Churches have finally awakened! Call for an end to Israeli occupation of arab lands!

[Micah68]

Not until the invention of the printing press, telecom, Raido , TV, internet etc. the prophecy of the Gospel being shared with the WHOLE WORLD was not possible until the 20th century.

Just an obvious example. 1 of many.

And where is this Bible verse, and the many others on this topic, located?

 

[Micah68]

I would hope my brides hair would take a very long time to groom....hahahaha

But seriously.

Genesis 17 : 8 The whole land of Canaan, where you are now an alien, I will give as an

( EVERLASTING )

possession to you and your descendants after you; and I will be their God.

Can you explain to me why Abraham paid for a piece of promised land to bury Sarah. In Abraham's Own Words,
Gen. 23:4
"I am an alien and a stranger among you. Sell me some property for a burial site here so that I can bury my dead."
Gen. 23:16
Abraham agreed to Ephron’s terms and weighed out for him the price he had named in the hearing of the Hittites: four hundred shekels of silver, according to the weight current among the merchants.

This after God made the 'everlasting covenant'.

 

[gwynedd1]

Obviously there are those who are not logical if it means reading the Bible in the grammatical structure it is given and believing God knows how to communicate to humans.

No, they have to distort the definition of simple words like "forever" "jew" and "Israel" to fit a preconceived agenda of prejudice against jews.

Yes, they have been vomited out of the land on a few occasions...and yet have always returned since 650 B.C.

Just a coincidence? Yeah, right....

Hello Yod,

Poor logic seems applicable to your position. I cannot resolve how earthly Israel can satisfy a promise for eternity.
Taking a thouand year period, for example, at its end, would it not constitute a betrayal by God deferred? I have not seen an answer to this. Considering the NT talks only of spiritual Israel I can hardly see a contrived agenda of ignoring earthly Israel as having a Godly purpose after Christ ented his Kingdom.
It is also a false notion that to consider Jews as being the same as any other to mean being against them. Strange how not considering a group to be God's people means "against" them. You could argue a poor interpretation of the Bible or simply consider one an unbeliever but pointing out that a group of people is not like any other is not being against them.

 

[gwynedd1]

I would hope my brides hair would take a very long time to groom....hahahaha

But seriously.

Genesis 17 : 8 The whole land of Canaan, where you are now an alien, I will give as an

( EVERLASTING )

possession to you and your descendants after you; and I will be their God.

Hello Carey,

Please explain how an Earth that will pass away can fulfill and eternal promise?
As to literalism it seems a matter of picking and choosing. What is the World?

John 12

The Pharisees then said to one another, "You see, you can do nothing. Look, the world has gone after him!"

The context certainly is more important than the term "World". Its not literally the World here.


It is also interesting that this scripture is taken symbolically by many Dispensationalist positions that I have seen. Rather than a Resurrection it is used to symbolize Israel. However the symbolism point of view is discarded in Revelation so that both my be made to fit the point of view.


Ezekiel 37

The hand of the Lord came upon me, and he brought me out by the spirit of the Lord and set me down in the middle of a valley; it was full of bones. 2He led me all round them; there were very many lying in the valley, and they were very dry. 3He said to me, ‘Mortal, can these bones live?’ I answered, ‘O Lord God, you know.’ 4Then he said to me, ‘Prophesy to these bones, and say to them: O dry bones, hear the word of the Lord. 5Thus says the Lord God to these bones: I will cause breath* to enter you, and you shall live. 6I will lay sinews on you, and will cause flesh to come upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath* in you, and you shall live; and you shall know that I am the Lord.’

 

[Carey]

Originally Posted by Carey
Not until the invention of the printing press, telecom, Raido , TV, internet etc. the prophecy of the Gospel being shared with the WHOLE WORLD was not possible until the 20th century.

Just an obvious example. 1 of many.

And where is this Bible verse, and the many others on this topic, located?

matthew 24 :
14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

 

[Carey]

Uh...God made this promise to Abraham before he ever had any children. 'I will bless them that bless thee...' (singular) pre-Israel days. Can anyone tell me why Abraham had to pay for the only piece of 'Promised' land he owned? In fact he paid full market value for this land which turned out to be family burial plots. Could it actually have been about something more than the land? I mean we are but tennets and God the land lord. Another question, Why did Israel lose the land in the first place if it was theirs unconditionally? Weren't there conditions for keeping the land?

and then this clear command in Ezekiel 47:21-23

"You are to distribute this land among yourselves according to the tribes of israel. 22 You are to allot it as an inheritance for yourselves and for the aliens who have settled among you and who have children. You are to consider them as native born Israelites; along with you they to be allotted an inheritance among the tribes of Israel. In whatever tribe the alien settles, there you are to give him his inheritance, " declares the Sovereign Lord."

Israel was NEVER an exclussive Jewish State.

Here is why He had to pay for the land.

genesis 15 : 15 You, however, will go to your fathers in peace and be buried at a good old age. 16 In the fourth generation your descendants will come back here, for the sin of the Amorites has not yet reached its full measure."

Here the land is described

Genesis 15 :
18 On that day the LORD made a covenant with Abram and said, "To your descendants I give this land, from the river [d] of Egypt to the great river, the Euphrates- 19 the land of the Kenites, Kenizzites, Kadmonites, 20 Hittites, Perizzites, Rephaites, 21 Amorites, Canaanites, Girgashites and Jebusites."

Yes the Covenant was about MORE than just the land
of Cannan.

Genesis 17:6 I will make you very fruitful; I will make nations of you, and kings will come from you. 7 I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to come, to be your God and the God of your descendants after you. 8 The whole land of Canaan, where you are now an alien, I will give as an everlasting possession to you and your descendants after you; and I will be their God.

Exodus 1 : 6 Now Joseph and all his brothers and all that generation died, 7 but the Israelites were fruitful and multiplied greatly and became exceedingly numerous, so that the land was filled with them.12 But the more they were oppressed, the more they multiplied and spread; so the Egyptians came to dread the Israelites

Deuteronomy 1 : 7 Break camp and advance into the hill country of the Amorites; go to all the neighboring peoples in the Arabah, in the mountains, in the western foothills, in the Negev and along the coast, to the land of the Canaanites and to Lebanon, as far as the great river, the Euphrates. 8 See, I have given you this land. Go in and take possession of the land that the LORD swore he would give to your fathers—to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob—and to their descendants after them."

Joshua 1 :4 Your territory will extend from the desert to Lebanon, and from the great river, the Euphrates—all the Hittite country—to the Great Sea [a] on the west

Right the Jews did not do like the Muslims and kill all the unbelievers.

The Quran says:"'How shall I bear a child,' she [Mary] answered, 'when I am a virgin...?' 'Such is the will of the Lord,' he replied. 'That is no difficult thing for Him...God forbid that He [God[ Himself should beget a son!...Those who say: 'The Lord of Mercy has begotten a son,' preach a monstrous falsehood..." (Surah 19:12-, 29-, 88)
"Prophet make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them. Hell shall be their home." (Surah 9:73)
"...make war on the leaders of unbelief...Make war on them: God will chastise them at your hands and humble them. He will grant you victory over them..." (Surah 9:12-)

judges 1 :
Judges 1

Israel Fights the Remaining Canaanites

1 After the death of Joshua, the Israelites asked the LORD, "Who will be the first to go up and fight for us against the Canaanites?" 9 After that, the men of Judah went down to fight against the Canaanites living in the hill country, the Negev and the western foothills. 10 They advanced against the Canaanites living in Hebron (formerly called Kiriath Arba) and defeated Sheshai, Ahiman and Talmai. 28 When Israel became strong, they pressed the Canaanites into forced labor but never drove them out completely

YEs they were scattered by God for a while more than once but....

Nehemia 1 : 8 "Remember the instruction you gave your servant Moses, saying, 'If you are unfaithful, I will scatter you among the nations, 9 but if you return to me and obey my commands, then even if your exiled people are at the farthest horizon, I will gather them from there and bring them to the place I have chosen as a dwelling for my Name.'

Gods word is always fulfiiled as iy was started being fulfilled in 1948 and is still ongoing to this day.

Jeremiah 1 : 12 The LORD said to me, "You have seen correctly, for I am watching [b] to see that my word is fulfilled."

Now again scattered for ( paganism)
Zephaniah 1

4 "I will stretch out my hand against Judah
and against all who live in Jerusalem.
I will cut off from this place every remnant of Baal,

But they again started acting right and...

Zecharia 1 : 2 "The LORD was very angry with your forefathers. 3 Therefore tell the people: This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'Return to me,' declares the LORD Almighty, 'and I will return to you,' says the LORD Almighty. "Then they repented and said, 'The LORD Almighty has done to us what our ways and practices deserve, just as he determined to do.'"
16 "Therefore, this is what the LORD says: 'I will return to Jerusalem with mercy, and there my house will be rebuilt. And the measuring line will be stretched out over Jerusalem,' declares the LORD Almighty.
17 "Proclaim further: This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'My towns will again overflow with prosperity, and the LORD will again comfort Zion and choose Jerusalem

Israel since the 1967 6 day war Israel gas propered unlike anytime in their History.
So the when was definitely after Jesus .

Acts 1 : 6So when they met together, they asked him, "Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?"
7He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority

I will stop here but this I pray helps you.

 

[Carey]

Hello Yod,

Poor logic seems applicable to your position. I cannot resolve how earthly Israel can satisfy a promise for eternity.
Taking a thouand year period, for example, at its end, would it not constitute a betrayal by God deferred? I have not seen an answer to this. Considering the NT talks only of spiritual Israel I can hardly see a contrived agenda of ignoring earthly Israel as having a Godly purpose after Christ ented his Kingdom.
It is also a false notion that to consider Jews as being the same as any other to mean being against them. Strange how not considering a group to be God's people means "against" them. You could argue a poor interpretation of the Bible or simply consider one an unbeliever but pointing out that a group of people is not like any other is not being against them.

NT does speak of the land as well also what people should be doing in the land when the anti christ/beast enters the 'HOLY PLACE" or Temple.

Acts 1 : 6So when they met together, they asked him, "Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?"
7He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority

Matthew 24 : 15"So when you see standing in the holy place 'the abomination that causes desolation,'[b] spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

 

[gwynedd1]

NT does speak of the land as well also what people should be doing in the land when the anti christ/beast enters the 'HOLY PLACE" or Temple.

Acts 1 : 6So when they met together, they asked him, "Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?"
7He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority

Matthew 24 : 15"So when you see standing in the holy place 'the abomination that causes desolation,'[b] spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

Hello Carey,

Those verese are rather ambigous to the subject matter wouldn't you say? Restoring the kindom of Israel does not express what that kingdom is or where it is. "No flesh may enter the Kingdom". "My Kingdom is not of this World" is not ambiguous..

I have multiple places to make this point while you have none. Why does Paul considers Jerusalem on Earth as a city of slaves if this is the Kingdom? Are you not refering to Jerusalem in the flesh? Once again, I can find it nowhere in the New Testament that an earthly, fleshly Jerusalem has any place in the Kingdom of God.

Galations 4

22For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by a slave woman and the other by a free woman. 23One, the child of the slave, was born according to the flesh; the other, the child of the free woman, was born through the promise. 24Now this is an allegory: these women are two covenants. One woman, in fact, is Hagar, from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery. 25Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia* and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26But the other woman corresponds to the Jerusalem above; she is free, and she is our mother. 27

 

[Carey]

Hello Carey,

Those verese are rather ambigous to the subject matter wouldn't you say? Restoring the kindom of Israel does not express what that kingdom is or where it is. "No flesh may enter the Kingdom". "My Kingdom is not of this World" is not ambiguous..

I have multiple places to make this point while you have none. Why does Paul considers Jerusalem on Earth as a city of slaves if this is the Kingdom? Are you not refering to Jerusalem in the flesh? Once again, I can find it nowhere in the New Testament that an earthly, fleshly Jerusalem has any place in the Kingdom of God.

Galations 4

Isnt it clear??

God first had to return them to the land of Cannan before the Kingdom could come and land there??

How could the Israel be returned to their land if there was a new Heaven and a new earth when the Kingdom comes??

Revelations 21 :
Revelation 21

The New Jerusalem

1Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. 2I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God

 

[gwynedd1]

Isnt it clear??

God first had to return them to the land of Cannan before the Kingdom could come and land there??

How could the Israel be returned to their land if there was a new Heaven and a new earth when the Kingdom comes??

Revelations 21 :
Revelation 21

The New Jerusalem

1Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. 2I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God

Carey,

Citing the New Jerusalem in heaven does not address the Jerusalem on Earth. What is the purpose of an earthly Jerusalem if the Kingdom of God is not on earth and Christ's kingdom is not of this world? That is my question.
I can see a reason for an Earthly Jerusalem before Jesus because the kingdom required Jesus to come through Judah. After Jesus, what exactly is the point of fufilling the promised land on Earth only to break it again a 1000 years later? What does that accomplish?

 

[minister50]

If you believe the Word of the Living God and His Christ than you you know the truth and stand behind Israel. (Deuteronomy 30:7) And the LORD thy God will put all these curses upon thine enemies, and on them that hate thee, which persecuted thee. (Zechariah 2:8) For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye. (Genesis 13:14) And the LORD said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward: (Genesis 13:15) For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

 

[Micah68]

If you believe the Word of the Living God and His Christ than you you know the truth and stand behind Israel. (Deuteronomy 30:7) And the LORD thy God will put all these curses upon thine enemies, and on them that hate thee, which persecuted thee. (Zechariah 2:8) For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye. (Genesis 13:14) And the LORD said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward: (Genesis 13:15) For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

Only if they keep ALL God's commands. The forever part is God's love not a piece of real estate, as is shown repeatedly in the scriptures.


Isaiah42:6 “I, the Lord, officially commission you; 13 I take hold of your hand. I protect you 14 and make you a covenant mediator for people, 15 and a light 16 to the nations,17

Election is not a special privalege nor for Israel's own sake but rather a call to service 'to the world'. Israel was chosen in order to turn its people into witnesses to the pagans to that they too might participate in the election. Election has always ment to include, That all families on earth might be blessed through Abraham's seed (singular- Jesus Christ).

Jeremiah 9:23 58 The Lord says,“Wise people should not boast that they are wise. Powerful people should not boast that they are powerful. 59 Rich people should not boast that they are rich. 60

Jeremiah 9:24 If people want to boast, they should boast about this: They should boast that they understand and know me. They should boast that they know and understand
that I, the Lord, act out of faithfulness, fairness, and justice in the earth and that I desire people to do these things,” 61 says the Lord.


When, as a Christian, one read's the scriptures they much be read through the eyes of Christ. Christian Zionism so sadly and horribly leaves out Christ and God's GRESTEST gift to man.


Luk 22:20And in the same way he took 1 the cup after they had eaten, 2 saying, “This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant 3 in my blood.

1Co 11:25In the same way, he also took the cup after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, every time you drink it, in remembrance of me.”

2Co 3:6who made us adequate 1 to be servants of a new covenant 2 not based on the letter but on the Spirit, for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Heb 8:8But 1 showing its fault, 2 God 3 says to them, 4 “Look, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will complete a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.(This was done with Christ's spilled blood)

Heb 8:13When he speaks of a new covenant, 1 he makes the first obsolete. Now what is growing obsolete and aging is about to disappear. 2

Heb 9:15And so he is the mediator 1 of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the eternal inheritance he has promised, 2 since he died 3 to set them free from the violations committed under the first covenant.

Heb 12:24and to Jesus, the mediator 1 of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks of something better than Abel’s does. 2

 

[minister50]

As the Lord said they would, but they are still the Chosen of the Lord and His Word still stands concerning Israel.

 

[Carey]

Yahweh is, today, rescuing from ALL nations a remnant washed in the blood of the Lamb and rebuilding the fallen Tabernacle of David. Renewed Covenant Yisrael, as defined as Yehudah (Jews) and the returning House of Yisrael (Lost 10 Tribes), are becoming ONE again through the Messiah Yahshua.
Their companions are the minority of non-Yisraelites, who by the blood of Messiah, join the nation of Yisrael and become grafted into the Yisraelite Olive Tree (Romans 11). We recognize that all Jews are Yisraelites but not ALL Yisraelites are Jews.
Acts 15:14-18;
Amos 9:9-12
Ephesians 2:1-22;
Galatians 6:16;
1 Kepha 2:9;
Ezek. 37:16

 

[Micah68]

As the Lord said they would, but they are still the Chosen of the Lord and His Word still stands concerning Israel.

I will disagree with you, Israel ceased being 'choosen' when they rejected Christ. One must still understand that a Jewish person and people living in Israel (the world) is still loved the same as you or I. God loves us all and wants each for his Kingdom. Sorry the land will never achieve this.

You can not honestly believe a faithful follower of Christ and ALL his teaching is less chosen than a secular nation. When reading the entire scripture one will see that FAITHFULNESS was always a requirement for possession of the land; we are give the consequences for this disobedience. Once again you leave Christ out of this picture, could it be because he never once elevated the land above faith?

 

[gwynedd1]

If you believe the Word of the Living God and His Christ than you you know the truth and stand behind Israel. (Deuteronomy 30:7) And the LORD thy God will put all these curses upon thine enemies, and on them that hate thee, which persecuted thee. (Zechariah 2:8) For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye. (Genesis 13:14) And the LORD said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward: (Genesis 13:15) For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

Hello minister50,

So read a few sections in Genesis and Deuteronomy and read no further? Not even the whole context in Deuteronomy apparently.

Deuteronomy 30

15 See, I have set before you today life and prosperity, death and adversity. 16If you obey the commandments of the Lord your God* that I am commanding you today, by loving the Lord your God, walking in his ways, and observing his commandments, decrees, and ordinances, then you shall live and become numerous, and the Lord your God will bless you in the land that you are entering to possess. 17But if your heart turns away and you do not hear, but are led astray to bow down to other gods and serve them, 18I declare to you today that you shall perish; you shall not live long in the land that you are crossing the Jordan to enter and possess.

Matthew 8

10When Jesus heard him, he was amazed and said to those who followed him, ‘Truly I tell you, in no one* in Israel have I found such faith. 11I tell you, many will come from east and west and will eat with Abraham and Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven, 12while the heirs of the kingdom will be thrown into the outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ 13And to the centurion Jesus said, ‘Go; let it be done for you according to your faith.’ And the servant was healed in that hour.

Acts 28

25So they disagreed with each other; and as they were leaving, Paul made one further statement: ‘The Holy Spirit was right in saying to your ancestors through the prophet Isaiah,
26“Go to this people and say,
You will indeed listen, but never understand,
and you will indeed look, but never perceive.
27For this people’s heart has grown dull,
and their ears are hard of hearing,
and they have shut their eyes;
so that they might not look with their eyes,
and listen with their ears,
and understand with their heart and turn—
and I would heal them.”
28Let it be known to you then that this salvation of God has been sent to the Gentiles; they will listen.’* 30 He lived there for two whole years at his own expense* and welcomed all who came to him, 31proclaiming the kingdom of God and teaching about the Lord Jesus Christ with all boldness and without hindrance.

Let it be known that Paul in Romans 11 said the remnant of Israel will also be included in the kingdom however there are many more from the world itself. This is specifically Christian Jews as our fellows. To follow and worship a people who specifically deny Christ is the essence of folly.

 

[gwynedd1]

As the Lord said they would, but they are still the Chosen of the Lord and His Word still stands concerning Israel.

minister50,

Do you have any supporting scripture for this in the New Covenant?

Please explain Paul's "error".

Galations 5

2 Listen! I, Paul, am telling you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no benefit to you. 3Once again I testify to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obliged to obey the entire law. 4You who want to be justified by the law have cut yourselves off from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. 5For through the Spirit, by faith, we eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness. 6For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything; the only thing that counts is faith working* through love.

 

[Tanakh]

I will disagree with you, Israel ceased being 'choosen' when they rejected Christ. One must still understand that a Jewish person and people living in Israel (the world) is still loved the same as you or I. God loves us all and wants each for his Kingdom. Sorry the land will never achieve this.

You can not honestly believe a faithful follower of Christ and ALL his teaching is less chosen than a secular nation. When reading the entire scripture one will see that FAITHFULNESS was always a requirement for possession of the land; we are give the consequences for this disobedience. Once again you leave Christ out of this picture, could it be because he never once elevated the land above faith?

NO!! The world states that we Jews rejected Jesus, the false prophet, and thus no Torah true Jew should ever listen to the "message" of the evil book called the gospel. We Jews rejected Jesus, although how can we reject someone who never even existed is beyond me, for a very good reason in that how can we give up our Torah for a more "updated" law that G-d supposedly gave to a Jew who deliberately changed the law to suit his own evil goals. G-d loves those who love His chosen people and His law but hates those who disobey His law as He states to those who disobey that they will be annihilated.

Deuteronomy 7:6-11 'For you are a holy people to HASHEM, your G-d; HASHEM, your G-d, has chosen you to be for Him a treasured people above all the peoples that are on the face of the earth. Not because you are more numerous than all the peoples did HASHEM desire you and choose you, for you are the fewest of all the peoples. Rather, because of HASHEM'S love for you and because He observes the oath that He swore to your forefathers did He take you out with a strong hand and redeem you from the house of slavery, from the hand of Pharaoh, king of Egypt. You must know that HASHEM, your G-d - He is the G-d, the faithful G-d, Who safeguards the covenant and the kindness for those who love Him and for those who observe His commandments, for a thousand generations. And He repays His enemies in his lifetime to make him perish; He shall not delay for His enemy - in his lifetime He shall repay him. You shall observe the commandment, and the decrees and the ordinances that I command you today, to perform them.'

And what G-d will do with Israel's enemies (the "Palestinians"):

Deuteronomy 7:17-24 'Perhaps you will say in your heart, "These nations are more numerous than I; how will I be able to drive them out?" Do not fear them! You shall remember what HASHEM, your G-d, did to Pharaoh and to all of Egypt. The great tests that your eyes saw, and the signs, the wonders, the strong hand, and the outstretched arm with which HASHEM, your G-d, took you out - so shall HASHEM, your G-d, do to all the peoples before whom you fear. Also the hornet-swarm will HASHEM, your G-d, send among them, until the survivors and hidden ones perish before you. You shall not be broken before them, for HASHEM, your G-d is among you, a great and awesome G-d. HASHEM, your G-d, will thrust these nations from before you little by little; you will not be able to annihilate them quickly, lest the beasts of the field increase against you. HASHEM, your G-d, will deliver them before you, and will confound them with great confusion, until their destruction. He will deliver their kings into your hands and you shall cause their name to perish from under the heaven; no man will stand up against you until you have destroyed them.'

Deuteronomy 8:1 'The entire commandment that I command you today you shall observe to perform, so that you may live and increase, and come and possess the land that HASHEM swore to your forefathers.'

 

[Archaeopteryx]

NO!! The world states that we Jews rejected Jesus, the false prophet, and thus no Torah true Jew should ever listen to the "message" of the evil book called the gospel. We Jews rejected Jesus, although how can we reject someone who never even existed is beyond me, for a very good reason in that how can we give up our Torah for a more "updated" law that G-d supposedly gave to a Jew who deliberately changed the law to suit his own evil goals. G-d loves those who love His chosen people and His law but hates those who disobey His law as He states to those who disobey that they will be annihilated.

I challenge you to prove your claim that Jesus was a false prophet and I challenge your understanding of a God that 'hates', regardless of what Scripture your present.

 

[Tanakh]

I challenge you to prove your claim that Jesus was a false prophet and I challenge your understanding of a God that 'hates', regardless of what Scripture your present.

I do not and will not follow the dictates of the "new testament" and therefore the verse I quoted stands firm for the verse is the word of G-d. The Torah says what it says regardless of what people think of G-d as He is "portrayed" in the "old law" as the law is the law. In order for anyone to be called the messiah they must complete their assigned task and in that they must not fail even 1 attribute that the messiah is to fulfil and sense Jewish law clearly states that the messiah will be human, yes, but that he will NOT be G-d as G-d is G-d for He is ONE therefore that alone forfeits Jesus' claim to be the "son of god". Thus it is you Christians that must "prove" that the Torah says that Jesus is in fact the messiah and that the Church is the "new Israel" as you Christians put it.