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Can Your Christianity Help a Dying Man?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by jimmyjimmy, Jul 8, 2017.

  1. Hammster

    Hammster Safeism is the new religion. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    The thief died believing the gospel.
     
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  2. jimmyjimmy

    jimmyjimmy Pardoned Rebel Supporter

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    Jesus died before either thief did, and the gospel goes back to Genesis 3:15. Many believed it, and they are all saved by the blood of Christ.
     
  3. pshun2404

    pshun2404 Newbie

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    It is not about what one says they will accept or believe or even simply believing IN GOD (the devils also believe)...it is about understanding the redemptive purpose...

    The gospel is NOT accept Jesus or go to hell...the gospel is you are going to go to hell because all have sinned and sin cannot remain ion the presence of God...(what we call Hell ios the place designed by God for all those who cannot remain in His presence)...and the person and work of His Christ (beginning with Genesis 3:15) IS the means of remissing those sins...it is the pardon offered...and it is free, given to those who faithe (believe God not just in Him).

    Even Ghandi understood this...the premise is, to get off the wheel of life (continuous reincarnation) and be elevated to the spiritual realm, one has to eliminate their bad Karma (have their sins replaced, remissed, or dealt with)...in the Bible Jesus IS that way...He is the remission of sin.
     
  4. pshun2404

    pshun2404 Newbie

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    That's all it takes...the gospel IS the power of God unto salvation...
     
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  5. timewerx

    timewerx the village i--o--t--

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    Proof of belief is this:

    John 14:12
    Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.


    The first two verses you mentioned requires proof. Nearly impossible to have when you're about to die.

    God knows our hearts yes... But it goes both ways.

    I'm not saying a deathbed salvation is impossible, as there can be other factors involved. But I wouldn't want to bet on it. Like you said, God knows our hearts....

    If someone only became accepting of our faith because death is staring them at their face (same thing as someone putting a gun to their head). Would that be a genuine repentance? It's probably not.
     
  6. 2Timothy2:15

    2Timothy2:15 Well-Known Member

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    Romans Road is a good way.

    What is the Romans Road to salvation?


    Romans 10
    8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

    9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

    10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
     
  7. Hammster

    Hammster Safeism is the new religion. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Only if it is.
     
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  8. 2Timothy2:15

    2Timothy2:15 Well-Known Member

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    Hogwash, it is ever too late to receive the Lord. What about the thief on the cross? I have seen people saved on their death bed. Jesus grace is that awesome!
     
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  9. 2Timothy2:15

    2Timothy2:15 Well-Known Member

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    Sorry but if you loved them you would want them saved for eternity not comforted on their way to hell.
     
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  10. 2Timothy2:15

    2Timothy2:15 Well-Known Member

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    Preaching the gospel is not manipulating anyone. No one comes to the son unless they are drawn by the Father. But they can not be drawn unless they hear the gospel. The Lord can do miracles in peoples heart and it is not up to us to decide who can hear and who the Lord softens hearts.

    Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

    We are commanded to preach the gospel.
     
  11. 2Timothy2:15

    2Timothy2:15 Well-Known Member

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    No he did not die under the OT it became the new covenant because Jesus was paying the price and Jesus promised him. Jesus is not a liar. Jesus made a covenant right there and then. Today you will be with me in paradise.
     
  12. ByTheSpirit

    ByTheSpirit Pray always!!

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    Sureeeee.... the second covenant wasn't enacted until Jesus was dead (and had risen)

    “Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant. For where a will is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established. For a will takes effect only at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive.”
    ‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭9:15-17‬ ‭ESV‬‬
     
  13. TheSeabass

    TheSeabass Well-Known Member

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    Paul said to work out your own salvation so God works in those that obey Him and those who were never Christians cannot, on their death bed moments from dying, work out their salvation.
     
  14. TheSeabass

    TheSeabass Well-Known Member

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    I cannot show you what does not exist, that is, I cannot show you where the NT gospel teaches death bed salvation when it doesn't. Can you show/prove that it does?
     
  15. TheSeabass

    TheSeabass Well-Known Member

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    Can you show me where the disobedient receives God's grace and be saved anyway?
     
  16. nonaeroterraqueous

    nonaeroterraqueous Nonexistent Member

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    The thief on the cross who repented was on his deathbed.

    That's a fallacious argument. You make the positive assertion and demand that your opponent prove you wrong. The onus is always on the one making the positive assertion, or I could claim limitless things that you could never disprove. You have no reason at all to believe that the thief was ever baptized, and that's all the rebuttal anyone ever needs to give you.

    The thief on the cross.

    In fifteen minutes, that dying person is a lump of compost. You would waste every last minute of that tending to needs that amount to nothing in as little as one second later. The appropriateness of an act of futility is nothing compared to at least addressing the person's afterlife, which is about the only thing left of any relevance at all. I see no reason to worry excessively about making polite conversation to a lump of compost.

    By the way, with no offence intended, I have never yet seen someone call another person sanctimonious (self-righteous) who was not guilty of that very thing.

    Probably not means possibly so. That's enough reason to try.

    Death is staring you in the face right now. Is your acceptance invalid? Whether it's fifteen years or fifteen minutes, it's only a matter of degree. I'm terrified by the thought of living less than a thousand years. From the perspective of the angels, you're practically going to die tomorrow.

    As far as the matter of proof is concerned, don't confuse the proof of the matter with the reality of the matter. There are many truths that can never be proved but are no less real.
     
  17. seashale76

    seashale76 Orthodox Christian and Unapologetic Iconodule

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    I've been in this situation as I've cared for a few dying folks considering my unit has a few hospice scatter beds (I'm a nurse). I cannot convince anyone of anything. By the time one is dying they are generally set in their ways. Actually- quite a few folks are not interactive when they are in the process of dying. It is up to their own convictions and God calling them to Himself at that point. I care for them. I silently pray for them. If they express a want or need for anything spiritual- I help them by calling the Chaplain (but this is something that generally occurs well before they are in their last moments). I've heard of a deathbed baptism at the hospital recently- but it was the patient's family that wanted it. I'm not certain the dying individual was concerned about this at all or even aware of what was going on.
     
  18. 2Timothy2:15

    2Timothy2:15 Well-Known Member

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    You should study Hebrews 9 in it's entirety and in context. You should also study all the passages. Surely you are free to believe what you want but I think after doing an honest study you may change your view based on scripture.

    Was the Thief on the Cross Saved Under the Old Covenant or New? | Dane's Place

    Hebrews 9:15-17 -  The New Covenant is Now In Force
     
  19. ByTheSpirit

    ByTheSpirit Pray always!!

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    The thief on he cross died under the Old Covenant
     
  20. ByTheSpirit

    ByTheSpirit Pray always!!

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