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Featured catholics, i am a protestant, i want to hear you

Discussion in 'Christian Philosophy & Ethics' started by lambofgod43985889, Aug 19, 2019.

  1. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    I’m sorry I misread your post. Yes I agree for the first 1500 years of Christianity all churches accepted the real presence of Jesus in the Eucharist. The earliest writing I can think of that confirms this would be St Ignatius’ epistle to the Smyrnaeans written in 107AD.
     
  2. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    Thanks.
     
  3. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats God Seeker

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    Care to explain? There is a reason Jesus told His apostoles to spread the Good News: getting the hair wet has no effect on your ability to learn it.
     
  4. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats God Seeker

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    It is also theologically impossible for Jesus to be both at the Father's right hand (as the Scripture clearly states) and inside the wine cups and bread crumbs.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2019
  5. escapee

    escapee Member

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    Too many things to answer, but I will try inlined.

    Biblical reference, plus the purification of the soul is a common theme, not only eternal damnation.

    For example, look at the conversation between the Holy Mary and Jesus at the wedding before His first miracle. Also, revelations with woman + crown in sky.

    Simply a fact of history, and as usual rejected by protestants, for eartly agenda, but God provides that fact.

    You can't entitle yourself to just whatever. This includes Jesus. You can't reject those who help you.

    Your child needs protection. You deny his protection by not babtizing him. Even Moses has a first-born-consecration law.

    If you don't repent, you can't atone. Basic logic of the Gospels.

    Popes have responsibility, the office is established by God.

    Direct traditions of the early churches. The catholic church is the apostolic church, carries the ancient and true practices uninterrupted from the day of Christ's first coming.

    Facts of life. It hurts people that those who are not attacked, attack the Church for helping those who are attacked.

    If you reject pieces of the Lord, it still remains true, only you reject them. Mathematical set theory. Apocryphies are real, only ignored by Protestants. Like negative roots of a quadratic equation.

    The Cross is venerable, and the Cross protects, the Cross was the only thing that is worthy to hold the Lord.
     
  6. ☦Marius☦

    ☦Marius☦ Orthodox Hillbilly Supporter

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    Not really, that is in fact WHY we have accepted the usage of it over the years, because it isn't that dissimilar.
     
  7. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    There’s much we don’t know about that time. So we really can’t say for sure but one event I would point out was how amazed the Pharisees were at His knowledge of the scriptures at such a young age.

    “Then, after three days they found Him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the teachers, both listening to them and asking them questions. And all who heard Him were amazed at His understanding and His answers. When they saw Him, they were astonished; and His mother said to Him, "Son, why have You treated us this way? Behold, Your father and I have been anxiously looking for You."”
    ‭‭Luke‬ ‭2:46-48‬ ‭NASB‬‬
     
  8. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats God Seeker

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    That is totally off topic. I just want to know why people think the wine and bread themselves literally hold or are Jesus Himself. Without His DNA in them, I cannot believe this at all.
     
  9. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    Baptism confers grace and forgives sin, so the idea that this might affect the recipient for the better, either immediately or over time, is certainly not unthinkable.
     
  10. rturner76

    rturner76 Senior Veteran Staff Member Red Team - Moderator Supporter

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    I think baptizing babies is a public announcement that this family is Christian, has chosen Godparents to ensure that if something happens to the parents. The baby/child will still receive Christian instruction from the Godparents and the community in attendance.

    One thing I have noticed about some Protestant views on this is that only people with the ability to accept Christ should be baptized. However, some of the same people say that baptism is not a requirement. If that so there should be nothing wrong with infant baptism. Children also go through First Communion where they publicly make a proclamation of faith. Then, acceptance of Christ is "Confirmed" at Confirmation around bar mitzvah age when you are fully aware of your beliefs.

    Coming to the church as a baptized adult (THe Church recognizes most trinitarian baptisms). You go through a course that lasts over 6 months, so by the time you publicly proclaim your faith, you have been taught a great deal about Catholicism and enter in eyes totally open.

    I think it is a good system. It's been around a while (couple thousand years or so)
     
  11. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats God Seeker

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    Grace does not depend on being baptized with water.

    In order to be a saving grace, the Holy Spirit must literally be in the water and baptism of the Holy Spirit, which is when people are born again, must occur at the same time. This obviously does not happen. Forgiveness has nothing to do with getting your head wet.
     
  12. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    When someone says "not that dissimilar," it's hard to know what to think. How similar is it?

    Well, the Orthodox and the Roman views have much in common, but the differences are also significant, although Orthodox Christians seem willing to use the term Transubstantiation, even though their POV rejects some of what Roman Catholics would say when explaining their own belief.
     
  13. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    I didn't say that it does.
     
  14. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats God Seeker

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    The Association of Vineyard Churches does something called baby dedication. Parents with babies or little kids bring them up to the stage and the pastor blesses them. It is a public pledge to teach the Gospel and lead their kids to follow Jesus. I love it.

    Just having a kid baptized does not automatically make anyone a godparent.
    Baptism is not a requirement to be saved. If it was all Protestants would agree babies should be baptized. However, Protestants still value baptism as one of God's two commands (along with Communion) to do in memory of Jesus as a public display of their rebirth. What's wrong with baptizing infants is people do it on the assumption baptism is necessary for salvation, which is incorrect.
    Protestant churches don't call it that, but I went through the same thing when I was 13. They just have a ceremony up front where kids proclaIm their faith - no big deal to me, since I was not a Christian. It lasts the entire school year though, not only 6 months.
     
  15. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats God Seeker

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    What did you mean by conferring grace and forgiving sins through baptism?
     
  16. escapee

    escapee Member

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    It is not only the Holy Eucarist that is above science. You can also look at for example when Christ stopped the waves and placed the whole ship 5 miles away to the harbor at an instance, when His desiplses asked Him if Hhe doesn't care that they will drown.

    Placing science above God is heresy typical of atheists.
     
  17. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    That is the conventional view of the sacrament. You aren't required to believe it. I was just saying that there MAY be a reason why you were drawn to Christianity at a later time, and it might have something to do with your having been baptized. But that comment was certainly not meant as any kind of theological lecture.
     
  18. escapee

    escapee Member

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    How is it theologically impossible?
     
  19. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    Do you believe that being 'seated at the right hand of the Father' literally means that there are two deities in heaven sitting on chairs??
     
  20. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats God Seeker

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    Of course not. That would be saying there are two Gods, both human. I was saying we know Jesus is with the Father in Heaven because of the Ascension and therefore He cannot be our wine and bread at church.
     
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