Born again (born from above)

[GraceBro]

1. What does it mean to be born again?
2. Is there any difference from the normal experience of baptism?
3. Are all Christians born again?

SCRIPTURES:
Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

4 Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?”

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’
John 3:3-7

Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 24 because

“All flesh is as grass,
And all the glory of man as the flower of the grass.
The grass withers,
And its flower falls away,
25 But the word of the Lord endures forever.”
1 Peter 1:22-25

Salvation is the restoration of the life of God. Therefore, to be born again means to have the Holy Spirit, lost when Adam sinned in the Garden of Eden, restored to you through faith in Jesus Christ. The Gospel is sin, death, forgiveness, and the restoration of the life of God. Baptism is the being identified with God through the indwelling Holy Spirit. Each Christian would have to answer that question. Some don't believe or understand being born again. Others think that belonging to a Church or denomination qualifies them as being saved. Ultimately, God is the judge of who is truly a Christian, but His sheep know His voice.

 

[Davy]

I just think you are completely misunderstanding what born again means.

Well, we definitely know Jesus meant our spirit being born of The Spirit, we know that part for sure. But there's a debate on how He meant the being born of water part, some thinking it referred to water baptism (the traditional view), and others thinking it mean being born of the water of woman's womb (which is how Nicodemus understood).

 

[zoidar]

Well, we definitely know Jesus meant our spirit being born of The Spirit, we know that part for sure. But there's a debate on how He meant the being born of water part, some thinking it referred to water baptism (the traditional view), and others thinking it mean being born of the water of woman's womb (which is how Nicodemus understood).

I don't know what born of water means. Born of Spirit I know. I think if you have been born of the Holy Spirit, you have been born again. Maybe Jesus is also refering to the work of the Spirit when he says born of water. Like someone might say: "You need to burn that with fire and heat" meaning aspects the same thing, but I don't know.

Jesus answered and said to her, “If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, ‘Give Me a drink,’ you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water.”
— John 4:10

He who believes in Me, as the Scripture said, ‘From his innermost being will flow rivers of living water.’”
— John 7:38

Of course I don't think Jesus needed to be born again, but that the robber needed to, and he was born again on the cross.

Sorry for misunderstanding you btw.

 

[AbbaLove]

The original meaning of "born again" has been so watered down that more than a few so-called Christians (e.g. easter eggs, marshmallow chicks, chocolate bunnies and chocolate crosses) think the supernatural "born again" experience was only powerful with the Apostles and not possible with today's "born again" Believers that are truly, truly baptized (Luke 3:15-16) with the abiding presence of His Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 12:8-11) with power.

Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in them. For everything in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—comes not from the Father but from the world. (1 John 2:15-16)​

Be Blessed This Resurrection Sunday

​

​

 

[zoidar]

He was literally crucified with Christ if you think about it. For example

Romans 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

And It does show examples of the forbiding water, or something hindering. For example John the baptist, when Jesus in Mat 3:1-14 came from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him. John forbad him, (for what might appear to be at first obvious reasons) by John (who had the Holy Ghost from the womb Luke 1:15) saying to Jesus, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? I won't post the thing in its entirety but the Ethiopian for example, after Phillip preached Jesus to him he apparently understood that he should be baptized and was the first to say, to Phillip, in Acts 8:36 See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? Philip adds he could if he believed (which follows, "believe and be baptized" as Jesus said) and so he was (nothing hindered him). And likewise again, concerning those who already had the Holy Ghost here Peter states it this way Acts 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? So John (knew he had to be baptized by Christ who baptized with the Holy Ghost) and yet John had the Holy Ghost from the womb) these also believed (and had the Holy Ghost and were still encouraged to be baptized but it was the way Peter said it "can any man forbid water". So it appears someone or even certain circumstances can hinder, or forbid it. But the cool part about the thief on the cross (who is often referred to when speaking of the necessity of water baptism) is that he falls into the very category of one (even in the picture itself) as one baptized into his death Romans 6:3 because he is very literally on the cross beside Christ Roman 6:3 As one literally crucified with Christ. Yet at the same time he could literally be understood as one hindered, forbidden or prevented from water itself.

I just always thought, wow, thats pretty cool

CYPRIAN OF CARTHAGE

“[Catechumens who suffer martyrdom] are not deprived of the sacrament of baptism. Rather, they are baptized with the most glorious and greatest baptism of blood, concerning which the Lord said that he had another baptism with which he himself was to be baptized [Luke 12:50]” (Letters 72[73]:22 [A.D. 253])

 

[chad kincham]

So are you saying that the Body of Christ, which we gentiles are saved by, also includes the New Covenant?

Do you think it is possible for us to be saved by being part of Christ's Body (Ephesians 1:3), which is by pure grace from God, instead of thru any covenants?

Ever noticed that Paul never written to us that we are under the same New Covenant that Jeremiah 31:31 mentioned?

He mentioned the Covenant once in Romans 11:26-27, and the context made it clear that he is referring to the nation Israel.

No.

One becomes part of the body of Christ after salvation, not before.

Christians are married to Jesus, and since two become as one in marriage, the bride of Christ becomes part of His body.

We are saved by grace THROUGH faith, says the oft-cited Ephesians 2:8-9, and faith doesn’t come by being zapped with irresistible grace from predestination, but faith comes when we hear the word of God.

But having faith alone doesn’t save us - we have to choose to receive Jesus to become a child of God, John 1:12;must choose to repent of our sins to be forgiven, Acts 3:19 and Acts 20:21; and choose to confess with our mouth the faith in our heart that Jesus is Lord whom God raised from the dead, and call upon the name of the Lord to be saved, Romans 10:8-13 (for with the heart, we believe unto righteousness and with the mouth, confession is made UNTO SALVATION).

Shalom.

 

[chad kincham]

If the new birth is some supernatural, monergistic movement of the Holy Spirit upon the individual where the individual has no role at all, then if one is not born again, whose fault would that be? It cannot be the indiiduals fault. Could Christ rightly, justly condemn one (as Nicodemus) who has not been born again, condemn one for something that was impossible, outside the control of the individual? How does the Holy Spirit determine which individuals to act upon? Is the Holy Spirit being a respecter of pesons by acting upon one person and not another? God desires all men be saved, then why dosen't the Holy Spirit act upon all men...Jesus 'would' those Jews be under His wing (Matthew 23:37) whose fault was it they were not if man has no role, no say so in who is saved/born again or not born again?

And that’s why reformed doctrine/Calvinism is reprehensible and an insult to God’s character and nature.

It has God arbitrarily withholding the ability to believe from those predestined to hell, then damning them for lack of belief.

It gets worse than that - since as the Westminster confession states, absolutely nothing happens without God decreeing it - that means God decreed mankind to fall in the garden of eden, and therefore to need saved from the consequences of sin, then decreed that the vast majority of mankind is predestined to eternal damnation, by withholding the regeneration that is needed to be able to believe, then condemning them for their lack of belief.

Since Jesus said most will be damned and few will be saved, that means the God of Calvinism has predestined the vast majority of humans to the lake of fire with no hope or chance at ever being saved, just to show His sovereignty.

Which makes the God of Calvinism a sadistic monster.

 

[ARBITER01]

It would be better understood if it was translated from the Greek as Born-Anew.

 

[Guojing]

No.

One becomes part of the body of Christ after salvation, not before.

Christians are married to Jesus, and since two become as one in marriage, the bride of Christ becomes part of His body.

We are saved by grace THROUGH faith, says the oft-cited Ephesians 2:8-9, and faith doesn’t come by being zapped with irresistible grace from predestination, but faith comes when we hear the word of God.

But having faith alone doesn’t save us - we have to choose to receive Jesus to become a child of God, John 1:12;must choose to repent of our sins to be forgiven, Acts 3:19 and Acts 20:21; and choose to confess with our mouth the faith in our heart that Jesus is Lord whom God raised from the dead, and call upon the name of the Lord to be saved, Romans 10:8-13 (for with the heart, we believe unto righteousness and with the mouth, confession is made UNTO SALVATION).

Shalom.

Alright, you also recognize that we are saved by grace thru faith, without being in the same New Covenant that was promised to Israel in (Hebrews 8:8, Jeremiah 31:31).

 

[SANTOSO]

1. What does it mean to be born again?
2. Is there any difference from the normal experience of baptism?
3. Are all Christians born again?

SCRIPTURES:
Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

4 Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?”

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’
John 3:3-7

Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 24 because

“All flesh is as grass,
And all the glory of man as the flower of the grass.
The grass withers,
And its flower falls away,
25 But the word of the Lord endures forever.”
1 Peter 1:22

Dear one, why you are concerned whether all Christians are born again ? Do someone offend you ?

Do someone that you know that don’t have a normal baptism? Are you concerned ?

Are you concerned about yourselves or others who are born again ? Why ?

What you don’t understand in the scriptures that you have quoted?

 

[mindlight]

Dear one, why you are concerned whether all Christians are born again ? Do someone offend you ?

Do someone that you know that don’t have a normal baptism? Are you concerned ?

Are you concerned about yourselves or others who are born again ? Why ?

What you don’t understand in the scriptures that you have quoted?

I have to preach on this - mid April. Be careful to consider your own life before pointing a finger.

 

[Butterball1]

Where do the Scriptures teach that "God does this only for those who are believers, choosing for themselves to submit to baptism"?

Answer: They don't.

Did you also notice that in Colossians 2 the Apostle St. Paul writes that baptism is a circumcision made without hands we have received in Christ? Tell me, was one a member of the Covenant only when they became an adult and chose to become circumcised, or were the Jews commanded to circumcise their male offspring, who were just as much part of the Covenant people as anyone else?

Infants have no body of sin to be removed/remitted in baptism therefore no spiritual circumcision made without hands can be performed upon infants. And baptism is just for those who can believe, Mark 16:16; Hebrews 11:6.

God's people is not comprised solely of adults, the Christian Church has children. Our children are Christians, not because one is "born" Christian, but because our children receive the same thing we ourselves received--the righteousness of God given as pure gift by the grace of God through the same Means of Grace which He uses for us: Word and Sacrament.

As infants are born spiritually alive having no sin yet as they grow and intellectually mature learning right from wrong (Isaiah 7:14-15) they reach an age of accountability to God's law (Romans 7:8-9) where sin thensprang up and one spitiually dies. Those then who believe, repent confess and baptized for emission of sins are the ones who becomes Christians. Again, infatns have no sins to be remittted, unable to believe. Romans 5:2 says faith is what gives access to grace. Since infants are not capable of having faith does not mean they are lost outside of grace for again they have no sin, innocent before God and if one dies as an infant will still be saved.

We are not saved by our works, not even our "yes" to God. We are saved by God alone, by what He has done, working as He has said He would. So that on Christ's account alone, by God's grace alone, through faith we are saved and justified.

-CryptoLutheran

I agree that God saves, most all on this forum would believe God saves. So the issue is WHO does God save and WHY did he save that person and not another? Hebrews 5:9; Matthew 7:21; Romans 5:17-18; Acts of the Apostles 2:38; Mark 16:16; etc etc God saves those who obey His will. Since God saves and He saves those who obey His will then in that since it can be said obedience saves.

Paul refutes that 'grace only' saves in Romans 6. Because a Christian is saved by grace does not excuse the Christian to live in sin for those who are Christians are dead to sin. Obedience to God's will is required to keep one from sinning, from living in sin. Those who do not obey are serving "sin unto death", (Romans 6:16). Therefore to keep from serving "sin unto death" one must must have "obedience unto righteousness". So salvation requires God's grace and man's obedience unto righteousness in order to be saved. Thogh grace has appeared to all men (Titus 2:11) grace will not save those who refuse to obey God's will and live in rebellion to God.

 

[Butterball1]

The robber on the cross then that repented and got saved?

---How do you know, what undisputable proof can you provide that the thief had never been baptized?

---the thief is not an example of NT gospel salvation, Hebrews 9:16-17. Christ being the Testator of the NT means that the NT would only come into force at some point AFTER Christ died.

---when Christ was on earth He had authority to forgive sins of those whom He thought was deserving, as the thief (Matthew 9:6). Yet Christ left earth some 2000 years ago (Acts of the Apostles 1:9-11) leaving behind His NT gospel as His authority on earth which teaches, requires water baptism for the remission of sins. So Christ is not on earth day in the flesh personally forgiving the sins of men. For one today to claim he is saved just as the theif would require one to have a time machine, go back in time to when Christ was on earth forgiving sin and have an encounter with Christ, as the thief, having Christ perosnally forgive thier sins.

 

[JulieB67]

Being born again definitely means -"born from above"

Ecclesiastes 12:7 "Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

So when Christ says born of water and the spirit he is talking first from water/womb

Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed thee in the belly I know thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations."

And then once we accept Christ we are born of the spirit.

The subject follows all the way through verse 13 in John 3

 

[zoidar]

---How do you know, what undisputable proof can you provide that the thief had never been baptized?

---the thief is not an example of NT gospel salvation, Hebrews 9:16-17. Christ being the Testator of the NT means that the NT would only come into force at some point AFTER Christ died.

---when Christ was on earth He had authority to forgive sins of those whom He thought was deserving, as the thief (Matthew 9:6). Yet Christ left earth some 2000 years ago (Acts of the Apostles 1:9-11) leaving behind His NT gospel as His authority on earth which teaches, requires water baptism for the remission of sins. So Christ is not on earth day in the flesh personally forgiving the sins of men. For one today to claim he is saved just as the theif would require one to have a time machine, go back in time to when Christ was on earth forgiving sin and have an encounter with Christ, as the thief, having Christ perosnally forgive thier sins.

All I can say is that when I got to know Christ something happened to me. It was like my old person got washed inside and out, and I came out a new person, can only describe it as a new birth.

 

[Butterball1]

All I can say is that when I got to know Christ something happened to me. It was like my old person got washed inside and out, and I came out a new person, can only describe it as a new birth.

Internet religious forums as this one are full of anecdotal stories. But the Bible is the standard that is to be followed not antecdotal stories. According to the Bible the new birth occurs at water baptism.

 

[zoidar]

Internet religious forums as this one are full of anecdotal stories. But the Bible is the standard that is to be followed not antecdotal stories. According to the Bible the new birth occurs at water baptism.

First we need to understand the Bible or we can make it say anything, right? What verses would you use for your claim?

 

[Marumorose]

1. What does it mean to be born again?

• To be born again is to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.

• Love Good and hate sin
• Believe that Jesus Christ is our saviour and he died for us so that we can be saved

1. Is there any difference from the normal experience of baptism?

Some churches do baptism to babies but the truth is babies do not have sins to confess to. Baptism must happen after you have confessed all your sins so that they can be forgiven
Acts 2:38 says "And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

1 Are all Christians born again?
No. Some of us do believe in God but we do not obey him
Luke 6:46 Jesus says "Why do you call me Lord, Lord, yet don't do what I say?"
May God Bless You

 

[pescador]

1. What does it mean to be born again?

• To be born again is to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.

• Love Good and hate sin
• Believe that Jesus Christ is our saviour and he died for us so that we can be saved

1. Is there any difference from the normal experience of baptism?

Some churches do baptism to babies but the truth is babies do not have sins to confess to. Baptism must happen after you have confessed all your sins so that they can be forgiven
Acts 2:38 says "And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

1 Are all Christians born again?
No. Some of us do believe in God but we do not obey him
Luke 6:46 Jesus says "Why do you call me Lord, Lord, yet don't do what I say?"
May God Bless You

The verse in Acts doesn't say that you must confess your sins before you're baptized. That is adding to Scripture.

 

[SANTOSO]

I have to preach on this - mid April. Be careful to consider your own life before pointing a finger.

Sorry I don’t know what you preach.
I never point a finger at you ; I don’t intend to offend you. But I am trying to understand why you ask what you ask.