Christians & gun control

[caley]

I do not support anything (gun control laws, death penalty, war) that gives the government control over its citizens.

 

[Evangelion]

Does that include taxes and a social security system?

 

[Evangelion]

*Ahem*

So, I guess the "right to bare arms" is tossed out the window?

What "right to bare [sic] arms" are you talking about?

That's simply a manmade law, and like every other manmade law, it can be repealed.

There is no such thing as an inherent right to bear arms.

 

[WayneH]

Today at 05:00 AM Evangelion said this in Post #23 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=646063#post646063)

*Ahem*



What "right to bare [sic] arms" are you talking about?

That's simply a manmade law, and like every other manmade law, it can be repealed.

There is no such thing as an inherent right to bear arms.

but the fact still remains here in the US.... We have the RIGHT to Bear arms - even if that right was given by a man made law... still the law... and its not soooooooooo easy to Repeal one of the amendments to the Constitution....... Not impossible - but not probable....

 

[Evening Mist]

Does this really need to be a moral issue? I mean seriously, do you think God has an absolute standard in his mind about guns, that he applies to everyone, all the time, everwhere? Or maybe it is an area where we get to use our good common sense.

Personally, I don't feel comfortable at the thought of having a gun in the same house with my 2 small children. It just doesn't strike me as a safe situation. There will not be a gun in my home, and my children will not be allowed to visit friends in the home of a person who owns a gun. I feel the same way about other sorts of weapons -- various martial arts weapons, etc.

 

[WayneH]

Evening......

I can respect your opinion and feelings about not having guns around - but it starts with training and safety.. My daughters have been taught since they could understand that guns are not toys to be played with.. also - though I have 6 guns in My house ( all in bedroom ) there is no easy access to ammo... If I buy a handgun ( Which I intend on doing ) it will have a safety trigger...

Those I know that have guns have done the same thing in regards to teaching their children about guns.. Granted - there are many who just could care less and are careless with guns - those are the ones My children would not be able to visit.. Common sense also plays a good part in owning guns... they are not toys.... they are deadly in the wrong hands

 

[Evening Mist]

Wayne, I appreciate your respect and of course I return it.

A couple thoughts: First, are guns not deadly in *any* hands? I mean, isn't that the whole point of them?

Also, why do you need 6 guns to protect yourself? Okay -- maybe it is a hobby for you? But violence/power as a hobby confuses me.

Thirdly, my biggest fear with a gun in the house is not the my children would missuse it. They could hurt themselves by breaking into our medicine cabinet or drinking bleach. My biggest fear is that a predator would use our own gun against *us.* If you knew me - -I suspect you'd agree that I could be easily disarmed.

Finally, while there is a lot to be said for being carefull and safe, our first and last defense is the protection of our heavenly parent. I have a fair amount of confidence in that protection.

 

[Ryder]

Our heavenly parent still expects us to be prepared and not just sit there. God gave many a battle to the Isrealites, but they still had to forge and swing swords ya know.

 

[Hector Medina]

by stratyhy boy:

I might also point out the drastically lower crime rate in Canada compared to the US. We already have more gun restrictions than the US does.
The gun registration was a good idea but implemented very poorly. I think a chimp could have done a better job than our government has done.


And be sure to compare populations of: 35,000,000 ppl in Can. to 280,000,000 ppl in U.S..

Obviously Canada is going to have less crime!!!


In Christ,

Hector

 

[WayneH]

*lol* - Evening - I'm sure there are several women as well as men who could be disarmed....

you asked a legit question.. One of the guns a 22 rifle belongs to My wife.. 2nd gun is My Remington 870 pump shotgun - 3rd gun I am trying to get rid of is a bolt action shotgun - 4th is My Savage pump deer shotgun - 5th is My Remington 270 ( Anniversary present from wife ) and the 6th gun is My 50 caliber Black powder...... with the exception of the 22 rifle - they are all hunting guns..

if My daughters can not get to ammo for these guns - anyone breaking into the house will not get ammo either.. and I doubt that I will be over powered... I am a firm believer that if in danger - you need / should protect yourself and not just let that threat happen.......

your right - guns are deadly in any hands - but proper education reduces that deadly threat unless in the hands of a kook.....

I can't argue that last statement about the protection of our heavenly Father.. however - God did give us a brain to use - and unless he lets me know I am wrong - I will help in that protection........ I do not think you should arbitrarily shoot someone breaking in your house - you should use that common sense I mentioned before.. the use of deadly force should be used a defense of bodily harm not be a judge.................. have a wonderful day

 

[Evening Mist]

Wayne -- believe me when I say I am not judging you! Guns are legitimate parts of certain cultures and I respect diversity.

They are not a part of mine. Guns in suburban and urban areas carry a different sort of meaning than they do in hunting country.

If I were attacked in my home, I have neighbors within shouting distance. I'll rely on them, and on God for protection.

 

[Lacmeh]

And where does the righ tto bear arms begin and mos timportant, end?
Which guns aren´t under the constitutional right? Machine guns? Submachine guns? Automatic? Semi Automatic?
Why am I not allowed to buy a grenade launcher, small missile launcher? They are arms too.
Why I am forbidden to buy urane ammo? It´s an infringement on constitutional law, or not?

So where should the right to bear arms end?

 

[WayneH]

Thats wonderful Evening.......

I do pray that IF anything ever did happen that those around not only heard your crys but also come to your assisstance...........

actually - I wish I lived in Hunting country.. alas - I only live in the subs... but I enjoy it...... not quite country - not quite city..........

May Gods protection in his arms

 

[Evangelion]

Well...

but the fact still remains here in the US.... We have the RIGHT to Bear arms - even if that right was given by a man made law... ]still the law... and its not soooooooooo easy to Repeal one of the amendments to the Constitution....... Not impossible - but not probable....

But it's obviously possible to repeal this amendment, isn't it? So the amendment is not an unalienable right, is it? At the end of the day, it's just another law which can be eliminated by the government.

Please stop talking about the 2nd Amendment as if it's some kind of holy cow.

 

[Gunny]

Today at 01:15 PM Evangelion said this in Post #34 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=646604#post646604)

But it's obviously possible to repeal this amendment, isn't it? So the amendment is not an unalienable right, is it? At the end of the day, it's just another law which can be eliminated by the government.

The 2nd Ammendenment will never be eliminated. England disarmed it's law abiding citizens and guess what guns in the hands of the criminals is on the increase.

 

[Lacmeh]

Gunnysgt, I don´t think,t hat the increase of guns in hands of the criminals can be tied to more restrictive gun laws. Do you really believe, that more private gun owners do hinder criminals get guns?
According to this, the US should have the least armed criminals in the Western world.

 

[Gunny]

Crime is lower in states with CCW laws, in the United States.

 

[WayneH]

Today at 01:15 PM Evangelion said this in Post #34 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=646604#post646604)

Well...



But it's obviously possible to repeal this amendment, isn't it? So the amendment is not an unalienable right, is it? At the end of the day, it's just another law which can be eliminated by the government.

Please stop talking about the 2nd Amendment as if it's some kind of holy cow.

HIGHLY UNLIKELY - you need to have another amendment to abolish this amendment then you need 3/4 of each states gov. to ratify.... so No - won't be eliminated by the Gov... Heck - you can't get any State Gov. to pull together 75% of the vote..............

to top that off - its not HOLY - but things are governed by the Amendments and Constitution - everyonme throws the Constitution in Our faces to prove a point - we have the right to use it to prove our point.....

if I read correctly - there has only been one or two Amendments repealed over the last 200+ years

 

[Lacmeh]

Gunnysgt, don´t evade the issue, you didn´t post about lower crime rates.

You posted:
England disarmed it's law abiding citizens and guess what guns in the hands of the criminals is on the increase.

That is a direct correlation between more restrictive gun laws and more gun usage by criminals. Reversing the statement, The more armed citizen are, the less armed criminals are.
So is this true or not?

 

[caley]

Today at 03:56 AM Evangelion said this in Post #22

Does that include taxes and a social security system?

Have you read the caption under my name?