Can the President Pardon Himself?

[DaisyDay]

President Trump is considering pardoning himself. I asked 15 experts if that's legal.

President Trump’s lawyers are exploring the potential uses of presidential pardons — including whether the president can pardon himself — as part of an effort to undermine special counsel Robert Mueller’s Russia investigation, according to a new Washington Post report.

 

[Eryk]

We're in new territory if he tries, and we'll have to see what the Supreme Court has to say. What a bizarre, watershed moment if they allow this.

In any event, a president cannot use the pardon power to immunize himself from impeachment or from prosecution by one or more of the 50 states. Were a president to pardon himself, this would surely trigger prosecution in the states (e.g., for fraud or tax evasion). It would, therefore, be a very foolish decision. The pardon would be admissible evidence of guilt.

 

[Kenny'sID]

No offense to DT, but in general, I just find it funny if indeed they didn't make that clear when they implemented the Pardon factor.

Oopsy

 

[Vyrzaharak]

Under the principle definition, one cannot receive clemency or a pardon without being having been found guilty. There's no other way. But just like all other politics, THE LEGAL SYSTEM LOVES ITS OWN DEFINITIONS.

So I'm just going to defer to Albert Einstein on this: "In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not."

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

A Governing Ruler in any country does not need to pardon himself.

There's other things to do to accomplish desired goals.

Release the known cure for leukemia for example.

Or declare war, (done more frequently,of course).

 

[bhsmte]

President Trump is considering pardoning himself. I asked 15 experts if that's legal.

They sound a tad desperate, dont they?

 

[bhsmte]

A Governing Ruler in any country does not need to pardon himself.

There's other things to do to accomplish desired goals.

Release the known cure for leukemia for example.

Or declare war, (done more frequently,of course).

Presidents cant declare war, sorry. And i have the cure for leukemia and i am keeping it secret.

 

[super animator]

They sound a tad desperate, dont they?

I don't think they can do it.

 

[DaisyDay]

Under the principle definition, one cannot receive clemency or a pardon without being having been found guilty. There's no other way. But just like all other politics, the legal system loves its own definitions.

I don't think that's true - Ford pardoned Nixon before he was impeached or even charged with anything.

From Wikipedia:

A presidential pardon of Richard Nixon (Proclamation 4311) was issued on September 8, 1974, by President of the United States Gerald Ford, which granted former president Richard Nixon a full and unconditional pardon for any crimes he might have committed against the United States while president.[1][2] In a televised broadcast to the nation, Ford, who succeeded to the presidency upon Nixon's resignation, explained that he felt the pardon was in the best interests of the country, and that the Nixon family's situation was "a tragedy in which we all have played a part. It could go on and on and on, or someone must write the end to it. I have concluded that only I can do that, and if I can, I must."[3] (Full text )​

 

[Allandavid]

Surely the pertinent question isn't if he can do it....WHY would he want to, if he's as blameless as he continually claims...?

 

[Vyrzaharak]

I don't think that's true - Ford pardoned Nixon before he was impeached or even charged with anything.

Did you forget to read where I mentioned that the legal system loves its own definitions or just intentionally throw it to the side of your brain?

 

[Maren]

I believe if Trump tries to pardon himself, or even just pardons his top aides -- particularly if it appears he's trying doing it to hamstring Mueller's investigation -- you'll see Congress start seriously looking at impeachment.

 

[Hank77]

I think it is unlikely that if it (investigating pardoning himself) were true that they would announce it to the media, unless....here is what one of the legal scholars said,

First, it is surprising this kind of a request — one that ordinarily would arise in the context of a confidential communication between a client and his attorneys — found its way to reporters. If one or more of Mr. Trump’s “close advisers” (the terminology employed by the Washington Post) communicated this information to reporters, did they do so with or without the president’s knowledge? One of the president’s attorneys has already denied the Washington Post’s report as “nonsense,” but that doesn’t reveal much about the original leak.


Moreover, one might wonder if the self-pardon talk is being raised as a method of reining in the special prosecutor’s investigation, or as a means of distracting the special prosecutor’s team by forcing them to consider a series of unprecedented, even if politically far-fetched, legal arguments.


The New York Times’s report that the Trump team is investigating Mr. Mueller’s team for conflicts of interests is consistent with this tactic. The actual merits of these claims matter less than their intended strategic effect, which is to place the special prosecutor and his team on the defensive.

President Trump is considering pardoning himself. I asked 15 experts if that's legal.

 

[DaisyDay]

Did you forget to read where I mentioned that the legal system loves its own definitions or just intentionally throw it to the side of your brain?

Get over yourself.Whatever.

 

[Vyrzaharak]

Get over yourself.

How about you read a post before responding?

 

[DaisyDay]

How about you read a post before responding?

So I'm just going to defer to Richard Feymann on this: "Get over yourself."Whatever.

 

[Vyrzaharak]

So I'm just going to defer to Richard Feymann on this: "Get over yourself."

You first. You responded to my post, trying to contradict what I said, when I quite clearly accounted for the different systems to begin with.

 

[mark46]

Under the principle definition, one cannot receive clemency or a pardon without being having been found guilty. There's no other way. But just like all other politics, the legal system loves its own definitions.

So I'm just going to defer to Albert Einstein on this: "In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not."

That is simply not true. Nixon was pardoned without being found guilty of anything.

 

[Vyrzaharak]

That is simply not true. Nixon was pardoned without being found guilty of anything.

How about you read the part where I talk about how the LEGAL SYSTEM LOVES ITS OWN DEFINITIONS!? Can you not read that part?

 

[mark46]

President Trump is considering pardoning himself. I asked 15 experts if that's legal.

I believe that the president has the unlimited right to pardon anyone including himself. In fact, the law specifically says that the act that he cannot overturn or prevent is impeachment, implying that he can pardon himself. Besides, it make little difference. If Trump was convicted of anything criminal, he would be impeached, and Pence would pardon Trump. We've seen this before, after all.

However, as another poster has indicated, pardoning himself would likely lead to impeachment, probably by Republicans not even bothering to wait until 2019.