Call To Ministry

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2PhiloVoid

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Mat 10:37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

Does this mean nothing? Just there to fill up white space?

I LOVE her. Obviously. Otherwise I wouldn't be torn about this. I'm praying (and have been) for a long time that she would come to the Lord.

Notice that it doesn't say "wife." And in Matthew 19:29 where it says, "And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life," this doesn't mean that you have divorced your wife. And the funny thing is, the NU manuscripts actually omit the word "wife" from this verse.
 
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Paidiske

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Mat 10:37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

Does this mean nothing? Just there to fill up white space?

No, of course not. But the reality is that in ministry you have options. For example, I know someone whose wife wasn't okay with him working in a congregation; so his ministry has been as a school chaplain. (Actually, I know several people like that). I know someone else whose wife wasn't happy with him becoming ordained, so his ministry has been to be a counsellor within a Christian context. And so on.

This isn't a matter of having to choose Jesus or your wife. The challenge for you - for all of us who have the twin vocations of ministry and marriage - is how best to love and serve Jesus without compromising our marriages.

By setting it up in your mind the way you are, you're making your wife the enemy of Jesus in your life; and that's a very very dangerous thing to do.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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Again, I'm not the one trying to divorce. It's not what I want, nor have I ever advocated it. Our counselor actually told her to knock that crap off. She threatens divorce over every little thing.

Yeah, but you could just keep pressing the matter in the hope that she does divorce you, then you could feel "free" to carry on. Just make sure that this isn't what is really going on. I'm condemning you. And I'm not implying that you're not a Christian. I'm not even implying that the Lord won't place you in ministry somewhere. What I am implying is that I've seen my share of men use their "calling" as an excuse to make things happen that shouldn't happen. Understand what I'm saying, brother?
 
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letmeseeyourphone

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Yeah, but you could just keep pressing the matter in the hope that she does divorce you, then you could feel "free" to carry on. Just make sure that this isn't what is really going on. I'm condemning you. And I'm not implying that you're not a Christian. I'm not even implying that the Lord won't place you in ministry somewhere. What I am implying is that I've seen my share of men use their "calling" as an excuse to make things happen that shouldn't happen. Understand what I'm saying, brother?
Thank you. I appreciate the input. I'm not pushing anything. Other than wanting to attend church twice a month besides going to school full time. That shouldn't be a big request. I don't try to get her to go anymore. I don't tell her about it when I get home. (Unless she asks, which is rare). I quit trying to get her to read or pray with me. It's a no. The only thing I'm pushing is that I'm allowed to attend church. Of my choosing.
 
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Paidiske

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So what I'm getting here is...Don't answer the Lord's call if your wife doesn't want it. End of story.

I should just stay home and forget about it all? Throw all my Bibles and books on the burn pile and ignore God?

I don't think I'm being clear enough...NO form of ministry will be acceptable to her. If she has to sacrifice anything, especially time with me, or money put toward that end...she will not be happy.

It all sounded fine if I was just gonna go to college and sit at home and write books. But since it will involve being in church, and heaven forbid, other people...it's a no go.

You have time. You're still in college. You're not getting ordained tomorrow. You have time to figure out where this will all lead; and so does your wife.

If academics are okay with your wife, maybe focus there for now; the Lord knows we need people to write the books that nourish the faith of the church! Work on making your degree the most rich time of equipping it can be. Think about maybe writing an honours thesis. And see what God does with it all.

It seems to me that you have a sense of urgency - I have to solve it now, I have to choose some unacceptable extreme - when that's really not necessary. You don't know what tomorrow's going to bring.

But that said, you should be "allowed" to attend church - and if your wife isn't okay with that, there's stuff there that does need work.
 
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A_Thinker

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So what I'm getting here is...Don't answer the Lord's call if your wife doesn't want it. End of story.

I should just stay home and forget about it all? Throw all my Bibles and books on the burn pile and ignore God?

I don't think I'm being clear enough...NO form of ministry will be acceptable to her. If she has to sacrifice anything, especially time with me, or money put toward that end...she will not be happy.

It all sounded fine if I was just gonna go to college and sit at home and write books. But since it will involve being in church, and heaven forbid, other people...it's a no go.

No ... the answer is make your ministry work ... for you AND your wife.

Noone said that it would be easy ... or without challenges.

Heck ... you yourself said that your dream showed the two of you ministering together.

So, it's obvious that the Lord intends for you to WIN her to Christ and ministry of some kind.
 
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Paidiske

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Thank you for giving solid advice. The urgency comes from her immediate attempts to keep me from attending church. Also, throwing huge fits and temper tantrums that are disrupting my school work. There won't be school much longer if she doesn't chill out. I already had to drop one class, and I'm getting an "F" in another. I'm now only focused on three other classes, and I'm behind in one of those.

Last semester I took five classes and made Deans' List.

Perhaps you need to take a leave of absence from study for a semester, and focus on your marriage. That situation is not healthy for either of you.
 
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GingerBeer

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I got wrapped up in the Hebrew Roots cult
Charismatic visions and prophetic messages are in the same encampment as Hebrew Roots - both depend on alleged words from God given to leaders and congregational prophets. Do not trust those words.
 
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letmeseeyourphone

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Charismatic visions and prophetic messages are in the same encampment as Hebrew Roots - both depend on alleged words from God given to leaders and congregational prophets. Do not trust those words.
Don't trust my own eyes or ears? Don't trust what the Lord has spoken directly to me and shown me?
 
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All4Christ

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What does a public forum have to do with it? There's no family names here...

Done all that. I've put more into this marriage than people realize. All I do is live to serve her. Now. I made mistakes in the past, I get that. But those mistakes do not define me.

How does making a real appraisal of my spouse's spiritual condition constitute immaturity on my part? It's calling things for what they are.
How hard do you think it would be for someone to figure out it is referring to their exact situation? Not so difficult.

In regards to the rest - There’s no stop to what you are called to do.
 
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Presbyterian Continuist

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The title sums it up. The Lord has placed a strong (and VERY obvious) calling on my life to enter ministry. He has given me dreams, open visions, prophetic word from other brothers and sisters, and spoken to me directly (inwardly during prayer).

I have NO doubts about my calling and the mission he's placed me on.

However, my wife is not a strong Christian. She was raised Catholic, and they weren't even very involved in that. The Lord has built my faith over the last 5 years or so through his prophetic words coming true over and over again. The Lord took me from the road I was on in grand supernatural fashion, and placed me on the right path toward his ministry. (I was in a Christian cult and didn't know it, I was deceived). She has zero faith. And on top of that, she fakes faith, going along when I receive a word, vision, or dream and pretending she's totally down with it...until it comes time to actually "step out" in that faith, doing our part until it's time for God to do his. Then the world's gonna fall apart, in her eyes, when I start taking those first steps out on the water toward Jesus.

The Lord showed me in a dream about four years ago, that I would come to a time when it would look like I was going to lose my family, but in the end we would be stronger than ever. My wife (although she doesn't know it yet) is called to be at my side as I go down this road. She's called to ministry too, just doesn't realize it, and refuses to see it. I can't force anything, I have to leave this in the Lord's hands. My wife doesn't trust my judgement at all. And partially, rightly so. (I had an affair several years ago, I was addicted to painkillers that the VA threw at me like candy, and I got wrapped up in the Hebrew Roots cult). I totally understand that she has fear.

BUT...that doesn't change what the Lord has told me and shown me. He also told me that I was trying to dive deep, and there would be alot of people like "water wings" trying to hold me back. She resists any effort to attend any church full time. It's always a struggle. Has been for 17 years. Things are coming to a head because I'm involved in a charismatic church (which is where the Lord told me I need to plant my butt right now) and the power of the Holy Spirit scares her. She thinks it's another cult. Nevermind that I've been associated with them for 5 years now. But NOW that I'm starting to take my call seriously and taking small steps to implement as the Lord leads, the things attached to her are crying out. She went running back to our old church (that she hated and did everything she could to disrupt attendance there) crying that I'm crazy and "addicted to God." Unfortunately what I'm seeing from everyone around me is the unBiblical position that "family comes first." Before serving Jesus? The state of the church today saddens me.

I know my family is important. I love them dearly. I DO NOT want to lose them. But I also absolutely refuse to let God's call pass me by. I'm prepared for the worst if it's necessary. Unfortunately my wife's trying to bring it.

What say you guys? I could use some input. Please, if your answer is "you can't minister if your home's not in order"...save it. I know that. This is part of that process. The Lord is shaking my home and putting it in right alignment. I have faith that ultimately, I will minister in a manner pleasing to the Lord.

I just don't know if my wife will be along for the ride. Some things I have strong faith with, but I'm still human and struggle with others. Thank you.
It is very hard to question someone when they say "God showed me [this and that]. But one thing stands glaringly obvious. You are in a committed marriage where you made vows before God. To be accepted into the ministry, you have to have the full support of your wife. If God has not shown her, then you cannot go forward. It doesn't matter how strong or weak your wife's faith is, you have a God-given commitment to your marriage.

You can quote Scripture and say you have received prophecies until the cows come home, but if the circumstances don't line up, you cannot proceed. If you do, you will be making a grievous error and you will have to own the consequences of that for the rest of your life. If your wife divorces you, that will be a big barrier to you entering the ministry anyway, and even if she reluctantly agrees with you going into the ministry, her lack of support for you and the constant sniping at you will not only ruin your marriage anyway, but will ruin your ministry as well.

I believe that nine out of ten dreams, visions, prophetic words, can come as easily from the world, flesh or the devil, other than from the Lord. The Lord is very consistent. He will honour your marriage vow, and will not say or do anything that will threaten your marriage.

I always wanted to go into the ministry, but the doors never opened for me, and when I did get the chance to do ministry training, I was led into school teaching instead. At one stage, between teaching jobs, I mentioned to my wife that I was interested in going to talk to someone about going into the ministry, and told me straight that she did not marry me to become a minister's wife. That settled it for me. I knew that it was not the direction that I was supposed to go in the Lord.

However, when I joined my current church in 1996, I started in the choir and Sunday school; then as a deacon, then the treasurer, then an elder, and when the senior elder stood down, I was appointed to that post. Because we don't have a minister at this time, I am fulfilling a lot of that pastoral role, along with other members of the ministry committee. So, although I now have a Master of Divinity, and not an ordained minister, I am doing everything that a minister does, and my wife fully supports me.

So if the prophetic stuff you have received is correct, then because your wife is ambivalent to it, it is obviously not the right time for the door to open to you. You need to put all that on the shelf and leave it to the Lord to direct you in the way He wants you to do. The outcome will be that you will enter into a ministry and a role that your wife will fully support. But if you force the issue and ignore your wife's concerns, then you will be the responsible one for breaking up your marriage, and any ministry hopes will be dashed, and if any of the prophetic events and words you have received will fail because you were disobedient in the Lord's way of telling you to wait on Him so He can direct your steps in the right way.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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Thank you. I appreciate the input. I'm not pushing anything. Other than wanting to attend church twice a month besides going to school full time. That shouldn't be a big request. I don't try to get her to go anymore. I don't tell her about it when I get home. (Unless she asks, which is rare). I quit trying to get her to read or pray with me. It's a no. The only thing I'm pushing is that I'm allowed to attend church. Of my choosing.

Ok. Well, with that, I've said my piece. I do understand what it is to have a wife who is less than enthusiastic about wanting to serve the Lord in a more direct capacity. So, I sincerely hope that it works out for you and everyone involved.

Be blessed in Christ,
2PhiloVoid
 
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letmeseeyourphone

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Ok. Well, with that, I've said my piece. I do understand what it is to have a wife who is less than enthusiastic about wanting to serve the Lord in a more direct capacity. So, I sincerely hope that it works out for you and everyone involved.

Be blessed in Christ,
2PhiloVoid
Thank you for what you've said. I appreciate your thoughts.
 
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Also, stating that your wife has zero faith and that she fakes faith - especially in a public forum - definitely does not show maturity in your spiritual life. Focus on your marriage. Love her as Christ loves the Church. Put her needs before your own. Be willing to die for her and pray for her. Focus on building your marriage - and that will help you in future ministry. That doesn’t mean that you won’t do the ministry...but it may not be right now. Even if she wasn’t a Christian - you are not free from your commitment.
I agree. Seeing this on a public forum will not impress her one bit, and will not draw her closer to Christ. A wife is the one who knows her husband the best because she is a real part of his personal life. She knows him better than any other person, inside or outside the church. I have the attitude that I have a congregation of two: My wife and my daughter. If the quality of my Christian life and experience does not impress them to draw nearer to Christ, then I would be wasting my time trying to impress anyone else to follow my example and turn to Christ.

My wife does not share my theology or my way of worshiping, and does not attend the worship services of my church, yet she gets involved in the social side. I did not marry her for her spirituality or the correctness of her theology. I married her for her character and faithfulness. I would never make any remarks about her in a negative way on a public forum. That would be showing an absolute disrespect for her. I would be absolutely loyal to her even before anyone else in the church. My priority is: God first, my wife and family next, my employment after that, and the church last. Problems happen when a church drives a wedge between a husband and a wife, and some Pentecostal and Charismatic churches are bad at that, especially where a spouse does not show loyalty to the church and yet the other one does. So the non-loyal spouse is treated as a second-class person and is often gossiped against (which is a work of the flesh and a grievous sin which stops the Holy Spirit in his tracks working in that church, although the pastor doesn't know it). Even if my wife was a total unbeliever (which she isn't), I would still put loyalty to her over and above any church I am associated with.

So, if the OP's wife so strongly feels ambivalent to the husband going into the ministry of his church, then there has to be a solid reason for it. Because she knows him better than anyone else, perhaps she sees things in his life and attitudes that makes her feel that she does not wish to become a minister's wife in that church, seeing that there are expectations on minister's wives in most churches. Perhaps she is a private person who does not want her home become like the city railway station with all sorts of random folk coming and going. Perhaps she has had the negative experience of being button holed, pounced on and preached to by members of the husband's church, and her husband hasn't stepped in and defended her as he should have. I don't know, but I know that sort of thing goes on in Pentecostal churches concerning "non-spiritual" spouses of church members. Thank goodness that in my Presbyterian church, no one has ever done that to my wife; and so I have not had to rise to my full height and punch anyone in the knee cap!
 
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