Can You Imagine?

murjahel

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This thread will take some Biblical stories, and alter them to fit the doctrines of today, and show how SILLY the Bible would be, if it truly happened as that...



CAN YOU IMAGINE??? if Mary Magdalene had met Jesus at the garden of the tomb, and been told by the Lord to be the first minister to preach a resurrection message to the disciples who were in hiding.... and...

she had reasoned...
'If I go there, the disciples are gathered together, and that would be a church service, and I would be the preacher... but I should not speak to men, nor preach a sermon to them, nor correct them for their doubts and fears in hiding while I was going to the tomb... I will be called a 'jezebel'.


I cannot speak that sermon to these 11 disciples... they will rightly rebuke me...


I had better just sit in the back, and smile... for if I let out this sermon of resurrection that I have, certainly I will be reprimanded...


I am allowed to tell my husband when at home, but wait, I am unmarried, so I have no man that I can tell...


If two or three gather together, it is a church service, so if I meet any man outside these four walls, I will be in a church service, and cannot tell...


I guess my only hope is to find a husband, marry him, and then on the wedding night, I can proclaim, Jesus is alive, and tell him how I met the Lord, and what He wants me to tell the disciples about meeting Him in Galilee...


Guess, I better propose to one of those single disciples soon, then my new husband can relate this wonderful sermon, this sermon has got to be preached.


LOL



The subject of women has long been debated in Christian circles.

The church has backslidden from the truth proclaimed by the Word of God.

The Word of God proclaims that God does not see us as male or female. He sees us all as equals, regardless of the gender.

So why would God favor one gender over another?
He does not, and when Christians teach otherwise, they are misapplying, and misinterpreting Scriptures.

Galatians 3:28
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female; for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

All races, classes, and sexes are equal in rights and privileges.

In Christianity, there is an equality for women that is unlike any other culture of the past.

In the Bible days, women were thought to be inferior to men.

They walked humbly behind their mate.

They served him in total subjection and fear.

If he chose, he could divorce her for combing her hair in an unpleasing manner.
He could send her from his home and from his life with a few words.

Then came Jesus. He taught a new equality for women.

He taught that God saw all of mankind as equal.

The women were delighted in that day.

Today, in Christianity, we find the doctrines of putting women as inferior to men, having crept back into the dogmas of congregations.

This is regrettable and sinful.

It is contrary to the true teachings of the Bible.

All Christians are as one in God's eyes.

He does not care what your profession is, and He does not care what your skin color is. He does not care if you are Jewish or Gentile, and He does not care if you are male or female.

Acts 10:34
"Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth, I perceive that God is no respecter of persons..."

Romans 2:11
"For there is no respect of persons with God."

Ephesians 6:9
"...neither is there respect of persons with Him."

I Peter 1:17
"And if ye call on the Father, Who without respect of persons judgeth..."

Can God make it any clearer? Does He need to put handwriting on the walls of the buildings of the congregations of today?

The truth of the New Testament's teaching is that God sees no difference in the rights and privileges of men or women.

The congregations of Christianity have often perverted some of the Scriptures.

Many have tried to teach that women are inferior to men.

I Corinthians 14:34-35
"Let your women keep silence in the churches; for it is not permitted unto them to speak... And if they learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home; for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."

This refers to the confusion caused when the women talked out loud to husbands in the midst of sermons. The women of the day were not educated as the men, and often did not understand what the preacher was saying.

In Christianity, the women were being given equality, and were being taught as the men in this new Christian faith.

Paul was only saying that the women should question the husband at home, and not disrupt the service.

I Timothy 2:11-12
"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."

This passage in Timothy also refers to the same situation as I Corinthians 14:34-35. The women were not to interrupt the sermon with talking out loud to their husbands.

The word "subjection" is from the Greek word
"hupotage" which means "a voluntary yielding in love."

There is a time for women to question their husband about the sermon. In love and respect for the service and for the husband, the wife should voluntarily wait.

They were also not to not argue with the man's interpretation of the sermon during the service.

This in no way lessens her equality, it only emphasizes a restraint of embarrassing a mate in public by flaunting her equality.

It also was to encourage her to respect the sanctity of the service.

This new found freedom in Christianity had now allowed a woman to disagree with her husband.

Sometimes, in a service there was probably a desire of the wife to say - "I told you so!"

She may want to teach her husband something she had learned before he had.

Paul simply instructs the woman not to "usurp authority" over the man, but to silently listen.

The Greek word for "usurp authority" is the word -
"authenteo"
which means "to exercise one's power over..."

In Christianity, the wife does have "power", and she can exercise it to question the husband, and to even teach the husband.

The translators were all men, and questionably translated this Greek word improperly.

A whole different meaning is found in the original word.

It shows that women have an "authority" to speak their mind, and have an opinion different from the husband's.

Paul is not removing the authority from the woman, that Christianity had given her.
No!
Rather he is only saying that she should not exercise that power in the middle of his sermon.

So, the idea that a woman is a 'jezebel' if she corrects, disagrees, preaches to a man, is nonsense.

Mary Magdalene had no such doctrine taught her by the Lord, and she immediately went and was the first preacher of the church age to preach a resurrection message.

Quite an honor.

more 'can you imagines?' to come
 
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murjahel

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CAN YOU IMAGINE

A missionary went to a small town in the nation in which he was to minister. Henry and Joe were both saved, baptized, and wanted to start a church.

Unexpectantly, the missionary was called back to the states.
Henry and Joe continued on their own in the church, and began to make converts. They took them to the river to baptize the new converts, and had been taught by that missionary that if one is not baptized, i.e. immersed, they are not saved.

They needed some money to build their church so they were collecting a dollar from each convert for the baptism.

One by one they were baptized. Finally, a married couple came to be baptized, and his wife paid the two dollars, one for each of them. She was immersed, and came up, and was told that now, she was saved. The man was immersed, when suddenly, he slipped out of their grasp and the river current pulled him under and out of their reach. Under the water he struggled and struggled, but finally drowned.

The wife was devastated but thought, well, he was saved before he died. Henry and Joe went aside to discuss whether he was truly saved, for he had been immersed, in likeness to Christ’s death, but had not come up out of the water, in likeness to the resurrection to new life. They argued a while but finally had to tell the woman, that since the baptism had not been completed, and he had not been bought up in resurrection life, he had died while still a sinner.

They refunded her one of the two dollars. She went home a dollar richer, but a husband poorer, and no hope in her mind that he had made it to heaven.
.............
 
There is much misunderstanding of water baptism. The doctrine has been perverted, and sometimes, due to the confusion on it, there is despair created.

The doctrine of water baptism has many varying proponents who argue over many issues of baptism. The mode (immersion, sprinkling, or pouring), the formula ("in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit", or "in the name of Jesus"), the timing (as an infant, or as an adult), etc is argued and debated today.

The church is to search the Scriptures to eliminate false doctrines, and to recognize false prophets.

Unfortunately, many Christians cannot tell you the names of the four gospels, let alone to identify false doctrines.

Baptism was an initiatory rite, in the world of that day. Even pagans used it to refer to washing clean of other faiths and beliefs. People were accepted into mystery cults, and most were secret initiations. The new Christian converts were acquainted with such practices, and therefore saw baptism as an announcement of entrance into the church of Jesus
.

Water baptism is connected with the remission of sins. Not that the baptism washes away sin, but it is an outward symbol of what the Lord did for us at salvation.

Acts 22:16
"Arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins..."
Hebrews 10:22 shows that it is a symbol of the regeneration of the regeneration. It says:
"Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water."

Neophytes to the mystery cults of the time of the early church also baptized and taught through such baptism that they died to the old life, and began a new one. The Christians also taught that with water baptism they were ingrafted into Christ, and in union with Him in His death and resurrection.

Romans 6:3-6
"Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into His death? Therefore we are buried with Him by baptism into death; that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been planted together in the likeness of His death, we shall also be in the likeness of His resurrection; Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin."

This new relationship now brings us into the family of God.

Galatians 3:26-27
"For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ."

Baptism is a symbol of all these things. And the water in baptism represents the blood of Jesus which washes away our sins, and with the purifying effect of the Holy Spirit Who cleanses us in salvation from our sinfulness. The rising out of the water represents the rising from sin to newness of life by virtue of Christ's death and resurrection.

Water baptism teaches through its symbolism that cleansing from sin is reached only through connection with the death of Jesus. And it teaches that when we avail ourselves of this cleansing, we are also enter into a new life as part of the family of God.

Faith is a prerequisite to baptism. It is not a product of baptism. We are not saved by baptism, but we are baptized because we have been saved. Baptism in water is only a sacrament to typify what the Lord did for us at salvation.
The Lord wants us to "baptize" and "teach" new converts. Actually, baptism is one of the teachings we need to be taught.

The husband of that wife had been saved, when he repented of his sins, and accepted Jesus. The false doctrine on baptism had devastated her hope of seeing him in heaven though. The false doctrines in some churches today can devastate, and cause heartache.

Blessedly, this story is only an ‘imagine’.
 
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ByTheSpirit

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You forgot to add that it is a Jewish ritual - like circumcism which Paul argued at length that it was not required . "Imagine" if christians knew that before being demanded/convinced/persuaded/guilted into having it performed on them .

And yet the Apostles and early church evangelists still baptized new Christian converts isnt that weird since it is a Jewish ritual? Hmmm
 
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SpiritPsalmist

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You forgot to add that it is a Jewish ritual - like circumcism which Paul argued at length that it was not required . "Imagine" if christians knew that before being demanded/convinced/persuaded/guilted into having it performed on them .

Repentance (turning away from sins) is a Jewish ritual too. Being baptized does not save but it is an act of obedience (to God) in demonstrating repentance.
 
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Frogster

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Repentance (turning away from sins) is a Jewish ritual too. Being baptized does not save but it is an act of obedience (to God) in demonstrating repentance.

obedience? you just turned it into a rule.
 
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Frogster

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You forgot to add that it is a Jewish ritual - like circumcism which Paul argued at length that it was not required . "Imagine" if christians knew that before being demanded/convinced/persuaded/guilted into having it performed on them .

true:thumbsup:, and certain people should lookie and seeee heee that it is plural in Heb 6..baptismssss/washingsssss, and we are not baptized into judaism.
 
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ByTheSpirit

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true:thumbsup:, and certain people should lookie and seeee heee that it is plural in Heb 6..baptismssss/washingsssss, and we are not baptized into judaism.

No but you are baptized into Christ... Oh wait I forgot, if we have to do anything it is wrong because God does everything that's right :doh:
 
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ByTheSpirit

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what baptism is 1 cor 12:13?:p

What baptism is Matthew 28:19-20, or Mark 16:15-16, or Acts 2:38, or Acts 8:36-37, or Acts 10:47-48, or Romans 6:3-4, or 1 Peter 3:20-21?

Oh thats right foolish me for trying to use good biblical sense when discussing matters on CF! :p
 
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Frogster

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What baptism is Matthew 28:19-20, or Mark 16:15-16, or Acts 2:38, or Acts 8:36-37, or Acts 10:47-48, or Romans 6:3-4, or 1 Peter 3:20-21?

Oh thats right foolish me for trying to use good biblical sense when discussing matters on CF! :p

paaaalease do not tell me that the symbolic water baptism in mind in romans 6!:bow:

then u r sayng our being IN CHRIST is symbolic!:D

besides, 1 cor 12:13 proves my point, stop looking for works everwhere, that place that u said u hang your hat.:p
 
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Frogster

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What baptism is Matthew 28:19-20, or Mark 16:15-16, or Acts 2:38, or Acts 8:36-37, or Acts 10:47-48, or Romans 6:3-4, or 1 Peter 3:20-21?

Oh thats right foolish me for trying to use good biblical sense when discussing matters on CF! :p

water here, judaism? or one new corporate new man?

swooosssshhhhh...

ALL OF US...

oh yes, he was talking water, as he was warding off racial superiority!:D


3:26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. 27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave[g] nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
 
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Frogster

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Whatever makes you feel better about your "walk" with the Lord brother. But you can't be walking with Him because that implies you are working and we all know that is a no no with God and grace... Right?

ok fine, do u want me to brag, and list my works, so i can brag about where i hang my hat?

please advise.:)
 
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ByTheSpirit

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ok fine, do u want me to brag, and list my works, so i can brag about where i hang my hat?

please advise.:)

Explain to me what Jesus meant by we will be judged by our works if works are not important. I'm pretty sure every single parable the Lord taught in Matthew 25 had to do with judgment based off works (the virgins may be questionable but the other two are not)
 
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ByTheSpirit

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You have a laxidasical attitude about anything work related as if you are so fearful to be associated with a work because you read once that they were bad and the Lord will condemn you for doing them when the majority of the NT and OT supports them. Only works done with an attitude that draws attention from the Lord onto ourselves are not good. When we do work, our sole purpose of that work should be to glorify God. I we are doing it for any other reason then it becomes a problem. But that doesn't mean we should run from all works like a scared chicken.
 
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Frogster

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Explain to me what Jesus meant by we will be judged by our works if works are not important. I'm pretty sure every single parable the Lord taught in Matthew 25 had to do with judgment based off works (the virgins may be questionable but the other two are not)

do you know what it is to indicate something?

sure, unsaved do not do good, we do, but no one is justified or sanctified by works, or the man from tarsus, that JESUS CALLED, was wrong, and so was peter james and john, please stop prooftexting the whole of the theology.

then u will do well, kipison..said affectionatly of course.:)

u fuse works too much, jesus said beleive and not condemend in john 3, and 5, fatoid of the week.
 
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You have a laxidasical attitude about anything work related as if you are so fearful to be associated with a work because you read once that they were bad and the Lord will condemn you for doing them when the majority of the NT and OT supports them. Only works done with an attitude that draws attention from the Lord onto ourselves are not good. When we do work, our sole purpose of that work should be to glorify God. I we are doing it for any other reason then it becomes a problem. But that doesn't mean we should run from all works like a scared chicken.

who said "hang hat?":)
 
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