Concerned about some of the fruits of my wife's spirit

Les Castor

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I was very lucky to marry my best friend 8 years ago so every day I am very very thankful for that. However, I have been doing a lot of praying lately and am starting to get concerned about some of the fruits of my wife's spirit.
First of all, I better clarify what I have been taught about good and bad fruit. Our pastor had said that the fruits to look for are not the big things we do consciously because for the most part we all know how a Christian should act so it is easy to put on a good act. But the things to really look for are the small things that are done or if habit and even more telling are the things that a person thinks are "not big deals".
Anyways I have been married to my wife for 8 years but we knew of each other pretty much since 9th grade, became friends junior year of college and dated senior year and got married 2 weeks after she graduated. In all the time I have know her she had always been the wilder one where as I have always been more calm and disciplined. Also yes she professes Christianity, we actually became friends when she joined the campus ministry some time during junior year. Before that she was much wilder and we ran with different crowds. She actually calmed down a lot that first year in our ministry. Before that she was constantly in trouble for things like drinking , shoplifting, and disorderly conduct. Actually one of the first things we did as friends was picking up trash at a park because she had to complete her community service for stealing a pair of boots and she didn't want to go alone. Well after joining our ministry she calmed down a whole lot and straightened out. When we started dating she still had some of her tendencies and I would remind her to think about what Jesus would want and over time it seemed that she pretty much got it. After 10 years she still needs the occasional reminder but it seemed that the mischievous spark in her had been replace with the light of faith. At least that's what I believed until I accompanied her on a recent business trip.
Last November my wife told me that she was going on one of her many business trips to her company's head office in Edmonton 4 days before Christmas and that she would be there until the 5th of January. To me this seemed very odd since during that 2 week period there were a total of 5 holidays. It would make no sense to fly some one in for 10 working days when 5 of those were company holidays. Since we have a lot of trust in the relationship I said OK.
I knew the holy spirit was telling me to say something because I had this nagging feeling pestering me to press her for more information. So later that day I pressed her for more details and she conceded that her supervisor, who is stationed out of the Edmonton office was having a blow out Christmas party followed by a blow out new years party and she was invited. This really didn't sit well with me because I thought she was lying about the nature of the trip. She said that she wasn't lying, she said that her supervisor scheduled her to be in the head office for "training" and an "inspection" ergo this trip would be a business trip and since she was in town anyways she would attend the parties when she was off work hours. I told her that to me this seems really really sketchy and that I didn't like it, she then told me that if I felt felt uncomfortable I was welcome to tag along but she could not cancel her trip. Again I felt the holy spirit telling me to go so I said I would go but an air ticket for me was a little out of our budget right now. She said that it was fine and charged it to her company card. To me this didn't seem correct but I went along with it since she was dead set on going.
On the day of our flight we had to check our bags, she checked her two bags with her company card. When it was my turn she wanted to use her company card but I told her no and that it wasn't correct to use her company card for a personal expense, she rolled her eyes but then let me pay.
When we first got there it was actually pretty pleasant, it was snowing and I had never been to Canada and it was absolutely beautiful. We went directly to her company's head office and we were met by a couple young guys and girls. She introduced me as "the ball and chain" and told them that her dance cards for both parties were full. They seemed like a nice group of kids, one of them gave her a set of keys and then took her to her company truck. The first thing she did when we got to her truck was take snow and pack it to the bumper to cover up the licence plate. I asked her what she was doing and she replied that there are a lot of red light and speed camera in Alberta so it's important to keep the plates covered up since the company will take the tickets directly out of her check. I then asked her, if she knows there are cameras everywhere shouldn't she just obey the speed limit and stop at the red lights. That's when the young guy who took us to the truck just laughed and made some joke about how in that case it would be cheaper to just hire a helicopter to fly her around when ever she is in town (basically implying that this is normal for her when ever she goes to Edmonton). I didn't feel comfortable but I didn't want to embarrass my wife in front of her coworker so I just kept my criticism to my self.
We went to drop off our stuff at the hotel and to go eat, I noticed that she was driving extremely aggressively, I gently reminded her to keep cool and for the most part she reigned it in. Lunch, sightseeing and dinner were all fun, Canada at this time of year is a winter wonderland. I did notice though that I was gently correcting her behavior slightly more than at home in the states. Initially I just chalked it up to my anxiety of being in a new place.
The next day she said that she needed to go into work for her "inspection/training session" and told me I was welcome to either stay in the hotel, or she could drop me off at the indoor Waterpark or I could come with her. Again I felt that God was prompting me to go with her so I did. When we got there she showed me to her office and it was very nice, and we meet up with that group of youngsters from the day before and they were all super nice.
I noticed that no one was really working, everyone was just hanging out and talking. I asked her what was going on and that I thought that she had work to do. She responded by saying "what work? it's the Friday before Christmas there isn't anything to do". She reaffirmed that the whole reason she was flown in was for the two parties and that she just needs to sit in the office for at least a couple hours to justify the air ticket, hotel, car, and food stipend. I asked her and the other guys there if that really was OK and they all laughed and told me to just "relax". Then one of the girls suggested that we should all go skiing at Snow Valley because they were doing all day lift passes half off that day. Apparently my wife is the most senior of the group so they all looked to her, she said that it's against company policy but since "the boss" (her supervisor) isn't in, it should be fine. I wanted to speak up but everyone was chanting snow valley by that time. As we were about to climb into the truck her supervisor pulled up, blocked her truck in, got out and started shouting at her. He demanded to know where everyone was going and why her rear plate was covered up with snow. I honestly thought my wife was about to be fired. Then I realized it was all a joke when he berated her for not dusting the snow packed on the plate with fresh powder to make it look "natural". They both laughed and he gave her a really big hug and she introduced him to me. Again she introduced me as the ball and chain. We all chatted for a few minutes and she told him that we were going to snow valley, instead of telling everyone to go back to work he told us to get him 2 lift tickets too and that he would meet us out there once he picks up his wife. So we all went skiing, it was a lot of fun but it didn't seem right.
The rest of the trip was pretty much like this too. The days we spent in the office were filled with horseplay and gossip, and very little work, and the parties were blowouts. There was a lot of drink and even some Marijuana use. At the first party, when the Marijuana pipe was passed to my wife, I quickly reminded her that she shouldn't be smoking pot, she simply waved it off by saying it's legal in Canada. Then some one yelled for her to blow smoke rings which she happily obliged. This tells me again this is normal behavior for her when she is in Canada on her business trips. I didn't say anything at the time because I didn't want to cause her any embarrassment in front of her coworkers.
In the two weeks we were in Canada, there were a lot of "little things" I just held my tongue on since at the time I just figured this is a different culture so who am I to judge. To be fair to my wife, she didn't do anything particularly awful and from the stories I heard about her from her boss, her coworkers and her Canadian friends, she gets a bit rowdy when she is in Edmonton but no one had any thing negative to say about her virtue as a wife or otherwise so at the time I figured this may just be a when in Rome type situation.
However, as I reflected more on the "when in Rome " justification, I began to get concerned. Mainly because that's exactly the issue the early church had with Rome. We as Christians are not suppose to be life the Romans. That's when I prayed more and remembered what our pastor said about the fruits of the spirit and what to watch out for. Like I said she doesn't do anything particularly terrible, but it seemed that when she is away from home more of her true nature, the wild free spirited party girl comes out. So that's why I am concerned. I am concerned that it seems like in her heart of hearts she sees no issues with abusing company funds (like the unfaithful servant), she is not concerned about the laws of the land (not submitting to authority), and that she sees nothing wrong with mind altering substances (be not impaired).
Now that we are back home she seems so much more careful about her behavior. She is much more demure, and cautious. So the question is, what is the state of her spirit? When she behaves her self is it because she has the holy spirit dwelling within her or is it her conconciously telling herself she must act a certain way to please those around her?
Is this something that we should talk about and what would be the best way to do it.
 

akmom

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That's a dangerous road to go down. I mean nitpicking your wife's behavior and second-guessing whether she is applying scripture correctly in her everyday actions. It is our own lives that we should go over with a fine-toothed comb, not others'.

Eight years is a long time. I think that demonstrates that she has come a long way from her wayward youth and stuck with it. It also sounds like you have a remarkable amount of trust in your marriage, such that she is willing to accommodate your concerns and absorb you into her plans. Be careful about expressing too much generic disapproval about how she conducts the minutiae in her life. Although some of her decisions sound questionable, it also sounds like she has a good grasp of workplace expectations. If you go down that road, you might compel your wife to secrecy. No one wants to feel constantly criticized.
 
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snoochface

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Was there texas BBQ made from smokers shaped like trains, and cut precisely with Katanas and music from Kid Rock at this blowout shindig her boss was having?

tenor.gif
 
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Blade

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For me.. I am only hearing one side not hers. For me this something one takes to talks to their pastor..someone strong in the lord. I understand your looking for hope help.. but.. again shes not here. And.. its not about her its about you. What can you do better? Christ said take that PLANK out of your eye then you can take the speck out of your brothers/wifes eye to help :)

Look at this as if someone else wrote it. Should not you be seated with your wife and telling her how you feel? No one controls us...no ONE should live their life do what I do.. I would not will not allow somethings to happen. This is something I did NOT DO EVER NIGHT! NO one should. I have done things wrong.. I remember the Church would do things.. and no way I wanted to go with them.. my wife did.. she kept going.. I later did go also :) Its not what my WIFE should be doing different that I think believe she should...its about ME...I live my life for Christ.

There are things I will not stand for.. I will not allow to happen. But again.. if one does this STAND over night...it could really ruin things..take a strong turn south.

I would talk to my wife about all this.. but if I came across as if SHE was guilty not doing things I think she should do.. NOT GOING to turn out good. We need Christ driving.. if you dont pray together start.. make it SO simple.. hey lets pray for the food.. Thanks Jesus for the food.. lol.. start small..

But know this.. KNOW THIS! BELIEVE THIS.. JESUS CHRIST is IN YOU! IN HER. HE loves you..loves her.. He sees you as ONE. She does not have to be there for you to demand satan take his hand off..her off your house.. find what the WORD OF GOD says.. Ask the Father to help you what to pray. Alone.. I tell the devil this is MY HOUSE and He has no right to it ..not in it..nor around my kids or my wife.. I pray the JOY OF THE LORD is HER strength and God fill her with the power of God.. on and on.. GOOD THINGS.. not HOPING He will do it. His words says if I KNOW He hears me.. I have the petitions I have asked for. His will is His word..


Hmm when my little boy was like 4. He really really liked this girl Adena..soooo cute. Yet she would have nothing to do with him. What I KNOW... Children listen so easy...God is the expert as "whispering".. So we prayed. Not long.. as I came to pick him up one day.. he got up.. the only one.. she got up.. came over and hugged him. SO made his world..

I am not my wifes God.. There are things as a husband I have the RIGHT to say and do.. always in love..always for Christ so on so forth.. but.. talk to her. But Christ HAS to be the center... work on that. But love her just as she is... dont try to change her.. change you to help her more.. love her more...makes no sence to the world..but Christ 1st loved us.. how does HE treat you?

KNOW that you know when you pray give this to HIM.. KNOW HE WILL make it right.. and know this have faith that GOD SAID "He that started a good work in you WILL FINISH IT!" Yeah.. what your GOD your Father started in your wife.. HELLO..HE WILL finish it.. HE NEVER loses... EVER!

I would talk to the pastor.. together if you can...
 
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DZoolander

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^_^ Zoolander, must every post that nitpicks a spouse be hers?? I thought this one was safe because it's "him" posting!
That’s really the only effective difference lol

Of course I could be wrong :)
 
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Rescued One

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If your spouse is imperfect, remember that you are, too! Fruit of the Spirit comes from the Spirit.

Perhaps she was never a Christian. God makes Christians, not boyfriends or husbands. Pointing out shortcomings doesn't work. we are called to pray.
 
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Les Castor

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That's a dangerous road to go down. I mean nitpicking your wife's behavior and second-guessing whether she is applying scripture correctly in her everyday actions. It is our own lives that we should go over with a fine-toothed comb, not others'.

Eight years is a long time. I think that demonstrates that she has come a long way from her wayward youth and stuck with it. It also sounds like you have a remarkable amount of trust in your marriage, such that she is willing to accommodate your concerns and absorb you into her plans. Be careful about expressing too much generic disapproval about how she conducts the minutiae in her life. Although some of her decisions sound questionable, it also sounds like she has a good grasp of workplace expectations. If you go down that road, you might compel your wife to secrecy. No one wants to feel constantly criticized.
Our church teaches OSAS and salvation by faith and not works. We don't believe backsliding is possible but there is a HUGE caveat. That caveat being the once saved part is the hard part... We are taught that works are not necessary but the HUGE but to that is if one has true faith it shows in your actions or more specifically your reactions. And our pastor teaches that actions is not necessarily feeding the hungary or clothing the cold or good deeds, it is more how one makes a default snap decision when confronted with a issue. Is your default righteous or is it wicked? So basically what would you do without thinking it through. Like I said my wife hasn't done anything truly heinous or awful in the near 14 years I have known her. She like my self like everyone had made some bad decisions. And you are right she does a whole lot fewer dumb things than she did in high school or college. Now the but to that is, some of the things she still does show she still has some ways to go, but that can be said of any one me included. What concerns me is she acts different when she is travelling than when she is at home. Again it is small things, it's not like she is a nun at home but a bank robbing harlot when she is traveling. She just seems to get "comfortable" and does little things she won't do at home (lIke she never covers up her plates here at home and I was surprised she smoked weed in Canada since I hadn't seen her smoke since college). Which makes me think she acts a certain way in front of me and her friends and family here. The reason I am concerned is because it makes me wonder if she was ever saved or if she was putting on an outward show. If the latter is the case that would make me very sad because that would mean we won't spend eternity together. I am going to be frank, none of the objectionable stuff she does would actually hurt or really even affect me. And you are right she is really good about accommodating my concerns but really my concerns shouldn't be what drives her behavior. This is where all that obey (and just in case you are keeping score I am not the one who needs to be obeyed) comes into play. She shouldn't be doing something or not doing something because I say so our not. Her actions should be driven by her obedience to God and Jesus. So really if I wasn't married to her I may roll my eyes at her behavior. Even as her husband none of the stuff she does really affects the household, she isn't a cheater, and if she gets a ticket or doing something dumb like driving with an obscured plate we may have to go out to eat one or two times less to pay the ticket but ultimately nothing she does really is a detriment to the marriage . However since I would really like for her to be saved I would always worry if her actions are indicative of not being saved. Not necessarily because I think covering a licence plate or smoking a little pot will condemn one to hell, but more that she would act one way in one place and another in another makes me question if her sense of right and wrong based more on pleasing God or pleasing men. I am not worried about her keeping secrets from me because ultimately I won't be her final judge. So I guess I am wondering how valid is our church's view on OSAS? Should I encourage my wife to get more involved with a women's group in church?
Make sense?
 
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Les Castor

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If your spouse is imperfect, remember that you are, too! Fruit of the Spirit comes from the Spirit.
That is very true and I acknowledge that I am not perfect. But what you say about the fruit of the spirit is what concerns me. Like I have said nothing she does is particularly bad. But the fact that the way she behaves different when in different environments and different peer groups is what makes me concerned. I have know this woman for over 14 years and I have seen some of the really idiotic things she has done when in the wrong crowd. I remember when she first joined our campus youth group and she was still dealing with the "legacy" of her wilder behavior (one of the first things we did as friends was we went to pick up trash together to satisfy a community service obligation she had for shoplifting boots). I remember the other time when she was part of our youth group and a few of us went to court with her after she shoplifted a subsequent time. None of us judged her for it we just were there to comfort her through her ordeal. And I told her back then too that although I think she did wrong, I still care for her and that I hope for her own sake she wouldn't do that again in the future. Back then in a fit if rage she accused us of judging her and I just told her frankly that none of us were the ones she had to really worry about judging her if you know what I mean. I may have been out of line back then but I actually told her that objectively speaking we really have no stake in her salvation other than our commandment to love one another, it's not like any one else would be sent to hell to burn on her behalf.
Now more than 10 years later, she is a lot better but I still worry. On the temporal level I am afraid if she is around the wrong people she would fall back into those behaviors and have to contend with temporal authorities and on a spiritual level I am afraid that her heart really didn't change and we wouldn't fulfill our vows to only be temperairly separated by death.
Perhaps she was never a Christian. God makes Christians, not boyfriends or husbands. Pointing out shortcomings doesn't work. we are called to pray.
This is what is bothering me. She professes Christianity but is she really Christian? Our pastor says that in a way it is easier to save an atheist it a Muslim than it is to save some one who claims Christianity but didn't truly accept the holy spirit. He says that in the case of the Muslim and the atheist they may heat the gospel and then realize they need a savior but in the case of the one who claims Christianity he may believe he had already accepted the spirit but really still worship mammon and would not realize that mammon controls his heart until he is before that white throne.
 
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mina

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It totally sounds like the Texas lady with the Kung-fu husband, LOL!!!! I have to say she was one of my favorite posters of all time. She was also super obsessed with OSAS.

Anyways, if this is real..... and your wife's behavior bothers you, you have to learn to talk to her. And maybe read the Bible together- iron sharpens iron sort of thing.
 
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snoochface

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Also entertaining this for the moment...

1) Do you see OTHER fruits of the Spirit from your wife?

2) Do you realize that your "little corrections" are not for you to do because you are not her Holy Spirit?
 
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DZoolander

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No, but God cares when you act disingenuously.

Why would you believe that when the face that someone presents to say...their children...isn't the same face that they present socially is a sin? Or think that would pose God a problem?
 
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DZoolander

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For example, to some people at work, I'm their boss. To some other people at work, I'm their subordinate. To some people I'm a confidant. To some people I'm their buddy from HS. To one person I'm a husband. To others I'm this... to others I'm that. My behaviors aren't uniform across the board. Are you saying that's being disingenuous?
 
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mama2one

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your wife is fortunate to work for a company that will foot the bill for a 10 day vacation with spouse including airplane & hotel

can't imagine what type of company that would spend thousands of dollars for their employees and spouses at a peak travel holiday time when hotels are most expensive


so I'd question her working for that company as something feels very off about it
 
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