Can inanimate objects have spiritual influence?

lismore · Dec 31, 2004

Jim M said:
Is anyone as uneasy as I am by the superstition and voodoo being passed off as truth in this thread?

\o/

Hi Jim

How are you

I dont think its superstition and voodoo its just discernment and common sense.

When Jesus was baptized in the River Jordan the Holy SPirit came on him like a dove, doves are very sensitive birds and will only land where completely happy. Its the same with the Holy Spirit who is in you, the Holy SPirit will not be comfortable where there are bad things around and you will sense this. Bhuddist idols, masonic symbols, satanic rituals can I believe all be bad things spiritually on a Christian. Have you never been to a place where you have felt uneasy and then found out about the things that had gone on there?
I was at a place called the Boleskin Churchyard, Loch Ness, where satanic rituals by a satanist called Alistair Crowley had gone on and the effect of this satanism was almost tangile about the place. I have heard that Egyptian idols also make some Christians feel uneasy.

God Bless

Lismore

lismore · Dec 31, 2004

enoch son said:
Sorry Jim and Asaph but I deal with this suff all the time. "If a house is not filled then the demon will return with 7 more worst them himself." To quote Jesus. A witch needs what I call a bridge to past on spills. It can be anything a peice of cloth to a peice paper. etc. I know this because the Holy Spirit has giving me words of knowledge to tell people where to find the bridge. We have prayed over houses that other brother have had on the market for months (we will fine a bridge) without any movement and a week later they are sold. Remeber King Saul. But the worst spirit I have had to fight is one of relgion. (the scapegoat).

Hi Enoch Son

I find also that Words of Knowledge are very welcome to reveal things and to confirm things. The last one I received was at a dinner meeting where the speaker went into Tongues and had a few paragraphs in French. I was the only one there who could speak French so I knew it was for me

Keep up the Good work

God Bless

Lismore

NewSong · Dec 31, 2004

Jim M said:
How is this different from paranormal and poltergeist reports, specters. spirits, ghosts, apparitions, Elm Street and Amityville? You are wanting me to take your word for it just as you described it, disallowing scripture. I am wondering about hallucinations, delirium, autosuggestion, superstition, or too much pizza before bedtime.

And you are offering no scriptural precedent whatever.

IOW, what you are asking me to believe is, well, a little much.

Sorry, NS, maybe if I knew you better I might be more receptive.

\o/

You don't have to believe that it happened. I don't offer any scripture because I don't have any and yes it happened. It was not hallucinations. I have never have hallucinated even when I have had fevers but it happened. Do I believe it was poltergeist? I don't know what to believe and I don't care to see it happen again. All I know is that it didn't quit after some preacher prayed either. I got rid of lots of wonderful items being that stinkin' superstitious. I believe I was being harassed. It is quite okay for you to think what you want to but don't expect me to change my story to please your ears either. Because it did happen. The guy who lived in the place before me or the person before he died there was into some rituals and there were alot of things that spooked me that I found, and once I got spooked that is all it took for the stuff to happen in my home. But once I got a handle on my faith in God and my eyes on Jesus, it never happened again. I believe I was being harassed mentally and spiritually and that had I never got a handle with God I would probably be locked away from insanity. Thankfully a lot of Christians stepped up and stood beside me. We done logical things like change the batteries in the remote control, the smoke detectors, and the answering machine we left unplugged and the one (touch lamp-which do that all the time with the right conditions).... we done a lot of logical things to take care of illogical things happening. By the way having done all of that it still happened and I just got so that I didn't give it attention and it went. Starve and it goes away~

I don't care what you happen to believe about me or about this report. I have got passed caring what someone thinks of me and I don't need to impress you or anyone else. However, I have given your threads respect and treated what you had to say as though you knew what you were talking about and I don't expect that you should minimize what I am saying is my experience.

Good day and that is all I have to say on the subject.

NewSong · Dec 31, 2004

Asaph said:
I am greatly pleased to see you back ES, but oh man did you go far in stretching that scripture.

Luke 11:24-26
24 "When an unclean spirit goes out of a man, he goes through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he says, 'I will return to my house from which I came.' 25 And when he comes, he finds it swept and put in order. 26 Then he goes and takes with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter and dwell there; and the last state of that man is worse than the first."
NKJV

That is not talking about buildings. It's talking about people.

Asaph

Agreed Asaph. Totally agree with you!

JimB · Dec 31, 2004

lismore said:
Hi Jim

How are you

I dont think its superstition and voodoo its just discernment and common sense.

When Jesus was baptized in the River Jordan the Holy SPirit came on him like a dove, doves are very sensitive birds and will only land where completely happy. Its the same with the Holy Spirit who is in you, the Holy SPirit will not be comfortable where there are bad things around and you will sense this. Bhuddist idols, masonic symbols, satanic rituals can I believe all be bad things spiritually on a Christian. Have you never been to a place where you have felt uneasy and then found out about the things that had gone on there?
I was at a place called the Boleskin Churchyard, Loch Ness, where satanic rituals by a satanist called Alistair Crowley had gone on and the effect of this satanism was almost tangile about the place. I have heard that Egyptian idols also make some Christians feel uneasy.

God Bless

Lismore

This could be turned around, you know. Perhaps the Holy Spirit would work more among us if we didnt dabble in so much superstition surrounding His work. What is the difference between Christian superstition and pagan superstition? Both are idolatrous.

\o/

KleinerApfel · Dec 31, 2004

Jim M said:
This could be turned around, you know. Perhaps the Holy Spirit would work more among us if we didnt dabble in so much superstition surrounding His work. What is the difference between Christian superstition and pagan superstition? Both are idolatrous.

\o/

Superstition? Some people here who are truly born again Christians, (as far as any of us can tell that about each other), have had very unpleasant experiences.
You can't just write all that off as superstition.
It may be that they have been misled or have misinterpreted what happened, or it may be exactly what they say it is, but just to say they are superstitious or hallucinating could come across a bit insulting.

Blessings, Susana

JimB · Dec 31, 2004

NewSong said:
You don't have to believe that it happened. I don't offer any scripture because I don't have any and yes it happened. It was not hallucinations. I have never have hallucinated even when I have had fevers but it happened. Do I believe it was poltergeist? I don't know what to believe and I don't care to see it happen again. All I know is that it didn't quit after some preacher prayed either. I got rid of lots of wonderful items being that stinkin' superstitious. I believe I was being harassed. It is quite okay for you to think what you want to but don't expect me to change my story to please your ears either. Because it did happen. The guy who lived in the place before me or the person before he died there was into some rituals and there were alot of things that spooked me that I found, and once I got spooked that is all it took for the stuff to happen in my home. But once I got a handle on my faith in God and my eyes on Jesus, it never happened again. I believe I was being harassed mentally and spiritually and that had I never got a handle with God I would probably be locked away from insanity. Thankfully a lot of Christians stepped up and stood beside me. We done logical things like change the batteries in the remote control, the smoke detectors, and the answering machine we left unplugged and the one (touch lamp-which do that all the time with the right conditions).... we done a lot of logical things to take care of illogical things happening. By the way having done all of that it still happened and I just got so that I didn't give it attention and it went. Starve and it goes away~

I don't care what you happen to believe about me or about this report. I have got passed caring what someone thinks of me and I don't need to impress you or anyone else. However, I have given your threads respect and treated what you had to say as though you knew what you were talking about and I don't expect that you should minimize what I am saying is my experience.

Good day and that is all I have to say on the subject.

I am not attacking you personally, NS. From your posts I gather that you are a very wonderful person and a fine Christian. I am simply finding your stories incredulous. I believe you believe they happened the way you are telling it, but your conclusions as to what caused them to happen may be wrong. You attribute it to demons. It could be something else entirely. Perhaps you were simply predisposed to think that way or to interpret some phenomenon the way you did.

\o/

NewSong · Dec 31, 2004

Jim M said:
I am not attacking you personally, NS. From your posts I gather that you are a very wonderful person and a fine Christian. I am simply finding your stories incredulous. I believe you believe they happened the way you are telling it, but your conclusions as to what caused them to happen may be wrong. You attribute it to demons. It could be something else entirely. Perhaps you were simply predisposed to think that way or to interpret some phenomenon the way you did.

\o/

Actually I do find it personal when you can not take my word for it. But that is okay. I was once on your side of the fence. I have no conclusions as to what happened. I don't know why it happend and it did happen and there were eye witnesses but regardless of what you think I may have interpreted or predisposed to think it went contrary to what I thought at that time in my life. I didn't believe it any more than you do. I have no explanations. All I can tell you is that something happened and I have no scriptural basis for it other than it happened. Do you sneeze? Do you say God bless you? And why do you sneeze? Why do you say God bless you if you do? The scriptures record one case of a sneeze and it wasn't from a human being? How do you explain a sneeze? OOPS EDITED BY ME ABOUT THE SNEEZE....

There was a sneeze by a Human being in the bible...Duh..on me...Sorry about that.

2 Kings 4:35 (King James Version
35Then he returned, and walked in the house to and fro; and went up, and stretched himself upon him: and the child sneezed seven times, and the child opened his eyes.

My point would be better made with a cough. There is nothing in the scriptures that say specifically that people cough but it happens.

NewSong · Dec 31, 2004

Actually JimM perhaps I come on very strong but I am would like to hear you word on this that God gave you to these things followed with scripture. I take back personalizing it because it is not mine to personalize. I also apologize for taking it as an attack. I don't need to defend me but I would like to hear what you and others like Asaph have to say on the subject because I believe it needs to be said. I don't think enough can be said about how we don't need to be afraid of demons hiding out and ready to get us...they do not and I agree with your post on that. ??? Okay? Thanks.

NewSong

JimB · Dec 31, 2004

NewSong said:
Actually JimM perhaps I come on very strong but I am would like to hear you word on this that God gave you to these things followed with scripture. I take back personalizing it because it is not mine to personalize. I also apologize for taking it as an attack. I don't need to defend me but I would like to hear what you and others like Asaph have to say on the subject because I believe it needs to be said. I don't think enough can be said about how we don't need to be afraid of demons hiding out and ready to get us...they do not and I agree with your post on that. ??? Okay? Thanks.

NewSong

I understand, NS. It is sometimes hard to separate our beliefs from our person. Please understand, I am not attacking your person when I disagree with your conclusions.

You have asked a very hard thing. You are asking me to prove that the sun does not come up in the west or that down is not really up. As I see it, the burden of proof is not on me.

I will only say that, from my studies, nowhere does the Bible ever support the idea that demons inhabit inanimate objects. If there was one recorded instance of it happening in scripture, I would gladly and readily accept the idea.

However, superstitious idolaters believe spirits inhabit inanimate and since I have been told to flee from idolatry (1 Cor. 10.14) I feel safer taking the role of a skeptic in these matters of spirits inhabiting the inanimate than in believing in it. That is, until you can prove otherwise from scripture.

\o/

NewSong · Dec 31, 2004

Jim M said:
I understand, NS. It is sometimes hard to separate our beliefs from our person. Please understand, I am not attacking your person when I disagree with your conclusions.

You have asked a very hard thing. You are asking me to prove that the sun does not come up in the west or that down is not really up. As I see it, the burden of proof is not on me.

I will only say that, from my studies, nowhere does the Bible ever support the idea that demons inhabit inanimate objects. If there was one recorded instance of it happening in scripture, I would gladly and readily accept the idea.

However, superstitious idolaters believe spirits inhabit inanimate and since I have been told to flee from idolatry (1 Cor. 10.14) I feel safer taking the role of a skeptic in these matters of spirits inhabiting the inanimate than in believing in it. That is, until you can prove otherwise from scripture.

\o/

Oh I wholeheartedly agree that my inanimate objects were not possessed by demons. In fact, that is the one thing I did learn in my whole experience was that those objects had no power what so ever. The power that was give was when I discovered the home I used to live in was a place of former satanical ritual and I was spooked by it and I believe I came under attack and also my sanity came under attack but did inanimate objects get involved in the attack? Yes they did but I don't think they were inhabited... I think it was shear and pure harrassment and like you just quoted to flee idolatry. I really learned the hard way. I mean I am still learning. I have fallen on my face more than once and don't mind falling again to find out truths. I don't have any reasonable explanation for what happened either but I don't believe they were possessed either. I believe they were a pawn in warfare and that is my only explanation. I mean if people can't bother you then why not use objects to blow you out of the water? I was wrestling with sanity at that point in my life. I had been married to a Psychologist who left for his alcohol and drug scene and wanted people to believe I was insane and I was fighting every thing I could to keep the sanity I had with his stinkin' mind games. That is why I perhaps come off strong. SO sorry as I said earlier that I did personalize it and tie it iin to me personally. God Bless and now I must run to work and may you be blessed exceedingly abundantly and I understand not wanting to start a new thread.

Happy New Year's to you and everyone else and may God bless you with His love and His mercy and goodness throughout the coming year and may you all bless Him with your lives in submission to Him.

JimB · Dec 31, 2004

I will agree that demons can deceive people into believing that inanimate objects have supernatural powers. Deception is the only weapon the devil has against believers, anyhow, and he is very good at it. Paul told the Corinthian believers that demons were behind superstition and idolatrous worship in ...

1 Corinthians 10

19Do I mean then that a sacrifice offered to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything? 20No, but the sacrifices of pagans are offered to demons, not to God, and I do not want you to be participants with demons.

Ergo, ascribing supernatural powers to inanimate objects borders on idolatry which is, itself, the worship of demons. Idolatry (ascribing supernatural power to inanimate objects) is, in effect, an indirect form of demonolatry.

Therefore, my dear friends, flee from idolatry (1 Cor. 10.14).

\o/

KleinerApfel · Dec 31, 2004

Thank you, NewSong and Jim, you have between you managed to answer my question, whilst actually appearing at one point to disagree with each other LOL!

So objects have no power, are not inhabited, but are used by evil spirits when it suits them. I think I finally get it, but can't help but wonder if someone will come along and tell me I've misunderstood again!

God bless you, Susana

Father Rick · Dec 31, 2004

Jumping in here...

First, I believe NewSong's accounts of what happened. In many parts of the world, these type of occurrences would not even be questioned since so many have encountered some form of supernatural activity. In in the U.S., there are thousands of reports of similar spiritual activity. To me, dismissing an overwhelming amount of anectdotal evidence, even if it cannot be empirically proven, would not be intellectually honest.

That being said, my favorite movie to have people watch concerning spiritual warfare is "The Wizard of Oz".

If you remember, when each person goes to see 'the wizard' they encounter their worst fear. Finally Toto pulls back the curtain and reveals that the 'wizard' is just an old man using smoke and mirrors.

That's how it is with Satan. Scripture says that when Jesus rose from the dead he 'stripped him of all power and authority, making a public spectacle of him'. The only real power Satan has left is the power of lies and deception. He tries to make us think he is so powerful in order create fear. Once we realize that Satan has been defeated (like NewSong said) then his power is broken.

A good book that touches on this is "The Bondage Breaker", I believe it's by Neal Anderson-- that emphasizes how many times what we need is a 'truth encounter' rather than a 'power encounter'.

Father Rick · Dec 31, 2004

The Lord is my banner said:
Thank you, NewSong and Jim, you have between you managed to answer my question, whilst actually appearing at one point to disagree with each other LOL!

So objects have no power, are not inhabited, but are used by evil spirits when it suits them. I think I finally get it, but can't help but wonder if someone will come along and tell me I've misunderstood again!

God bless you, Susana

By jove, I think she's got it!

KleinerApfel · Dec 31, 2004

Father Rick said:
Jumping in here...

First, I believe NewSong's accounts of what happened. In many parts of the world, these type of occurrences would not even be questioned since so many have encountered some form of supernatural activity. In in the U.S., there are thousands of reports of similar spiritual activity. To me, dismissing an overwhelming amount of anectdotal evidence, even if it cannot be empirically proven, would not be intellectually honest.

That being said, my favorite movie to have people watch concerning spiritual warfare is "The Wizard of Oz".

If you remember, when each person goes to see 'the wizard' they encounter their worst fear. Finally Toto pulls back the curtain and reveals that the 'wizard' is just an old man using smoke and mirrors.

That's how it is with Satan. Scripture says that when Jesus rose from the dead he 'stripped him of all power and authority, making a public spectacle of him'. The only real power Satan has left is the power of lies and deception. He tries to make us think he is so powerful in order create fear. Once we realize that Satan has been defeated (like NewSong said) then his power is broken.

A good book that touches on this is "The Bondage Breaker", I believe it's by Neal Anderson-- that emphasizes how many times what we need is a 'truth encounter' rather than a 'power encounter'.

I'm with you there Father Rick. The Bondage Breaker (yes it is by Neil T. Anderson), was a real eye-opener for me.

God bless, Susana

NewSong · Dec 31, 2004

Father Rick said:
Jumping in here...

First, I believe NewSong's accounts of what happened. In many parts of the world, these type of occurrences would not even be questioned since so many have encountered some form of supernatural activity. In in the U.S., there are thousands of reports of similar spiritual activity. To me, dismissing an overwhelming amount of anectdotal evidence, even if it cannot be empirically proven, would not be intellectually honest.

That being said, my favorite movie to have people watch concerning spiritual warfare is "The Wizard of Oz".

If you remember, when each person goes to see 'the wizard' they encounter their worst fear. Finally Toto pulls back the curtain and reveals that the 'wizard' is just an old man using smoke and mirrors.

That's how it is with Satan. Scripture says that when Jesus rose from the dead he 'stripped him of all power and authority, making a public spectacle of him'. The only real power Satan has left is the power of lies and deception. He tries to make us think he is so powerful in order create fear. Once we realize that Satan has been defeated (like NewSong said) then his power is broken.

A good book that touches on this is "The Bondage Breaker", I believe it's by Neal Anderson-- that emphasizes how many times what we need is a 'truth encounter' rather than a 'power encounter'.

That is the exact book I read~ I can hardly believe it. I went to a Christian counselor who is spirit filled and he made the recommendation and then one of my friends bought it and gave to me not knowing the recommendation. That book was excellent. That is the book I read. Thank you ~~~

NewSong · Dec 31, 2004

The Lord is my banner said:
Thank you, NewSong and Jim, you have between you managed to answer my question, whilst actually appearing at one point to disagree with each other LOL!

So objects have no power, are not inhabited, but are used by evil spirits when it suits them. I think I finally get it, but can't help but wonder if someone will come along and tell me I've misunderstood again!

God bless you, Susana

'

Oh cool!

That is the point I would like to make~ Very well put Susana~

goy · Jan 1, 2005

The Lord is my banner said:
So objects have no power, are not inhabited, but are used by evil spirits when it suits them. I think I finally get it, but can't help but wonder if someone will come along and tell me I've misunderstood again!

God bless you, Susana

Arghhh... no wonder my prayers are unanswered! My darn roof is blocking them!!!

;-P

KleinerApfel · Jan 2, 2005

goy said:
Arghhh... no wonder my prayers are unanswered! My darn roof is blocking them!!!

;-P

What? How did my comment lead to this?

Blessings, Susana

Can inanimate objects have spiritual influence?

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