By his stripes we were healed

sunlover1

Beloved, Let us love one another
Nov 10, 2006
26,146
5,348
Under the Shadow of the Almighty
✟94,511.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
I'll be sure to let my mom know that the reason she died of cancer is because she just didn't have enough faith.

-CryptoLutheran
Good for her if she's hanging with Jesus!
Maybe sometimes faith isn't a good thing ;)
My mamma died of cancer too and I could not for the life of me understand!
I had read the place in the Bible where it said that "whatever we ask for, believing,
we shall have"! Yet, I had prayed (in great faith) and she still died!
Not until many years later did I find out the "rest of the story" from studying Scripture
and God's revelations.
Since then I have personally believed God for healing all of my life.
And it DOES take work on our part sometimes. Just like when the disciples did it
Remember that kid they couldn't heal?
Jesus scolded them and called them perverts for lack of faith!!
Yep. He never changes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Optimax
Upvote 0

sunlover1

Beloved, Let us love one another
Nov 10, 2006
26,146
5,348
Under the Shadow of the Almighty
✟94,511.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
This Isaiah 53 scripture is one of the most misused scriptures in the Church today. This scripture is not referring to physical healing at all, but instead is referring to sin and spiritual illnesses. Throughout the scriptures we see God referring to spiritual blindness and deafness, (Mathew 13). Also, the Lord refers to sin as an illness. (Mathew 9). That's what needs healed and that's the promise of Isaiah 53.

Lets examine Mathew chapter 9. The Lords miracle healing in Mathew chapter 9 points to a spiritual truth. Look at the scripture, Christ only heals this man after the Lord is accused of blasphemy. Christ performed this miracles to prove he had power to forgive sin. Look also at his next statement, it reads: "Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick.". The Lord is referring to sinners here, and they were not sick with any illness. Their illness was sin itself

I believer that WOF preachers need to be healed of their blindness so they can see the correct interpretation of the scriptures. I don't mean that to be sarcastic but instead is meant in the uttermost seriousness. Jesus did do many healing miracles, but those things are not the promise that is mentioned in Isaiah 53, Mathew 9, or Mathew 13. His miracles are signs that follow apostles and follow Christ, but not all are apostles, and not all are miracle workers. If these WOF preachers were actually anointed they would send their healers to heal you, instead of fleecing the Church for money, using their flawed word of faith doctrine. They tell us to just keep speaking words of faith, just believe enough, and sow more financial seeds. It seems that Gods promise doesn't come cheap, or easy

Ask yourself, are all sinners sick with physical illness? No. Is physical illness a sign that you are a sinner who needs to repent? No, not necessarily. Our bodies are growing old and our glory will fade like grass in the field. Our promises are found in heaven, that's where death, the ultimate sickness, will be healed. These WOF prosperity preachers keep telling us that if we just speak the word enough, and if we just believe enough, and give them enough money, that we will be healed. This however is just not the truth. If we find healing then that's a good thing, but if we don't then we need not blame ourselves as these WOF preachers do, no we just need to look toward heaven for our redemption.



Isaiah 53:4 Surely He has borne our griefs
And carried our sorrows;
Yet we esteemed Him stricken,
Smitten by God, and afflicted.
5 But He was wounded for our transgressions,
He was bruised for our iniquities;
The chastisement for our peace was upon Him,
And by His stripes we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray;
We have turned, every one, to his own way;
And the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.

Mathew 9:12 When Jesus heard that, He said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. 13 But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice.’ For I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.”


Mathew 13:10 And the disciples came and said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?”

11 He answered and said to them, “Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given. 12 For whoever has, to him more will be given, and he will have abundance; but whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him.13 Therefore I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.14 And in them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled, which says:

‘Hearing you will hear and shall not understand,
And seeing you will see and not perceive;
15 For the hearts of this people have grown dull.
Their ears are hard of hearing,
And their eyes they have closed,
Lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears,
Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn,
So that I should heal them.

16 But blessed are your eyes for they see, and your ears for they hear; 17 for assuredly, I say to you that many prophets and righteous men desired to see what you see, and did not see it,and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.





By HIs stripes we were healed. There is no need to keep speaking words of faith, or sow financial seeds. We are already healed. No, instead we need to follow the Lords example, bear our own cross, and walk in love. That's what peter is exhorting us to do in 1 Peter 2. Hes not exhorting us to speak words of faith, sow more financial seeds, or to believe more.


1 Peter 2:18 Servants, be submissive to your masters with all fear, not only to the good and gentle, but also to the harsh. 19 For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully. 20 For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God. 21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us,[f] leaving us[g] an example, that you should follow His steps:

22 “Who committed no sin,
Nor was deceit found in His mouth”; [h]
23 who, when He was reviled, did not revile in return; when He suffered, He did not threaten, but committed Himself to Him who judges righteously; 24 who Himself bore our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live for righteousness—by whose stripes you were healed. 25 For you were like sheep going astray, but have now returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls.
And this is the lie that the devil hopes we buy.
Because if we believe that God doesn't want us healed, then the dev can pick us off
Nothing new under the sun there.
All through history it's been his one desire. to dispose of God's people.
God, on the other hand, wants to build a mighty army!
That's why we have marriage! :D
That we might have godly offspring! (Malachi I believe)
If He gave us armor and weapons, it's because we're in battle!
"From the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of
heaven suffers violence, and violent men take it by force.

Healing can be a real battle! That's why God told the disciples that some
need fasting ..
Wish I had known this stuff earlier in my life
God bless!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Optimax
Upvote 0

razzelflabben

Contributor
Nov 8, 2003
25,814
2,508
63
Ohio
✟122,293.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I also don't think that we bring judgement on ourselves when we take communion. Look at the BTK killer who was president of his church. He took communion but still killed people. He didn't get sick. Look at Judas, he partook of the Lords supper and sinned, he didn't get sick, although he did commit suicide. My point is that many sinners take communion and probably sin, and they don't get sick.

I think, in my humble fallible opinion, that perhaps Paul is actually saying that we bring judgment on ourselves because we are sinning. He says we don't discern the Lords body. He mentions "despising the poor" who have nothing. Its my opinion that they dont discern the fact that when we despise the poor we despise Christ himself, we are not discerning that Christs body is that poor person. Thats the sin. Jesus said that when we give a cup of water to the least of our brethren we are actually giving it to him.

That's probably the discernment of the Lords body, which paul refers to, in my humble and fallible opinion. Also, i think that perhaps the sickness that results from that lack of discernment is perhaps more sin and more spiritual blindness but not illness itself. We reap what we sow. However, this is just my opinion, im not married to it, but i do ponder it.
isn't the judgment that we are "eating and drinking" spiritual judgment, not fleshly judgment?
 
  • Like
Reactions: All4Christ
Upvote 0

Extraneous

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2016
4,885
1,410
49
USA
✟19,796.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Jesus didn't bear the common cold or the ebola virus for us on the cross.

-CryptoLutheran

I dont believe that God meant for us to have perfect health necessarily. It doesn't make sense that he would give us perfect health as our bodies grow old and feeble. I believe God wants us to be in good spiritual health. The older we get the more health issues we have. AS paul said, we groan inwardly, waiting for the adoption of our body. All creation groans, even believers. I think this refers to the reality of the temporary natural world. It refers to this world with all its temporary imperfection. We are looking for the Lord to redeem us from this earth.
 
Upvote 0

razzelflabben

Contributor
Nov 8, 2003
25,814
2,508
63
Ohio
✟122,293.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
One thing that really spoke to me that I think relates to this issue was when I started looking into our bodies being the temple of the living God. Most people take this to mean healthy bodies, strong, healthy living, etc. But what does scripture say about the temple? It is a place of prayer....how cool is that?! Instead of trying to turn God's dwelling place into an exercise gym with healthy food, we need to work to turn it into a place of constant prayer and worship. That understanding changes our view of physical healing all the time as well, or at least it should.
 
Upvote 0

Extraneous

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2016
4,885
1,410
49
USA
✟19,796.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
One thing that really spoke to me that I think relates to this issue was when I started looking into our bodies being the temple of the living God. Most people take this to mean healthy bodies, strong, healthy living, etc. But what does scripture say about the temple? It is a place of prayer....how cool is that?! Instead of trying to turn God's dwelling place into an exercise gym with healthy food, we need to work to turn it into a place of constant prayer and worship. That understanding changes our view of physical healing all the time as well, or at least it should.

Yes, i agree. Its not a bad thing to get into physical shape, but if that's what we think spiritualism is then we run the risk of becoming like pharisees.
 
  • Like
Reactions: razzelflabben
Upvote 0

sunlover1

Beloved, Let us love one another
Nov 10, 2006
26,146
5,348
Under the Shadow of the Almighty
✟94,511.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
isn't the judgment that we are "eating and drinking" spiritual judgment, not fleshly judgment?
Judgement is spiritual, the consequences though, appear to be physical.
29For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly.
30For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep.…
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

razzelflabben

Contributor
Nov 8, 2003
25,814
2,508
63
Ohio
✟122,293.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Judgement is spiritual, the consequences though, appear to be physical.
29For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly.
30For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep.…
?????? why is it that all of a sudden all kinds of people seem to think that there is no connection between the spirit of man and the flesh of man? Seriously, where is this idea coming from, you are the second person today to try to make this claim yet scripture seems very clear that there is a connection, so I am very curious where you all are getting the idea that there is no connection.
 
Upvote 0

razzelflabben

Contributor
Nov 8, 2003
25,814
2,508
63
Ohio
✟122,293.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Not sure why people don't believe that God wants them healthy
who is suggesting HE doesn't? There is a huge difference between teaching that God always wants us physically healthy all the time and God is concerned with our flesh as well as our spirit.

I don't know, I really don't get where this idea that we have to always be comfortable in our flesh in order to be in a right relationship with God....can you enlight me where this idea is coming from, cause it isn't scriptural.
 
Upvote 0

Extraneous

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2016
4,885
1,410
49
USA
✟19,796.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Judgement is spiritual, the consequences though, appear to be physical.
29For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly.
30For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep.…


Im not so sure that the judgment, which is mentioned in that scripture above, is physical, but i believe it might be spiritual instead. We see the scriptures teaching us not to sleep, but to be awake. And to live as one who is alive not dead (although that can seem to contradict Colossians 3, but it doesn't, and instead affirms it) Its spiritual living verses living in the flesh.


Romans 8:10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Extraneous

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2016
4,885
1,410
49
USA
✟19,796.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
It is far better to believe what the scripture says rather than what one thinks.

The scriptures say not to store wealth on earth. People dont follow that however, and instead follow what they think it means instead. However, they blind themselves to the truth when they do that. The scriptures are written in a way that the natural man will see them in a natural way, but the spiritual man will see them in a spiritual way.

This scripture refers to that spiritual blindness-

Mathew 6:22 “The lamp of the body is the eye. If therefore your eye is good, your whole body will be full of light. 23 But if your eye is bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in you is darkness, how great is that darkness!
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Extraneous

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2016
4,885
1,410
49
USA
✟19,796.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Spiritual sight verses carnal sight. Where is Christ? In heaven, and we are dead, hidden with Him. His sheep know his voice and follow it.


1 Corinthians 2 And I, brethren, when I came to you, did not come with excellence of speech or of wisdom declaring to you the testimony[a] of God. 2 For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified.

6 However, we speak wisdom among those who are mature, yet not the wisdom of this age, nor of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. 7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the ages for our glory, 8 which none of the rulers of this age knew; for had they known, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. 9 But as it is written:

Eye has not seen, nor ear heard,
Nor have entered into the heart of man
The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.”[c]

Colossians 3 If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of God. 2 Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth. 3 For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. 4 When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with Him in glory.

Matthew 13:16 But blessed are your eyes, because they see; and your ears, because they hear. 17 For truly I say to you that many prophets and righteous men desired to see what you see, and did not see it, and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
18 “Hear then the parable of the sower.

Revelation 14:4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed[a] from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.

John 10:27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
 
Upvote 0

Extraneous

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2016
4,885
1,410
49
USA
✟19,796.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Hmm. interesting ...
Reminds me of gnosticism of sorts.
Nothing new under the sun.

Reminds me of Romans 8

5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
 
  • Like
Reactions: razzelflabben
Upvote 0

Extraneous

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2016
4,885
1,410
49
USA
✟19,796.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Nothing new under the sun.

Nope, sure isn't. I agree.

Romans 8:20 For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it in hope; 21 because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groans and labors with birth pangs together until now. 23 Not only that,but we also who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, eagerly waiting for the adoption, the redemption of our body. 24 For we were saved in this hope, but hope that is seen is not hope; for why does one still hope for what he sees? 25 But if we hope for what we do not see, we eagerly wait for it with perseverance.

Ecclesiastes 1 The words of the Preacher,[a] the son of David, king in Jerusalem.

2 Vanity of vanities, says the Preacher,
vanity of vanities! All is vanity.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Extraneous

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2016
4,885
1,410
49
USA
✟19,796.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Nothing new here.

Genesis 3:17 Then to Adam He said, “Because you have heeded the voice of your wife, and have eaten from the tree of which I commanded you, saying, ‘You shall not eat of it’:

“Cursed is the ground for your sake;
In toil you shall eat of it
All the days of your life.
18 Both thorns and thistles it shall bring forth for you,
And you shall eat the herb of the field.
19 In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread
Till you return to the ground,
For out of it you were taken;
For dust you are,
And to dust you shall return.”


Mathew 13:18 “Therefore hear the parable of the sower: 19 When anyone hears the word of the kingdom, and does not understand it, then the wicked one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is he who received seed by the wayside. 20 But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21 yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles. 22 Now he who received seed among the thorns is he who hears the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful. 23 But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”
 
Upvote 0