Border update -- Border Patrol reports 300% spike at border -- National Emergency

[KCfromNC]

Huh? Your claim wasn't about births here in the U.S., but about literally bringing in numbers more than 33% of the current U.S. population.

The fact that it doesn't make any sense is no reason not to believe it.

 

[TLK Valentine]

How is it you always know I am wrong, even when you do not follow the conversation?

Given your track record for accuracy, it's never a bad bet.

 

[dgiharris]

I wonder if there can be a meeting of the minds on this issue.

For instance, I think we may be quibbling over the word "crisis".

#1) Can we all agree that illegal immigration in this country is a "Serious Problem?"

Plenty of studies and analysis has shown that building a wall along the "Entire" length of the border is not cost effective or efficient.

#2) Can we all agree that walls/barriers should be built at all high access and illegal immigration crossing points?

If we can agree to #2 then logically we start at the most frequent crossing points and simply work our way down the list until all crossing points have barriers. (A version of this has always been occurring). Given that illegal immigration has been a problem for DECADES this approach would enable us to solve this problem in a decade.

#3) Can we all agree to use actual logic and analysis in our decision making process regarding stopping the flow of illegal drugs, sex trafficking, etc.

If 90% of QRS come through legal ports of entry then does it make sense to spend $X billion of dollars focusing on the 10%???

I feel the Dems are guilty of letting the moral and humanitarian nature of this problem blind them. For instance, it is simple math, the US can only absorb so many illegal aliens and we need to take tough measures.

I feel the GOP are guilty of letting tribal-esque emotion and rhetoric blind them about this problem. For instance, not all "illegals" are equal in terms of negative impact to this country and policies treating them all (to include children) as if they are drug dealing rapists do not sit well with a moral populace. The GOP is "supposed" to stand for fiscal conservatism so for the love of all that is holy be Fiscally Conservative and stop proposing multi-billion dollar inefficient solutions.

If we can just take a step back from our Blue and Red Trenches and look at the total landscape, the reality is that the Dems and GOP aren't that far apart on this issue. It's just that both sides lack the resolve required to do what is necessary. What we need to do is Take Trump's energy and zeal on this issue and merely channel it efficiently while simultaneously resist the urge to politicize this issue.

There is more than enough common ground to solve a significant part of the problem, dare I even see the majority of this problem. We just have to be honest as well as use data, math, analysis. We need to stop being blinded by emotion on both sides.

 

[LoAmmi]

If those same people get into a car an kill themselves, that's on them. Cars are a choice, do you really think those trafficked, or Babies murdered had that choice?

Yours is one of the most ridiculous comparisons I've ever seen here.

The comment I quoted was about how the cost doesn't matter even if only a small percentage were stopped.

But good job removing my quote from the context it was made in to try to insult me. Bang up job, chief.

 

[Kenny'sID]

The comment I quoted was about how the cost doesn't matter even if only a small percentage were stopped.

But good job removing my quote from the context it was made in to try to insult me. Bang up job, chief.

You're welcome?

 

[LoAmmi]

You're welcome?

D-

 

[Speedwell]

I wonder if there can be a meeting of the minds on this issue.

For instance, I think we may be quibbling over the word "crisis".

#1) Can we all agree that illegal immigration in this country is a "Serious Problem?"

The Dems have agreed to this for years. But what kind of a "serious problem" is it? You will never get them to agree that Latinos represent an existential threat to the American cultural way of life. Dems don't care that these immigrants are not white, English-speaking Evangelical Protestants.

Plenty of studies and analysis has shown that building a wall along the "Entire" length of the border is not cost effective or efficient.

#2) Can we all agree that walls/barriers should be built at all high access and illegal immigration crossing points?

Dems have agreed to this for years. Its the Right that wants The Wall and nothing else.

#3) Can we all agree to use actual logic and analysis in our decision making process regarding stopping the flow of illegal drugs, sex trafficking, etc.

Apparently not. The Trump administration even denies the figures published by its own agencies.

I feel the Dems are guilty of letting the moral and humanitarian nature of this problem blind them. For instance, it is simple math, the US can only absorb so many illegal aliens and we need to take tough measures.

Whether we allow these people into the country or not, it is still an humanitarian crisis which at least in part our fault. Shall we put up a 35-foot concrete barrier so we can wall them off and forget them?

 

[dgiharris]

Whether we allow these people into the country or not, it is still an humanitarian crisis which at least in part our fault. Shall we put up a 35-foot concrete barrier so we can wall them off and forget them?

My view regarding the immigration and the economics of Latin America are similar to lifeboats surrounding the sinking Titanic.

There are only so many drowning victims a lifeboat can support before it sinks and everyone drowns. There are only so many immigrants America can absorb.

I believe that we need to put American citizens first, however, it is "still" in our best interest to help the South American countries obtain a vibrant economy. The better their economy, the less severe our illegal immigration problem. So I'm fine with economic aid packages to these countries provided they actually help achieve the objective of making their economy better and lowering the number of people fleeing to the US.

I would support ANY measure that would provide an air tight border to include deploying the military. Once we have an air tight border, I'm a big proponent of another Amnesty program.

In terms of the illegals that are already here. My viewpoint is that if they contribute to our economy and follow our laws and pay taxes then I'm 100% ok with them staying here. I disagree with the logical fallacy that equates an illegal alien to a drug dealing rapist-- That is, not all crimes are equal. As such, the "focus" of our law enforcement should be on priority crimes and not kicking down doors looking for migrant farm workers without VISAS. But we NEED to have an air tight border first before we implement amnestry programs. If your house is on fire, no point point rebuilding the roof until the fire is out. No point implementing amnesty programs unless you solve the problem that necessitates the need for an amnesty program

 

[Speedwell]

No point implementing amnesty programs unless you solve the problem that necessitates the need for an amnesty program

no point unless you recognize the problem for what it is. Most illegals are visa overstays who originally entered the country legally. What should we do about that? The Right says "build a wall." Illegal economic migrants come here because they can get work with the connivance of their employers, What shall we do about that? The Right says "build a wall." Drugs come into the country by truck through legal ports of entry, by air and even by submarine. What shall we do about that? The Right says "build a wall." It's getting tiresome.
,

 

[Tanj]

Well let's see....

The Obama Administration's New Crackdown on Migrant Families - The Atlantic

"In November 2014, Barack Obama made one of the most significant unilateral decisions of his presidency, announcing wholesale changes in the way the federal government would enforce immigration laws. No longer would the vast majority of immigrants who entered the U.S. illegally and who had committed no further crimes be priorities for deportation."

Obama basically said if we don't have anything on you...you aren't a priority. Yet 13 months later....

"Thirteen months later, the Department of Homeland Security began raids in Georgia, Texas, and North Carolina to round up families who have been ordered out of the country by an immigration court for deportation."

So he relaxed priorities...and Central Americans realized that since we don't lock up children, and we don't separate families, all they have to do is...

1. Show up with kids...
2. Request asylum...
3. Once released, never show up for your hearing.

Your evidence does not support your assertions Ana. Obama moved the yardstick in both directions durig his presidency, but all the underlying fundamentals predate him.

Catch and release (immigration) - Wikipedia

Why did you think so many are showing up with kids that aren't even theirs? Or pretending their kids are younger than 18? Why would someone bother to bring some stranger's kids all the way up through Mexico?

None of that is true.

Edit- You both don't seem to understand what's happening. Try actually looking into it. There's a ton of information about this.

I have, but yet again collecting evidence for your assertions is not my job.

 

[dgiharris]

no point unless you recognize the problem for what it is. Most illegals are visa overstays who originally entered the country legally. What should we do about that? The Right says "build a wall." Illegal economic migrants come here because they can get work with the connivance of their employers, What shall we do about that? The Right says "build a wall." Drugs come into the country by truck through legal ports of entry, by air and even by submarine. What shall we do about that? The Right says "build a wall." It's getting tiresome.
,

agreed.

which is why solutions need to be data driven. Blowing $20B+ on an elementary school level solution just so you can thump your chest and feel good does not help the country.

 

[Ana the Ist]

The Dems have agreed to this for years. But what kind of a "serious problem" is it? You will never get them to agree that Latinos represent an existential threat to the American cultural way of life. Dems don't care that these immigrants are not white, English-speaking Evangelical Protestants.

It's simple math. Nobody, left or right, thinks that illegals create a surplus for the economy. It's all a deficit...and whether it's $5 billion annually or $100 billion, at some point the numbers will impact those people who are actually born here.

Whether we allow these people into the country or not, it is still an humanitarian crisis which at least in part our fault. Shall we put up a 35-foot concrete barrier so we can wall them off and forget them?

Yes. I don't like the idea of the world starving and becoming more violent either....but we cannot hope to let in the 6 billion people who have it worse than us every time things go badly for them.

 

[LostMarbels]

Given your track record for accuracy, it's never a bad bet.

Odd, I stated there will be ever increasing caravans coming to our border like what happened in europe. Maybe even random boats landing on beaches like Italy. It's the same program. I also stated there is a real crisis on our border because this is artificially being motivated. Those people being pushed on us are the victims. And a huge increase in unaccompanied children will occur.

I haven't been wrong, so where is this idea you are somehow correct in proving me false? On the contrary you attest nothing is happening. There is no concerted effort to force migrate individuals into the US, child exploitation/sex trafficking is a silly notion to be mocked, and walls only work in fairytales.

300% increase even tho Trump has been adamant. An entirely opposed political party purposely working against a sitting President, and world leaders creating laws/rules on what we will do with our border. I fail to see how you can crow there is no crisis. Nor how I have not been accurate.