Confession and Repentance?

[Wordkeeper]

I mean what you wrote, and now are continuing to write, is just all wrong.

Well let's go through the claims one by one. The first main conclusion:

"Justification, being found righteous by God, in the old covenant was conditional on humility, and being lifted up, exalted, was forgiveness."

That is supported by this Scripture passage:

Luke 18:13But the tax collector, standing some distance away, was even unwilling to lift up his eyes to heaven, but was beating his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me, the sinner!' 14"I tell you, this man went to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."

The publican, poor uneducated soul, read the Scriptures and understood that God required all the commandments to be observed. He knew he couldn't be compliant and turned to God's mercy for forgiveness.

The Pharisee decided for himself, after being educated, that the recipients of God's blessings were those who were Abraham's seeds, identified by praying, tithing and fasting. He omitted justice, mercy and loyalty, since these were not attributes unique to Jews. He was so happy that his education allowed him to be compliant , kosher, unlike the publican he looked down on, who was isolated from the teachings of the temple. Ironically, His rationalisation deprived him of the benefits of the old covenant.

So what specifically is wrong with this claim?

 

[Steeno7]

Whether the "claims" are correct or not, it is the conclusions you draw from them that is just all wrong.

 

[NonTheologian]

To "repent" one totally walks away and does away with a sinful behavior in their life, but confession is not the same as repentance (it may be the beginning of repentance)

Actually, I think it means more than that. The Greek word is "metanoia", which has its root in the word "nous". "Nous" is a difficult word to translate and it doesn't appear by itself in the New Testament, although it does show up attached to many words (e.g. dianoia, or reason). It carries the meaning of inner being, a spiritual core which seeks to understand truth.

As such, I think the Greek word which "repent" attempts to convey in English refers not to so much a turning away from sin, as a complete re-orientation of one's life towards God. In the eastern Christianity, repentance is understood not to be some one-time request for forgiveness, but rather a life-time process of orienting and re-orienting one's life toward God. It is a continuous inner struggle, in which we are helped by God.

 

[Wordkeeper]

Whether the "claims" are correct or not, it is the conclusions you draw from them that is just all wrong.

Your post indicates a setting of ways. Are you really interested in seeing the gospel make you fruitful? How do you propose to discuss? Maybe you should make the claims and I can rebut them. Ball is in your court...

 

[Steeno7]

Your post indicates a setting of ways. Are you really interested in seeing the gospel make you fruitful? How do you propose to discuss? Maybe you should make the claims and I can rebut them. Ball is in your court...

Stick a fork in yourself, it looks like you're done.

 

[Wordkeeper]

Stick a fork in yourself, it looks like you're done.

Sure, I'm done with continuing with the futile discussion, as your post indicates an inability to accept truth.

You blew of the whole view, without having a reason. You then dismissed specifics, again without having any counter for the claim. As Christ said:

Matthew 11:1'We played the flute for you, and you did not dance; we sang a dirge, and you did not mourn.'

Now I'm trying, maybe futility as well, to remove the cause:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/tribalism

Simple Definition of tribalism

• : loyalty to a tribe or other social group especially when combined with strong negative feelings for people outside the group

 

[Wordkeeper]

Actually, I think it means more than that. The Greek word is "metanoia", which has its root in the word "nous". "Nous" is a difficult word to translate and it doesn't appear by itself in the New Testament, although it does show up attached to many words (e.g. dianoia, or reason). It carries the meaning of inner being, a spiritual core which seeks to understand truth.

As such, I think the Greek word which "repent" attempts to convey in English refers not to so much a turning away from sin, as a complete re-orientation of one's life towards God. In the eastern Christianity, repentance is understood not to be some one-time request for forgiveness, but rather a life-time process of orienting and re-orienting one's life toward God. It is a continuous inner struggle, in which we are helped by God.

Many terms have the same meaning, for example, faith, loyalty, being in Christ. Reiteration is used so that if one statement doesn't register, another will.

Repentance, being born again is another synonymical group. Repentance is changing a world view, leaving Egypt and following God to rest in Canaan, leaving the world and following Christ, switching loyalty from serving mammon to serving God, living to gain superficial treasure to living to gain treasure that does not perish, treasure that really matters, treasure that has currency in the world to come, olam haba.

 

[PanDeVida]

To "repent" one totally walks away and does away with a sinful behavior in their life, but confession is not the same as repentance (it may be the beginning of repentance)

What if one does actually confess and ask forgiveness for/from their sin, but they still do it the very next day... Say this person dies in this/that state of confessing but not repenting, if this person died, would they be saved?

How long do we get away with confession without repenting?

Does a person who never confesses, or has a prayer life headed for hell?

Comments?

God Bless!

Hello Neogaia, first of all we must realize that Scripture states on how we are to approach in order that we have our sins confessed.

One way is that we must for give each other the sins we have committed against our brothers and sisters as it says so in Scripture in: James 5:16Confess therefore your sins one to another: and pray one for another, that you may be saved.

However it does not stop at James 5: 16 we also MUST confess our sins we have committed against God, i.e. breaking any of the ten commandments and this kind of confessing our sins we MUST go to the Apostles, Christ said so Himself, in John 20: 21He said therefore to them again: Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you. 22When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost. 23Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.

Neogaia, we the laity MUST forgive at all times the sins that we commit against each other, 70 X 7 X, if we do not forgive our brothers and sisters, then we shall not be forgiven ourselves and we will be lost. HOWEVER! The Apostles/Church CAN retain our sins, again, Jesus Christ said it, Jesus Christ gave such power to His Church founded on Rock to FORGIVE sins or RETAIN sins.

Neogaia, Jesus referring ONLY to the Apostles stated: "As the Father hath sent me, I also send you". To do what??? The answer and the Truth is, that the Father sent Jesus into the world to forgive or retain our us, and by the Lord breathing on His Apostles, gave them the Holy Spirit, to His Apostles to forgive us or retain our sins.

Neogaia, nowhere in Scripture, will you find that Jesus Christ said to the Apostles, tell the people to come straight to ME in order that I may forgive them or retain their sins.

Yes, it is good thing to go straight to Jesus Christ, to ask for his forgiveness, I do this many times throughout the day and night!!! However, it is the Lords will that He wants us to go and seek forgiveness from his Church, founded on Rock, it is the Lords words not mine.

Neogaia, so where can we have this forgiveness, of His Breath of the Holy Spirit given to His Apostles and to their successor by the Laying on of Hands for the forgiveness of our sins or have them retained, today??? If you find this Church you would find the Church that was founded on Rock, there can only be one.

The Church is there for the sinners and it is there we have forgiveness, thus the reason for a Church.