Livindesert
Well-Known Member
Lol the smile song was used specifically because it was on a secular program. It was ment to be a fun song not a deep one lol
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Bishop Veron Ashe
- Thread starter River-Dweller
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Lol the smile song was used specifically because it was on a secular program. It was ment to be a fun song not a deep one lol
I actually own quite a few messages by Bishop Veron Ashe; some that were preached in his now defunct Orthodox Church in Fresno and others that he preached in other pentecostal churches. Seemingly, depending on where he is, will determine the style of preaching/teaching.
Don't know how much preaching/teaching he is doing now. Endured some physical/ financial hardships around 2005 which pretty much took him off of the evangelistic circuit. I think he still preaches here and there but nothing like he was doing in the late 90's and early 2000's.
Last message I heard him preach, he still proclaims he is Orthodox...
Don't know how much preaching/teaching he is doing now. Endured some physical/ financial hardships around 2005 which pretty much took him off of the evangelistic circuit. I think he still preaches here and there but nothing like he was doing in the late 90's and early 2000's.
Last message I heard him preach, he still proclaims he is Orthodox...
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Joseph Hazen
The Religious Loudmouth
I would be interested in info on this church if you have any. Feel free to PM me.
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I tried sending you a PM but could not because I haven't had 15 posts! Just joined! Nevertheless, I don't have any information concerning Bishop Ashe's ministry. I don't think he has a church but rather does all ministry from his Facebook page. At this point, I think he pretty much evangelizes when he is well. According to his Theres Got To Be More Facebook wall, he was in the hospital earlier this month and requesting prayers. He has been battling colon cancer.
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Joseph Hazen
The Religious Loudmouth
Ah, hadn't seen you were a Newbie. Ah well, I was more interested specifically in that church. I have some friends who I think might have come from it, and it would explain some...oddities, I might've found about their practices.
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They have a very interesting history. I have followed Bishop Ashe's ministry for many years; pre-Orthodoxy. He was born into the Catholic but had an 'experience' at an early age and became apart of the Pentecostal church against this devout grandmother's wishes. Thre is a lot to his story but I, for one, could never really grasp all that they were doing. There were several churches that followed him into the Orthodox movement and all have gone their separate ways now. He doesn't seem to let his roots run deep anywhere; don't know if that's a good thing or a bad.
Lets just say, I was there when he started the transformation from Pentecostalism to Orthodoxy. Went from being Prophet Ashe to Bishop Ashe to Archbishop Ashe is probably less than a year. Never understood that movement...
Lets just say, I was there when he started the transformation from Pentecostalism to Orthodoxy. Went from being Prophet Ashe to Bishop Ashe to Archbishop Ashe is probably less than a year. Never understood that movement...
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Irish Melkite
Melkite Greek-Catholic
It's always good to be reminded to keep up to date on Mar Enoch a/k/a Veron Ashe. He's been floating around the vagante episcopi scene for well more than a decade now, since he was 'ordained to the episcopate' by "Papa Joe" Vredenburg, a/k/a Patriarch Joseph, a/k/a Mar Narsai, one of the truly legendary among the episcopi vagante and the founder of what used to be called the Federation of Saint Thomas Christians, to which Mar Enoch has claimed for some years to be heir in its latest incarnation. (Someone referred to the Federation as a 'dubious' Syro-Malankara jurisdiction - that's a kind way to put it; the Malankarese would not be so subtle.)
When Mar Enoch/Veron wasn't busy shepherding the Mar Thoma Orthodox Church Archdiocese and celebrating the Holy Qurbana in Fresno, he could be found on the East Coast where, as Archbishop Veron Ashe, he was busy shepherding The Church of Miami, which was (probably still is) a function of Archbishop Veron Ashe Ministries and at which he was or is Presiding Overseer and Pastor. TCOM has a decidedly Protestant ("Praise and Worship", "Praise the Lord") evangelical tenor to it, reminiscent of the Archbishop's Charismatic/Pentecostal faith affiliation before he "went East" (as someone said, he began life as a RC - our loss - right).
But, if one is traveling coast-to-coast, one should have a waystation between origin and destination, as the Pony Express riders did. If nothing else, it provides a place to change one's clothes from the Eastern garb one wears on the West coast to the Western garb one wears on the East coast. And, lo and behold, there was just such a spot in beautiful Denver, CO, where one could stop in at St Isaac's Christian Church, the Cathedral seat of the Convergence Church and visit with the Divine Nature Network a/k/a The Imago Dei Global Communities and join a "pack" (let me assure you that's not a Malabarese or Malankarese term meaning "congregation").
While in Denver, one used to be able to pick up audio or video tapes of His Grace or the piece de resistance, for a mere $150.00:
I apologize for not providing links to all of the above 'churches' and ministries. I used to have but I'm not sure that they are all still live and I'm too lazy at the moment to check them all out. (After all, it's tough to keep your websites up while moving your lazy-boy throne from garage to rec room, ... umm, I mean from cathedral to cathedral.)
But, Veron does give one hope for one's own advancement in hierarchical ranks, I myself am thinking of becoming a patriarch or at least an eparch - maybe a mitred archpriest, at least ...
Many years,
Neil
When Mar Enoch/Veron wasn't busy shepherding the Mar Thoma Orthodox Church Archdiocese and celebrating the Holy Qurbana in Fresno, he could be found on the East Coast where, as Archbishop Veron Ashe, he was busy shepherding The Church of Miami, which was (probably still is) a function of Archbishop Veron Ashe Ministries and at which he was or is Presiding Overseer and Pastor. TCOM has a decidedly Protestant ("Praise and Worship", "Praise the Lord") evangelical tenor to it, reminiscent of the Archbishop's Charismatic/Pentecostal faith affiliation before he "went East" (as someone said, he began life as a RC - our loss - right).
But, if one is traveling coast-to-coast, one should have a waystation between origin and destination, as the Pony Express riders did. If nothing else, it provides a place to change one's clothes from the Eastern garb one wears on the West coast to the Western garb one wears on the East coast. And, lo and behold, there was just such a spot in beautiful Denver, CO, where one could stop in at St Isaac's Christian Church, the Cathedral seat of the Convergence Church and visit with the Divine Nature Network a/k/a The Imago Dei Global Communities and join a "pack" (let me assure you that's not a Malabarese or Malankarese term meaning "congregation").
While in Denver, one used to be able to pick up audio or video tapes of His Grace or the piece de resistance, for a mere $150.00:
All in all, the Archbishop has always been a busy man, a regular on the evangelical circuit, and apparently hierarch of a few non-denominational churches as well, such as Deliverance Central in Springfield, MA.
I apologize for not providing links to all of the above 'churches' and ministries. I used to have but I'm not sure that they are all still live and I'm too lazy at the moment to check them all out. (After all, it's tough to keep your websites up while moving your lazy-boy throne from garage to rec room, ... umm, I mean from cathedral to cathedral.)
But, Veron does give one hope for one's own advancement in hierarchical ranks, I myself am thinking of becoming a patriarch or at least an eparch - maybe a mitred archpriest, at least ...
Many years,
Neil
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You are very well-versed in your 'Ashe-ology'. I never knew that the Church of Miami (TCOM) was ever started. I heard several start dates by Ashe himself but I don't know if they ever materialized. I believe it was supposed to happen in 2005. HOwever, in that same year, he became ill with something called Mega Toxic Colon and would later discover that his assistant had embezzeled a large sum of money from him. From there, it was downhill resulting in homelessness, eating from a soup kitchen and a stint in jail - his words, not mine.
Concerning St. Issaacs, I was there! However, things went awry after a while. Ashe was supposed to ordain Paul Schell to Bishop but for some reason it never happened so Paul Schell found another consecrator. Last I checked, he was Archbishop of COCA (Christian Orthodox Church of America?). Church has gone undergone a name change. Too much to try to keep up with...
Not sure what's going on with Ashe nowadays. I believe he's still battling colon cancer. In terms of where he is geographically, I don't know. I was told he had left California and was in Florida. I don't know. Interestingly enough, a young man who had been in touch with me enlisting messages from my Ashe catalog was desperately trying to reach him. Jose Ojeda. He was successful in reaching his idol, I mean, Ashe and has now seemingly started a ministry in Mesa, AZ called 'On The Way Ministries.' Google them!
Whew, that's a lot!
Concerning St. Issaacs, I was there! However, things went awry after a while. Ashe was supposed to ordain Paul Schell to Bishop but for some reason it never happened so Paul Schell found another consecrator. Last I checked, he was Archbishop of COCA (Christian Orthodox Church of America?). Church has gone undergone a name change. Too much to try to keep up with...
Not sure what's going on with Ashe nowadays. I believe he's still battling colon cancer. In terms of where he is geographically, I don't know. I was told he had left California and was in Florida. I don't know. Interestingly enough, a young man who had been in touch with me enlisting messages from my Ashe catalog was desperately trying to reach him. Jose Ojeda. He was successful in reaching his idol, I mean, Ashe and has now seemingly started a ministry in Mesa, AZ called 'On The Way Ministries.' Google them!
Whew, that's a lot!
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OuterWater
Formerly InnerPhyre
I'm kind of lost. This guy claims to be Orthodox? As in Eastern Orthodox? He's a jester from what I can see. Style over substance, and the style doesn't have much to brag about either.
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I would never lie and pretend to know the ins and outs of Bishop Ashe. I can only share what I have experienced. In short, in 1995, Ashe visited a church in New York called Zoe Ministries (Bishop E. Bernard Jordan). Bishop Jordan had been ordained Bishop in the Pilgrim Assemblies (Bishop Roy E. Brown) but for some reason he broke away. Shortly after this separation, Ashe showed up at Zoe. He and Bishop Jordan hit it off and before long Prophet Ashe was ordained Bishop Ashe by Bishop Jordan.
The next thing we (the congregation) knew was there was a change going on. Suddenly the leaders of the church are reading books called 'The Way of the Pilgrim and The Orthodox Church.' I questioned one of the Elders as to what was going on. He told me that Bishop Jordan was considered 'a Bishop on the lose' since he no longer had any ties wih anyone. So now allegedly Ashe told him how they could connect with the Orthodox Church.
So Ashe started to prepare Bishop Jordan; teaching him how things are done in the liturgical church etc. Bishop Jordan had no liturgical roots so he had to do a lot of reading and studying to 'get in'.
Bishop Jordan was ordained and given the name Mar Elijah and Bishop Ashe would assume the name of Mar Enoch. For some reason, Ashe would become Archbishop.
That's the story that I witnessed. I was there for a great deal of it (except for the actual ordinations.)
The next thing we (the congregation) knew was there was a change going on. Suddenly the leaders of the church are reading books called 'The Way of the Pilgrim and The Orthodox Church.' I questioned one of the Elders as to what was going on. He told me that Bishop Jordan was considered 'a Bishop on the lose' since he no longer had any ties wih anyone. So now allegedly Ashe told him how they could connect with the Orthodox Church.
So Ashe started to prepare Bishop Jordan; teaching him how things are done in the liturgical church etc. Bishop Jordan had no liturgical roots so he had to do a lot of reading and studying to 'get in'.
Bishop Jordan was ordained and given the name Mar Elijah and Bishop Ashe would assume the name of Mar Enoch. For some reason, Ashe would become Archbishop.
That's the story that I witnessed. I was there for a great deal of it (except for the actual ordinations.)
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Irish Melkite
Melkite Greek-Catholic
Not Ashe in particular, but I'm a long-time observer of the 'independent Catholic' and 'independent Orthodox' movements, as the episcopi vagante of this day and age like to term themselves.
Yes, he did. In fact, he reputedly was ordained by His Holiness Archbishop Joseph Vredenburgh, ThD, DD, a/k/a Maran Mar Timotheous Josephus Narsai, Catholicos Patriarch - the same 'hierarch' who 'ordained' Ashe to the episcopate.
Last I was aware, about 2 years ago now, Schell was still calling it COCA, although he had resurrected the 'Convergence Church' styling. Haven't heard much about him of late. This article was the last thing I picked up on him, I believe.
These days, for $300, he'll mentor you in phone prophecy Verone Ashe. He also spoke this past spring at something called the Beit-Midrash Messianic Prophetic Congregation's 2011 Passover Summit in Dallas and generally keeps himself occupied on the circuit, appearing anywhere and everywhere - but most commonly in the pentecostal arenas. I haven't seen any signs of him delving into 'Orthodoxy' of late, but it doesn't mean it's not happening.
is on-line, but there isn't a lot about it and it's hard to tell if he's actually got an active, current, ministry going there. As long as he's not out there touting himself as an Eastern Christian hierarch, I'm not too concerned - but, still, one never sees anything about him where that chapter of his ministry isn't touted - so, the risk remains that the uncatechized will be attracted.
Many years,
Neil
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I am familiar with the church in Texas (Irving). The church is called Prayer Fast International Ministries under the leadership of Prophet Dominique Josue. I do believe she is supposed to be Jewish. The leader came out of the Potters House (T.D. Jakes). I read somewhere that Ashe was supposed to be the Dean of their seminary/school (whatever they call it). I don't know if that actually happened.
At one point, Ashe was very popular with the mainstream pentecostals. But once things took a nasty turn in 2005, those who were once 'fans', if you will, now have more access to him as many of his old friends have dissipated.
Jose Ojeda (On the way ministries) comes out of a pentecostal church in Arizona. From what I can gather, he is having meetings in his home but is definitely on the Ashe bandwagon. He connected himself to me a few years ago as he was desperately trying to get in touch with Ashe. He was able to do that as Ashe spoke at his 'possibly-former' church in 2010. I can't remember the name of the church but at that time, Ojeda had not branched out on his own. On The Way is actually a title of a message Ashe preached if that tells you anything about Ojeda. He's a fan and will seemingly do whatever he needs to do to stay in the good graces and company of Ashe.
At one point, Ashe was very popular with the mainstream pentecostals. But once things took a nasty turn in 2005, those who were once 'fans', if you will, now have more access to him as many of his old friends have dissipated.
Jose Ojeda (On the way ministries) comes out of a pentecostal church in Arizona. From what I can gather, he is having meetings in his home but is definitely on the Ashe bandwagon. He connected himself to me a few years ago as he was desperately trying to get in touch with Ashe. He was able to do that as Ashe spoke at his 'possibly-former' church in 2010. I can't remember the name of the church but at that time, Ojeda had not branched out on his own. On The Way is actually a title of a message Ashe preached if that tells you anything about Ojeda. He's a fan and will seemingly do whatever he needs to do to stay in the good graces and company of Ashe.
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Checked out the veroneashe website. I don't know if that's him but I'm not sure. There was a phone number listed (South Florida area) so I called. The voice message was by someone named Prophet Noel. I don't know if who he is or if he's afiliated with Ashe in anyway.
There is an article on the Christian Post website under the iPost heading posted by me. It is entitled 'Denver Prophets Faces 20 Years Imprisonment.' The prophet, Vickie Dilliard Crowe, was once apart of Paul Schell's church and was closely with Ashe at one point. Sorry, I'm a newbie so I can't post links...
There is an article on the Christian Post website under the iPost heading posted by me. It is entitled 'Denver Prophets Faces 20 Years Imprisonment.' The prophet, Vickie Dilliard Crowe, was once apart of Paul Schell's church and was closely with Ashe at one point. Sorry, I'm a newbie so I can't post links...
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Jesus4Madrid
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I enjoy modern praise and worship music. But that all pales compared to these videos.
I think the Cherubic Hymn is one of the most "charismatic" songs I have ever heard.
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I was reading the thread on Bishop Ashe and saw that some of you had some of his messages. Can I trouble you for copies? I am doing a thesis on The Union of Pentecostalism and Orthodoxy, How the Charismatic Renewal Revival has crossed into the East and West Churches.
Bishop Ashes messages will help to rationale what doctrines of the East are accepted in the pentecostal circuits. Please let me know what I can do to get those messages if you still have them.
Bishop Ashes messages will help to rationale what doctrines of the East are accepted in the pentecostal circuits. Please let me know what I can do to get those messages if you still have them.
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jckstraw72
Doin' that whole Orthodox thing
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MrFerguson, if youre going to do a paper on Orthodoxy and Pentecostalism then I urge you to look into Fr. Seraphim Rose's book Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future, which includes his critique of Pentecostalism and its minor influence among some Orthodox. Here is the book Saint Herman Press and here is an article by Fr. Seraphim you can read online Charismatic Revival As a Sign of the Times. His work is excellent.
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jckstraw72
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here are 2 more essential articles for the subject The Charismatic Movement and Orthodoxy and On Glossologia: Ch. 18 from The Truth of Our Faith
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I have a few DVDs and CDs by Bishop Ashe. You can find them at 1220-media.com. Most the messages listed there are messages Bishop Ashe preached in pentecostal circles and does not necessarily speak of orthodoxy. I do have some older cassette messages where he preached at his church in Fresno but they have not been converted to CD as yet...
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