Christians who hate...

[interested in life]

agreed thanks for the good posts phinehas c u.

 

[Phinehas2]

Criada,

I can testify against someone if I am a witness to wrongdoing, without any hatred towards them!

Exactly, that’s distinguishing between the sin and the sinner.

 

[onemorequestion]

ive changed my icon to reflect more accurately my status,i cant align with what passes as christianity here.Is that hate?
I wonder why standards are regarded as hate.

Shouldn't your icon be "Christian seeker" then?

 

[onemorequestion]

wayseer,
Why is it when ever scriptures are provided to support something, liberal theology dissmisses them as selective, out of context or cherry picking, and merrily continues with its scriptural unsupportive worldview.

Liberalism is supported by the world in many powerful political places.

No - you explain it. Just where does Jesus say he 'hated' anything?

20

Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed.

As far as you are concerned, possibly John, possibly Jesus.


does this count?
John 7:7 "The world cannot hate you, but it hates me because I testify that what it does is evil."

Hate then really should be defined, or seens as "opposition to." Now that would bringing the Biblical up to speed with modern times, without having to alter truth for political power.

Excellent points Phinehas2. Stick with ideologies and not personalities and you will be most effective in every case.

 

[wayseer]

wayseer,
Why is it when ever scriptures are provided to support something liberal theology dissmisses them as selective, out of context or cherry picking, and merrily continues with its scriptural unsupportive worldview.

Anyone can use the biblical texts to support any person belief they like. We even have some here arguing that there are texts supporting the idea that jesus 'hated'.

What you have to demonstrate is a theology that supports your argument. You own experience is interesting but such experience is of little value unless you link it to something more concrete.

does this count?

Hardly. The question before the house is - what scripture supports the idea that Jesus 'hated'.

All you have provided is scripture to support the fact that we will be hated - which is a different subject.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

Let's further stipulate that the question is "is it okay for Christians to hate others?"

We know that we are to hate what is evil, but that we are to love our enemies. Nowhere in the bible are we told to hate a person.

So...try coming at it from that angle and maybe the debate about hating someTHING can end. In a thread about whether or not it's okay to hate, I find it interesting that the conversation is getting heated.

 

[Phinehas2]

wayseer,

Anyone can use the biblical texts to support any person belief they like.

Again, that doesn’t address what I said in what you quoted. Please re-read, particularly where it says

and merrily continues with its scriptural unsupportive worldview

One has to start with scripture and it needs to be in context of the Bible holistically.
People can try, and do try and use Biblical texts to support any view they like, but not in context.
However I don’t see any Biblical texts to support same sex relationships.

All you have provided is scripture to support the fact that we will be hated - which is a different subject.

In this case you have a valid point, but don’t you accept the Romans 12 verse, 'hate what is evil and cling to what is good' has come from the risen Lord or been inspired by the Spirit?

I am not saying you are necessarily wrong. But consider...
Luke 14:26 " If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple.
Most versions translate this as hate. Very much what the epistles elaborate on, the old life is dead, the new has come.
Isn't Jesus requiring hatred of something?

 

[Leah]

Some questions...

Is it okay for Christians to hate other Christians simply because they disagree with them?

Should Christians who profess that hatred continue to stew and seethe about them to other people?

Is it okay for Christians to carry grudges?

Hi PW.

No to all of your questions.

Jesus has given us the commandment to love each other even as He has loved us and love is not self-centered. He is love and any christian who says he/she loves Jesus yet hates his brother/sister for any reason is a liar. The book of 1 John says this.

A christian who hates/doesn't love is an oxymoron. Its either one or the other but you cannot be both.

The only thing we are to hate is sin and hatred of people is sin.

 

[wayseer]

wayseer, Isn't Jesus requiring hatred of something?

First up Jesus not to write those words in Romans - Paul did.

Second - learn the context.

Three - do you 'hate' your parents? Probably, and hopefully not.

Fourth - All you are doing is seeking some biblical text to support your own agenda.

If you are putting this argument forward as some theological insight then you have to follow through otherwise you are placing yourself in the position of a hypocrite or deliberate going against Christ.

In other words, stop trying to defend the indefensible.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

for those of who believe that the bible is the inerrent word of God, as He spoke to the authors, it is indeed Christ saying that.

I believe that verse refers to hating not necessarily people, but the sinful natures in people. If I have more love for my parents than I do God, I'm not doing right by God. If I hold my parents more important than God, I'm not doing right by God.

For that one verse, there are so many that tell us not to hate each other.

I'm always shocked when I find out that someone hates me, even if that person and I never got along to begin with. For me personally, I don't have time to waste hating people.

 

[Zebra1552]

No - you explain it. Just where does Jesus say he 'hated' anything?

Jesus is God. God is stated numerous times to hate evil. I don't have much to explain.

 

[Zebra1552]

Opposition is not hate.

Prove that Jesus was merely opposed.

 

[razeontherock]

Very good job of narrowing the focus of the thread! I have been told by unbelievers on CF that it is impossible to hate the sin and love the sinner. I do not find that to be so.

OTOH, one of the hardest things for me to obey is to hate evil. Being reconciled to G-d is to love what He loves, and hate what He hates. This is simply not natural for me.

Once I finally understood I am actually supposed to hate, things started changing for the better. And now I have considerably more victory! Like a car battery, you need a positive and a negative connection to get power.

This is difficult ground to walk in though. Sort of like the commandment to "be angry and sin not." It really tests our Faith.

 

[razeontherock]

Very good job of narrowing the focus of the thread! I have been told by unbelievers on CF that it is impossible to hate the sin and love the sinner. I do not find that to be so.

OTOH, one of the hardest things for me to obey is to hate evil. Being reconciled to G-d is to love what He loves, and hate what He hates. This is simply not natural for me.

Once I finally understood I am actually supposed to hate, things started changing for the better. And now I have considerably more victory! Like a car battery, you need a positive and a negative connection to get power.

This is difficult ground to walk in though. Sort of like the commandment to "be angry and sin not." It really tests our Faith.

 

[ebia]

Prove that Jesus was merely opposed.

Did Jesus say "he who has seen me has seen the father" or "he who thinks he knows the father knows me"?

As Christians we look to Jesus to see what God is like - that's a good deal of what Incarnation is all about - not look to our preconceptions about God to see what Jesus is like.

 

[Zebra1552]

Did Jesus say "he who has seen me has seen the father" or "he who thinks he knows the father knows me"?

As Christians we look to Jesus to see what God is like - that's a good deal of what Incarnation is all about - not look to our preconceptions about God to see what Jesus is like.

Red herring.

 

[ebia]

Red herring.

Not at all - its absolutely fundamental.

Is Jesus the clearest revelation of God, or is are the OT descriptions of God the clearest revelation of Jesus?

If the former, which is absolutely basic to Christianity, then you learn about God by looking at Jesus, not learn about Jesus by looking at OT descriptions of God.

If you don't allow Jesus to overturn all your ideas about God then you are stuck where so many of his 1st century opponents were.

 

[Phinehas2]

Jaws13,

Red herring.

On the contrary ebia's posts are spot on, this is absolutely fundamental. You have just doubted an absolute core fundamental of Christianity.
from the Nicene Creed...
true God of true God, (John 17: 1-5)
of one essence with the Father, (John 10: 30)

 

[Phinehas2]

wayseer,

First up Jesus not to write those words in Romans - Paul did.

Can you explain further what your point is, Jesus didn’t write any of the Bible, nor anything else as far as I am aware except in the sand at one point.

Second - learn the context.

Learn to debate rather than make one line contradictions.

Three - do you 'hate' your parents? Probably, and hopefully not.

Does it say hate even parents? I think it does, you asked. Just where does Jesus say he 'hated' anything?
Now you see where He did, and you have seen the context I have described.

Fourth - All you are doing is seeking some biblical text to support your own agenda.

No, I am seeking God’s agenda from what His Biblical testimony says, the liberal approach is to deny the Biblical testimony to support its agenda which is the same as the world’s cultures.

 

[wayseer]

Jesus is God. God is stated numerous times to hate evil. I don't have much to explain.

You have side stepped my question.

Where does Jesus say he hated anything? I cannot find any reference.

In fact Jesus says exactly the opposite - that we are to love that which we would otherwise hate - namely our enemies.

The only solution to your agenda is neatly slip back into OT philosophy. Certainly there are references to God hating evil - but you have avoided elaborating on the 'nature' of that evil. That evil was not loving God - of distancing oneself from God. This was a message to Israel.

The OP is talking about Christians. In what context are Christians taught to hate?