Charismatics Are At War With Each Other Over Failed Prophecies Of Trump Victory

topher694

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Actually it's the third major hit within a year. They produced a video, twenty prophets giving what they thought would happen in 2020. A full hour of waffle. None of it bore any relation to reality. Then they predicted the end of Corona virus on March 6th. March 7th came and the virus was worse. Then they said Trump would win in November.

I'm pleading with the folks here, please stop listening to these deceivers. Their track record is dreadful. There are so many more delights to be had in the bible :)
The true prophetic is our there and is very good. These folks are either opportunists or immature or both. But because some people abuse the truth doesn't mean we should refuse the truth.
 
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lismore

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The true prophetic is our there and is very good.

Hello topher. Can you point me towards those who prophesied the Biden win? I'm curious to see what they say what the Lord's purpose is in it. God Bless :)
 
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topher694

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Hello topher. Can you point me towards those who prophesied the Biden win? I'm curious to see what they say what the Lord's purpose is in it. God Bless :)
You are missing the point. Prophesying election results, especially when you know who is running, is unwise and undisciplined. As is rejoicing in others being wrong.
 
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lismore

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You are missing the point. Prophesying election results, especially when you know who is running, is unwise and undisciplined.

Especially if you can't prophecy the winner because you're not a prophet. Samuel could prophesy that David would be King over Israel because he was a prophet. Kenneth Copeland cannot prophesy when Covid will end or who will win the election because he's not a prophet.

As is rejoicing in others being wrong.

We completely disagree. I think we should rejoice in false prophets those wolves in sheep's clothing being revealed by our Lord. We should be kneeling in prayer to thank the Lord and doing cartwheels down the streets. The only people who shouldn't rejoice are those who are going to fall for more deceptions from the same wolves. They should rightly weep.

God Bless :)
 
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topher694

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Especially if you can't prophecy the winner because you're not a prophet. Samuel could prophesy that David would be King over Israel because he was a prophet. Kenneth Copeland cannot prophesy when Covid will end or who will win the election because he's not a prophet
What is your personal experience with the prophetic?

We completely disagree. I think we should rejoice in false prophets those wolves in sheep's clothing being revealed by our Lord. We should be kneeling in prayer to thank the Lord and doing cartwheels down the streets. The only people who shouldn't rejoice are those who are going to fall for more deceptions from the same wolves. They should rightly weep
Then you are just as much a part of the problem. And you should be rejoicing in that being revealed to you.
 
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lismore

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What is your personal experience with the prophetic?

I have shared my personal experience with prophecies on the forum many times. If you still can't find it and need to know please get back to me.

Then you are just as much a part of the problem. And you should be rejoicing in that being revealed to you.

According to the Lord Jesus Christ it's the wolves in sheep's clothing who are the problem:

“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves" (Matthew 7:15) God Bless :)
 
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topher694

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I have shared my personal experience with prophecies on the forum many times. If you still can't find it and need to know please get back to me.
This is a non answer. I have no idea what I should be searching for.

According to the Lord Jesus Christ it's the wolves in sheep's clothing who are the problem:

“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves" (Matthew 7:15) God Bless :)
A. I see nothing in this scripture about rejoicing. In fact a refresher on 1 cor 13:4-7 might be in order.

B. Mistaken prophets are not false prophets. False should not be thrown around lightly, nor as a blanket statement over a group of Christians. Hence the rules against such things around here.

C. You are making the second error I alluded to earlier that so many are making these days. And that is sloppy or improper application of prophetic principles.

D. All of the above makes statements like yours a part of the problem. See Pro 6:16-19
 
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Andrewn

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I think we should rejoice in false prophets those wolves in sheep's clothing being revealed by our Lord. We should be kneeling in prayer to thank the Lord and doing cartwheels down the streets.
I agree. People like Kenneth Copeland and other Independent Network Charismatics (INC) have mislead too many people for too long.

"INC promotes a form of Christian nationalism the primary goal of which is not to build congregations or to convert individuals, but to bring heaven or God’s intended perfect society to Earth by placing “kingdom-minded people” in powerful positions at the top of all sectors of society, the so-called “seven mountains of culture” comprising government, business, family, religion, media, education and arts/entertainment."

How self-proclaimed 'prophets' from a growing Christian movement provided religious motivation for the Jan. 6 events at the US Capitol
 
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Gregory Thompson

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I agree. People like Kenneth Copeland and other Independent Network Charismatics have mislead too many people for too long.

How self-proclaimed 'prophets' from a growing Christian movement provided religious motivation for the Jan. 6 events at the US Capitol
Trump as God’s chosen president
Many of those referred to as prophets in INC Christianity predicted another Trump victory in 2020. After his Nov. 3 loss, many we have studied have not recanted their prophecies, and have adopted Trump’s conspiratorial rhetoric that the election was fraudulent. Many believe that the demonic forces that have stolen the election can still be defeated through prayer.

For INC Christianity’s “prophets,” Trump is God’s chosen candidate to advance the kingdom of God in America, so any other candidate, no matter what the vote totals show, is illegitimate.

Is there any statement on this extreme belief, from this organization, now that January 20 has passed?
 
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Andrewn

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I have shared my personal experience with prophecies on the forum many times. If you still can't find it and need to know please get back to me.
According to the Lord Jesus Christ it's the wolves in sheep's clothing who are the problem:
“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves" (Matthew 7:15) God Bless :)

So true ... what if we are witnessing an age in history that is really a turning point for believers to stop believing in what other so called leaders of the church are saying ... Like Andrewn said above "It's scary"

I watched Dutch Sheets one more time this morning along with 190,000 other views by the way and then I went to the other show that he was on Flashpoint (a KCM production) and everyhting is the same as it was "Pray for America" "Everything is going to be restored" Like this is just a speed bump they almost got me back, but I'm moving on ... You tube is full of people that want to fool you ... they are so fooled themselves that they believe. The false prophecies were just a speed bump for them. I still think God had something to do with their being wrong to show us who to follow and it sure isn't them.

The key words in the scripture Matthew 7:21-23 are "I never knew you"

“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

What I'm trying to say is we need to pray God's will be done instead of man's will be done
 
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lismore

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This is a non answer. I have no idea what I should be searching for.

Hello Topher. I joined this forum in 2003 and have posted my experiences on numerous occasions. I don't have the opportunity to restate all that at the moment so we'll just have to leave it as a 'non-answer' then. Sorry about that.

A. I see nothing in this scripture about rejoicing. In fact a refresher on 1 cor 13:4-7 might be in order.

There is much in scripture about false prophets being dangerous. In the scripture in question Matthew 7:15 they are described as wolves in sheep's clothing that we are to beware of. Dangerous and cunning predators. The unmasking of a dangerous predator is clearly a cause for rejoicing. That's where I'm coming from, I hope you understand me better now. I don't see from this passage that the Lord is merely describing them as being mistaken, they're dangerous.

B. Mistaken prophets are not false prophets.

Perhaps we're talking at cross purposes. But with all due respect it sounds like you're clutching at straws.

False should not be thrown around lightly, nor as a blanket statement over a group of Christians.

False prophets are not Christians. The Apostle Paul describes them as evil men and impostors, The Lord Jesus said he never knew them.

I'm talking about self appointed leaders with a consistent record of giving false prophecies, teaching false doctrines, introducing destructive heresies, running scams, protecting other wolves rather than the sheep even being sexually dangerous to women.

God Bless :)
 
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Direct Driver

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I'm not seeing a war. I stopped taking this nonsense seriously decades ago.

My first church was AG, we had lots of messages in tongues and prophesies. Most of it was innocuous stuff like, "I am your God and I will uphold you." and stuff like that. Then, one day before the turn of the century a woman had a "word from God" that involved "All the computers" crashing at Y2k. I was a Y2k remediation programmer. I actually sent an email to the pastor pointing out the above and that this is the first "qualifiable and quantifiable" message I've ever heard and I'll be looking to see if it happens and how we will respond if it doesn't.

Obviously it didn't.

Sadly, there is a lot of nuttery in the Christian community and we are often tempted to believe stuff just because it aligns with our general world view. I used to really follow the "end times stuff" and 700 club stuff back in the 80's. I'm over it and have been for a long time.

My focus is on bible teaching. Regarding all this prophesy and "end times" stuff, I figure that if I'm up on the content of the bible from a "study" rather than simple "read" perspective, I'll know it when I see it. We're told to WATCH. I'm watching events, not listening to professional prophesy broadcasts.
 
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Lg2000

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Hello Topher. I joined this forum in 2003 and have posted my experiences on numerous occasions. I don't have the opportunity to restate all that at the moment so we'll just have to leave it as a 'non-answer' then. Sorry about that.



There is much in scripture about false prophets being dangerous. In the scripture in question Matthew 7:15 they are described as wolves in sheep's clothing that we are to beware of. Dangerous and cunning predators. The unmasking of a dangerous predator is clearly a cause for rejoicing. That's where I'm coming from, I hope you understand me better now. I don't see from this passage that the Lord is merely describing them as being mistaken, they're dangerous.



Perhaps we're talking at cross purposes. But with all due respect it sounds like you're clutching at straws.



False prophets are not Christians. The Apostle Paul describes them as evil men and impostors, The Lord Jesus said he never knew them.

I'm talking about self appointed leaders with a consistent record of giving false prophecies, teaching false doctrines, introducing destructive heresies, running scams, protecting other wolves rather than the sheep even being sexually dangerous to women.

God Bless :)
yes sir. People don't stress it enough.
People take it lightly when it shouldn't be taken lightly. It's straight blasphemy and they lead people astray. Doesn't matter how eloquently they talk or how sincere they try to come off as
 
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lismore

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I watched Dutch Sheets

Hello geetrue. One issue for me is that a lot of characters who have been revealed as making false prophecies lately have a long track record of dubious behaviour. For example Dutch Sheets was irradiated in the whole Todd Bentley fiasco. Events have been brought to head, but the pot has been boiling over for a long time.


What I'm trying to say is we need to pray God's will be done instead of man's will be done

Hopefully there will be a time of pruning which will leave the church purer and stronger. A lot of Christian 'leaders' really just need to stop talking, join a bible believing church where they can receive basic bible teaching and discipleship, living a quiet life in all Godliness. God Bless :)
 
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topher694

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Hello Topher. I joined this forum in 2003 and have posted my experiences on numerous occasions. I don't have the opportunity to restate all that at the moment so we'll just have to leave it as a 'non-answer' then. Sorry about that.
I have decades of experience with the prophetic. I have been taught by people with combined experience of centuries in the prophetic, including the man who is considered by most to be the father of the modern prophetic. I train and equip people in it, including Prophets. I've written books & manuals on it.

There. That is my personal experience summed up. I don't see how something like that is so hard to share.

Given your insistence on calling a large number of people "false" it is a valid thing to ask. In other words, what is your fruit that people should listen to you?

There is much in scripture about false prophets being dangerous. In the scripture in question Matthew 7:15 they are described as wolves in sheep's clothing that we are to beware of. Dangerous and cunning predators. The unmasking of a dangerous predator is clearly a cause for rejoicing. That's where I'm coming from, I hope you understand me better now. I don't see from this passage that the Lord is merely describing them as being mistaken, they're dangerous.
1 Cor 13:6 - [love] does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth
You are rejoicing in iniquity. Is it good when false things are exposed? Yes. Do we rejoice in that? No. Why, because God loves those people too and wants them to come to repentance. One might argue that you are "rejoicing" in the truth. But the principles of love are not adversarial, but they should be harmonious... they should all be working together at the same time, not one here and another there.

Perhaps we're talking at cross purposes. But with all due respect it sounds like you're clutching at straws.
No straws at all here. I have seen this first hand.

Take the guy in this video for example. If you watch the first video, he seems to thrive on the criticism of those who don't believe in him (like us). He gives them lip service, but he comes across as being obsessed with those folks and clearly considers them to be less enlightened than him (a dangerous view no doubt). He is indirectly/passive aggressively very condescending to them.

Now, the approach you are taking feeds directly into this. You are giving him what he - and his supporters - wants. In turn he keeps making videos which feeds your outrage and the cycle continues with everyone feeling justified in their views and nothing changing. THE WHOLE CYCLE NEEDS TO STOP.

False prophets are not Christians. The Apostle Paul describes them as evil men and impostors, The Lord Jesus said he never knew them.

I'm talking about self appointed leaders with a consistent record of giving false prophecies, teaching false doctrines, introducing destructive heresies, running scams, protecting other wolves rather than the sheep even being sexually dangerous to women.
I am well aware of such things happening and it is horrible. But I am very, very careful to call one a false prophet, a false prophet intentionally deceives, divides and manipulates. It goes beyond just being in error. There are a few I know to be false prophets for certain. And I can say that not just because of what they put out publicly, but because I have inside information that they knowingly and intentionally mislead in their prophecies and public statements people to sell books and gain supporters, that they have been confronted on this behavior and not repented and one even has been kicked out of the church he started because of it (then lied to his followers about that).

But, even with the guy in this video... I basically disagree with everything he said, some of it is very alarming, but I'm not going to call him a false prophet. I don't know his heart and intentions. He could be (is) in pride, mistaken, or have poor teachers, yet still sincerely love the Lord.

Further, the best way to combat what is false is not to run around yelling "false" from the rooftops and rejoicing at the destruction of another. The best way to combat what is false is to continually demonstrate what is true.
 
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lismore

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Given your insistence on calling a large number of people "false" it is a valid thing to ask. In other words, what is your fruit that people should listen to you?

Hello topher. Thanks for your reply.

When you say 'prophetic', do you mean you study the prophecies of others or are you giving prophecies yourself?

I don't think people should listen to me. I think people should listen to the word of God.

Matthew 7:15 is a key scripture that I hope people listen to.

Also Deuteronomy 13 and Deuteronomy 18. If a prophet says something that does not come to pass or if the prophet says something that leads people away from the true God then that person is a false prophet.

Every word of God is flawless, the truth of the word is a safeguard for us.

God Bless :)
 
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Gregory Thompson

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One thing I find odd about this movement is there's this rhetoric, where it is said, it's not about left or right but about God, but then they demonize the left and make it about right and left.
 
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lismore

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My first church was AG, we had lots of messages in tongues and prophesies.

Hello Direct Driver. I was in AOG 1999-2007. I was given several prophecies/ words of knowledge that were not true. I think most everyone from that background will have a similar experience of having been given false words. Indeed a friend of my uncle's was confronted while visiting an AOG by a prophetess who said he was a wife beater. A single guy, that was his only visit to an AOG church.

Prophecy was cheapened so much, it was treated it like dross instead of gold and there was never any reining in of false prophets. Showmanship rather than reality.

However the Lord works for the good in all circumstances and our experiences in the AOG will be used for his glory.

God Bless :)
 
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