion and disappointment with this faith as they have never lead to what I want – clear direction from god. It is not only direction that I want, but any intimacy, any closeness, contact or connection with him. The only clarity of instruction of any kind that I can find from god is in his bible. I am far more able to trust the bible than I am any other aspect of this faith – prayer, fasting, praise and worship, fellowship or even god himself. I read the bible frequently and it is very useful for godly living. But god is very much just a concept in my life now.

When I was a child, my relationship with god was very different. I remember it and it resembled what I read in the new testament much more closely than my current relationship with god. The interaction, intimacy and closeness with Jesus was there and in all honestly, it is the memory of that relationship that keeps me involved with the religion of Christianity at all. I would very happily have forgotten this religion completely if it wasn’t for that memory. Today and since I was around 13, Jesus and god are both concepts in the bible only, and, if it wasn’t for the memory of my childhood relationship with Jesus, I would have quickly disregarded the bible too, even If I did find it useful and full of wisdom because, well, I'd probably view life as being to short to subject yourself to rules.
There’re times when I can’t escape the fact that I’ve done everything that the bible tells me I am supposed to do in order to seek god. There’re times when I look around at others, then look at myself and come to the conclusion that belief in god makes so little sense and is only the outcome of the human desire to feel as though the world around us is controlled and can be explained and that we’re therefore safer than if it wasn’t. That’s without even beginning to list the drawbacks of practicing the Christian religion. The confusion. The cognitive dissonance. The guilt. The misunderstandings. The narrow, indistinct line between faith and fundamentalism.

I would’ve made decisions differently if it wasn’t for this belief, the belief that god plans for the lives of individuals and has a purpose for them. I believed it because I’ve often felt so hopeless in my own potential and prospects. Is that my misunderstanding? I’m led to my question here. What am I doing wrong? Why is this like this? Thank you for reading this far and any advice would be appreciated.
Nicholas.

 

[JosephZ]

What am I doing wrong?

Below are a few things I picked up on from your posts.

I was too stubborn to listen,

I put a lot of effort, time and care into seeking him through prayer,

Those stints of god-seeking... never lead to what I want

I’ve done everything that the bible tells me I am supposed to do

The above isn't a complete list, but you seemed to use the term "I" quite a bit in that post. I think you are trying too hard. It's probably time to stop trying to find God and the results you are seeking from a relationship with Him and let God do all of the work in that department. What you want and expect in this life may not be in line with what God wants for you.

I was taught by both the church and my mother that god has a plan and a purpose for the lives of individual disciples.

This is 100% true as "we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will." (Ephesians 1:11)

When I was a child, my relationship with god was very different. I remember it and it resembled what I read in the new testament much more closely than my current relationship with god. The interaction, intimacy and closeness with Jesus was there and in all honestly, it is the memory of that relationship that keeps me involved with the religion of Christianity at all.

What is the difference between today and when you were a child? Is it possible that when you were a child that you weren't trying so hard to have a relationship with God? That it came natural as a child?

I would like to recommend a book for you to read. I'm not sure how easy it will be to find in Vietnam, but it will be worth the effort to find a copy if you can. It's titled "The Saving Life of Christ" by Major Ian Thomas. Here is a link to Amazon where you can read some of the reviews from others. https://www.amazon.com/Saving-Life-Christ-Major-Thomas/dp/0310332621

 

[Oldmantook]

Hello.
I am new to this forum and come here for advice. Please excuse that this post is long. This is because it concerns something that I'm not able to discuss with anyone at all for reasons detailed in the post.
My name is Nicholas Milton. I am a teacher, living in Vietnam. I am from the UK and have been living in Vietnam for over 3 years. I am 32 and married with a daughter who is 7 months old. I am a Christian. I was raised by a Christian mother and a secular father and attended church as a child and inconsistently as a teenager and adult.

I don’t have any friends in this country. I am friendly with my colleagues but don’t spend any time with them outside of work. I also have a baby daughter, giving little opportunity to socialize without leaving my wife alone with the burden of her care for too long. I would also find it difficult to talk about issues such as the following with any of my colleagues or anyone else I know because I’m not aware of anyone that I think would be able to relate to any of it. This is why I’ve written this; as an appeal for advice and as a means of expressing what I think and feel every day.

I was taught by both the church and my mother that god has a plan and a purpose for the lives of individual disciples. I have always prayed for his guidance in my decisions. I have prayed about education and jobs as well as other big decisions. To be honest, I was rarely aware of any kind of clear answer. There was a time when I believe god tried to guide me, but I only became aware of that in retrospect as at the time I was too stubborn to listen, clearly to the point of being beyond even able to hear him. Since leaving school I lived with a sense of purposelessness in my life. I still do. I’ve often reached out to god in prayer to give me direction or purpose in life but I’ve never been aware of his answers. There’re times when I put a lot of effort, time and care into seeking him through prayer, bible reading and fasting and there’re times when I back off from those things and don’t practice them because they can be exhausting and seem so futile. The times when I do seek god in these ways are usually prompted by something that’s ‘stirred up my faith’, such as interaction with another ‘holy spirit’ filled Christian, as you might say. Those stints of god-seeking have often lead to an even greater sense of frustration, confusion and disappointment with this faith as they have never lead to what I want – clear direction from god. It is not only direction that I want, but any intimacy, any closeness, contact or connection with him. The only clarity of instruction of any kind that I can find from god is in his bible. I am far more able to trust the bible than I am any other aspect of this faith – prayer, fasting, praise and worship, fellowship or even god himself. I read the bible frequently and it is very useful for godly living. But god is very much just a concept in my life now.

When I was a child, my relationship with god was very different. I remember it and it resembled what I read in the new testament much more closely than my current relationship with god. The interaction, intimacy and closeness with Jesus was there and in all honestly, it is the memory of that relationship that keeps me involved with the religion of Christianity at all. I would very happily have forgotten this religion completely if it wasn’t for that memory. Today and since I was around 13, Jesus and god are both concepts in the bible only, and, if it wasn’t for the memory of my childhood relationship with Jesus, I would have quickly disregarded the bible too, even If I did find it useful and full of wisdom because, well, I'd probably view life as being to short to subject yourself to rules.
There’re times when I can’t escape the fact that I’ve done everything that the bible tells me I am supposed to do in order to seek god. There’re times when I look around at others, then look at myself and come to the conclusion that belief in god makes so little sense and is only the outcome of the human desire to feel as though the world around us is controlled and can be explained and that we’re therefore safer than if it wasn’t. That’s without even beginning to list the drawbacks of practicing the Christian religion. The confusion. The cognitive dissonance. The guilt. The misunderstandings. The narrow, indistinct line between faith and fundamentalism.

I would’ve made decisions differently if it wasn’t for this belief, the belief that god plans for the lives of individuals and has a purpose for them. I believed it because I’ve often felt so hopeless in my own potential and prospects. Is that my misunderstanding? I’m led to my question here. What am I doing wrong? Why is this like this? Thank you for reading this far and any advice would be appreciated.
Nicholas.

Some people believe easily and don't question their faith. Nothing wrong with that. Others such as myself have to know what they believe and WHY they believe it. I became a Christian shortly before graduating from college but I had to first have evidence of why the Christina faith was a viable vehicle for believing in God and the truths of the Bible. I read Josh McDowell's book "More Than A Carpenter" which establishes the premise that Jesus was either a liar, lunatic, or the Lord. If evidence of Jesus' resurrection proves to be trustworthy, than he is indeed Lord and God. You may want to read it, or other books like it to clear up any doubts and confusion. The Christian faith need not be a blind faith but rather an informed faith.

 

[com7fy8]

I have always prayed for his guidance in my decisions.

There was a time when I believe god tried to guide me, but I only became aware of that in retrospect as at the time I was too stubborn to listen, clearly to the point of being beyond even able to hear him.

Ok, so you know there is such a thing as not listening to God, and being stubborn. And it is good, at least, that we know being stubborn is wrong and can hurt us and keep us from how we could be sharing with God.

So . . . prayer for you > and for all of us to do better to be humble with God. All of us, Nicholas, can be imperfect >

"be clothed with humility" (in 1 Peter 5:5).

"rather let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the incorruptible beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is very precious in the sight of God." (1 Peter 3:4)

God is quiet and gentle, in His love. So, we can be in sharing with God, by being deeply quiet, trusting Him to have us with Him the way He wants. Trust God who is our Good Judge, to decide what He wants with you, Nicholas, and God bless you ! ! !

It is good, however you are being kind and loving with your wife. This can help you be with God.

"Husbands, love your wives and do not be bitter toward them." (Colossians 3:19)

Do not accept any excuse, then, ever, for even starting to get bitter. But trust God to get rid of any nasty negative stuff which gets started in you, and submit to how He has you being even peaceful and kind, instead, and enjoy discovering how He makes us creative in how we love our ladies

Even right while things attack to get us bitter, we instead can be creative in how we love, including being encouraging and good examples . . . not only trying to control someone who is a problem for us.

We all need this, more and more, Nicholas
Bill

 

[llywelyn]

Hi JosephZ. Thanks for taking the time to read such a long post as that one. I can't even make church on Sunday mornings whilst I'm required to work then so the opportunities I have to meet other Christians and talk about things like this are very limited. You said;

The above isn't a complete list, but you seemed to use the term "I" quite a bit in that post. I think you are trying too hard. It's probably time to stop trying to find God and the results you are seeking from a relationship with Him and let God do all of the work in that department.

I always thought the injunction of the bible toward the christian was to seek god with our whole hearts. We're told we'll find him when we seek him with out whole hearts. Are you saying that I can stop seeking god through bible reading, prayer and fasting and just wait for him?

What is the difference between today and when you were a child? Is it possible that when you were a child that you weren't trying so hard to have a relationship with God? That it came natural as a child?

Lots of things happened to me over the course of adolescence. It'd be pointless to recount them but to answer your question, I definitely wasn't trying so hard when I was a child, and up till around 13 years old, to have a relationship with god and it did come naturally. But like I said, now there're times when I make the efforts I've described to 'seek god' and times when I don't.
The frustration and disappointment enters when I realize how much time has passed, how much older I am now and that I haven't benefited from the promise of guidance for the individual in the bible. Are you saying that I should stop seeking god in all ways?

What is the difference between today and when you were a child? Is it possible that when you were a child that you weren't trying so hard to have a relationship with God? That it came natural as a child?

https://www.amazon.com/Saving-Life-Christ-Major-Thomas/dp/0310332621

Thanks for the recommendation, I'd like to do some more reading on christian themes. It's so tough to get books like that in Vietnam though. There's 1 christian bookshop in the capital!

 

[llywelyn]

Some people believe easily and don't question their faith. Nothing wrong with that. Others such as myself have to know what they believe and WHY they believe it. I became a Christian shortly before graduating from college but I had to first have evidence of why the Christina faith was a viable vehicle for believing in God and the truths of the Bible.

Hi Oldmantook. Thanks for taking the time to read such a long post. I think in future, I'll try and keep postings here more concise. To be honest, I've always known what I believe and why and I do believe the bible, but this is entirely based on personal experience, in particular the experiences of faith and worship during childhood as described in the post. Without them, I don't think I could've persevered in believing this long.

 

[Oldmantook]

Hi Oldmantook. Thanks for taking the time to read such a long post. I think in future, I'll try and keep postings here more concise. To be honest, I've always known what I believe and why and I do believe the bible, but this is entirely based on personal experience, in particular the experiences of faith and worship during childhood as described in the post. Without them, I don't think I could've persevered in believing this long.

Perhaps that is why God commanded the Israelites in the OT to erect memorials to help them to remember what God did for them such as in Joshua 4:1-24 in order to continue to believe and trust in Him. Sounds like your childhood memories serve the same purpose. We all need whatever help we can in order to persevere.

 

[llywelyn]

Ok, so you know there is such a thing as not listening to God, and being stubborn. And it is good, at least, that we know being stubborn is wrong and can hurt us and keep us from how we could be sharing with God. Bill

Hi com7fy8, thanks for taking the time to read such a long post. As I've mentioned, in future I will make the effort to make posts more concise.

Yes, I realize that we all have that tendency. But these days, I'm sure that it's not my stubbornness that prevents me from hearing him or drawing close to him.

So, we can be in sharing with God, by being deeply quiet, trusting Him to have us with Him the way He wants.

Being deeply quiet hasn't worked either.

Do not accept any excuse, then, ever, for even starting to get bitter.

Okay, that's something to bear in mind. Thanks. Recently I have been aware of myself beginning to resent certain things about her and I will continue to pray about that. I don't find that I try to control her. That wouldn't work anyway, such is her character.

 

[com7fy8]

Being deeply quiet hasn't worked either.

Well, it depends on how we are being quiet. If our quietness is getting us into boredom and loneliness and frustration and unforgiveness and wishing for what we don't have . . . we need how God quiets us >

"And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body; and be thankful." (Colossians 3:15)

So, yes all of us are "called in one body" to be personally ruled by God's own peace. This effects how our character is so we are submissive to Him more and more all the time, I consider, and in God's peace He is personally guiding us while we keep submitting to how He rules us in His peace.

So, then, when negative and nasty stuff is trying to get my attention in me, I need to be paying attention to how God rules me in His peace, including how He corrects where my attention is going! And as much as I do fail in this, still pray for God to have His way, and keep at this. Possibly, there is nothing else worth doing. And as He corrects me, I would say from my own experience, then I am encouraged and enlightened in His peace in how I see things, plus His peace is creative in how I find myself loving and caring for any and all people, because God is all-loving.

But . . . of course . . . we are not perfect about this. And it is not our nature to "be" thankful. But this is what is commanded. And joy is included. Since God wants "the incorruptible beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit", my opinion is that His joy is gentle and humble . . . deeper than just emotional and passing moments.

This is all a character issue.

So, what is right can not work until God has been correcting our nature. We need to actively seek our Heavenly Father for this correction > Hebrews 12:4-14 < this correction is guaranteed to every child of God. And it can take the rest of our lives, but with us growing in this, not only going through some one-time total self-produced change. We grow in Jesus. And God has us growing together with one another, as the body of Jesus > no one becomes some all-by-oneself super-strong saint, but we are growing with each other, helping one another.

So, if the Bible says to do something, and this does not work > well, it is what works, but we may not be doing what works. But God does. This is about how God works in us >

"for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure." (Philippians 2:13)

And every scripture can be somehow used by God to help us with this. His word is guaranteed to do all which He means by His word > Isaiah 55:11 < so trust what His word says to Him to do this in us.

So, when I keep finding I am not a joy machine and not being deeply gentle and sensitive to God > I need more correction. It will not work to just get frustrated and make up excuses and explanations. My failure is proof of how > I < don't work!!

 

[com7fy8]

I also have a baby daughter, giving little opportunity to socialize without leaving my wife alone with the burden of her care for too long.

Well, sharing with your wife and daughter certainly is socializing. Congratulations that you have your baby, you two ! God bless you prayer for you all

I think you know enough how having a baby is a special blessing and trust of God. But we can let ourselves get tricked into feeling a child is a liability and restriction. But do you suppose our Heavenly Father feels restricted by having all of us?????

I think of how Paul and Silvanus and Timothy say they related with the Thessalonians >

"as a nursing mother cherishes her own children" (in 1 Thessalonians 2:7)!!!

So, in being with nursing mothers, these great men learned how to love God's children, I see from this. Nursing mothers were their seminary for learning how to take care of children of God. And marriage can be a person's research laboratory for making breakthrough discoveries in how to share in a close relationship in God's love.

So, possibly you are exactly where you can get the most challenging interesting satisfying education, that we can get learning how to love.

 

[Ayenew]

Hello.
I am new to this forum and come here for advice. Please excuse that this post is long. This is because it concerns something that I'm not able to discuss with anyone at all for reasons detailed in the post.
My name is Nicholas Milton. I am a teacher, living in Vietnam. I am from the UK and have been living in Vietnam for over 3 years. I am 32 and married with a daughter who is 7 months old. I am a Christian. I was raised by a Christian mother and a secular father and attended church as a child and inconsistently as a teenager and adult.

I don’t have any friends in this country. I am friendly with my colleagues but don’t spend any time with them outside of work. I also have a baby daughter, giving little opportunity to socialize without leaving my wife alone with the burden of her care for too long. I would also find it difficult to talk about issues such as the following with any of my colleagues or anyone else I know because I’m not aware of anyone that I think would be able to relate to any of it. This is why I’ve written this; as an appeal for advice and as a means of expressing what I think and feel every day.

I was taught by both the church and my mother that god has a plan and a purpose for the lives of individual disciples. I have always prayed for his guidance in my decisions. I have prayed about education and jobs as well as other big decisions. To be honest, I was rarely aware of any kind of clear answer. There was a time when I believe god tried to guide me, but I only became aware of that in retrospect as at the time I was too stubborn to listen, clearly to the point of being beyond even able to hear him. Since leaving school I lived with a sense of purposelessness in my life. I still do. I’ve often reached out to god in prayer to give me direction or purpose in life but I’ve never been aware of his answers. There’re times when I put a lot of effort, time and care into seeking him through prayer, bible reading and fasting and there’re times when I back off from those things and don’t practice them because they can be exhausting and seem so futile. The times when I do seek god in these ways are usually prompted by something that’s ‘stirred up my faith’, such as interaction with another ‘holy spirit’ filled Christian, as you might say. Those stints of god-seeking have often lead to an even greater sense of frustration, confusion and disappointment with this faith as they have never lead to what I want – clear direction from god. It is not only direction that I want, but any intimacy, any closeness, contact or connection with him. The only clarity of instruction of any kind that I can find from god is in his bible. I am far more able to trust the bible than I am any other aspect of this faith – prayer, fasting, praise and worship, fellowship or even god himself. I read the bible frequently and it is very useful for godly living. But god is very much just a concept in my life now.

When I was a child, my relationship with god was very different. I remember it and it resembled what I read in the new testament much more closely than my current relationship with god. The interaction, intimacy and closeness with Jesus was there and in all honestly, it is the memory of that relationship that keeps me involved with the religion of Christianity at all. I would very happily have forgotten this religion completely if it wasn’t for that memory. Today and since I was around 13, Jesus and god are both concepts in the bible only, and, if it wasn’t for the memory of my childhood relationship with Jesus, I would have quickly disregarded the bible too, even If I did find it useful and full of wisdom because, well, I'd probably view life as being to short to subject yourself to rules.
There’re times when I can’t escape the fact that I’ve done everything that the bible tells me I am supposed to do in order to seek god. There’re times when I look around at others, then look at myself and come to the conclusion that belief in god makes so little sense and is only the outcome of the human desire to feel as though the world around us is controlled and can be explained and that we’re therefore safer than if it wasn’t. That’s without even beginning to list the drawbacks of practicing the Christian religion. The confusion. The cognitive dissonance. The guilt. The misunderstandings. The narrow, indistinct line between faith and fundamentalism.

I would’ve made decisions differently if it wasn’t for this belief, the belief that god plans for the lives of individuals and has a purpose for them. I believed it because I’ve often felt so hopeless in my own potential and prospects. Is that my misunderstanding? I’m led to my question here. What am I doing wrong? Why is this like this? Thank you for reading this far and any advice would be appreciated.
Nicholas.

Hi Nicholas, I may be naive (as I am new for "advising") and I am not fluent in the language too. But here is what I need to tell you.

I feel that keeping a Christian spirit while alone is difficult. I have this problem for so long. (BTW my life has many similarities with yours). And yes, it's hard (and may be "boring") to live as a Christian without the Spirit of God in us. I always get that real filling of Christianity after Sunday services and continues for the week (decreasing in strength). So, try to get Chritians and have communion with them. Or atleast try to make your Sunday (Lord's day) free for Lord and spend it spiritually, may be with your family.

At last, be happy that you have your childhood good memories. It may be arranged by God to keep you with Him until the day of His visiting.