Bio-Ethicists give thumbs-up to infanticide

Henaynei

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Ethicists give thumbs-up to infanticide
| 25 Feb 2012 |
If abortion, why not infanticide? This leading question is often treated as a canard by supporters of abortion. However, it is seriously argued by two Italian utilitarians and published online in the prestigious Journal of Medical Ethics this week.

Alberto Giubilini and Francesca Minerva are associated respectively with Monash University, in Melbourne, Australia, and with the Centre for Applied Philosophy and Public Ethics, at the University of Melbourne.

They argue that both the fetus and the new-born infant are only potential persons without any interests. Therefore the interests of the persons involved with them are paramount until some indefinite time after birth. To emphasise the continuity between the two acts, they term it "after-birth abortion" rather than infanticide.
these guys are in earnest. Numerous companion articles can be found on the net.
 
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ChavaK

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- these guys are in earnest. Numerous companion articles can be found on the net.
Very disturbing. If they can murder infants, why not people who are older and don't fit into their ideal of what the perfect person should be?
 
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Gxg (G²)

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It's the legacy of Eugenics and "survival of the fittest"...as many of the same people arguing such about fetuses have now said that rape isn't a bad thing but a surival tatic
 
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pat34lee

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They are more honest than (but just as evil as) most people who advocate abortion rights. Instead of playing legal games of "Is a fetus a person", or "when does a person become a person", they don't care. Their argument is that it isn't wrong to kill the helpless if they are a burden to you. And there is a direct tie to forced euthanasia for those no longer able to work so that they aren't a 'drain' on society.
 
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Gxg (G²)

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For anyone interested, I'd highly suggest for people to look up the history of Planned Parenthood. For one will see rather quickly just how much Eugenics has ALWAYS Been in view for decades---and many are not aware of it.

Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Breakthrough

For anyone interested, the following is a documentary that came out a couple of years ago--in connection with what the people at Bound4Life ministries in their work of addressing the history of how our nation got to where it is today. Very informative and good resource material, in light of the sermon series on what abortion is about...and how to go about dealing with it.

--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 1/13)" ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B2YG7vtwXA&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 2/13)" ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUASluJJFvI&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 3/13) " ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuthEinnxmw&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 4/13) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8NwG-HuwQM )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 5/13)" ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nq5tS5i_KqQ&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 6/13) " ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jACmuz5kWdE&feature=related )_
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 7/13)" ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpvgZjyRnbA&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 8/13) " ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0ed0_S-fU0 )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 9/13) " ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMyFXff12eg&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 10/13)" ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-o9BvpkA43Y&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 11/13) " ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrhdzN6gJ1Y&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 12/13) "( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-Q0C77-NY4&feature=related )
--"Abortion: Black Genocide in 21st Century America (Part 13/13) " ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOzQFSGH1K4&feature=related )​




Can't place up the entire series, as it's rather extensive (13parts)--but one can always go online to check out the rest of it.
 
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etZion

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- these guys are in earnest. Numerous companion articles can be found on the net.

Isaiah 5:20
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

It is sad to see how the world can call evil good, or at least frame it in a way that sounds like it is a great thing, they always propose it by saying it will "better human life and better the planet", or "So many people have children they can't afford, this is better for the parent and the child", nonsense.
 
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Henaynei

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This is a response off the quoted article website. I would title this: "for any who say this will never happen.."
Sorry folks but for the Spina Bifida community this is old news. The most serious instance of disability discrimination appears under the Groningen Protocol developed in the Netherlands to regulate and justify hastening the death of newborns with severe impairments. Doctors are directed to discriminate their counseling based on a babies disability. Parents are counselled that their babies' impairments will result in a life not worth living and that they should die. This is often not evidence based but the result of implicit stereotyping about the lives of people with disabilities. This practice is has resulted in the death of more than 20 Dutch babies born with Spina Bifida. The Groningen Protocol has been accepted as a standard of practice by the Dutch Paediatrics Association. But it is not only Dutch children with Spina Bifida who are at risk for dying through application of the Protocol but many others, including premature babies, infants with Down Syndrome and other infants born with significant problems.

The Protocol holds that it is medically and legally proper to withhold, withdraw treatment or medically terminate the life of a baby, when two out of the following seven conditions are met
ofunctional disability,
opain, discomfort,
opoor prognosis, and hopelessness,
olack of self-sufficiency,
oinability to communicate,
ohospital dependency and
olong life expectancy (with a disability)

The Protocol is applied to
obabies with no chance of survival.
obabies that have a very poor prognosis and are dependent on intensive care.
obabies with a hopeless prognosis who experience what parents and medical experts deem to be unbearable suffering. For example, a child with the most serious form of Spina Bifida who is judged, even after many operations to have an extremely poor quality of life. A baby like my son.

The Protocol states that people with severe disabilities have a poor quality of life - often so poor that others are entitled to decide that they should die. A statement like '...a child with the most serious form of Spina Bifida will have an extremely poor quality of life....' which assigns to all persons in a group an attribute that may be true of some members is a stereotype and reflects a discriminatory attitude towards people with disabilities. Active life-ending measures are only recommended because of disability. Parents of a 'normal' baby that may need temporary help to breathe would be counselled to approve ventilation, but the parents of a baby with a severe disability would not.

There is no universal consensus on the definition of what constitutes quality of life, particularly for children. Adults with Spina Bifida report that although they suffer from pain and discomfort related to their condition, they do not experience unbearable and hopeless suffering. In a study of Spina Bifida patients cited by the Health Council of the Netherlands, there was a large discrepancy between the negative medical prognosis made during the patients' infancy and the degree of disability described by their parents after a four to eighteen year period in 50% of all cases. Quality of life is assessed by persons who are living with a disability or who are intimately involved in the life of a person with a disability. One study concluded that Spina Bifida is not a very important determinant of life satisfaction. Parents play a key role in protecting their children's rights and their best interests remain the province of parents or when they fail, to the courts. Health professionals have a duty to avoid discrimination and maximize the life possibilities of any child with a disability. It is not appropriate to give health professionals the power to decide that a disability is so severe that the 'best interests' of the child is to die.

Practices, like the Groningen Protocol, that counsel parents that it is best for babies to die because they have severe disabilities is in direct contravention of the standards required under the UNCRPD , and violates international human rights conventions that set the standards for legal and humane medical treatment recommendations for all people. The International Federation for Spina Bifida and Hydrocephalus (IF) fiercely opposes the Groningen Protocol.

So it would seem that we have ethicists and doctors on the same side but if there is any outrage to be displayed it should be directed at the fact that we only get outraged when this is suggested that this is an acceptable course of action for an otherwise 'normal' baby (whatever normal is) but the same level of outrage is not displayed when it happens to a baby born with disabilities.

So why do I care ? If my little boy had been born in the Netherlands - he would have been a target.
 
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yedida

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Right here in the USA, as late as the 60's babies born with obvious mental retardations, downs syndrom, etc. were rolled into closets or rooms away from the other infants and left to starve to death. Are we back there again?
Take a look at my grandbaby (in one of my albums). Born with severe problems, little hope. But she blessed us with the 20 days that she was with us, but just too sick to win the battle. I hurt and I still grieve, and those days were extremely stressful, but I wouldn't trade those days for anything!
 
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