Can you Christian borderlines help me understand my wife?

[Resolute]

She's been a good person. How could she start telling serious lies all of a sudden? Here is the story:

After 19 years of marriage, she moved out "to get some space." She said we weren't separating, but just having some time out for a few months. But within a short time of getting her own place, she got a "friend" and now spends weekends with him at her sister's house/mansion (her story is that he is the sister's handyman and my she stays there out of concern for her sister who has health issues.)

It started three months ago, and she still indignantly insists he is just a friend. She claims they are not physical, but my wife is very uninhibited sexually so this is preposterous to me. I discovered they were texting day and night, including during the period we were still coming together as man and wife. Then they secretly went out of state together to see his family for 12 days! over the holidays and she lied about that (though finally she had to admit her lie when I gave her a copy of her the cell phone records showing her out of state.) I have told her I don't believe her, and none of her Christian friends would either, nor would they think it was OK for a married woman and a believer to act this way. She maintains there is nothing wrong with what they are doing.

She was not a liar before, outside of maybe exaggerating a bit when she was upset. Her lies are totally ridiculous now, yet she acts outraged and offended when I don't believe her. I just can't figure out why has she become such a blatant liar all a sudden? It's almost as if she has become pathological --she's so calm and looks me in the eyes when she lies, I would almost say she believes what she's saying.

She has BPD but is high functioning - a very successful and admired executive director of a non-profit. Can anybody help me understand what happened? Does a new infatuation make you do crazy things or cause distorted reality? Has splitting me black justified the lying in her mind, because "bad" people don't deserve the truth. What happened to her morals and her relationship with Jesus???

 

[Resolute]

I'm wondering if my post offended some people, like I was suggesting that pwBPD are all liars. Please forgive me if I did.

I would just like to understanding how she appear so comfortable in this charade when she's always condemned this type of behavior in others.

 

[anonym00s]

Your post didn't offend me, but then again I do not have bpd. The bpd person I knew had a HIGH risk of not lying per se but exaggerating (of course, it is always difficult to say for sure). Probably because they truly believed liying was wrong. Instead, in my opinion, they deluded themselves into actually believing what they were saying or just let their emotions speak. I looked at your post previously but didn't respond because I didn't see the point of your question. You are saying that you already know that your wife is openly sinning. Does it really matter HOW she got there? I think the question should be how to get her back.

 

[Resolute]

I don't know if it's possible to get her back (have a marriage) if she can't admit that what she is doing is wrong.

 

[madison1101]

Sexually acting out is usually a sign of childhood sexual abuse. The lies are part of a deep sense of denial. If she is truly a believer in Christ, she knows the truth about her behavior deep down inside. The guilt and shame she is probably bearing is too hard to face.

I speak from some of my own personal experience about lies, and acting out.

If you and she have been church members, it might be good to enlist some fellow believers in trying to restore her to fellowship. Instead of arguing about her behavior, trying to convince her she's lying, take a woman or two she respected in the church, and talk to her about her relationship with the Lord. Remind her of 1 John 1:9. Tell her that you, and everyone at church has been praying for her.

But, first of all, bathe her in prayer.

 

[artqween]

I don't know if it's possible to get her back (have a marriage) if she can't admit that what she is doing is wrong.

 

[artqween]

I don't know if it's possible to get her back (have a marriage) if she can't admit that what she is doing is wrong.

:-/

 

[artqween]

What is she doing wrong? And what do u mean Christian borderline? I've never heard that before? Hey btw
Resolute, has she ever acted like this before??

Sorry for dup. Posting .. Wow

 

[Christine2013]

I can only say anything from my own experience. I have BPD, among other things. Sometimes me "acting out" isn't so obvious to me. Don't try to go through this alone, get someone close to you who understands the situation and can be more help. Is she seeing a therapist? If not, encourage her to do so. Actually, encouraging her might not get her to go. She needs some motivation to do that and to make things right. I'm praying for the two of you.

 

[artqween]

She's been a good person. How could she start telling serious lies all of a sudden? Here is the story:

After 19 years of marriage, she moved out "to get some space." She said we weren't separating, but just having some time out for a few months. But within a short time of getting her own place, she got a "friend" and now spends weekends with him at her sister's house/mansion (her story is that he is the sister's handyman and my she stays there out of concern for her sister who has health issues.)

It started three months ago, and she still indignantly insists he is just a friend. She claims they are not physical, but my wife is very uninhibited sexually so this is preposterous to me. I discovered they were texting day and night, including during the period we were still coming together as man and wife. Then they secretly went out of state together to see his family for 12 days! over the holidays and she lied about that (though finally she had to admit her lie when I gave her a copy of her the cell phone records showing her out of state.) I have told her I don't believe her, and none of her Christian friends would either, nor would they think it was OK for a married woman and a believer to act this way. She maintains there is nothing wrong with what they are doing.

She was not a liar before, outside of maybe exaggerating a bit when she was upset. Her lies are totally ridiculous now, yet she acts outraged and offended when I don't believe her. I just can't figure out why has she become such a blatant liar all a sudden? It's almost as if she has become pathological --she's so calm and looks me in the eyes when she lies, I would almost say she believes what she's saying.

She has BPD but is high functioning - a very successful and admired executive director of a non-profit. Can anybody help me understand what happened? Does a new infatuation make you do crazy things or cause distorted reality? Has splitting me black justified the lying in her mind, because "bad" people don't deserve the truth. What happened to her morals and her relationship with Jesus???

Have you discussed this with her? Humm?? God please help this couple..

 

[bhsmte]

I'm wondering if my post offended some people, like I was suggesting that pwBPD are all liars. Please forgive me if I did.

I would just like to understanding how she appear so comfortable in this charade when she's always condemned this type of behavior in others.

Resolute,

I recently divorced my wife of 20 years because of excessive BPD behaviors and I was awarded sole custody of all three of our kids.

The type of behavior you are talking about, is common place with those who suffer from BPD. In fact, it is the only type of behavior they know, especially when they sense they are losing control of their environment. Cognitive dissonance, false accusations and a host of other pleasant things start to rule their behavior. BPD's typically have the emotional maturity of a child, because for likely both genetic and environmental conditions, their emotional development was halted early in life. They have built up extraordinary defense mechanisms which mirror those of what you would see in a child. My ex wife refused to acknowledge she had a problem and of course, said that I was the one with psychological problems. She also, touts herself as a "great Christian" and actually used spiritual abuse tactics with myself and with the kids (and I mean way over the top).

The bottom line, the only way to make things better is for her to acknowledge she needs help and to seek out a therapist who is skilled at treating this condition. The sad part is, most who suffer from BPD, have a defense mechanism so strong, they can not admit to their own behaviors and never seek help.

 

[Christine2013]

When I was finally diagnosed with BPD, it was never disussed with me. The doctors have side stepped the issue for years, and recently was told that seeing someone for actual therapy would be a big help. If I can get into the program. It usually feels like a lose-lose situation. I've been speakin up more on these isses. But I still have a lot more to do. But I know I'm following the right thing for the moment. Anyway, it isn't fun being this way and I wish that others could se through our eyes to see what it's like. Then maybe they would get more supportive.

 

[bhsmte]

When I was finally diagnosed with BPD, it was never disussed with me. The doctors have side stepped the issue for years, and recently was told that seeing someone for actual therapy would be a big help. If I can get into the program. It usually feels like a lose-lose situation. I've been speakin up more on these isses. But I still have a lot more to do. But I know I'm following the right thing for the moment. Anyway, it isn't fun being this way and I wish that others could se through our eyes to see what it's like. Then maybe they would get more supportive.

Christine,

It sounds like you are on the right track if you are willing to see the right therapist. As I stated, many folks with BPD won't even acknowledge they need some help and typically blame others for their problems.

I find it unusual (and too bad) that you were diagnosed a while ago and the diagnosis or treatments were not discussed with you.

A couple of points that may be helpful; BPD is often mis-diagnosed and should only be diagnosed by a professional who has experience in doing the same. Also, therapists who truly understand how to treat BPD are not common and it is important that you research their experience in dealing with BPD.

Best of luck.

 

[BRERDO]

If she is truly a believer in Christ, she knows the truth about her behavior deep down inside.

Madison, it is not that easy. One is blinded with mental illness. Their faith is sometimes out of their control and it gets lost within the neurotransmitters that fire inside our minds that get us out of whack. One can populate their faith but when an "episode" or at certain triggered events take place, you become something/someone else and you may know what you are doing and watching through your eyes the things you are not wanting to do but cannot stop but unfortunately with BPD and other mentall illnesses like BiPolar and Schizophrenia, the person who are struggling with the disorder do not have that much control over the situation to know the behavior they are displaying.


That being said, Resolute... is your wife currently taking any medication? Any ssi's or mood stabilizers? You said she is highly functioning but being highly functioning off medication and during only psychotherapy may not be enough. Had she been diagnosed prior to you meeting? Did you know she was BPD and have you discussed anything in her past that may trigger these behaviors?

I have been diagnosed with a personality disorder along with BiPolar and off medication I can totally see how your wife's actions can be somewhat expected. Perhaps she wants to leave you but wants you to end things so that she is not seen as the one who did? I am sad for your situation and I hope that it all works out for your best interest but it seems that if she does return to you that you probably won't be able to trust her and would probably constantly worry that she is doing something behind your back with that guy or someone else.

I will pray for you and your situation and I wish nothing but the best for you.

 

[bhsmte]

Madison, it is not that easy. One is blinded with mental illness. Their faith is sometimes out of their control and it gets lost within the neurotransmitters that fire inside our minds that get us out of whack. One can populate their faith but when an "episode" or at certain triggered events take place, you become something/someone else and you may know what you are doing and watching through your eyes the things you are not wanting to do but cannot stop but unfortunately with BPD and other mentall illnesses like BiPolar and Schizophrenia, the person who are struggling with the disorder do not have that much control over the situation to know the behavior they are displaying.


That being said, Resolute... is your wife currently taking any medication? Any ssi's or mood stabilizers? You said she is highly functioning but being highly functioning off medication and during only psychotherapy may not be enough. Had she been diagnosed prior to you meeting? Did you know she was BPD and have you discussed anything in her past that may trigger these behaviors?

I have been diagnosed with a personality disorder along with BiPolar and off medication I can totally see how your wife's actions can be somewhat expected. Perhaps she wants to leave you but wants you to end things so that she is not seen as the one who did? I am sad for your situation and I hope that it all works out for your best interest but it seems that if she does return to you that you probably won't be able to trust her and would probably constantly worry that she is doing something behind your back with that guy or someone else.

I will pray for you and your situation and I wish nothing but the best for you.

Speaking from direct experience, I couldn't agree more with your comment about faith above.

My ex wife professed to be an ardent Christian and as her BPD began to spiral out of control, she chose to use her faith as a weapon against others. I won't even begin to give you examples of her behaviors in this regard, because they are so disturbing.

BPD is something you need professional/clinical help for. Without the right help, the problem can not be wished or prayed away.

 

[Jacojacojaco]

My advice would be to bring in a trusted 3rd party for counsel who isn't as closely involved in the situation. Maybe talk to a pastor or a chritan counselor. Also, do not lose heart! It has been my experience that when God begins to work through very deep and rooted issues of pain within us that outwardly things can get very messy on the surface but there is most assurdely a plan here that has been lovingly concieved for both you and your wife and ultimately the Glory of God. There is a wonderful book entitled "The Meaning of Marriage" by Timothy Keller that you may find very helpful and encouraging. I own it if you would like I will send it to you just pm me! Take care and God bless brother.

 

[bhsmte]

My advice would be to bring in a trusted 3rd party for counsel who isn't as closely involved in the situation. Maybe talk to a pastor or a chritan counselor. Also, do not lose heart! It has been my experience that when God begins to work through very deep and rooted issues of pain within us that outwardly things can get very messy on the surface but there is most assurdely a plan here that has been lovingly concieved for both you and your wife and ultimately the Glory of God. There is a wonderful book entitled "The Meaning of Marriage" by Timothy Keller that you may find very helpful and encouraging. I own it if you would like I will send it to you just pm me! Take care and God bless brother.

I would respectfully disagree with this, at least in part. Again, I have been through this first hand and it is essential, that the party you bring in, be someone trained and experienced at recognizing and dealing with the behaviors your wife has demonstrated (a good psychologist).

As you can see by my profile, I am an agnostic, but until a couple of years ago, I considered myself a Christian. The troubles with my ex wife are what started me on a deep exploration (investigation) of the bible, faith etc., and that is how I got to where I am now, with deep thought and reason.

My ex wife and I saw pastors and Christian therapists at first and most of those folks just were not capable of cutting through the religious smoke screen (that is how my ex used religion) to see the clarity of what was going on. One Christian therapist, actually did figure it out and was an immense help to me, to understand her BPD and to remove myself and the kids from her verbal, sometimes physical and spiritual abuse.

Again, BPD is not something that is understood except by trained professionals and it is essential they be sought out. Lastly, some BPD individuals are very adept, at convincing others (sometimes pastors etc.) that they are the victim, at least in the short term.

 

[marleyhill]

I am borderline. I also think of myself as a "Christian" (my definition doesn't always line up with other people's). I'm married and I'm having problems with my husband. I would say that of the recent episodes I've had one was from work, one was from a death in the family and four were triggered by my husband.

Many people with personality disorders are high functioning and appear successful in life until they have a crisis, episode or a trigger.

People in unhappy marriages don't just wake up one day and say I want "some space". In my marriage, looking back in hindsight, I could see how we ended up here. You get space by going on a vacation, going and seeing your friends for the weekend or going for a walk.

Unfortunately, your marriage (and mine) has probably been neglected. As my husband does, do not put all the blame on her borderline reaction...it could be something you have done or have been doing that has triggered this extreme reaction.

Sadly us people with borderline need constant re-assuring and if we can't do it ourselves we seek it out from other people. In my marriage there is no other physical person but I have to seek support from other people which my husband fails to provide. Your wife is getting this non-accusatory support from this other man and his family and her sister! All of whom have no benefit in saving your marriage. No one likes to be constantly accused.

I'm a sexually extroverted person but I wouldn't dream of cheating on my husband. That said I don't put myself in a vulnerable position for the opportunity to present itself. I stay in my house and I don't socialise frequently alone with other men. Your wife is vulnerable and although she might not have done anything yet this man is worming his way into your marriage and overstepping the friendship boundary. If he was a true friend, he would be inviting you both over to his place for a BBQ for a no-pressure supportive social event!

That explains your wife and that man. As for her relationship with the Holy Trinity, borderline stops you from acting rationally and having self-control and some would agree following a religious way of life is about rational self-control. Your wife is in some sort of emotional turmoil/struggle with the Devil that she's stopped acting rationally and with self control.

What can you do?

1. God is love; forgive her 70 times 7. You will need your spiritual strength to do this. Although you are furious, remember the bigger picture "God's plan if you will". You need to save your wife or lose her.

2. She's got to go to (non-religious) therapy. DBT dialectal behavioural therapy is supposedly the best.

3. You both have got to go to couples therapy (non-religious). My husband is a terrible communicator and when I get emotional I either clam up or come out aggressive neither effective communication strategies and can trigger episodes

4. Women want to be cherished.. This man whoever he is, is paying your wife a lot of attention. You need to up your game. if you are constantly dropping by her place or work with little gifts, (can be cheap not expensive, a single flower, her favourite pastry) calling her, texting her, emailing her, inviting her out on fun and romantic dates, taking her on a little vacay, driving her to church...do you think she will have time for this other man?

here is a bit that I have seen from the therapy which makes sense. try to use this when dealing with your wife. I know when I behave like this with my husband it can work sometimes. it's from the DBT manual module for interpersonal effectiveness:- sometimes religion and Christianity does not provide us with all of the tools.



DEARMAN - getting somethingThis acronym is used to aid one in getting what he or she wants when asking.

• Describe your situation.
• Express why this is an issue and how you feel about it.
• Assert yourself by asking clearly for what you want.
• Reinforce your position by offering a positive consequence if you were to get what you want.
• Mindful of the situation by focusing on what you want and ignore distractions.
• Appear Confident even if you don’t feel confident.
• Negotiate with a hesitant person and come to a comfortable compromise on your request.

GIVE - giving somethingThis skill set aids one with maintaining his or her relationships, whether they are with friends, coworkers, family, romantic partners, etc. It is to be used in conversations.

• Gentle: Use appropriate language, no verbal or physical attacks, no put downs, avoid sarcasm unless you are sure the person is all right with it, and be courteous and non-judgmental.
• Interested: When the person you are speaking to is talking about something, act interested in what they are saying. Maintain eye contact, ask questions, etc. Do not use your cell phone while having a conversation with another person!
• Validate: Show that you understand a person’s situation and sympathize with them. Validation can be shown through words, body language and/or facial expressions.
• Easy Manner: Be calm and comfortable during conversation, use humor, smile.

FAST - keeping self-respect. This is a skill to aid one in maintaining his or her self-respect. It is to be used in combination with the other interpersonal effectiveness skills.

• Fair: Be fair to both yourself and the other person.
• Apologies (few): Don’t apologize more than once for what you have done ineffectively, or apologize for something which was not ineffective.
• Stick to Your Values: Stay true to what you believe in and stand by it. Don’t allow others to get you to do things against your values.
• Truthful: Don’t lie. Lying can only pile up and damage relationships and your self-respect.

Hope this wasn't too long. Good luck and just remember that God does not want anyone to be abused or disrespected and if your wife does not co-operate, you are entitled to separate from her. If you have clear evidence of her cheating (nude photos in bed with the other man; cyber sex logs; private investigator report)(not general conversational communication) you are well within your civil and religious rights to divorce her for having an affair.

Remember stay rational and not emotional!

 

[bhsmte]

Some very good points from Marly.

Borderlines do need a significant amount of understanding, but many times that is just not enough. As Marly stated, the disorder can appear in high functioning folks (who have good jobs etc.), because the BPD behavior, typically exposes itself with those people they are closest to. My ex wife, was thought of very highly by many people who didn't know her well and had no idea of the utter destruction she was carrying out at home. It is only when she got close to someone and they did something to disappoint her (whether it was perceived properly or not), is when that person saw the other side and then; look out!

The biggest mistake I made, was I cowered to her behavior for many years (would say it was my fault when I did nothing wrong and would actually listen to her when she claimed I had serious psychological problems). Eventually, you get to a breaking point and everyone has that point of no return. Although borderlines do not care for it, my therapist stated it was EXTREMELY important, to set healthy boundaries, otherwise, you lose your own sense of meaning.

All borderlines are a little bit different and in reality there is no such thing as a "pure borderline" when it comes to the psychological definition and the criteria. My therapist and others explained, all borderlines are a mixed bag of the various personality disorder and they happen to have borderline as the dominant player. My ex, had some paranoid qualities as well as narcissist as well.

Seek good professional help and someone who has experience with BPD.

 

[Bonnie Lee]

He's seeking help and you see no point to his question? Hmmm, Maybe you shouldn't be on this website if you can't offer sound edifying advice.