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Featured CAN YOU HAVE GOD'S GRACE WITHOUT GOD'S LAW?

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by LoveGodsWord, Jan 9, 2019.

  1. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    I place no special meaning on those words. All of Paul is suspect as Chief of all sinners. Like I said, no haloes. :holy:
     
  2. W2L

    W2L Well-Known Member

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    No, you misinterpret them.
     
  3. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    The admitted Chief of Sinners? He never even met Jesus. He seems to have a hard time applying what had learned into action. Never meeting Jesus, that makes sense.
     
  4. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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  5. W2L

    W2L Well-Known Member

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    I can post scripture too, but i know people have studied them for themselves and common sense tells them that the apostles commands have not been replaced by mans law. Thats not what Paul is saying in Romans. You have totally missed what he teaches in Romans.
     
  6. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    No, not even close to right.
    If anyone trusts man, if anyone obeys man instead of obeying Yahweh, they are cursed. (as Yahweh Says).
     
  7. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    But you keep opposing all Scripture. When you 'claim' to agree with one , you then dis-em-bowel it by denying Yahweh's Authority - as it is written
    trying (but not succeeding) to "have the form of religion, but denying the power there-of". i.e. not even having the form of Righteous religion, not even having the appearance of DOing what is right,
    instead approving of sin, continually, disregarding as if nothing Yahweh's Word. --- using it only when convenient to the false ideas, dismissing it when it exposes the abominations / sins.
     
  8. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    My vantage is that sin is only in ones own heart, and not in the written law.
    All my messages stick to that premise.
    If you read scripture different than me, well, that must be SATAN working on your brain! (I guess that's what you're teaching me to say, teacher.)
    What Does the Bible Say About God Sees The Heart Not Works?
    What Does the Bible Say About Only The New Covenant Of Grace Saves?
     
  9. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    The links are apparently toxic, so best not to go there.

    True - sin that Yahweh sees in the heart, of acknowledged (self-admitted and obvious) perverts who keep serving demons and refuse to repent , is why they are hated by Yahweh and condemned by Yahweh, as His Word Clearly States Always.

    Proverbs 11:20 The perverse in heart are an abomination ... - Bible Hub
    Proverbs 11:20 The perverse in heart are an abomination to the LORD, but the blameless in their walk are His delight.
    The LORD detests those whose hearts are perverse, but he delights in those whose ways are blameless. New Living ... The LORD hates sneaky people, but he likes everyone who lives right. .... Strong's Hebrew 8549: Entire, integrity, truth
    Proverbs 17:20 The one with a perverse heart finds no good, and he ...

    Proverbs 17:20 The one with a perverse heart finds no good, and he whose tongue is deceitful will fall into trouble.
    One whose heart is corrupt does not prosper; one whose tongue is perverse falls into trouble. ... It is a restless evil, full of deadly poison. ... The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I ...
     
  10. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    The links are just an open source topical search engine like a study Bible. Your loss.
     
  11. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    Just scripture, not me. But casue you are afraid:

    God Sees The Heart Not Works


    1 Samuel 16:7
    But the Lord said to Samuel, “Do not look on his appearance or on the height of his stature, because I have rejected him. For the Lord sees not as man sees: man looks on the outward appearance, but the Lord looks on the heart.”

    Proverbs 4:23
    Keep your heart with all vigilance, for from it flow the springs of life.

    Ephesians 2:10
    For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

    Psalm 51:10
    Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me.

    Colossians 3:23-24
    Whatever you do, work heartily, as for the Lord and not for men, knowing that from the Lord you will receive the inheritance as your reward. You are serving the Lord Christ.

    2 Corinthians 5:17
    Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.

    Psalm 44:21
    Would not God discover this? For he knows the secrets of the heart.

    1 Kings 8:39
    Then hear in heaven your dwelling place and forgive and act and render to each whose heart you know, according to all his ways (for you, you only, know the hearts of all the children of mankind),

    Revelation 1:1-20
    The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, who bore witness to the word of God and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, even to all that he saw. Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear, and who keep what is written in it, for the time is near. John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace from him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven spirits who are before his throne, and from Jesus Christ the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of kings on earth. To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood ...

    Hebrews 4:12
    For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart.

    Philippians 4:13
    I can do all things through him who strengthens me.

    Galatians 6:9
    And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up.

    Romans 6:23
    For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

    Matthew 6:21
    For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

    Matthew 6:2
    “Thus, when you give to the needy, sound no trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may be praised by others. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward.

    Matthew 5:8
    “Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God.
     
  12. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    Knowledge of good and evil is free will. Animals don't worry about sin against God and have no worry about evil.
     
  13. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    Rather since you are attempting to justify sin the last several years with your posts and links, as others noted the posts are attempts to twist and distort God's Word,
    it is best not to go along nor to read them in context of those posts - the motive and direction is appearing sinful, all wrong , directly contrary to Jesus' Direction .
     
  14. W2L

    W2L Well-Known Member

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    You said those commands were obsolete. Why are you quoting them?
     
  15. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    For years that has been happening, not just with one poster, but with most on earth ......
     
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  16. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    What does the word, "fruit", mean when it occurs more than forty times in the new Testament?

    You clearly see the word, 'fruit', as meaning obedience to God' law.
    I interpret the word 'fruit' differently, rather the result of the work of the Holy Spirit in us.

    There are two clear meanings of 'fruit' in the N.T., one is the godly attributes shown below.

    Galatians 5:22-23
    But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.

    The second meaning of 'fruit' in the N.T. is the conversion of disciples.

    Matthew 13:23
    And the one on whom seed was sown on the good soil, this is the man who hears the word and understands it; who indeed bears fruit and brings forth, some a hundredfold, some sixty, and some thirty.”
     
  17. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    Your questions are just all over the place like a jello marshmallow salad.

    The New Covenant
    13 By speaking of a new covenant, He has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

    On this topic:

    Luke 22:20
    In the same way, after supper He took the cup, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is poured out for you.

    2 Corinthians 3:6
    And He has qualified us as ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

    2 Corinthians 5:17
    Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away. Behold, the new has come!

    Hebrews 7:22
    Because of this oath, Jesus has become the guarantee of a better covenant.

    Hebrews 8:6
    Now, however, Jesus has received a much more excellent ministry, just as the covenant He mediates is better and is founded on better promises.

    Hebrews 8:8
    But God found fault with the people and said: "Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.

    Hebrews 9:15
    Therefore Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, now that He has died to redeem them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.

    Hebrews 12:24
    to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.
     
  18. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    He posted all correctly , in line with ALL GOD'S WORD - instead of trying to say sinning is okay by ignoring most of God's Word.

    So he's good, right with God, as God's Word and Spirit Confirm together.

    Not so , those are not good, when anyone is twisting God's Word out of context, promoting sinful unrepentant life.

    Yahweh's Word are all over the place - Alpha to Omega, Beginning to End, Everywhere through all time.

    Whoever REJECTS Yahweh's Word, has already rejected Yahweh.
     
  19. Oscarr

    Oscarr Senior Veteran Supporter

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    The law no longer has any place for us. The old covenant was based on the foundation of the 10 Commandments and the Mosaic Law. But that covenant was broken and the breach of contract made righteousness by the law ineffective.

    If people try to keep the law in order to be acceptable to God at any time, it is no longer grace.
    "By grace you have been saved through faith, and not of yourself, but it is the gift of God" (Ephesians 2:8).

    "But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works, otherwise grace is no longer grace" (Romans 11:6).

    "My grace is sufficient for you" (2 Corinthians 12:9).

    "The just shall live by faith" (Romans 1:17).

    These Scriptures show very clearly that the Christian is not saved by observance to the law in any way. Furthermore, he does not grow in grace through any observance to the law either. If it is by following any laws, including the 10 Commandments, it cannot any longer be grace.

    If a person tries to keep the law even to the smallest extent, he is trying to work his way to Heaven, therefore, grace does not apply to him. He is trying to make a debtor out of God, that if he is a good boy and follows the rules, God will owe him a ticket to Heaven. But God owes us nothing. He never had to save us in the first place and could have left us to wallow in our hopelessness.

    So, everything we have in Christ is through the grace and mercy of God and nothing else.

    To say that a genuinely converted Christian can willfully and happily commit sin is nonsense because it is not in his new nature. But there is a battle between the flesh and the Spirit in him, and he depends on 1 John 1:9 to win the battle. All he has to do is to talk to God about it, and he is totally forgiven and cleansed.

    The promise of God is that what He doesn't like about us, He will change by the power of the Holy Spirit.
     
  20. W2L

    W2L Well-Known Member

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    Ephesians 5 Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children; 2 and walk in love, just as Christ also loved [a]you and gave Himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma.

    3 But immorality [c]or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among [d]saints; 4 and there must be no filthiness and silly talk, or coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks. 5 For this you know with certainty, that no [e]immoral or impure person or covetous man, who is an idolater, has an inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.

    6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience. 7 Therefore do not be partakers with them; 8 for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light 9 (for the fruit of the Light consists in all goodness and righteousness and truth), 10 [f]trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord. 11 Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even [g]expose them; 12 for it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret. 13 But all things become visible when they are [h]exposed by the light, for everything that becomes visible is light. 14 For this reason it says,

    “Awake, sleeper,
    And arise from the dead,
    And Christ will shine on you.”

    15 Therefore [j]be careful how you walk, not as unwise men but as wise, 16 [k]making the most of your time, because the days are evil. 17 So then do not be foolish, but understand what the will of the Lord is.
     
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