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Featured CAN A BELIEVER FALL AWAY FROM GOD AND BECOME AN UNBELIEVER?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by LoveGodsWord, May 23, 2019.

  1. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Hi my brothers and sisters. Can a believer become an unbeliever? If so how? I believe we can all fall away from believing and following God's Word because this is what the scriptures teach...

    CAN WE KNOW GOD'S WORD AND FALL AWAY FROM THE TRUTH?

    1 JOHN 2:18-19
    [18], Little children, it is the last time: and as you have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
    [19], They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

    What did they go out from? Yep you guessed it. They went out from the truth. It was going out and leaving the truth that made these people not of us as leaving God's truth made them "UNBELIEVERS". The CONTEXT is that there is many antichrists and false teachers. They went out from the truth of God's Word and no longer believed and followed Gods' Word which made them not of us (Believers and followers of Gods' Word). If they contunued with us then they would be continuing to believe and follow the truth of God's Word and would have been of us.

    HEBREWS 3:7-19
    [7], Why (as the Holy Ghost said, To day if you will hear his voice, [8], Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
    [9], When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.[10], Why I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do always err in their heart; and they have not known my ways. [11], So I swore in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.
    [12], TAKE HEED BRETHEREN LEST THERE BE IN ANY OF YOU AN EVIL HEART OF UNBELIEF DEPARTING FROM THE LIVING GOD.
    [13], But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
    [14], For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end;
    [15], While it is said, To day if you will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
    [16], For some, when they had heard, did provoke: however, not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
    [17], But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcasses fell in the wilderness?
    [18], And to whom swore he that they should not enter into his rest, BUT TO THEM THAT BELIEVED NOT?
    [19], So we see that they could not enter in BECAUSE OF UNBELIEF.

    2 THESSALONIANS 2:3-4
    Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the FALLING AWAY comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

    2 THESSALONIANS 2:9-10
    The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, BECAUSE THEY DID NOT RECEIVE THE LOVE OF THE TRUTH THAT THEY MIGHT BE SAVED.

    HEBREWS 6:4-8
    [4], For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
    [5], And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
    [6], If they shall fall away, to renew them again to repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
    [7], For the earth which drinks in the rain that comes oft on it, and brings forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receives blessing from God:
    [8], But that which bears thorns and briers is rejected, and is near to cursing; whose end is to be burned.

    2 PETER 2:1-22
    [1], But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privately shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction.
    [2], And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
    [3], And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingers not, and their damnation slumbers not.
    [4], For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved to judgment;
    [5], And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly;
    [6], And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample to those that after should live ungodly;
    [7], And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:
    just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:
    [8], For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds;
    [9], The Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust to the day of judgment to be punished:
    [10], But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, self-willed, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.
    [11], Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.
    [12], But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
    [13], And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
    [14], Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

    [15], WHICH HAVE FORSAKEN THE RIGHT WAY, AND ARE GONE ASTRAY, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;

    [16], But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbade the madness of the prophet.
    [17], These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.
    [18], For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
    [19], While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
    [20], FOR IT THEY HAVE ESCAPED THE POLLUTIONS OF THE WORLD THROUGH THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE LORD AND SAVIOUR JESUS CHRIST, THEY ARE AGAIN ENTANGLED THEREIN AND OVERCOME, THE LATTER END IS WORSE THEN THE BEGGINING.
    [21], FOR IT HAD BEEN BETTER FOR THEN NOT TO HAVE KNOWN THE WAY OF RIGHTEOUSNESS, THAN, AFTER THEY HAVE KNOWN IT, TO TURN FROM THE HOLY COMMANDMENT DELIEVERED UNTO THEM.
    [22], But it is happened to them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

    Yep seems Peter thinks that you can know and follow God and then turn back from God to follow SIN and leave God....

    links to....

    HEBREWS 10:26-31
    26, FOR IT WE SIN WILLFULLY AFTER WE RECEIVE A KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH, THERE REMAINS NO MORE SACRIFICE FOR SINS,
    27, BUT A FEARFUL LOOKING FORWARD FOR OF JUDGEMENT AND FIERY INDIGNATION, WHICH SHALL DEVOUR THE ADVERSARIES.
    28, He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
    29, OF HOW MUCH MORE SORER PUNISHMENT, SUPPOSE YOU, SHALL HE BE THOUGHT WORTHY, WHO HAS TRODDEN UNDER FOOT THE SON OF GOD, AND HAS COUNTED THE BLOOD OF THE COVENANT WITH WHICH HE WAS SANCTIFIED AN UNHOLY THING AND HAS DONE DESPITE TO THE SPIRIT OF GRACE?
    30,
    For we know him that has said, Vengeance belongs to me, I will recompense, said the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
    31, IT IS A FEARFUL THING TO FALL INTO THE HANDS OF THE LIVING GOD.

    GALATIANS 1:6
    [6] I marvel that you are TURNING AWAY SO SOON from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, TO A DIFFERENT GOSPEL.

    ACTS 20:28-31
    Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood. For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. Also from among yourselves men will rise up, speaking perverse things, TO DRAW AWAY DISCIPLES AFTER THEMSELVES. Therefore watch, and remember that for three years I did not cease to warn everyone night and day with tears.

    HEBREWS 2:1-3
    Therefore we must give the more earnest heed to the things we have heard, LEST WE DRIFT AWAY. For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward, how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed to us by those who heard Him.

    HEBREWS 10:35-38
    [35], CAST NOT AWAY THEREFORE YOUR CONFIDENCE, which has great recompense of reward. [36], For you have need of patience, that, after you have done the will of God, you might receive the promise. [37], For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry. [38], Now the just shall live by faith: BUT IF ANY MAN SHALL DRAW BACK, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

    Seems both PAUL and PETER agree together that you can KNOW GOd have a KNOWLEDGE of the TRUTH and fall away back into SIN.

    ISAIAH 59:1-3
    1, Behold, the LORD's hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
    2, BUT YOUR INIQUITIES HAVE SEPARATED BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR GOD, AND YOUR SINS HAVE HID HIS FACE FROM YOU THAT HE WILL NOT HEAR.
    3, For your hands are defiled with blood, and your fingers with SIN; your lips have spoken lies, your tongue has muttered perverseness.

    Seems Isaiah agrees with Peter and Paul that SIN can separate us from GOD.

    EZEKIEL 3:17-21
    [17], Son of man, I have made you a watchman to the house of Israel: therefore hear the word at my mouth, and give them warning from me.
    [18], When I say to the wicked, You shall surely die; and you give him not warning, nor speak to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at your hand.
    [19], Yet if you warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but you have delivered your soul.
    [20], AGAIN, WHEN A RIGHTEOUS MAN DOES TURN FROM HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS, AND COMMIT INIQUITY, AND I LAY A STUMBLING BLOCK BEFORE HIM, HE SHALL DIE IN HIS SIN, AND HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH HE HAS DONE SHALL NOT BE REMEMBERED; but his blood I will require from your hand.
    [21], Nevertheless if you warn the righteous man, that the righteous sin not, and he does not sin, he shall surely live, because he is warned; also you have delivered your soul.

    Well there we have it Ezekial, Isaiah Peter and Paul all agree that you can know God and have a KNOWLEDGE of the TRUTH and fall away back into SIN.

    JOSHUA 23:11-13
    [11], Take good heed therefore to yourselves, that you love the LORD your God.
    [12], ELSE IF YOU IN ANY WISE GO BACK TO JOIN TO THE REMNANNT OF THESE NATIONS, EVEN THESE THAT REMAIN AMONG YOU AND SHALL MAKE MARRIAGES WITH THEM AND GO IN UNTO THEM AND THEY TO YOU:
    [13], KNOW FOR A CERTAINTY THAT THE LORD YOUR GOD WILL NO MORE DRIVE OUT THESE NATIONS FROM BEFORE YOU.; but they shall be snares and traps to you, and scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes, until you perish from off this good land which the LORD your God has given you.

    Now Joshua is joining Ezekial, Isaiah Peter and Paul who all agree that you can know God and have a KNOWLEDGE of the TRUTH and fall away back into SIN.

    NUMBERS 14:43
    [43], For there the Amalekites and the Canaanites are facing you, and you shall fall by the sword. BECAUSE YOU HAVE TURNED BACK FROM FOLLOWING THE LORD, the Lord will not be with you.”

    Now you can also add Moses to Joshua, Ezekial, Isaiah, Peter and Paul who all agree that you can know God and have a KNOWLEDGE of the TRUTH and fall away back into SIN.

    JAMES 5:19
    [19], My brothers, IF ANY AMONG YOU WANDERS FROM THE TRUTH AND SOMEONE BRINGS HIM BACK, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

    Seems also James agrees with Moses, Joshua, Ezekial, Isaiah, Peter and Paul who all agree that you can know God and have a KNOWLEDGE of the TRUTH and fall away back into SIN.

    JEREMIAH 3:8-14
    [8], And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also.
    [9], And it came to pass through the lightness of her prostitution, that she defiled the land, and committed adultery with stones and with stocks.
    [10], And yet for all this her treacherous sister Judah has not turned to me with her whole heart, but feignedly, said the LORD.
    [11], And the LORD said to me, The backsliding Israel has justified herself more than treacherous Judah.
    [12], Go, and proclaim these words toward the north, and say, RETURN FAITHLESS ISRAEL, declares the Lord. I will not look on you in anger, for I am merciful, declares the Lord; I will not be angry forever.
    [13], Only acknowledge your iniquity, that you have transgressed against the LORD your God, and have scattered your ways to the strangers under every green tree, and you have not obeyed my voice, said the LORD.
    [14], TURN O BACKSLIDING CHILDREN, said the LORD; for I am married to you: and I will take you one of a city, and two of a family, and I will bring you to Zion.

    Looks like we can add Jeremaiah to James, Moses, Joshua, Ezekial, Isaiah, Peter and Paul who all agree that you can know God and have a KNOWLEDGE of the TRUTH and fall away back into SIN.

    JOEL 2:13
    [13], And rend your hearts and not your garments. RETURN TO THE LORD YOUR GOD, for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and abounding in steadfast love; and he relents over disaster.

    LUKE 8:13
    [13], They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation FALL AWAY.

    Well here so far we have Joel, Jeremaiah, James, Moses, Joshua, Ezekial, Isaiah, Peter, Luke and Paul who all agree that you can know God and have a KNOWLEDGE of the TRUTH and FALL AWAY back into SIN.

    .................

    What do you think can we fall away from believing and following God's WORD? If so how?

    Thanks for sharing and God bless you all as you continue seeking JESUS through His WORD!
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2019
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  2. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith I'm Currently An Eastern Orthodox Catechumen Supporter

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    Yes.
     
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  3. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Thanks brother 3Contendforthefaith, for sharing. What do you think causes someone to fall away from believing and following God's Word in your view?
     
  4. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith I'm Currently An Eastern Orthodox Catechumen Supporter

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    But with most of them God was not well pleased, for their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.
    Now these things became Our Examples, to the intent that we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted. And do not become idolaters as were some of them. As it is written, "The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play." Nor let us commit sexual immorality, as some of them did, and in one day twenty-three thousand fell; nor let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed by serpents; nor complain, as some of them also complained, and were destroyed by the destroyer. Now All these things happened to them As Examples, and they were written For Our Admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages have come. Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed Lest He Fall
    1 Corinthians 10: 5-12



    Do not cast me away from Your presence, And Do Not Take Your Holy Spirit From Me.
    • Psalm 51:11



     
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  5. Kris Jordan

    Kris Jordan Member

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    Historically, there has been great debate among Christians as to whether a believer is secure in their salvation after having received it, or whether their salvation can be lost or forfeited due to sin or the renouncing of one’s faith. Although there are opposing viewpoints on the topic, each with compelling arguments and strong scriptural support, the answer to the question really hinges upon these factors: how salvation is imparted, upon what basis it must be received, and what element must be present for it to be sustained.


    Salvation is a free gift of God that is imputed to (and received by) an individual on the basis of faith alone in the redemptive work of Jesus Christ upon the cross. God never forces salvation upon anyone, but neither is it imputed automatically to someone without their personal repentance and faith in Christ. Therefore, salvation is a choice, both on the part of God, and of sinful man.


    From the very beginning, God chose to save sinners because of His great love for them. Because God is “not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance” (2 Peter 3:9b), and because He “desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth” (1 Timothy 2:3-4), He has accomplished and provided everything that is necessary for their salvation in every aspect, including revealing Himself through creation and conscience, drawing each person to Himself by the Holy Spirit, sending His own Son to pay their sin penalty so they could be forgiven and saved, and providing even the faith necessary for them to believe. God is always ready to impart His saving grace to those who would come to Him in genuine, sincere faith. However, man must also take part in the equation because he has been given free will. He can only receive God’s gift of grace by choosing to turn away from his life of sin (Matthew 16:24) and personally placing his faith in Jesus for forgiveness and redemption (John 3:16). That final step on the part of sinners is, in essence, what completes the salvation transaction. Aside from grace through faith, salvation cannot be obtained through any other means; nor is there any other Savior but Jesus Christ Himself (Acts 4:12).



    Because it is impossible for any of us to see into the heart of a person in order to know whether or not they actually possess genuine saving faith, the basic point of debate on this topic really boils down to this: could a person who claimed to be a believer and who exhibited good works over a long period of time ever have possessed genuine saving faith, if they ultimately ended up renouncing their faith later on?


    Supporters of the “eternally secure” position argue that such a person never possessed saving faith, but simply offered lip service and modified their external behavior accordingly. They believe that genuine salvation cannot be altered or undone once it is received, since God is the one who keeps a person’s faith intact. Furthermore, they conclude that any verses in Scripture which appear to support the idea that genuine salvation can be abandoned actually refer to people who never “actually” possessed saving faith to begin with.


    Supporters of the “not eternally secure” position argue that such a person could possess genuine saving faith at one point (as evidenced by good works, among other proofs) but then willfully choose to reject or deny Jesus later on, forfeiting their salvation. They also argue that all verses supporting “eternal security” are referring to Christians who continue believing and never stop.


    Supporters of both views seem to agree on the issue of sin itself within the lives of those who profess to be believers. Both positions assert that when a professing believer sins or even struggles with a particular sin, they do not “lose” their salvation but have merely broken fellowship with God and need to confess their sins to Him in order to have that intimate fellowship restored. On the other hand, if a professing believer habitually and continually practices sin, treating the grace of God as a license to do so, they likely do not possess genuine, saving faith.


    Regardless of which position one leans toward when it comes to the security of the believer, the fact remains that personal faith in Christ is a mandatory prerequisite for sinners to receive God’s salvation, and it remains the mode by which God’s salvation is retained or sustained. Whether or not one’s personal faith can ever truly be altered, rescinded or renounced by a genuine believer is really the “uncertainty factor” in the whole equation; and because we do not have viewing-access to the Book of Life, or a current glimpse into heaven or Hades to see who is actually there, we will never know the answer to this uncertainty factor on this side of eternity.


    Because every Scripture must always be interpreted in light of all other Scripture, and because there are many verses which can be used to support each of the viewpoints, it is up to each individual believer, together with the leading of the Holy Spirit and the reconciliation of all related Scriptures, to draw their own conclusion.
     
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  6. crossnote

    crossnote Berean Supporter

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    They went out from the truth and the local fellowship. But what seems to be missing in your argument is "they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us."

    So the reason they went out from the truth/fellowship is because they were not of them...not born again.
    The actual question should be is 'can a person be 'unborn' once they are truly born again?' I say NO!
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2019
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  7. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Hi sister Kris, nice to meet you and thanks very much for sharing your thoughts. Nice overview. I agree with the majority of your post and enjoyed reading it. I also agree we have a free will and choice to either BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD of not to do so. For me I do not believe God's Word teaches OSAS. According to God's WORD eternal security is only had by all those who CONTINUE BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD enduring temptation to the end *MATTHEW 24:13; JAMES 1:12. I enjoyed reading your post and there were some good points you brought out in it. What is your view on why or how a person falls away?

    God bless
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2019
  8. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Hi brother crossnotes, nice to see you and thankyou for sharing your view. For me these scriptures are a good example of what it means not to be "OF US". They were not of us because they went out from us. Another words they are not of us because they no longer believe and follow God's WORD. The scriptures here do not really say if they were born again or not but HEBREWS 6:4-8 seems to suggest these people were born again who also departed from the faith. Thanks for sharing brother.

    God bless.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2019
  9. crossnote

    crossnote Berean Supporter

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    I'd beg to differ as the text says 'but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.' Hence, the reason they went out from the truth is because they were not of the truth.
    1 John 4:6 (KJV) We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

    Regarding born again...

    1 John 2:27 (KJV) But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

    Can a person born again become unborn, especially as the Holy Spirit abides in us and has sealed us?
     
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  10. lismore

    lismore Legend

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    I agree with you crossnote. What I would say in reply to the OP, the Lord gave the parable of the wheat and the tares, the sheep and the goats. He also spoke of a narrow gate and small path to life and only a few would find it.

    Someone who is born again cannot, will not be anything other than born again. They've found the pearl of great price!

    On the other hand in churches and in Christian circles there are many, many who are not born again, the goats mixed in with the sheep, the tares mixed in with the wheat. Soon, at the return of the Lord they will be separated. For the moment they're there, spreading false doctrines and discouragement. God Bless :)
     
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  11. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    You are free to believe as you wish brother. What is it exactly that you disagree with I am not quite sure. If they went out from us. What are they going out from? They are going out from the faith, no longer believing and following God's Word. The scriptures you provide above only support the point being made. They do not disagree with them.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2019
  12. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Hello brother lismore nice to meet you and welcome. Are we literally born again or spiritually? If spiritually, can we grieve God's Spirit so that God's Spirit departs from us? Also are we literally God's Sheep or Wheat or is this a parable about God's children and the children of the devil? How do we know if we are the children of God or the children of the devil? If you can honestly answer these question from the scriptures, then you may wish to re-think your post. Thanks for sharing your thoughts brother.

    God bless.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2019
  13. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    How do you understand the following verses?

    Luke 8:11-15
    Now the parable is this: the seed is the word of God. Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved. Those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away. The seed which fell among the thorns, these are the ones who have heard, and as they go on their way they are choked with worries and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to maturity. But the seed in the good soil, these are the ones who have heard the word in an honest and good heart, and hold it fast, and bear fruit with perseverance.
     
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  14. crossnote

    crossnote Berean Supporter

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    True, professors compared to possessors.
     
  15. Mantishand

    Mantishand Member

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    There is not anything anyone could say or do to make me not believe. I've met him.
     
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  16. crossnote

    crossnote Berean Supporter

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    You seemed to be taking a stand that a true Christian (born again) can ultimately lose their salvation.
    If that is your position then I would take issue. You do realize many profess themselves as Christian, hang out at Church, even have some bible knowledge, but are not born from above? These I can see lasting awhile and then throwing in the towel. Maybe those tares are what you are referring to?
     
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  17. Kris Jordan

    Kris Jordan Member

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    Hi LoveGodsWord, thank you for your encouraging words.

    Having walked with the Lord for over 30 years now and hearing both sides of the debate (and researching the scriptures feverishly), my personal opinion is this:

    We are saved and forgiven when we choose to believe Jesus for what He did for us on the cross, thereby accepting God's free gift of salvation by faith. The only way I can see an individual becoming "unsaved" would be if they no longer choose to believe Jesus for what He did for them on the cross, since He is the only means for salvation. But even THAT view has issues...lol!

    God never forces us into the Kingdom and He doesn't push us out. He always wants people to repent and be saved (2 Peter 3:9), but the choice is always up to us to either accept or reject it at any given time. That is why I love 1 John 5:11-13 which says, "And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God."

    It's all about belief/faith in Jesus...:)
     
  18. Maria Billingsley

    Maria Billingsley Well-Known Member Supporter

    +759
    United States
    Christian
    In Relationship
    No repentance causes a believer to fall away from salvation. We all sin however, it is the unrepentant sinner who looses their way to the narrow gate thus lost on the wide road of destruction. We have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ of Nazareth but He can not advocate for those who do not do the will of the Father.
    Blessings
     
  19. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

    +1,154
    Australia
    SDA
    Married
    Hello brother David, nice to see you. Good scriptures. For me these scriptures are talking about how God's WORD is received and those who keep it and those who depart from it and some of the reasons why people depart from God's Word after they had received it. How do you understand these scriptures? BTW nice scriptures very relavant to the OP. Thanks for sharing.
     
  20. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

    +1,154
    Australia
    SDA
    Married
    Hi brother Mantishand praise the Lord! :) Is there are test in God's WORD to help us to know if we know God or not? Also, why do you think God's Word encourages us to "Examine oursleves to see if we are in the faith or not *2 CORINTHIANS 13:5; 2 PETER 1:10-11 Thanks for sharing.

    God bless
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2019
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