Christianity Can’t Be Stretched To Endorse Homosexuality

[jimmyjimmy]

In light of the Orlando massacre, The New York Times published a forum of evangelicals writing on the question, “Have Christians Created a Harmful Atmosphere for Gays?” Two noted evangelical leaders, popular blogger Julie Rodgers and professor David Gushee, represented the “yes” perspective. Remarkably, they both hold that kindness and sincere friendship toward same-sex-attracted persons is not enough. Failing to affirm their sexuality does them harm, contributing in measure to demonic actions like Orlando. They call on Christians to repent.

Rodgers admits “The Christians I know were grieved by the massacre and they want to know how to help.” But she followed her recognition with this: “The best thing they can do is repent for the ways they’ve helped create a culture that devalues L.G.B.T. people made in the image of God, and then begin to tell a better story about us in their circles.”

Not donate blood for the injured? Not prepare food for the families? Not stand quietly with and put a sympathetic arm around those mourning at vigils and memorials? These are some of the things many Christians did without hesitation that terribly dark Sunday and the days following.

Agree With Me Or Else
But we are told such things are actually harmful if not followed by full and unqualified affirmation of same-sex relationships. Gushee says exactly this, recognizing that the “typical evangelical” thankfully rejects “hate speech or any violence toward L.G.B.T. people” but cannot adopt “a place of acceptance of gay marriages, or of L.G.B.T. people in religious leadership.” He concludes that “even polite half-acceptance leaves L.G.B.T. people in a demeaning second-class position.”

They adopt the well-worn LGBT equation: disagreement equals discrimination, denunciation, and thus danger to the same-sex-attracted person. The conclusion is illogical and manipulative to the extreme: Either you fully affirm the sexuality of the same-sex-attracted person or we will publically charge you with the sins of bigotry and violence regardless of how kind you are. The accusation is vile. There is no other word for it.

Rodgers has a solution, though. If “everyone grew up hearing that God delights in gay people and we have gifts to nourish our communities, I do not think we would be targeted for violence or discrimination.” Can she honestly believe Omar Mateen and his ilk would never do such wicked things if they had only heard such a message in their formative years? Great evil happens, unfortunately, even from those who are wonderfully parented. Happy talk is too naïve for such a serious and evil injustice.

Christianity that Endorses Sexual License Isn’t Christianity
The problem the “gay-Christian” movement faces really comes down to this. Those who seek to rewrite historic and biblical Christian orthodoxy to sanctify certain sexual relations through hermeneutic ingenuity and accusations of harm are calling for a bridge that simply cannot be built. They must construct a whole other faith to do so. There is simply no honest reading of Jesus’ words and the rest of Scripture that makes room for any sexual ethic beyond the monogamous, permanent union of a husband and wife, be it gay, straight, bi, poly, or otherwise.

So how should we then live? Christ was clear. As much as possible, always treat the person before us with extravagant, uncompromising grace and kindness. Likewise, treat the issue of sexual ethics with kind but uncompromising truth. Jesus was unequivocal about what this truth is. He affirmed the divine and exclusive nature of the husband/wife sexual union and the singularly authoritative text of Genesis 1 and 2 on such matters. He doesn’t leave us much wiggle room.

Christians are called to live faithfully in the balance and tension between the grace and truth Jesus embodied in full. We are required to live squarely in the place where we love, affirm, and work to protect everyone, accepting them as fully human, as ones toward whom God has a fatherly heart. Of course, this includes the same-sex-attracted person, as no one’s sexuality cancels out his humanity.

True Human Rights Don’t Depend on Sexuality
But affirming anyone because of his or her sexuality actually diminishes his or her humanity and the ideal of equality itself. It values them conditionally. The gay rights movement likes to make much of its supposed connection with the righteous struggle of our nation’s African-American citizens. But the abolition movement was founded on the simple but powerful question: “Am I not a man and a brother?” and the modern civil rights movement on the proclamation: “I AM A MAN.” Common humanity, not uniqueness.

The gay individual absolutely deserves love, care, affirmation, and protection because of her humanity. Nothing more can be said for a person in the case for his dignity and worth. This does not mean, however, we pretend differences don’t exist among us.

But as we strive to truly love and befriend every individual, Christians are also called to honor, teach, and live the truth of a biblical sexual ethic. This is the tension God has called us to in this and all moral issues. It is of his design and wisdom and we have no room to wish it away, much less call it evil.

To live in this tension is neither easy nor neat. But what those in the “gay-Christian” project are calling for is a violation of this and therefore simply not an option in faithful Christianity.



Photo txking / Shutterstock.com
Glenn T. Stanton is the director of global family formation studies at Focus on the Family and the author of eight books on various aspects of the family including "The Ring Makes All the Difference" (Moody, 2011) and "Loving My LGBT Neighbor" (Moody, 2014). He blogs at glenntstanton.com.

http://thefederalist.com/2016/07/06...ail&utm_term=0_cfcb868ceb-59df1004b1-83889421

 

[SkyWriting]

Christianity Can’t Be Stretched To Endorse Hate

There is simply no honest reading of Jesus’ words and the rest of Scripture that makes room for any sexual ethic beyond the monogamous, permanent union of a husband and wife, be it gay, straight, bi, poly, or otherwise.

That is correct. There is a spiritual or organizational structure, monogamous, permanent union, be it gay, straight, bi, poly, or otherwise. Becasue God made plenty of "otherwise" to form unions.

Don't confuse sexual orientation or gender identity with the condemnations found in scripture.
Those issues were: promiscuity and unbridled lust outside of a permanent union.

But lets get to the gender issue that is your pet peeve.


Causes of Gender Dysphoria
By Dr Ananya Mandal, MD

Gender dysphoria usually means a difficulty in identifying with the biological sex in an individual. The causes of gender dysphoria are not fully clear.

Psychiatric and biological causes

It was traditionally thought to be a psychiatric condition meaning a mental ailment. Now there is evidence that the disease may not have origins in the brain alone. Studies suggest that gender dysphoria may have biological causes associated with the development of gender identity before birth. More research is needed before the causes of gender dysphoria can be fully understood.

Genetic causes of biological sex

Research suggests that development that determines biological sex happens in the mother’s womb. Anatomical sex is determined by chromosomes that contain the genes and DNA. Each individual has two sex chromosomes. One of the chromosomes is from the father and the other from the mother. A normal man has an X and a Y sex chromosome and a normal woman has two X chromosomes.
It is seen that during early pregnancy, all unborn babies are female because only the female sex chromosome (or the X chromosome) that is inherited from the mother being the active one.
After the eighth week of pregnancy, the chromosome from the father (an X for a female and a Y for the male), gains in activity.
If the father’s contribution is the X chromosome the baby continues to develop as female with a surge of female hormones.
This helps develop her female sex organs, reproductive organs and features. This makes her sex and gender female.
If the inherited chromosome from the father is a Y there is a surge of testosterone and other male hormones that lead to development of male characteristics, such as testes. This makes the baby’s sex and gender male. (1)

Causes of gender differences
There are several different potential causes of gender differences, these include hormonal changes, exposure to estrogenic drugs and so forth. (1-4)

Hormonal causes
Hormones that trigger the development of sex and gender in the womb may not function adequately.

For example, anatomical sex from the genitals may be male, while the gender identity that comes from the brain could be female. This may result from the excess female hormones from the mother’s system or by the foetus’s insensitivity to the hormones. The latter condition is called androgen insensitivity syndrome (AIS).

Exposure to progesterone or other estrogenic drugs

Although there is no research that shows that males or females exposed to progesterone in the womb or other estrogenic drugs, such as diethylstilbestrol (DES) may have a raised risk of gender dysphoria; there may be an association in some atypical aspects of gender role behavior.

Rare conditions that may lead to gender dysphoria

There may be rare conditions like congenital adrenal hyperplasia (CAH), and intersex conditions (also known as hermaphroditism) which may also result in gender dysphoria.

In CAH a female foetus has adrenal glands (small caps of glands over the kidneys) that produce high level of male hormones. This enlarges the female genitals and the female baby may be confused with a male at birth.

Intersex conditions mean babies may be born with the genitalia of both sexes. In these cases the child is allowed to grow and choose his or her own before any surgery is carried out to confirm it.

Other causes of gender dysphoria

There may be chromosomal abnormalities that may lead to gender dysphoria. Sometimes defects in normal human bonding and child rearing may be contributing factor to gender identity disorders.
Edited by April Cashin-Garbutt, BA Hons (Cantab)

Further Reading
What is Gender Dysphoria?
Gender Dysphoria Symptoms
Gender Dysphoria Diagnosis
Gender Dysphoria Treatments
Sources:
http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Gender-dysphoria/Pages/Causes.aspx
http://www.webmd.com/sex/gender-identity-disorder
http://www.umm.edu/ency/article/001527.htm
http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/293890-overview#showall



But the big big issue is this, Gender regulations are not allowed.

Do not make marriage rules for gay people
unless you allow gays to make rules for you.
This is the summation of the law and the prophets.
When you read in context, you find that the golden
rule is the narrow path.....not Christianity.

------------------------->

 

[Mudinyeri]

@SkyWriting I think you're attempting to create ambiguity that doesn't exist in the Bible. Our instructions regarding homosexuality are very straightforward. "Do not practice homosexuality. To lay with a man, as with a woman, is an abomination."

We also know that lusting in one's heart is the same as committing the actual sin.

Where I think we do a disservice to the sin of homosexuality - and a few other sins - is making them "pet sins," i.e. sins that are trotted out more frequently than others when sin is spoken about. We rarely bring up the sin of gluttony, for example. Yet, related health conditions are literally killing our population. The sin of gossip is almost never addressed yet social media is filled with it.

 

[Armoured]

In light of the Orlando massacre, The New York Times published a forum of evangelicals writing on the question, “Have Christians Created a Harmful Atmosphere for Gays?” Two noted evangelical leaders, popular blogger Julie Rodgers and professor David Gushee, represented the “yes” perspective. Remarkably, they both hold that kindness and sincere friendship toward same-sex-attracted persons is not enough. Failing to affirm their sexuality does them harm, contributing in measure to demonic actions like Orlando. They call on Christians to repent.

Rodgers admits “The Christians I know were grieved by the massacre and they want to know how to help.” But she followed her recognition with this: “The best thing they can do is repent for the ways they’ve helped create a culture that devalues L.G.B.T. people made in the image of God, and then begin to tell a better story about us in their circles.”

Not donate blood for the injured? Not prepare food for the families? Not stand quietly with and put a sympathetic arm around those mourning at vigils and memorials? These are some of the things many Christians did without hesitation that terribly dark Sunday and the days following.

Agree With Me Or Else
But we are told such things are actually harmful if not followed by full and unqualified affirmation of same-sex relationships. Gushee says exactly this, recognizing that the “typical evangelical” thankfully rejects “hate speech or any violence toward L.G.B.T. people” but cannot adopt “a place of acceptance of gay marriages, or of L.G.B.T. people in religious leadership.” He concludes that “even polite half-acceptance leaves L.G.B.T. people in a demeaning second-class position.”

They adopt the well-worn LGBT equation: disagreement equals discrimination, denunciation, and thus danger to the same-sex-attracted person. The conclusion is illogical and manipulative to the extreme: Either you fully affirm the sexuality of the same-sex-attracted person or we will publically charge you with the sins of bigotry and violence regardless of how kind you are. The accusation is vile. There is no other word for it.

Rodgers has a solution, though. If “everyone grew up hearing that God delights in gay people and we have gifts to nourish our communities, I do not think we would be targeted for violence or discrimination.” Can she honestly believe Omar Mateen and his ilk would never do such wicked things if they had only heard such a message in their formative years? Great evil happens, unfortunately, even from those who are wonderfully parented. Happy talk is too naïve for such a serious and evil injustice.

Christianity that Endorses Sexual License Isn’t Christianity
The problem the “gay-Christian” movement faces really comes down to this. Those who seek to rewrite historic and biblical Christian orthodoxy to sanctify certain sexual relations through hermeneutic ingenuity and accusations of harm are calling for a bridge that simply cannot be built. They must construct a whole other faith to do so. There is simply no honest reading of Jesus’ words and the rest of Scripture that makes room for any sexual ethic beyond the monogamous, permanent union of a husband and wife, be it gay, straight, bi, poly, or otherwise.

So how should we then live? Christ was clear. As much as possible, always treat the person before us with extravagant, uncompromising grace and kindness. Likewise, treat the issue of sexual ethics with kind but uncompromising truth. Jesus was unequivocal about what this truth is. He affirmed the divine and exclusive nature of the husband/wife sexual union and the singularly authoritative text of Genesis 1 and 2 on such matters. He doesn’t leave us much wiggle room.

Christians are called to live faithfully in the balance and tension between the grace and truth Jesus embodied in full. We are required to live squarely in the place where we love, affirm, and work to protect everyone, accepting them as fully human, as ones toward whom God has a fatherly heart. Of course, this includes the same-sex-attracted person, as no one’s sexuality cancels out his humanity.

True Human Rights Don’t Depend on Sexuality
But affirming anyone because of his or her sexuality actually diminishes his or her humanity and the ideal of equality itself. It values them conditionally. The gay rights movement likes to make much of its supposed connection with the righteous struggle of our nation’s African-American citizens. But the abolition movement was founded on the simple but powerful question: “Am I not a man and a brother?” and the modern civil rights movement on the proclamation: “I AM A MAN.” Common humanity, not uniqueness.

The gay individual absolutely deserves love, care, affirmation, and protection because of her humanity. Nothing more can be said for a person in the case for his dignity and worth. This does not mean, however, we pretend differences don’t exist among us.

But as we strive to truly love and befriend every individual, Christians are also called to honor, teach, and live the truth of a biblical sexual ethic. This is the tension God has called us to in this and all moral issues. It is of his design and wisdom and we have no room to wish it away, much less call it evil.

To live in this tension is neither easy nor neat. But what those in the “gay-Christian” project are calling for is a violation of this and therefore simply not an option in faithful Christianity.



Photo txking / Shutterstock.com
Glenn T. Stanton is the director of global family formation studies at Focus on the Family and the author of eight books on various aspects of the family including "The Ring Makes All the Difference" (Moody, 2011) and "Loving My LGBT Neighbor" (Moody, 2014). He blogs at glenntstanton.com.

http://thefederalist.com/2016/07/06...ail&utm_term=0_cfcb868ceb-59df1004b1-83889421

Assuming everyone agrees with your idea of Christianity. Fortunately for the rest of us, you're not the grand high arbiter of real Christianity. 30,000 Christian denominations and counting...

 

[Armoured]

@SkyWriting I think you're attempting to create ambiguity that doesn't exist in the Bible. Our instructions regarding homosexuality are very straightforward. "Do not practice homosexuality. To lay with a man, as with a woman, is an abomination."

We also know that lusting in one's heart is the same as committing the actual sin.

Where I think we do a disservice to the sin of homosexuality - and a few other sins - is making them "pet sins," i.e. sins that are trotted out more frequently than others when sin is spoken about. We rarely bring up the sin of gluttony, for example. Yet, related health conditions are literally killing our population. The sin of gossip is almost never addressed yet social media is filled with it.

There are many Biblical scholars who will argue that that isn't an accurate translation of the relevant clobber passage. Good point about the "pet sins" bit.

 

[Mudinyeri]

There are many Biblical scholars who will argue that that isn't an accurate translation of the relevant clobber passage. Good point about the "pet sins" bit.

... and just as many who will argue that it is an accurate translation. So, who do we believe?

 

[Armoured]

... and just as many who will argue that it is an accurate translation. So, who do we believe?

Well, that's the real question, isn't it? My point, though, is that things aren't quite as unambiguously cut and dried as all that.

 

[Mudinyeri]

Well, that's the real question, isn't it? My point, though, is that things aren't quite as unambiguously cut and dried as all that.

Can you point me to a translation that is ambiguous?

 

[Armoured]

Can you point me to a translation that is ambiguous?

Could you rephrase the question?

 

[Hieronymus]

Being homosexual has little to do with it, it's about sexual pride and sexual depravity like sodomy.
So yes, indeed Christians kind of push hostility towards homosexuals.
Not every homosexual embraces or endorses the typical gay culture.
And most homosexuals don't choose to be homosexual either (although it is kind of popular / fashionable in the world nowadays)

What if a homosexual person seeks God?
He will be condemned by "loving Christians" before he even gets the gist of the Gospel.

 

[Armoured]

And most homosexuals don't choose to be homosexual either

FTFY

 

[Hieronymus]

FTFY

Quote the full sentence please (including the bit after it), because it is quite fashionable nowadays, it is an attractive identity to some, because of media and entertainment suggestion etc..
(and i don't know what FTFY means)

 

[Armoured]

Quote the full sentence please (including the bit after it), because it is quite fashionable nowadays, it is an attractive identity to some, because of media and entertainment suggestion etc..
(and i don't know what FTFY means)

FTFY= Fixed That For You.

And no, I don't for a second buy the idea that anyone is claiming to be homosexual because it's "fashionable". Nor do I believe it's "fashionable", per se, really. Just not instantly condemned and vilified as it used to be, which isn't the same thing.

 

[SkyWriting]

@SkyWriting I think you're attempting to create ambiguity that doesn't exist in the Bible. Our instructions regarding homosexuality are very straightforward. "Do not practice homosexuality. To lay with a man, as with a woman, is an abomination."

We also know that lusting in one's heart is the same as committing the actual sin.

Where I think we do a disservice to the sin of homosexuality - and a few other sins - is making them "pet sins," i.e. sins that are trotted out more frequently than others when sin is spoken about. We rarely bring up the sin of gluttony, for example. Yet, related health conditions are literally killing our population. The sin of gossip is almost never addressed yet social media is filled with it.

Not using the word abomination much,
it is often misunderstood. What it means
is that they are born that way. It's not a choice.

Promises take higher priority. And the time of law
is past and replaced with grace.

Do you obey your parents? It's in the same
section of scripture. As is gluttony.

Most important - "Do unto others" is the narrow path.
By avoiding "do unto others" you are on the wide path.
Note how the passage on "narrow way" immediately
follows the golden rule. Your references do not.

 

[Hieronymus]

Christianity Can’t Be Stretched To Endorse Hate

Amen.

 

[FireDragon76]

Kindness and sincere friendship are indeed a good place to start.

Trying to restrict the marriage rights of other human beings and kick them out of your churches is anything but kind, however.

 

[Mudinyeri]

Not using the word abomination much,
it is often misunderstood. What it means
is that they are born that way. It's not a choice.

Promises take higher priority. And the time of law
is past and replaced with grace.

Do you obey your parents? It's in the same
section of scripture. As is gluttony.

Most important - "Do unto others" is the narrow path.
By avoiding "do unto others" you are on the wide path.
Note how the passage on "narrow way" immediately
follows the golden rule. Your references do not.

That's odd. My Hebrew dictionary defines the Hebrew word translated as "abomination" as: abomination; abominable thing; disgusting thing (nothing about being born in a certain way).

I can't agree that "do unto others" is the "most important" thing about Christianity but I do agree that it is important. I wouldn't want someone to institutionalize my sin as perfectly acceptable ... nor anyone else's sin for that matter.

 

[Hieronymus]

FTFY= Fixed That For You.

Aha, okay.

And no, I don't for a second buy the idea that anyone is claiming to be homosexual because it's "fashionable".

Hmmm... but it can influence those who aren't too sure.

Nor do I believe it's "fashionable", per se, really.

For some it is.
It's an identity that is celebrated in the entertainment industry.
It symbolizes freedom too.

Just not instantly condemned and vilified as it used to be, which isn't the same thing.

Indeed, that's not the same thing.
But it's gone beyond acceptance i.m.o.
It's something to be proud of apparently, as in "gay pride".

<Staff Edit>

 

[Armoured]

That's odd. My Hebrew dictionary defines the Hebrew word translated as "abomination" as: abomination; abominable thing; disgusting thing (nothing about being born in a certain way).

I can't agree that "do unto others" is the "most important" thing about Christianity but I do agree that it is important. I wouldn't want someone to institutionalize my sin as perfectly acceptable ... nor anyone else's sin for that matter.

Jesus would seem to disagree with you;

"
Matthew 22:35-40King James Version (KJV)
35 Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying,

36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?

37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

38 This is the first and great commandment.

39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
"

 

[Armoured]

Aha, okay.Hmmm... but it can influence those who aren't too sure.

Only those who were already inclined to it.

For some it is.
It's an identity that is celebrated in the entertainment industry.
It symbolizes freedom too.

I don't see it being "celebrated in the entertainment industry, beyond it sometimes being acknowledged as a thing that exists.

Indeed, that's not the same thing.
But it's gone beyond acceptance i.m.o.
It's something to be proud of apparently, as in "gay pride".

The whole point of "gay pride" is overcoming the social stigma that was, until recently, universal. And why shouldn't they be proud? They're not saying they're better than straight people, merely that they have nothing to be ashamed of.