Cardinal Pell charged with child sex offences

squirrel123

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You are assuming he is guilty?
No. What in my post made you think that?

I'm glad that the allegations against him are being taken seriously and that he is being charged and will be tried, so that we can find out for sure if he is guilty and deal with it appropriately if he is. Of course he should have a fair trial, and of course he is innocent until proven guilty.

But at least the court is given a chance to prove him guilty, if that is the case.

My issue is with the far too many clergy who was never made to answer the allegations against them, and worst - those who admitted guilt and were protected by the church.
 
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ImAllLikeOkWaitWat

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They do have hobbies. Its called sex with kids.

Exactly why I said they need real hobbies, they need a huge gym in the Vatican or a swimming pool so all these old men can get out all that energy they got for children, and release it in a more healthy productive way. I still personally don't see how being a priest explains desires for children and not grown women. Celibacy does not create pedophile urges so I don't think so called repressed urges explains this.
 
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Motherofkittens

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In your view, what distinguishes a good person from a bad person? And are you a good person?
I don't want to derail this thread. I will say our moral compasses are probably very similar. And I believe most people are more good than bad.
 
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Landon Caeli

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Dubious claims of the widely discredited psychological theory of “repressed memories,” have been used to put priests at a significant disadvantage in obtaining justice. In these cases, individuals claim that a priest molested them years earlier and assert that they repressed the memory due to the trauma. The alleged incident is often recalled, Pierre says, “through the suggestive questioning of an unprincipled therapist and, often under hypnosis.” Naturally, hypnosis leaves people open to the power of suggestion. Many experts believe that repressed memory is simply bogus. Dr. James McGaugh, from the University of California, Irvine, an expert in the area of memory, states, “I do not believe there is such a thing as a repressed memory… And there’s absolutely no proof that it can happen. Zero. None. Niente.” Dr. Richard J. McNally, Director of Clinical Training in the Department of Psychology at Harvard University claims, repressed memory therapy is “the worst catastrophe to befall the mental health field since the lobotomy era.”

http://www.catholicleague.org/bogus-charges-against-priests-abound/

 
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Landon Caeli

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Most of these supposed 'abuse victims' go to Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests, where lawyers see dollar signs in their eyes with the possibility of new cases.

Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests - Wikipedia
In 2002, SNAP advocated for a bill in California that lifted the statute of limitations on child sexual abuse cases. The bill was drafted by Laurence E. Drivon, a lawyer who had represented 320 plaintiffs in clergy abuse cases and who had contributed to SNAP. The lifting of the statute of limitations allowed Drivon and other lawyers to file hundreds of new lawsuits.[11]

In 2004, SNAP acknowledged accepting donations from leading attorneys who had represented clients in abuse cases, but maintained that it did not direct clients to these attorneys
 
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jazzflower92

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Dubious claims of the widely discredited psychological theory of “repressed memories,” have been used to put priests at a significant disadvantage in obtaining justice. In these cases, individuals claim that a priest molested them years earlier and assert that they repressed the memory due to the trauma. The alleged incident is often recalled, Pierre says, “through the suggestive questioning of an unprincipled therapist and, often under hypnosis.” Naturally, hypnosis leaves people open to the power of suggestion. Many experts believe that repressed memory is simply bogus. Dr. James McGaugh, from the University of California, Irvine, an expert in the area of memory, states, “I do not believe there is such a thing as a repressed memory… And there’s absolutely no proof that it can happen. Zero. None. Niente.” Dr. Richard J. McNally, Director of Clinical Training in the Department of Psychology at Harvard University claims, repressed memory therapy is “the worst catastrophe to befall the mental health field since the lobotomy era.”

http://www.catholicleague.org/bogus-charges-against-priests-abound/

I would advise you not to take the words of the Catholic League with seriousness, because of the fact that they tend to really stick by anything without question.
 
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Landon Caeli

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I would advise you not to take the words of the Catholic League with seriousness, because of the fact that they tend to really stick by anything without question.

Still, Dr. James McGaugh, from the University of California, is a credible expert on the subject of memory. (Post 29)

Dr. Richard J. McNally, Director of Clinical Training in the Department of Psychology at Harvard University is an expert as well. (Post 29)
 
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jazzflower92

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Still, Dr. James McGaugh, from the University of California, is a credible expert on the subject of "supressed memory". (Post 29)

Dr. Richard J. McNally, Director of Clinical Training in the Department of Psychology at Harvard University is as well. (Post 29)

Suppressed memory is one thing, but the Catholic League has been known to be very dismissive of all cases. .
 
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Zoii

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I'm sure the charges are bogus, like many other similar attempts at smearing the Catholic Church.

http://www.catholicleague.org/bogus-charges-against-priests-abound/
Whether these are bogus is a matter for the courts and neither you or anyone can be "sure" as we were not there and his accusers real. You also cannot refute the overwhelming evidence, Royal commission, and convictions concerning preist sexual abuse. But we also cant ignore that similar horrors exist in evangelist churches eg Hillsong, protestant and even the Salvation Army
 
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Landon Caeli

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Whether these are bogus is a matter for the courts and neither you or anyone can be "sure" as we were not there and his accusers real. You also cannot refute the overwhelming evidence, Royal commission, and convictions concerning preist sexual abuse. But we also cant ignore that similar horrors exist in evangelist churches eg Hillsong, protestant and even the Salvation Army

Well, he claims he is innocent, so I take him at his word.
 
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PeaceB

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Well, he claims he is innocent, so I take him at his word.
Sure, everyone is innocent until proven guilty. But it is also possible that he is guilty of the crimes that he is being accused of.

Certainly some of the sexual abuse claims are false and much of the media hype surrounding the scandal is motivated by anti-Catholicism, but on the other hand many of these were and are real crimes, and they should be taken seriously. Even one case is too many and we should constantly be striving so that there are zero cases.

If we say that the Catholic Church has a special authority from Christ to declare the truth as it pertains to Christian morality, then we have to hold ourselves to a much higher standard of conduct than protestant churches and secular institutions. In a sense you can view the disproportionately high level of criticism leveled at the Catholic Church, as opposed to other institutions, as an implicit recognition of Her authority to speak concerning the moral life. That is, when we preach but do not practice, it is seen as the height of hypocrisy, but when other groups preach but do not practice, it is not particularly noteworthy because nobody truly views their preaching as having any authoritative value in the first place.
 
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PeaceB

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Did you know that the devil hates the Catholic Church probably more than any other institution? And that he works overtime in trying to destroy it, just like he worked overtime trying to temp Jesus before the crucifixion?

...Sure, the devil works directly against some priests but he also works hard in others who try to frame priests. Now we have 13 people accusing Cardinal Pell, one of pope Francis' closest aids - and cardinal Pell states he is completely innocent, and is a victim of a "relentless character assasination". George Pell, top Pope advisor, charged with sexual assault offenses - CNN.com

If these 13 people fail in court, I'd like to know their names, so we can keep an eye on them. Like Judas, they would obviously be under the devils control.
God will handle the devil and anyone who cooperates with him. Our first priority is to grow in our personal holiness, and let's face it, there are plenty of us who need a lot of work in this area (myself included).

I am not saying that people who are falsely accused should not defend themselves, but the reason why this problem happened in the first place, and the reason why we are even in a position to be framed in the first place, is because there were plenty of priests who did in fact abuse minors, and there were many people who attempted to cover it up. The problem is primarily a result of our own failure to be holy, not because of what other people have done to us.

You can't make excuses for it. We screwed up, and we are paying a punishment for it. The only long term way out of that is to make sure that we do not screw up again in the future.
 
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Landon Caeli

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While the devil hates the church, he can also do things like make the institution do corrupt things to hold onto an image. If you don't try to clean things up, then the devil will win by people assuming that everything is just people being framed.

The devils goal is not merely to allow sexual sins to go unnoticed. It is to destroy faith in Christ's institution.
 
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