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Christ is NOT God. He is an HEIR of God!

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by edpobre, Dec 23, 2001.

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  1. edpobre

    edpobre Well-Known Member

    +0
    Friends,

    Galatians 4:4-7 teach us that God SENT Jesus to REDEEM those under the law that they may RECEIVE the adoption as SONS (v. 4-5). These sons hve the SPIRIT of Christ in their hearts (v. 6). As a SON, one becomes HEIR of God THROUGH Christ (v. 7).

    Galatians 3:26-29 teach us that people can become sons of God through FAITH in Christ (v. 26). Those who have FAITH in Christ are BAPTIZED INTO Christ and put on Christ (v. 27). Having been BAPTIZED INTO Christ, they become ONE in Christ or IN UNION with Christ (v. 2:cool: . Those who are IN Christ or IN UNION with Christ, BELONG to Christ and are therefore, Abraham's SEED. As such, they become HEIRS according to the PROMISE (v. 29).

    Titus 3:5-7 teach us that one is SAVED through the WASHING of regeneration and RENEWING of the Holy Spirit (v.5) THROUGH Jesus (V. 6). Those that have been WASHED are JUSTIFIED by God's grace and become HEIRS according to the HOPE of ETERNAL LIFE (v. 7).

    Romans 8:17 teaches us that CHILDREN of God are HEIRS of God and JOINT-HEIRS with Christ according to the PROMISE (Gal. 3:29) and according to the HOPE of ETERNAL LIFE (Titus 3:7).

    If Christ were God, why is he an HEIR of God according to God's PROMISE and HOPE of ETERNAL LIFE?

    If Christ were God and children of God are JOINT-HEIRS with him, doesn't that make ALL children of God ALSO Gods?

    Ed
     
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  2. Because He is. Why can't God be an heir to himself? Read Psalms 45, and 110. :)



    No. Why would it?
     
  3. fingermeelmo

    fingermeelmo Guest

    +0
    Blah, blah blah.... Jesus said something in John along the lines of,

    "Believe in me because of the works I do, for in that way God and I are one, through the Holy Spirit".

    Jesus = a man, the Son of Man.
    God = God.
    Holy Spirit = works through which God was revealed through Jesus.
    Jesus = Son of God.

    The Son of God is what Jesus saw himself to be, and knew himself to be, and the Son of Man is what everyone else saw him as... Understand now???????????? Ie., "The Son of Man will be crucified once we get to Jerusalem", ect. "I am the Son of God".

    The entire ministry of Jesus is based on Jesus being an example for everyone to follow. He wanted to do away with hypocrisy and establish better moral guidlines for everyone to follow through the use of a taoist-like philosophy. In that way, it is said, he died for our sins. He was a very honorable person. He knew that if he was guilty of commiting some crime, and that if crucifixion was the punishment for such a crime, that in order to retain his honor he would have to be crucified, and so he was, so that we would follow his example to this day. He wanted to show us that it IS possible to retain purity and honor through God, as for through God nothing is possible (I AM AN ATHEIST I AM JUST QUOTING HIM!). He said you can move a "mountain" (ie., SIN, the ego, ect., to become a better person) if only you believe. That's all you have to do.

    Any questions?

    NOTE: I am a secular taoist so I do not believe in God or any of the supernatural crap in the Bible, I'm just trying to point something out to everyone here.
     
  4. fingermeelmo

    fingermeelmo Guest

    +0
    "as for through God nothing is possible"

    I meant to say, "as for through God nothing is IMpossible".
     
  5. finger, your quote seems to me to be a little off. I've read the gospels many many times and don't remember that being there. Maybe you were trying to paraphrase? :)
     
  6. fingermeelmo

    fingermeelmo Guest

    +0
    I said, "ALONG THE LINES OF"
     
  7. Josephus

    Josephus <b>Co-Founder Christian Forums</b> Supporter

    +230
    Messianic
    ed, didn't Jesus say to the Pharisees that we are all "gods" - refering to a verse in the old testament?
     
  8. edpobre

    edpobre Well-Known Member

    +0
    Josephus,

    You wrote:


    You're right. Jesus did say that. But we are talking of the ONLY true God, not "gods". The Jehovah Witnesses consider Jesus as a "god" along with the other "gods" of the world like money, pride, kings, mobsters, etc.

    The TRUTH is that Jesus is Abraham's SEED (a MAN) with whom God made a lasting covenant (Gen. 17:7; Gal. 3:16). All children of God are found in the BODY of Christ of which Christ is the HEAD (Col. 1:1:cool: . That's the reason why children of God are JOINT-HEIRS with Christ according to the PROMISE and the HOPE of eternal life.

    Ed
     


  9. I agree, Ed. Jesus is a MAN.



    That's where you and I differ. I believe that everyone who believes is in the body of Christ. Many verses say that whosoever believes in Jesus will not perish, but have everlasting life. To avoid those verses being untruthfull, "Whosoever" would have to include somebody stuck on an island who can't go to church but still believes. Or else the "whosoever" is not truthfull.




    The Son, being the heir of all things (Hebrews 1:2), would indeed be an heir with us, thus making us join-heirs.

    I fully agree with you on that.
     
  10. LouisBooth

    LouisBooth Well-Known Member

    +59
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    Ed, in Galatians Paul clearly shows that Jesus is God. Look at verse 1:1

    "Paul, an apostle-sent NOT from men NOR by man, but by Jesus Christ and God the Fahter..."

    That clearly says that Jesus is God like God the Father is.

    In titus he didn't address this because it was a very focused letter and the issue he was writting to had nothing to do with the diety of christ, they already believed that.
     
  11. edpobre

    edpobre Well-Known Member

    +0
    LouisBooth,

    Michael is right. You don't really know what you are saying. Why don't you check other verses first before you post so you won't make postle Paul a liar?

    Look at Gal. 1:3; Eph. 1:2; Col. 1:2 God the Father is definitely separate and distinct from our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Look at Eph. 1:3. God is God and Father OF our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Look at Col. 1:3. God is God and Father OF our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Even apostle Peter wrote that God is God and Father OF our Lord Jesus Christ (1 Peter 1:3).

    Apostle Paul wrote the Corinthians that there is ONLY ONE God and that is the FATHER (1 Cor. 8:6). Apostle Paul also wrote that Jesus is a MAN (1 Tim. 2:5).

    Isn't there any end to your LYING Louis?

    Ed
     
  12. edpobre

    edpobre Well-Known Member

    +0
    Blalron,

    You wrote:


    While it is true that "whosoever believes in him shall not perish," TRUE believers are found ONLY in the Iglesia Ni Cristo (the ONLY true church of Christ).

    Your belief that "everyone who believes is in the body of Christ" is an indication that you are in a FALSE body of Christ. Most people who adhere to this belief are Trinitarians who do NOT abide or stay in the doctrine of Christ that he is a MAN (John 8:40) and the FATHER is the ONLY true God (John 17:3).

    Apostle John says "whosoever transgresses and does NOT abide in the doctrine of God DOES NOT HAVE God" (2 John 9).

    Now tell me my friend, can anyone who DOES NOT HAVE God be in the TRUE body of Christ?

    Ed
     
  13. LouisBooth

    LouisBooth Well-Known Member

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    "Why don't you check other verses first before you post so you won't make postle Paul a liar?"

    :lol: I have with people that have studied the text longer then I have been alive.

    "Look at Gal. 1:3; Eph. 1:2; Col. 1:2 God the Father is definitely separate and distinct from our Lord Jesus Christ. "

    Exactly! that's what trinity is. They are distinct AND the same because the bible says BOTH.

    "Isn't there any end to your LYING Louis?"

    I just quoted you a verse ed. Its you that don't believe the bible. I think Paul made it quite clear that he doesn't think Jesus is just a man else he would not have said that in his letter. Nor would have have said christ has the nature of God, or that he was diety incarnate.
     
  14. ZoneChaos

    ZoneChaos Senior Veteran

    +21
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    So.. that person would become a member of the INC, If God showed the guy who He was, correct?
     
  15. edpobre

    edpobre Well-Known Member

    +0
    ZoneChaos,

    Please elaborate on your question. As it is, I don't know ht you are driving at.

    Ed
     
  16. Josephus

    Josephus <b>Co-Founder Christian Forums</b> Supporter

    +230
    Messianic
    Well ed, our life is indeed the breath "of" God. Though we are not God himself, we are of God. He made us from nothing, and breathed his life into us. Agreed? :)

    I am just trying to make clear a point that we are in a sense beings of eternal existence, of the life of God, but clearly we are not God. Our spirits are totally seperate and distinct from God's Spirit, but we are "related" - and we are "adopted" as his immediate family when we are saved and make Him Lord.
     
  17. ZoneChaos

    ZoneChaos Senior Veteran

    +21
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    What I am asking is.. if God showed a man who He was... and the man then beleived... would that Man be a member of the INC?
     
  18. epobre

    epobre Guest

    +0
    Josephus,

    You wrote:[.b]


    Your belief is non-Biblical and therefore FALSE! Gal. 4:4-5 tells us that God "sent His son to REDEEM those under the law that they may RECEIVE ADOPTION as sons."

    Thus, "adoption as son" comes first before "salvation." As "sons of God, we become HEIRS according to the hope of eternal life" (Gal. 4:7).

    Apostle Paul writes that God delivers people from the power of darkness and translates (transfers) them to the kingdom of His son in whom there is redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of
    " (Col. 1:13-14).

    From these verses we can UNDERSTAND that to become HEIRS and JOINT-HEIRS with Christ, we MUST be DELIVERED from the world (OUTSIDE) and TRRANSFERRED to the KINGDOM of His Son (INSIDE) in order to be REDEEMED through Christ's blood.

    The KINGDOM is the CHURCH which Christ PURCHASED (redeemed) with his own blood (Acts 20:2:cool: . The CHURCH is Christ's BODY and Christ is the HEAD (Col. 1:1:cool: . Thus, one becomes an HEIR and Joint-HEIR with Christ by being INSIDE Christ's BODY and REDEEMED by his blood.

    Ed
     
  19. LouisBooth

    LouisBooth Well-Known Member

    +59
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    "Thus, "adoption as son" comes first before "salvation." "

    Hate to tell ya ed, but that statement is not biblical.
     


  20. Yep. And if you believe, you are automatically in his church. :) Whosoever believeth in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life.
     
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