Christ, Israel, and the fall of Jerusalem

[parousia70]

I gave you the actual history.

So did I

What you posited from a a source you did not link to or give citation credit to, is easily debunked. The Jews and Jerusalem of the 1st century AD were despised throughout the Roman Empire.

All the sources I gave were from scripture.

You have failed to debunk those scriptures, much less provide your alternative explanation for them.

Our readers can easily see who's position has the weight of scripture behind it and who's position is grounded only in speculation and wishful thinking.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

mkgal1 said: ↑
.....is the title of this quoted article that I'd like to discuss in this thread. An excerpt and the link follows:
CHRIST, ISRAEL AND THE FALL OF JERUSALEM
And He came to restore Israel, not as a State ruling over all the nations by the power of the sword,

Ezek 20:33
I will rule you with an iron fist and in great anger and with power.

That's it? That's all you could muster up - A 1 line verse in response? Typical......

"Shepherding" also has a good ring to it...........

Micah 5:2
2 And thou, Beth-Lehem Ephratah, Little to be among the chiefs of Judah!
From thee to Me He cometh forth -- to become Ruler in Israel,
And His goings forth are of old, From days of antiquity/eon.

Isaiah 9:
6 A Child is born to us! A Son is given to us! And He will be our ruler. He will be called, “Wonderful Counselor,” “Mighty God,” “Eternal Father,” “Prince of Peace.” 7 Of the greatness of his government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on David’s throne and over his kingdom, establishing and upholding it with justice and righteousness from that time on and forever. The zeal of the Lord Almighty will accomplish this.

Eze 34:10 [John 10:26]
‘Thus says Yahweh Elohim:
“Behold! I am against the Shepherds, and I will require My Flock at their hand;
I will cause them to cease feeding the Sheep, and the Shepherds shall feed themselves no more;
for I will deliver My Flock from their mouths, that they may no longer be food for them.”
[Chief Priests and Rulers of 1st century 70AD Jerusalem]

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD
Proof that Matthew 24 was fully fulfilled in 70 AD!

===============================
John 10:26
“But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you.
Revelation 14:11
And the smoke of the tormenting of them is ascending into Ages to-Ages.
==========================
1Peter 5:4
And of being made manifest the Chief-Shepherd/arci-poimenoV <750>, ye shall be being requitted the unfading Crown of the Glory
===========================
Reve 2:27
And He shall be sherpherding/poimanei <4165> (5692) them in rod iron, as the instruments, the pottery, is being crushed, as also-I have gotten beside the Father of Me.

Reve 7:17 That the Lambkin in midst of the throne shall be shepherding/poimanei <4165> (5692) them and shall be way leading them upon life springs of waters and shall be out-rubbing the God every tear out of the eyes of them.

Jesus' Birth, Crucifixion, Death, Resurrection and Ascension in Revelation.

Reve 12:5 And she brought forth a Son, a male, Who is being about to be shepherding/poimainein <4165> (5721) all the Nations in rod/staff of iron.
And is caught-away the child of her toward the God, and toward the throne of Him.

Reve 19:15 And out of the mouth of Him is issuing-out a sharp sword, that in it He should be smiting the Nations,
and He shall be shepherding/poimanei <4165> (5692) them in rod iron
and He is treading the trough of the wine of the fury of the God, the Almighty.

 

[Sal Robinson]

I really what barclay said about the jewish hope for the king from David's line....really puts me in their shoes...thanks for this enlightening post

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Christ, Israel, and the fall of Jerusalem

yeshuaslavejeff said: ↑
Is this another attempt to promote the heresy of universal salvation ? (totally unscriptural)

Nope. We are not speaking of the afterlife (or where a person goes when they die) in this thread. That would be off topic......just to be clear.

Hello mkgal.
They say faith can move mountains. Interesting correlation between Matt 21, Heb 12 and Rev 8.

Allusions in Revelation from Old Testament
Mountain burning sea..........

Matthew 21:21
Yet Jesus answering said to them, "amen I am saying to ye, if ever ye may be having Faith, and no ye may be doubting<1252>, not only the of the fig-tree<4808> ye shall be doing,
but even-ever to this Mountain ye may saying, 'Be being lifted up!<142> and be being cast!<906> into the Sea', it shall be becoming";
[Revelation 8:8]

Hebrews 12:
18 For ye have not come toward [to the mountain] to being handled and to having been burned to fire, and to blackness, to murkiness and to gloom and whirlwind
19 and of a trumpet blaring and to voice of declarations which those hearing begged/refuse no to be added to them.
22 But ye have come to Mount Zion, and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to a myriad of Messengers,

Revelation 8:8
And the second Messenger trumpets, and as it were a great Mountain with fire burning was cast into the Sea, and the third of the sea became blood,[Old Covenant Mt Sinai 70AD?]
[Matthew 21:21]

==================================
"Ye will hear of battles and rumors of battles" 1st century concluding in Judea/Jerusalem 70ad

Matthew 24:6
“And ye will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that ye are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
==================================
The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD
Proof that Matthew 24 was fully fulfilled in 70 AD!

Our Lord now retired to the Mount of Olives, to which place the disciples followed him, in order to make more particular inquiries relative to the time when the calamitous events, foretold by him, would come to pass. We have already intimated, that, the Mount of Olives commanded a full view of Jerusalem and the temple.
No situation, therefore, could have been better adapted to give energy to a prediction which related chiefly to their total ruin and demolition.; and if we suppose (and the supposition is highly probable) that our LORD, While in the act of speaking, pointed to the majestic and stupendous edifices, whose destruction he foretold, every word which he then uttered must have been clothed with inexpressible sublimity, and derived from the circumstances of the surrounding scenery a force and effect, which it is not possible adequately to conceive............

The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover
=============================
Matt 24:6..The Jewish Wars in 1st century...Up to 70ad and Masada

This will be a thread dedicated to the events wars/battles occurring during the last days leading up the "consummation" of the OC Jewish Age as prophecied in Daniel and the Olivet Discourse.

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive

CAST OF CHARACTERS: Roman: Emperor Nero | General Vespasian | General Titus | The Roman Army || Jewish: General / Historian Josephus | Factional Leaders in Jerusalem || Administrators of Roman Judea Targets: Jerusalem | Herod's Temple // Maps of the Roman Invasion // Theological Timeline

CHRONOLOGY IMMEDIATELY SURROUNDING THE WAR

Stage 1: Murder of James the Just, "Opposition High Priest" ; Irrevocable Split: 62
Stage 2: General Revolt in Jerusalem ; Zealot Occupation of Masada: August-September 66
Stage 3: The Campaign of Cestius Gallus and the Defeat of the Twelfth Legion: October-November 66
Stage 4: End of Collaborative Government, Priesthood ; General Flight: November 66 - March 67
Part 6: Vespasian Subdues Northern and Western Palestine: December 66 - December 68
Part 7: Three-way Power Struggle within Jerusalem After Roman Retreat: January 68 - May 70
Part 8: Romans Breach City Walls and Leave Jerusalem Desolate: May 10 - September 10, 70
====================================
Matthew 24 Mount of Olives and Titus' 10th Legion on Mt Olives 70ad

Just a little bit of what was happening up to the 70ad destruction of Jerusalem. This site as a plethora of maps and pictures portraying the action going on back then........

APRIL, A.D. 70 - PHASE ONE
THE ROMAN ARMY ARRIVES AT JERUSALEM TO PREPARE THE SIEGE

The first night of Titus' encampment with the 15th, 3rd and 18th Legions, the 5th Legion arrived from Emmaus and set camp north of the city on Mount Scopus.
Later the next day, the famed 10th Legion (founded by Julius Caesar) marched in from Jericho and camped on the Mount of Olives, east of the city.
Instead of waiting to starve the Jews into submission, Titus decides to assault many different parts of the city and overwhelm the defenders. Titus was early on in the middle of the fighting with his soldiers. At least two times, Titus and his detachment are surrounded by defenders, only to escape unharmed.
=============================

Revelation 8 Commentary- Plagued by Trumpets

The Roman Assault on Israel Began around the Feast of Trumpets Hence the Seven Trumpets of Revelation—
Thus Began the Jewish War.

In A.D. 66 while Judea was aflame in bloodshed, riot and revolt, Rome responded by sending the 12th legion in addition to thousands of auxiliaries from neighboring kingdoms. These troops, as if orchestrated by God, arrived in Jerusalem in the Jewish month of Tishri, a month that begins with the Feast of Trumpets. Called the Day of Judgment, it is on this day that trumpets sound the somber days of atonement and final judgment (Leviticus 23:24, Numbers 29:1).
Thus began the Jewish War.3

The A.D. 70 Doctrine View, Interpretation, Exposition and Commentary of Revelation 8: In Every Event that Fulfills the Seven Trumpets of Revelation an Audible Trumpet Sound Was Heard.

The Sound Of The Trumpet

The Apostle Paul used the Roman military trumpet as a metaphor for spiritual battle. First-century historian Josephus wrote that the Roman army did nothing, except by trumpet signals.
He listed three specific trumpet sounds, all of which can be devotionally applied.

The first trumpet was a signal to prepare to depart. "Now when they are to go out of their camp, the trumpet gives a sound."(1) The Bible believer should be ready to depart swiftly for any field of conflict as ordered, always ready to fight the good fight of faith (1 Tim. 6:12; 2 Tim. 4:7).

The second trumpet was a signal to form up: "Then do the trumpets sound again, to order them to get ready for the march."(1) At this stage, a believer should have on the whole armor of God. The Lord wants skilled warriors, lined up with others, who will do battle against the wiles of the Devil (Eph. 6:11).

The third trumpet sound was the order to march: "Then do the trumpets give a sound a third time, that they are to go out."(1) Some have suggested that this is the equivalent of "the last trumpet" that Paul referred to in 1 Corinthians 15:52 concerning the Rapture of the church: Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed--in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed (1 Cor. 15:51-52).

This trumpet may also point to the personal resolve of a believer to march out to serve Christ, to stand against all challenges to God's kingdom, and to be willing to endure hardships like a good soldier (2 Tim. 2:3).
===================================

 

[mkgal1]

Great post, LLoJ!

Zechariah 13, 14 and Micah 1:3 are tied to all of this as well.

Quoting Dr. Chuck Crisco:
IN THAT DAY INCLUDES BOTH THE CRUCIFIXION AND AD 70

Do we believe that the day that the fountain was opened for sin was the crucifixion and resurrection? Yes. There is no way that we can say that Jerusalem doesn't have access to the gospel until Jesus returns.

Do we realize that Jesus said false prophets would fill the land (Matthew 24) after his death? Yes.

Was Jesus wounded in the "house of his friends"? Yes. All of the "in that day" is the same time period: Zechariah 13:1-6, “IN THAT DAY a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and for the inhabitants of Jerusalem, for sin and for uncleanness. It shall be in that day,” says the Lord of hosts, “that I will cut off the names of the idols from the land, and they shall no longer be remembered. I will also cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to depart from the land. And it shall be IN THAT DAY that every prophet will be ashamed of his vision when he prophesies; they will not wear a robe of coarse hair to deceive. But he will say, ‘I am no prophet, I am a farmer; for a man taught me to keep cattle from my youth.’ And one will say to him, ‘What are these wounds between your arms?’ Then he will answer, ‘Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.’

He continues (7-9)... same "in that day" is the period of history in which Jesus was crucified (Matthew 26:31) and the same exact period of history would be when 2/3 of the ones would be "cut off", i.e, judgment against Jerusalem, AND a remnant would be saved from the destruction. Specifically it would be the remnant that called on his name (Remember Peter, whosoever calls on the name of the Lord will be saved). This is exactly what Jesus was saying in Matthew 24 that when the believing Jews saw Rome approaching they were to flee the city. This is the same "in that Day":

"Awake, O sword, against My Shepherd,
Against the Man who is My Companion,”
Says the Lord of hosts.
“Strike the Shepherd,
And the sheep will be scattered;
Then I will turn My hand against the little ones.
8 And it shall come to pass in all the land,”
Says the Lord,
“That two-thirds in it shall be cut off and die,
But one–third shall be left in it:
9 I will bring the one–third through the fire,
Will refine them as silver is refined,
And test them as gold is tested.
They will call on My name,
And I will answer them.
I will say, ‘This is My people’;
And each one will say, ‘The Lord is my God.’”

IN THAT DAY DESCRIBES THE FINAL DESTRUCTION OF OLD COVENANT JERUSALEM

As chapter 14 (1-2) begins we see more specifically what would happen in that day. Notice again that a remnant would be saved (Mathew 24) as they would flee the city: "Behold, the day of the Lord is coming, And your spoil will be divided in your midst. For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem; The city shall be taken, The houses rifled, And the women ravished. Half of the city shall go into captivity, But the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city."

Because the prophet refers to the nations being gathered against Jerusalem, it is wrongly assumed that this means all the nations of the whole earth. What is overlooked is that Rome’s army that was brought against Jerusalem in 66-70AD was made up of people from the various known nations of the day. Everyone considered the Roman Empire the “world” in that day (Luke 2:1), and those armies were made up of people groups, nationalities, of all the various conquered nations under the Roman banner (aprox. 80 million people).

Interestingly enough, when he says some would go into captivity (which is exactly what happened) Jesus warned his generation about this. As was common practice an invading nation would take the best leaders, artisans, teachers, etc into captivity (like Daniel was to Babylon). Jesus said in Matthew 24:40-41, "Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left."

In that day, the believers were not cut off, being stuck within the city. Rather they fled to safety and according to historians not one Christian died. Afterwards, believing Jews re-entered the city after its destruction.

Gary Demar says, "For I will gather all the nations [the Roman armies] against Jerusalem to battle, and the city will be captured, the houses plundered [Matt. 24:17], the women ravished [Luke 17:35], and half the city exiled [Matt. 24:16], but the rest of the people will not be cut off from the city” (Zech. 14:2)…The time when the Romans marched their armies, composed of many nations, to besiege Jerusalem, was “the day of the Lord” Jesus, on which he came to “destroy those that would not that he should reign over them” [Matt. 22:1¬10; 24:3, 23¬35; Luke 19:11¬27, 41¬44]. When the Romans had taken the city, all the outrages were committed, and the miseries endured, which are here predicted [Luke 21:20¬24]. A very large proportion of the inhabitants were destroyed, or taken captives, and sold for slaves; and multitudes were driven away to be pursued by various perils and miseries: numbers also, having been converted to Christianity, became citizens of “the heavenly Jerusalem” and thus were “not cut off from the city” of God [Gal 4:21¬31; Heb. 12:22¬25]."

What about his feet splitting the Mount of Olives?

I addressed this question in this blog. Check it out for a detailed description of why this has been fulfilled. Again, it is IN THAT DAY... same period of history. This had to happen in the same time period as his crucifixion. Zechariah 14:4, "And IN THAT DAY His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, Which faces Jerusalem on the east. And the Mount of Olives shall be split in two, From east to west, Making a very large valley; Half of the mountain shall move toward the north And half of it toward the south." This was never intended for them to imagine it as a physical event.

In Micah 1:3 we are told that God “is COMING FORTH FROM HIS PLACE” to “COME DOWN and TREAD on the HIGH PLACES (mountains) of the earth.” Do you believe God literally physically did this treading with his feet when it was fulfilled by the Babylonian judgment on Jerusalem? How is this descriptive language different from the Lord standing on the Mount of Olives with the result that it will split?

Micah goes on to say “the MOUNTAINS will MELT UNDER HIM, and the valleys WILL BE SPLIT, like wax before the fire, like water poured down a steep place” (1:4). Did they literally split in this case? Did they literally melt? No they were apocalyptic language to describe the activity of God, usually in judgment or deliverance.

When Zechariah says that the Mount of Olives will split, he is also using language similar to the Exodus event where there was a splitting of the Red Sea to deliver them from Egypt. In this case the idea is that in that period of history (AD 30-70) God is making a way of deliverance from the Romans armies and from the persecution of Jerusalem. There was a SPLIT between the literal mountain-Jerusalem and spiritual mountain Jerusalem (Zion- Hebrews 12) when the Jewish believers fled the city while the Jewish unbelieving apostates stayed in there. Talk about a church split! It separated the wheat from the chaff!
Will Jerusalem Be Surrounded in the Last Days? — A New Day Dawning

 

[Shrewd Manager]

He was Himself both the Son of God, one of the Holy Trinity, and the Messiah, the Son of David. But He came as the Suffering Servant of Isaiah 53, not the ferocious war-lord of the apocalypses.

Jesus is typified by the 4 living-critters cherub of the Ezekiel 1 vision: the ox (suffering servant), the man (last Adam), the lion (Davidic messiah) and the eagle (heaven-sent). Ensigns of the 4 camps of Israel. The different emphases of each of the 4 gospels.

And as David the good shepherd, subduing the bears and lions of the powers and principalities in ferocious spiritual warfare. Casting down the great dragon the serpent that deceiveth the whole world. Make no mistake, he doesn't come to muck about.

 

[mkgal1]

Yet in every prophecy on the Coming of the Lord is deliverance for Jerusalem and Jews. 70AD was not this.

This completely denies what God had accomplished and what had been prophesied all through Scripture. It steals away the salvation that was brought to the early church (which were the faithful Jewish remnant):

Acts 2

When Pentecost Day arrived, they were all together in one place.​

2 Suddenly a sound from heaven like the howling of a fierce wind filled the entire house where they were sitting.
3 They saw what seemed to be individual flames of fire alighting on each one of them.
4 They were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other languages as the Spirit enabled them to speak.
5 There were pious Jews from every nation under heaven living in Jerusalem.
6 When they heard this sound, a crowd gathered. They were mystified because everyone heard them speaking in their native languages.
7 They were surprised and amazed, saying, "Look, aren't all the people who are speaking Galileans, every one of them?
8 How then can each of us hear them speaking in our native language?
9 Parthians, Medes, and Elamites; as well as residents of Mesopotamia, Judea, and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia,
10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the regions of Libya bordering Cyrene; and visitors from Rome (both Jews and converts to Judaism),
11 Cretans and Arabs—we hear them declaring the mighty works of God in our own languages!"
12 They were all surprised and bewildered. Some asked each other, "What does this mean?"
13 Others jeered at them, saying, "They're full of new wine!"
14 Peter stood with the other eleven apostles. He raised his voice and declared, “Judeans and everyone living in Jerusalem! Know this! Listen carefully to my words!
15 These people aren't drunk, as you suspect; after all, it's only nine o'clock in the morning!
16 Rather, this is what was spoken through the prophet Joel:
17 In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy. Your young will see visions. Your elders will dream dreams.
18 Even upon my servants, men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will prophesy.
19 I will cause wonders to occur in the heavens above and signs on the earth below, blood and fire and a cloud of smoke.
20 The sun will be changed into darkness, and the moon will be changed into blood, before the great and spectacular day of the Lord comes.
21 And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.
22 “Fellow Israelites, listen to these words! Jesus the Nazarene was a man whose credentials God proved to you through miracles, wonders, and signs, which God performed through him among you. You yourselves know this.
23 In accordance with God's established plan and foreknowledge, he was betrayed. You, with the help of wicked men, had Jesus killed by nailing him to a cross.
24 God raised him up! God freed him from death's dreadful grip, since it was impossible for death to hang on to him.
25 David says about him, I foresaw that the Lord was always with me; because he is at my right hand I won't be shaken.
26 Therefore, my heart was glad and my tongue rejoiced. Moreover, my body will live in hope,
27 because you won't abandon me to the grave, nor permit your holy one to experience decay.
28 You have shown me the paths of life; your presence will fill me with happiness.
29 “Brothers and sisters, I can speak confidently about the patriarch David. He died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this very day.
30 Because he was a prophet, he knew that God promised him with a solemn pledge to seat one of his descendants on his throne.
31 Having seen this beforehand, David spoke about the resurrection of Christ, that he wasn't abandoned to the grave, nor did his body experience decay.
32 This Jesus, God raised up. We are all witnesses to that fact.
33 He was exalted to God's right side and received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit. He poured out this Spirit, and you are seeing and hearing the results of his having done so.
34 David didn't ascend into heaven. Yet he says, The Lord said to my Lord, ‘Sit at my right side,
35 until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet.'
36 "Therefore, let all Israel know beyond question that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ."
37 When the crowd heard this, they were deeply troubled. They said to Peter and the other apostles, "Brothers, what should we do?"
38 Peter replied, "Change your hearts and lives. Each of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
39 This promise is for you, your children, and for all who are far away—as many as the Lord our God invites."
40 With many other words he testified to them and encouraged them, saying, "Be saved from this perverse generation."
41 Those who accepted Peter's message were baptized. God brought about three thousand people into the community on that day.​

 

[redleghunter]

This completely denies what God had accomplished and what had been prophesied all through Scripture. It steals away the salvation that was brought to the early church (which were the faithful Jewish remnant):

I really don’t know what you quoted from me and Acts 2 leads you to claim what God accomplished is somehow diminished by showing the OT prophecies of God delivering Jerusalem.

 

[tampasteve]

MOD HAT ON
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MOD HAT OFF​

 

[mkgal1]

I really don’t know what you quoted from me and Acts 2 leads you to claim what God accomplished is somehow diminished by showing the OT prophecies of God delivering Jerusalem.

You had posted this:

Yet in every prophecy on the Coming of the Lord is deliverance for Jerusalem and Jews. 70AD was not this.

Ancient Jerusalem WAS delivered from the corrupt religious system that had kept them in bondage. He released them (the faithful remnant that was the foundation of the New Testament church) from the bondage parallel to how He led them out of Egypt.​

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Study Bible (Matthew) Jesus says
Lament over Jerusalem
36Truly I tell you, all these things will come upon this generation. 37O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those sent to her, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were unwilling! 38Look, your house is left to you desolate.…
Berean Study Bible · Download

 

[mkgal1]

Study Bible (Matthew) Jesus says
Lament over Jerusalem
36Truly I tell you, all these things will come upon this generation. 37O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those sent to her, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were unwilling! 38Look, your house is left to you desolate.…
Berean Study Bible · Download

This didn't represent ALL the people in Jerusalem though (that were "unwilling" to be gathered to Him). Look at the day of Pentecost:

Pentecost
2 When Pentecost Day arrived, they were all together in one place. 2 Suddenly a sound from heaven like the howling of a fierce wind filled the entire house where they were sitting. 3 They saw what seemed to be individual flames of fire alighting on each one of them. 4 They were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other languages as the Spirit enabled them to speak.

5 There were pious Jews from every nation under heaven living in Jerusalem. 6 When they heard this sound, a crowd gathered. They were mystified because everyone heard them speaking in their native languages. 7 They were surprised and amazed, saying, “Look, aren’t all the people who are speaking Galileans, every one of them? 8 How then can each of us hear them speaking in our native language? 9 Parthians, Medes, and Elamites; as well as residents of Mesopotamia, Judea, and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, 10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the regions of Libya bordering Cyrene; and visitors from Rome (both Jews and converts to Judaism), 11 Cretans and Arabs—we hear them declaring the mighty works of God in our own languages!” 12 They were all surprised and bewildered.


14 Peter stood with the other eleven apostles. He raised his voice and declared, “Judeans and everyone living in Jerusalem! Know this! Listen carefully to my words! 15 These people aren’t drunk, as you suspect; after all, it’s only nine o’clock in the morning! 16 Rather, this is what was spoken through the prophet Joel:

17 In the last days, God says,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy.
Your young will see visions.
Your elders will dream dreams.
18 Even upon my servants, men and women,
I will pour out my Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
19 I will cause wonders to occur in the heavens above
and signs on the earth below,
blood and fire and a cloud of smoke.
20 The sun will be changed into darkness,
and the moon will be changed into blood,
before the great and spectacular day of the Lord comes.
21 And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

22 “Fellow Israelites, listen to these words! Jesus the Nazarene was a man whose credentials God proved to you through miracles, wonders, and signs, which God performed through him among you. You yourselves know this. 23 In accordance with God’s established plan and foreknowledge, he was betrayed. You, with the help of wicked men, had Jesus killed by nailing him to a cross. 24 God raised him up! God freed him from death’s dreadful grip, since it was impossible for death to hang on to him.

36 “Therefore, let all Israel know beyond question that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ.”

37 When the crowd heard this, they were deeply troubled. They said to Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what should we do?”

38 Peter replied, “Change your hearts and lives. Each of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 This promise is for you, your children, and for all who are far away—as many as the Lord our God invites.” 40 With many other words he testified to them and encouraged them, saying, “Be saved from this perverse generation.” 41 Those who accepted Peter’s message were baptized. God brought about three thousand people into the community on that day.


36 “Therefore, let all Israel know beyond question that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ.”

37 When the crowd heard this, they were deeply troubled. They said to Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what should we do?”

38 Peter replied, “Change your hearts and lives. Each of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 This promise is for you, your children, and for all who are far away—as many as the Lord our God invites.” 40 With many other words he testified to them and encouraged them, saying, “Be saved from this perverse generation.” 41 Those who accepted Peter’s message were baptized. God brought about three thousand people into the community on that day.​

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

This didn't represent ALL the people in Jerusalem though (that were "unwilling" to be gathered to Him).

As written, AS JESUS SAYS, AS YAHUWEH'S WORD SAYS : "A FEW" WERE SAVED...

Jerusalem was not.

 

[mkgal1]

As written, AS JESUS SAYS, AS YAHUWEH'S WORD SAYS : "A FEW" WERE SAVED...

Jerusalem was not.

FEW =/= NONE

ALL were "saved" from the ancient (and corrupt) religious system that was destroyed in 70 A.D.

I believe God is concerned about PEOPLE not places. Who was Peter addressing in Acts 2?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

....
ALL were "saved" from the ancient (and corrupt) religious system that was destroyed in 70 A.D.
....

No they weren't.
There still continued, and continues today, (as you often promote it or part of it) , a "corrupt religious system" oppressing and deceiving multitudes everywhere.

 

[mkgal1]

No they weren't.
There still continued, and continues today, (as you often promote it or part of it) , a "corrupt religious system" oppressing and deceiving multitudes everywhere.

I didn't post that He removed corruption - or even religious corruption.

I posted that He destroyed the corrupt religious system that was removed from them in 70 A.D. They no longer represented God in the Temple.

He is our High Priest and King that sits on the throne of David (as promised). A kingdom that will never be taken from Him.

 

[mkgal1]

Quoting from That the World May Know article:
The Seeds of Revolt

The Seeds
After the Romans began their occupation of Judea in 64 BC, the Jews became divided on how to respond.

The religious leaders, particularly the Pharisees, believed the Messiah would come from the Jewish people and make Israel a great, free nation. They condemned Rome's access and viewed Romans as oppressors punishing God's people for their unfaithfulness to the Torah.

The Sadducees and secular leaders decided to cooperate with the Romans, who gave them various special privileges (John 11:49-50).

The Zealots proclaimed revolution to be God's solution to Roman oppression (Acts 5:37).

The Essenes waited for the Messiah to lead a violent overthrow of the Romans and their Jewish supporters, while the Herodions (nonreligious Jews who supported Herod) were completely satisfied with Herod's dynasty (Matt. 22:16).

The Sparks
The Jews were motivated to revolt by a number of different factors. After Herod Agrippa I died, the Romans appointed a series of increasingly cruel, corrupt governors to rule over the Jews, causing confusion, hatred, and division.

The paganism of Rome's culture offended the Jews, and the Jewish priests, who became more dependent on Roman security and support, became more corrupt. Priests and their followers also began fighting each other in the streets.

During feast days, especially Passover, nationalistic tensions escalated, causing Rome to increase its military presence. Wanting to serve God in their own way, the Jews longed for freedom.

Although Jesus warned his followers not to participate in military methods of bringing his kingdom, some Jewish people decided to seek out salvation through political and military might. Their actions brought about the Jewish Revolts and ultimately led to their destruction. ~ The Seeds of Revolt​

......but those that followed Jesus' instruction fled to the mountains - and were saved (in a literal and spiritual sense). Thus began the New Testament church.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I didn't post that He removed corruption - or even religious corruption.

I posted that He destroyed the corrupt religious system that was removed from them in 70 A.D. They no longer represented God in the Temple.

He is our High Priest and King that sits on the throne of David (as promised). A kingdom that will never be taken from Him.

The "systems" all over the world today, ever since then, remain with corruption - it wasn't destroyed, but has grown , even perhaps flourished, for the last 2000 years, in most places....
Those who even seek Yahuweh's Kingdom, are fewer by far than those who worship in some corruption..... as always since when? --- shortly after the flood ----

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

..but those that followed Jesus' instruction fled to the mountains - and were saved (in a literal and spiritual sense). Thus began the New Testament church.

No. The New Testament church began earlier than that.
And those who fled, thus their lives were spared, were saved BEFORE they fled (mostly).
Some , yes, might have been saved in a very timely manner WHEN or AFTER they fled,
just like some Egyptians joined with the Israelites when they fled Egypt following Moses.....

 

[mkgal1]

The "systems" all over the world today, ever since then, remain with corruption - it wasn't destroyed, but has grown , even perhaps flourished, for the last 2000 years, in most places....
Those who even seek Yahuweh's Kingdom, are fewer by far than those who worship in some corruption..... as always since when? --- shortly after the flood ----

But I'm speaking of a specific religious system that was destroyed in 70 A.D.

What was unique about that system was that it was rooted in a covenant with God (although I do recognize that some cults will also make that claim as well).