Biblical weaning age?

[NaturalFamiLEA]

Does anyone know what the Biblical weaning age was? The Bible mentions Isaac weaning, and Samuel, and I wondered if there was any way to tell what the age was.

(I wasn't sure where to post this :o )

Thanks in advance

 

[plum]

i wonder if it says anything in traditional Jewish resources...hmm

WEANING

The term "weaning" designates the period during which the mother begins giving the baby other foods in addition to breast milk and finally ceases nursing altogether. The normal age for weaning was set by some sages as twenty-four months, (Kettubot 60, Responsa Noda BeYehuda 142:20), however, others maintained that the infant was ready for solid foods at fifteen months.(Responsa Iggerot Moshe 2:6) As such long periods of nursing are not practiced in modern times, (since it is considered dangerous for the baby to go without solid foods for so long, a fact confirmed by Rabbi Feinstein, z"l), it is the practice for mothers to follow the advice given by the talmudic sage Samuel: the baby should nurse as long as he wants to. (Kettubot 60) If the child becomes ill at any point after weaning, it is the mother's responsibility to continue nursing it. This will help relieve the baby's illness.(Kettubot 60)
In biblical times, it was the custom to make a joyous feast on the occasion of weaning the child to give thanks to the Almighty that the child had survived the most perilous stage of infancy..This is learned from the feast prepared by Abraham on the occasion of his son's weaning. (Genesis 21:8) In talmudic times, it was the custom to celebrate the child's weaning any time from eighteen months to five years. (According to the school of Hillel, the child is weaned at eighteen months; according to Rabbi Eliezer, the child may nurse up to twenty-four months; according to Rabbi Joshua, a child should be allowed to nurse up to the age of five! (Kettubot 60)
Accordingly, we note that Samuel was weaned at the age of three, after which he was admitted into the services of the Temple.(I Samuel 1:24)

http://www.jewishagency.org/JewishA...n/Jewish+Time/Jewish+Sources/child/week+7.htm

 

[Wags]

It would be hard to guess, based on the limited info we have. Currently the average world wide weaning age is 4 years old. In many cultures children aren't weaned until 5-6 years of age - of course those are cultures where child led weaning is the norm and society supports it.

Unfotunately the US has one of the worst track records for breastfeeding. It always amazes me how many US women claim they "can't" breastfeed. Guess we are a defective lot - cause most everyone else seems to be able to do so just fine.

Okay - I'll get off my soap box now....

 

[Mela'h]

As a mother who believes in child led weaning I say a hearty Amen Wags.....Now, where is Jan with her input?

 

[NaturalFamiLEA]

Eirene - that was informative, thanks!

Wags - oh, I heartily agree! Ariana is 2 years, 8 months and still nurses (99.9% of the time it's to nurse to sleep). I just wanted some kind of back-up from the Bible that it was okay to nurse at least until 3 DH thought nursing until 2 was long enough...and although he hasn't dis-allowed it (how could he?) he has mentioned it a time or two...and I know when she's 3 it will be mentioned again. I was hoping to point out that, say, 5 was the norm

 

[Mela'h]

I have friends that nursed until their children were 5 or 6. Personally, I would not feel comfortable doing it that long but it really is such a personal relationship between you and your child that it is truly something that no one else but you can put a limit on. I always said that I would nurse my children until either they wanted to quit or I felt uncomfortable with it. Let me tell you, I had some pretty awful comments made to me and some hate filled looks, but I stuck to my guns......Looking back, nursing my children was one of the best things that I have ever done or will ever do for them.

 

[Wags]

I weaned my daughter at 19 months - becuase her brother was due the next month and I didn't want to tandem nurse. But then she got sick while we were in Jamaica so I started nursing her again at 22 months and she didn't wean the second time unitl about 26 months. So I ended up tandem nursing afterall, and it wasn't so bad. She still sometimes asks - but then just laughs and runs off to play. I intend to nurse my son for as long as he wants.

The World Health Organization recommends nursing until at least 2 years of age and beyond if both parties are agreeable.

 

[witherandbloom]

I believe the Bible shows evidence of child-led weaning. Hannah waited on the time for the child to wean- she didn't seem to say "I'll wean him at exactly 2 years of age. Eli, he will be there when he's two." On the other hand, I'm not so certain that the bible shows any evidence of women breastfeeding children.. I don't know.

I've been nursing since June 28, 2003! I nursed my firstborn for 14 mos: he self-weaned three months before ds2 was born. My second son (still br-feeding) will be 2 in January. We're all quite happy to be nursing through the cold and cough season.

 

[Wags]

II'm not so certain that the bible shows any evidence of women breastfeeding children.. I don't know.

Some scritpure about breast feeding:

1Kngs 3:21 - When I awoke in the morning to feed my child from my breast, there it was, dead. But when I took a closer look later in the morning, why, it wasn't my son at all - not the one I gave birth to!"

Ps 8:2 - From the mouths of babies and infants at the breast you established strength because of your foes, in order that you might silence the enemy and the avenger.

Isa 28:9 -Can no one be taught anything? Can no one understand the message? Must one teach barely weaned toddlers, babies just taken from the breast,

Isa 49:15 - Can a woman forget her child at the breast, not show pity on the child from her womb? Even if these were to forget, I would not forget you.

Isa 66:11 - so that you nurse and are satisfied by her comforting breast, drinking deeply and delighting in the overflow of her glory.

Joe 2:16 - Gather the people; consecrate the congregation; assemble the leaders; gather the children, even infants sucking at the breast; let the bridegroom leave his room and the bride the bridal chamber.

Lu 21:23 - What a terrible time it will be for pregnant women and nursing mothers! For there will be great distress in the Land and judgment on the people.

 

[witherandbloom]

wow!! that's crazy! thank you!

 

[jgonz]

The WHO (World Health Organization) reports that the world-wide weaning age is 4 years old, like Wags said.

In the US, it's an Appalling 6 months old! And in my area (El Paso, TX) it's a horrific 6 weeks old.

I was taught that Samuel was at least 4 when he weaned and went to the Temple... my source could have been wrong though. But I would think that in Biblical times, when formula wasn't around , that the mother would nurse until the baby weaned him/herself. Pregnancy and nursing was Such a revered thing~ proving to everyone else G-d's blessings on the mother.

The average age my kids weaned was around 2... with my youngest not weaning until she was 3.5.

 

[Mela'h]

Hi Jan 6 weeks, that's awful I have found that a lot of women are not prepared beforehand on how painful breastfeeding can be and how it doesn't come so naturally, it is something that both you and your baby need to learn to do well. It is sad that so many women give up so early.

When ever I see a woman breastfeeding her child, I always make it a point to look at her in the eyes and smile at her and if I feel that it is right, I say something encouraging.

I was blessed in that when I had my babies, I lived in a community that was predominately hippie, so it was expected to nurse your children for years and to be comfortable doing it anywhere.

 

[Athaliamum]

I would just like to say beware not to look down on or think any less of women who doesn't breast feed. You don't know why they don't. While it is best to breast feed, and while it's horrible that some women chose not to out of selfish reasons, some women's bodies simply don't do what they were designed to do.

 

[Wags]

The percentage of women that truely "can't" is less than 5% and some studies say it is less than 1% of the population. Which is why I wonder about North Americans - we have a horrible rate of breast feeding and I think it is because breasts are sexualized here so much and breastfeeding is discouraged. There is a pediatrian in this town who has actually told people that she thinks it is just gross to nurse a baby beyond 3 months of age.

When my doctor moved I asked him about the doctor my family as being assigned to - was he supportive of extended breast feeding etc. He actually closed the door and then whispered "no, he isn't he will try to convince you to switch to formula" And then he gave me a few names of doctors that I could try to get switched to that while not necessarily pro breast feeding were at least tolerant. Our current doctor is one of those - but I'm working heartily to educate him and the fact that Ari is such a BIG healthy baby has gone a long way to changing his mind.

 

[Tea]

Thankyou ladies, this has been very interesting. I agree that breast feeding is the way to go, but I have also learnt that sometimes not everything goes to plan, no matter what you do.
With my eighth child due in 5 weeks, I am very much looking forward to feeding again, as I personally see this as G-d gift to us, for giving birth. Unfortunately mine seem to self ween around the 9-12 month period, but I am very grateful for the time that I do get.
Thanks Wags, for the scritpures.
Tracey

 

[jgonz]

6 weeks, that's awful

Yah, it is. Makes being a La Leche League Leader quite the Job. Part of it around here is the Mexican influence... formula feeding is considered a status thing. It's "in" to be like Americans (although about 20 yrs behind).

Breastfeeding should never be painful (sore sometimes, ok, but not painful).... If it is, then there is a latch problem, thrush, or something not right going on. Breastfeeding is natural, but it's a Learned Skill... and since we typically don't have our mothers, aunts, cousins, etc. breastfeeding in front of us all the time, we have to learn that skill from moms who know. (That's part of the reason I love LLL~ all the moms are So incredibly supportive of each other.)

Wags is right~ the percentage of women who medically "can't" breastfeed is Very Very low. If women back in Bible times used the excuses I hear on a weekly basis, generations of humans would have died. lol

 

[Wags]

I am one of those that had a very painful experience - three different lactation consultants described my daugther as a "baricuda." Never could get her to latch properly. But knowing it was the best thing for her, I persisted inspite of the difficulty..

Fortuantely my son wasn't quite as bad, and my doctor prescribe APNO for me at the first sign of cracking/bleeding this time. That stuff is a gift from G-d! Took away the pain and healed things up quickly!!

Tracey - hope all goes well with your impending birth. Friends of ours with a large family has a rule that mom shouldn't get our of her robe for at least 2 weeks after giving birth and should be waited on hand and foot during that time. They offered to loan us the brass bell that she uses to summon help when I gave birth last year. If you don't have one, perhaps someone in your family can get you a bell for chanukah.

 

[Mela'h]

I too had a very painful time with nursing my son. And the pain from letdown was bad enough that I would grab the edge of the couch until it subsided. That pain went away after my milk was established.

Thankfully, with my daughter, I was an old pro and hardly had any problems But she was such a dainty eater, my son on the other hand!

Baricuda - great description Wags!

Blessings to you Jan as a La Leche League leader. I went to meetings for support when my son was 2. I was getting a lot of comments from people about how I was harming him by nursing him that long. La Leche was really a great support for me then.

 

[LadyGarnetRose]

There is are two other groups of mothers who cannot breastfeed.

Those that adopt. My mother was the best mom I could have had, and she never could breastfeed me because she had no natural children.

5% is the average that cannot breastfeed due to a physical problem with their anatomy. There are far more who after giving birth are medicated for many different reasons to breastfeed would be horribily irresponsible.

I can't even give birth, so breastfeeding would be completely out of the picture if I ever become a mother.

 

[Wags]

Actually some adopitve women can breast feed, and even some men can. But it does take a a lot of effort and determination.