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Cain and Abel

Discussion in 'Messianic Judaism' started by visionary, Oct 30, 2017.

  1. Mercymessianicjudiasm

    Mercymessianicjudiasm Member

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    Artificial insemination
     
  2. Open Heart

    Open Heart Well-Known Member

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    Is NOT asexual reprocuction. There is still a father and a mother who use an egg and a sperm. It is you who doesn't understand what asexual reproduction is. Please do some research yourself. I think we have all been very patient with you. You are not taking our gentle hints. I can't speak for others, but I'm moving into the mode where I'm going to be blatantly frank with you because the gentle approach isn't working.
     
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  3. Christie insb

    Christie insb Well-Known Member

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    I have moved into the mode where I figure he will have to live in ignorance because something is preventing him from learning.
     
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  4. Open Heart

    Open Heart Well-Known Member

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    You may be smarter than I. I think I optimistically think people can still learn long after they have shown how set in their ways they are. Perhaps I should think again and simply cease communication on the matter.
     
  5. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    So is most of the world. (Ephesians 2) (Revelation) et al
    Likewise, (the other family) (good news)
    others are
    "Of the Lord your God; whom therefore you must not disparage by unworthy or unbecoming practices, such as here follow, and whom you must not disobey. Ye shall not cut yourselves, nor make any baldness between your eyes, which were the practices of idolaters, both in the worship of their idols, as 1 Kings 18:28; or in their funerals, as here, and Jeremiah 16:6; or upon occasion of public calamities, as Jeremiah 41:5 47:5. See Poole "Leviticus 19:27", See Poole "Leviticus 19:28". See Poole "Leviticus 21:5". For the dead; through excessive sorrow for your dead friends, as if you had no hope of their happiness after death, 1 Thessalonians 4:13.
    "Deuteronomy 14:1 Commentaries: "You are the sons of the LORD your God; you shall not cut yourselves nor shave your forehead for the sake of the dead.
    and
    Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible
    "Ye are the children of the Lord your God,.... Some of them were so by the special grace of adoption, and all of them by national adoption; which was the peculiar privilege of the people of Israel, and laid them under great obligation to honour and obey the Lord their God, who stood in the relation of a father to them, and they of children to him, Malachi 1:6. The Targum of Jonathan paraphrases it "beloved children"; so the apostle calls the saints; the "dear children of God", who therefore ought to be followers of him, Ephesians 5:1 and for a like reason this relation is observed here, namely, to quicken a regard to the exhortations of the Lord, his cautions, commands, laws, and ordinances, particularly to what follows:"
     
  6. Christie insb

    Christie insb Well-Known Member

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    Oh yeah. I hope you can reach him. If he could understand the difference between meiosis and mitosis.... Then maybe he would understand that when we say plants reproduce sexually we don't mean they get up out of the ground and walk over to another tree and start doing weird things.
     
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  7. Mercymessianicjudiasm

    Mercymessianicjudiasm Member

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    Asexual explicitly means without sex, there are examples of asexual reproduction with only one parent. I also explained mitosis which you ignored my simple reasoning. Mitosis involves "seperation" not necessarily parenting because both new cells are identical.
     
  8. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    You have the label "Messianic",
    but the posts don't reflect that label.

    What's up ?
     
  9. Mercymessianicjudiasm

    Mercymessianicjudiasm Member

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    You have not been gentle with me, your thoughts are very arrogant in nature. When an "a" precedes a word in science it means without, this is why asexual means without sex. I understand if you wish to be contentious about this, which I find counterproductive because the actual topic deals with Cain and Abel whom were conceived through normal or sexual reproduction. We can agree to disagree however.
     
  10. Mercymessianicjudiasm

    Mercymessianicjudiasm Member

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    Please don't judge me. Just because I understand asexual reproduction? Wow!
     
  11. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    Why or what do you mean ?

    I don't care if you understand something or not, or if you think you do.

    What you have posted does not fit Christian nor Messianic 'labels' which you took to post in this forum as understood by Christians and Messianics who have questioned you.
     
  12. Mercymessianicjudiasm

    Mercymessianicjudiasm Member

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    I know the difference, in fact I only mentioned mitosis, one parent cell. Meiosis would be considered sexual reproduction, but of course my view was asexual reproduction. Again asexual reproduction or mitosis occurs in ALL organisms with genetically identical cells
     
  13. tampasteve

    tampasteve Messianic leaning Lutheran Staff Member Red Team - Moderator Supporter

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    Any way we can get this conversation back on topic????
    @Lulav
     
  14. Lulav

    Lulav Ephesians 6:12 Staff Member Administrator CF Staff Trainer Supporter CF Senior Ambassador

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    Just a reminder of what the subject of this thread is about

    Cain and Abel
    This thread has gone seriously off course.
    Posts have been removed for being off topic or in other violations of the SOP of this forum.

    Please stay on topic of the OP

    thank You!
     
  15. Lulav

    Lulav Ephesians 6:12 Staff Member Administrator CF Staff Trainer Supporter CF Senior Ambassador

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    Attention please.jpg
    Admin hat beret.jpg

    Because of so many posts that were off topic

    And even after I posted an ADMIN hat asking to get back on topic there were pages of posts that still were off topic to the OP. Because of this I have spent over an hour going through all the posts and making a new thread for those who wish to talk about wither or not Cain and Abel were aware of the Sabbath, kept the Sabbath, knew anything about sacrifices, and other Torah commandments.

    Anything you have to say on that matter needs to be posted in this thread.

    Did Cain and Abel Keep the Torah or Sabbath?

    Now I have left the posts above so you can all see that another rabbit trail has begun about the plants and reproduction.

    That is not the topic.

    So please stick to the OP topic.

    Any posts after this notice that are not on topic to that will be subject to warnings.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2017
  16. Open Heart

    Open Heart Well-Known Member

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    Scientifically speaking, sex means to reproduce with two beings, one contributing a male gamete and the other contributing the female gamete. Scientifically speaking, sex does not refer to intercourse. Scientifically speaking, sex can happen and does happen all the time without intercourse.

    When I say I'm being gentle, what I mean is that I'm simply being factual with you. I'm not giving you an attitude, or thinking you are a horrible person, or talking down to you, or any of that. I am simply responding to whatever you say with facts. The only time I came close to an attitude was when I said, "What do you think pollination is?" That was said at a time when I thought you understood the pollination process and the male female parts of plants. I would have never made that statement if I had been aware of your education level. Because in my country these facts are taught down in the elementary level of school, I tend to assume that everyone in the world knows them, and that's not right of me, and I apologize for my presumption.
     
  17. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    No. Because the ground was cursed and scripture says

    Gen 3:17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
    18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
    19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

    But....then we see Noah....

    Ge 5:29 And he called his name Noah <05146>, saying, This same shall comfort us concerning our work and toil of our hands, because of the ground which the LORD hath cursed.
    05146 נח Noach no’-akh
    the same as 05118, Greek 3575 Νωε; n pr m; [BDB-629a] {See TWOT on 1323 @@ "1323b"}
    AV-Noah 46; 46
    Noah= "rest"
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
  18. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    Certainly. Much much much much much much much more than people today. (Remember YHWH walked in the Garden with and spoke directly with Adam and Havah, who also trained and taught their children in things YHWH taught them).

    How did the curse change Adam's and Havah's knowledge of the set apart days, etc ?
    Why would they not have much better 'brains'/knowledge/understanding than people do today ? (in day to day life, health, and what YHWH had told them directly ? )
     
  19. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    It certainly did not allow them a rest.......So no, Adam and his sons did not keep a Sabbath. Knowledge of one or not. And besides this, It does not mean a Sabbath like was given to the nation of Israel by the law.
    Ex 33:14 And he said, My presence shall go with thee, and I will give thee rest.
    De 3:20 Until the LORD have given rest unto your brethren, as well as unto you, and until they also possess the land which the LORD your God hath given them beyond Jordan: and then shall ye return every man unto his possession, which I have given you.
    De 12:9 For ye are not as yet come to the rest and to the inheritance, which the LORD your God giveth you.
     
  20. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    This after they were to rest from gathering manna 40 years in the desert.
     
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