Biblical Truth: Christ Jesus is not God.

Status
Not open for further replies.

Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old.
Site Supporter
Aug 21, 2003
28,578
6,064
EST
✟993,185.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
KJV KJV+ Darby Webster YLT Num 23:17 What hath the LORD spoken?

Num 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent
Num 23:19 God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. (ESV)

So your opinion is that God told Balaam to say to Balak, "Rise up, Balak, and hear; hearken unto me, thou son of Zippor:?" God's words do not begin until vs. 20!
Num 23:17-20
(17)
And when he came to him, behold, he stood by his burnt offering, and the princes of Moab with him. And Balak said unto him, What hath the LORD spoken?
(18) And he took up his parable, and said, Rise up, Balak, and hear; hearken unto me, thou son of Zippor:
(19) God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?
(20) Behold, I have received commandment to bless: and he hath blessed; and I cannot reverse it.​
 
Upvote 0

Godchaser_70

Married happily to my nupreacher
Nov 21, 2010
552
115
Oklahoma
✟16,676.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Yes, especially study this verse:
"God is not a man, that He should lie, Nor a son of man, that He should repent."
Num 23:19 NASB
there you go again hun, that scripture is a metaphor, does not mean when he was on earth that he was a man. he had to be to go through what we did. the sickness the pain and more. he did that for us so that when he died on the cross. he payed for our sins, he did not have to do that. he loved us enough to do that.
a man would lie, man or woman. does not mean just a man, means either. he will never lie,
he is the same yesterday,today and forever more.
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
So your opinion is that God told Balaam to say to Balak, "Rise up, Balak, and hear; hearken unto me, thou son of Zippor:?" God's words do not begin until vs. 20!
Num 23:17-20
(17)
And when he came to him, behold, he stood by his burnt offering, and the princes of Moab with him. And Balak said unto him, What hath the LORD spoken?
(18) And he took up his parable, and said, Rise up, Balak, and hear; hearken unto me, thou son of Zippor:
(19) God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?
(20) Behold, I have received commandment to bless: and he hath blessed; and I cannot reverse it.​
Why did you leave out verse 16?
Num 23:16 And the LORD met Balaam, and put a word in his mouth, and said, Go again unto Balak, and say thus.
 
Upvote 0

nChrist

AKA: Tom - Saved By Grace Through Faith
Site Supporter
Mar 21, 2003
21,118
17,842
Oklahoma, USA
✟902,160.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Isaiah 25:1-3 KJV O LORD, thou art my God; I will exalt thee, I will praise thy name; for thou hast done wonderful things; thy counsels of old are faithfulness and truth. 2 For thou hast made of a city an heap; of a defenced city a ruin: a palace of strangers to be no city; it shall never be built. 3 Therefore shall the strong people glorify thee, the city of the terrible nations shall fear thee.

Isaiah 25:1-3 AMP O LORD, You are my God; I will exalt You, I will praise Your name, for You have done wonderful things, even purposes planned of old [and fulfilled] in faithfulness and truth. 2 For You have made a city a heap, a fortified city a ruin, a palace of aliens without a city [is no more a city]; it will never be rebuilt. 3 Therefore [many] a strong people will glorify You, [many] a city of terrible and ruthless nations will [reverently] fear You.


***************

Isaiah 40:2-5 KJV Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the LORD'S hand double for all her sins. 3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God. 4 Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low: and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough places plain: 5 And the glory of the LORD shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

Isaiah 40:2-5 AMP Speak tenderly to the heart of Jerusalem, and cry to her that her time of service and her warfare are ended, that [her punishment is accepted and] her iniquity is pardoned, that she has received [punishment] from the Lord's hand double for all her sins. 3 A voice of one who cries: Prepare in the wilderness the way of the Lord [clear away the obstacles]; make straight and smooth in the desert a highway for our God! [Mark 1:3.] 4 Every valley shall be lifted and filled up, and every mountain and hill shall be made low; and the crooked and uneven shall be made straight and level, and the rough places a plain. 5 And the glory (majesty and splendor) of the Lord shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together; for the mouth of the Lord has spoken it. [Luke 3:5, 6.]
 
Upvote 0

cubinity

jesus is; the rest is commentary.
Jun 11, 2010
3,171
403
✟20,090.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Private
there was a time that I did not personally know that God, today is a different story, but I asked you what constituted observation, not do you have a personal experience with the living God. If you explain to me what you think qualifies as observable, maybe we can identify what you see that I don't, or what I see that you don't...but if you would rather just pretend I don't care what others think, rather than communicating with me when I ask questions, then I guess we will never know what is and is not standing in the way of our understanding one another.

Oh, and one more thing, don't confuse my having answers with my not listening or trying to understand your point of view. Scripture tells us to be ready to give an answer, I take that command seriously, and because I do, I have answers when others don't. It doesn't mean I know it all, or that I don't want to learn all I can, but rather it means that I take seriously the command to be ready to give an answer. I appreciate this, but I also wish to explain a bit before you decide to put me on ignore. In the past, I have been warned for accepting an apology, for warning another poster that the comments made were out of line and some other hard to believe things. In fact, I was warned once because I said that I believe God has more to say to us than simply "yes, no or wait"...yep, I was warned for saying He has more to say than yes, no or wait. Hard to believe I know. For this reason, I never know what will offend another poster to the point of reporting me and me being warned. This sometimes sets me on edge because I do not wish to offend anyone nor do I wish to compromise the truth of scripture out of fear of being reported and warned. That being said, I am more sensitive at the moment and probably if I was wise, would take a short break, but that too would drive me crazy. You see, a few months ago our son suddenly died, yesterday, we buried and aunt, so I am on hyper alert right now and not wise enough to take a break. they concern me because (and I know this sounds odd) I love them. As I love you, which is why I am interested in learning all I can from you and others here. I know that some don't think I am going about it the right way, that is their issue, not mine. When I write, I am not only honest, but in the minds of many, authoritative, this is only because I am prepared to give answer to what I believe and nothing more, reading more into it, is to remove the context of what I am saying and reinventing it into something else. thanks, I am content, in pain, grieving, confused by so many comments here and how people are reading my posts, but content none the less. Cautious of storms, tired of pain, wishing people could read what I write for what it says, but content, for I know whom I believe in and why I believe and that is great contentment.

Razzelflabben,

Thank you, from the bottom of my heart, for sharing what you are going through. We sometimes forget, while arguing over this stuff, that the people we are speaking with are also still living life, with all of its ups and downs.

The bare truth that infuriates most Christians I talk to is that I simply don't believe what we believe about Jesus being God or not being God (entirely separate from all of the ramifications and assumptions people add to it) is simply a semantic nuance. I don't think belief on that one issue matters at all, but the ripple effects of our beliefs surrounding that Christology certainly do.

Let me try to explain. I love and depend on Jesus Christ alone for my salvation. Without him, I am never going to see my heavenly Father. He is Lord of God's Kingdom, authoritative over the entire universe as I understand it. He was pre-existent with his Father, and was responsible for the creation of all things. Jesus has no quality that is in contrast with the will of his Father. He eternally exists with his Father, and he shares his Father's glory. In all of these ways, and more that I can't think of at the moment, I am in complete agreement with the Trinity doctrine. So, for the most part, and unless I mention it, Trinitarians and I totally agree about who and what Jesus is.

The big issue for me is that some would condemn others over what they believe about this issue. Some Trinitarians have mentioned that those who do not believe Jesus is God will not go to heaven. Likewise, some non-Trinitarians, including that JW I met in that mall so many years ago, have claimed that those who believe Jesus is God will not go to heaven. This frustrates me enough to want to fight this perspective wherever I encounter it.

I haven't encountered this judgmental attitude from you, and I have been thankful for that. However, there are many on this forum promoting such an agenda, and I feel a loving responsibility to those who might be easily manipulated into buying into this lie. I feel like someone needs to say no, this is not (though it is certainly closely related to) a condemnable issue. Someone needs to speak up to say that neither judgmental position is the right one. Jesus loves us and is interested in saving our souls even when our theological perspective isn't accurate (and inaccuracy does consistently exist no matter what side of that fence we sit on).

It has been great getting to know you, and I wish you the very best God has in store for you and your family. I'm sorry to hear that your family is experiencing so much turmoil at this time, and you all will be in my prayers. I look forward to seeing you around on CF!

God bless, Cubinity
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Isaiah 25:1-3 KJV O LORD, thou art my God; I will exalt thee, I will praise thy name; for thou hast done wonderful things; thy counsels of old are faithfulness and truth. 2 For thou hast made of a city an heap; of a defenced city a ruin: a palace of strangers to be no city; it shall never be built. 3 Therefore shall the strong people glorify thee, the city of the terrible nations shall fear thee.

Isaiah 25:1-3 AMP O LORD, You are my God; I will exalt You, I will praise Your name, for You have done wonderful things, even purposes planned of old [and fulfilled] in faithfulness and truth. 2 For You have made a city a heap, a fortified city a ruin, a palace of aliens without a city [is no more a city]; it will never be rebuilt. 3 Therefore [many] a strong people will glorify You, [many] a city of terrible and ruthless nations will [reverently] fear You.


***************

Isaiah 40:2-5 KJV Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the LORD'S hand double for all her sins. 3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God. 4 Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low: and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough places plain: 5 And the glory of the LORD shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

Isaiah 40:2-5 AMP Speak tenderly to the heart of Jerusalem, and cry to her that her time of service and her warfare are ended, that [her punishment is accepted and] her iniquity is pardoned, that she has received [punishment] from the Lord's hand double for all her sins. 3 A voice of one who cries: Prepare in the wilderness the way of the Lord [clear away the obstacles]; make straight and smooth in the desert a highway for our God! [Mark 1:3.] 4 Every valley shall be lifted and filled up, and every mountain and hill shall be made low; and the crooked and uneven shall be made straight and level, and the rough places a plain. 5 And the glory (majesty and splendor) of the Lord shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together; for the mouth of the Lord has spoken it. [Luke 3:5, 6.]
Opps!
Isa 40:18 To whom then will ye liken God? or what likeness will ye compare unto him?
 
Upvote 0

patience7

Regular Member
Oct 11, 2010
1,149
135
Louisiana
✟9,906.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
First, let me say thank you for responding and I see your heart in answering.

go back to the OT, you'll find a host of your questions answered there, but the short version is this....the consequence for sin is death/blood. Therefore in order for our sins to be "blotted" out, blood was needed. In the OT this blood was in the form of animal sacrifice, but that was a temporary fix. In the NT, Jesus came and because Jesus was deity in flesh form, His blood was a covering that would last. It was a once for all (so to speak, don't get that twisted into something new and different) sacrifice that would satisfy the "curse"/consequence of our sin.

I fully understand that Jesus Christ as the Son of God was the propitiation for our sins.

to encourage Him, comfort Him, strengthen Him...remember, He was also flesh, with the same fleshly limitations and desires we have. Think of it this way...why do we need the HS when we are tempted? To comfort us, guide us, strengthen us, encourage us so that we can remain without sin. If Jesus was flesh, He would need the same thing.

OK - God is omnipotent - all powerful, possessing complete, unlimited or universal power. Its unfathomable to me why He would need any help from anyone - even in human form - it would be rational to think that He was still God. Or when God is in another form He looses His omnipotent power?

He prayed to the FAther part of God. Remember, 3 forms of the same God. Why would you pray to God but ask the HS to comfort or heal you? Because as 3 forms, each has a different purpose.

yep, goes back to being flesh as well as deity. maybe not if He was only God, but remember, He was both God and flesh. When we remove the flesh part of Jesus from the equasion, it all falls apart, just as it does when we remove the God part of Jesus from the equasion. It is only when both ideas are firmly in place that it upholds the arguments. Now, truth withstands the storms, of argument, which brings us back to one more way to know if we got it right or wrong, because if we got it wrong, problems occur, when we get it right, the arguments all fall in the face of that truth.

I do see God as Holy Spirit because the word of God tells us this. I believe that the word of God is our standard of truth. But it doesn't tell us that God is Jesus. There are less verses that could be construed to say that than those that are clear cut and say the Jesus is the Son of God.

amen, and yet scripture tells us we can only understand by the HS revelation in our lives. So it is impossible for man to understand without the HS speaking to Him, which is exactly why I don't try to convince anyone of anything, only try to fathom what people don't understand and why they don't get it.

I can see why this topic just goes round and round! On both sides, we both believe and standfast in what we believe. :)

 
Upvote 0

Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old.
Site Supporter
Aug 21, 2003
28,578
6,064
EST
✟993,185.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Why did you leave out verse 16?

Num 23:16 And the LORD met Balaam, and put a word in his mouth, and said, Go again unto Balak, and say thus.

Why did YOU omit vss. 16, 18, and 20 from the post I responded to? Verse 16 does NOT address my question or comment. So your opinion is that God told Balaam to say to Balak, "Rise up, Balak, and hear; hearken unto me, thou son of Zippor:?" God's words do not begin until vs. 20! Balaam is speaking his own words in vss. 18 and 19. He identifies what God spoke to him in vs. 20, "Behold, I have received commandment to bless: and he hath blessed; and I cannot reverse it."
 
Upvote 0

razzelflabben

Contributor
Nov 8, 2003
25,814
2,508
63
Ohio
✟122,293.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Razzelflabben,

Thank you, from the bottom of my heart, for sharing what you are going through. We sometimes forget, while arguing over this stuff, that the people we are speaking with are also still living life, with all of its ups and downs.

The bare truth that infuriates most Christians I talk to is that I simply don't believe what we believe about Jesus being God or not being God (entirely separate from all of the ramifications and assumptions people add to it) is simply a semantic nuance. I don't think belief on that one issue matters at all, but the ripple effects of our beliefs surrounding that Christology certainly do.
what "infuriates" me is that people claim one thing, then live as if they believe something totally different. In fact, your honesty in what you believe, is one reason I enjoy talking with you. Some time ago, I had a man tell me that no one lived what they believe more than I do. I'm not so sure about that, I fail often times to trust God, live in His grace, etc. But I do know I try, just like the command to be prepared to give an answer. Anyway, I think that if more people lived as if they believed what they were saying, the world would be a totally different place, this applies to trinity as well as every other part of our lives.
Let me try to explain. I love and depend on Jesus Christ alone for my salvation. Without him, I am never going to see my heavenly Father. He is Lord of God's Kingdom, authoritative over the entire universe as I understand it. He was pre-existent with his Father, and was responsible for the creation of all things. Jesus has no quality that is in contrast with the will of his Father. He eternally exists with his Father, and he shares his Father's glory. In all of these ways, and more that I can't think of at the moment, I am in complete agreement with the Trinity doctrine. So, for the most part, and unless I mention it, Trinitarians and I totally agree about who and what Jesus is.

The big issue for me is that some would condemn others over what they believe about this issue. Some Trinitarians have mentioned that those who do not believe Jesus is God will not go to heaven. Likewise, some non-Trinitarians, including that JW I met in that mall so many years ago, have claimed that those who believe Jesus is God will not go to heaven. This frustrates me enough to want to fight this perspective wherever I encounter it.
first let me ask you a question...have I issued such judgment? I don't recall doing so, in fact, I recall talking about how I honestly believe I was saved before I even knew there was a Jesus. But that is off topic, so I'll stop there and make a comment.

To the best of my recollection, the only passage that deals with this topic is the one that talks about being overcomers. now one could argue that overcoming includes death, and I'm not sure that is totally wrong, but I personally see overcoming the world more as the things that we deal with on a daily basis. For example, having joy in the midst of grief, love for our enemy, peace in the midst of storm.....let me also say that when I say such things I am referring to scriptural identification of these words, not the worlds. As in, joy is not happiness, they are two different things, love is not a feel good emotionalism, and peace is not a nothingness. Just wanted to clarify that for everyone before it is taken out of context and misrepresented and this thread is taken off track because of it.
I haven't encountered this judgmental attitude from you, and I have been thankful for that. However, there are many on this forum promoting such an agenda, and I feel a loving responsibility to those who might be easily manipulated into buying into this lie. I feel like someone needs to say no, this is not (though it is certainly closely related to) a condemnable issue. Someone needs to speak up to say that neither judgmental position is the right one. Jesus loves us and is interested in saving our souls even when our theological perspective isn't accurate (and inaccuracy does consistently exist no matter what side of that fence we sit on).
maybe we need to start a thread that deals only with the biblical reason it is necessary to believe trinity. Might be interesting to study and discuss. we all might learn something important and valuable.
It has been great getting to know you, and I wish you the very best God has in store for you and your family. I'm sorry to hear that your family is experiencing so much turmoil at this time, and you all will be in my prayers. I look forward to seeing you around on CF!

God bless, Cubinity
thanks, I am and have enjoyed our discussion and your honest approach to things.

Edit: so I just started a thread asking the very question...according to scripture why is belief in the trinity important to our salvation or act of being saved. If you would like to voice your opinion, or just watch the discussion, here is the link http://www.christianforums.com/t7516433/#post56197927
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Why did YOU omit vss. 16, 18, and 20 from the post I responded to? Verse 16 does NOT address my question or comment. So your opinion is that God told Balaam to say to Balak, "Rise up, Balak, and hear; hearken unto me, thou son of Zippor:?" God's words do not begin until vs. 20! Balaam is speaking his own words in vss. 18 and 19. He identifies what God spoke to him in vs. 20, "Behold, I have received commandment to bless: and he hath blessed; and I cannot reverse it."
Gill and Henry do not agree:

Gill's Exposition of the Entire BibleAnd the Lord met Balaam, and put a word in his mouth,.... As he did before, Numbers 23:5.
and said, go again unto Balak, and say thus; the words which are expressed in Numbers 23:18.

When Balaam returned Balak was impatient to know what message he had: "What hath the Lord spoken? Are there any better tidings yet, any hopes of speeding?" This should be our enquiry when we come to hear the word of God. See Jer. 23:35.

v. 17), Balaam now addresses himself particularly to him (v. 18): Rise up, Balak, and hear.It was a message from God that he had to deliver, and it is required of Balak, though a king, that he attend (hear and hearken, with a close application of mind, let not a word slip), and also that he attend with reverence: Rise up, and hear. His successor Eglon, when he was to receive a message from God, rose out of his seat, Jdg. 3:20. Matthew Henry's Whole Bible Commentary
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old.
Site Supporter
Aug 21, 2003
28,578
6,064
EST
✟993,185.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Gill and Henry do not agree:

Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible And the Lord met Balaam, and put a word in his mouth,.... As he did before, Numbers 23:5.
and said, go again unto Balak, and say thus; the words which are expressed in Numbers 23:18.

By careful and deliberate manipulation of the text you try to make Num 23:18 say something it does not say. Num 23:5 is the first time Balaam appeals to the Lord. 23:16 is the second time. The words I am discussing are the words in vss. 16-20, the second time Balaam appeals to the Lord.
Gill - Num 23:18 - And he took up his parable,.... Pronounced the word put into his mouth:

and said, rise up Balak, and hear; not from his seat, as Eglon a successor of his did, Jdg_3:20 for he was now standing by his burnt offering; but the sense is, that he would raise his attention, and stir up himself with all diligence to hear what he was about to say:

hearken unto me, thou son of Zippor; or to his word, as the Targums of Onkelos and Jonathan, which follow.​
Since you cited Gill as an authority, let us read the Targums of Onkelos and Jonathan. Note neither translations says "God is not a man."
Tgm PsJon Arise, Balak, and hear; listen to my words, Bar Zippor. The Word of the living God is not as the words of men for the Lord, the Ruler of all worlds, is the unchangeable (but) man speaketh and denieth. Neither are His works like the works of the children of flesh, who consult, and then repent them of what they had decreed. But when the Lord of all worlds hath said, I will multiply this people as the stars of the heavens, and will give them to possess the land of the Kenaanites, is He not able to perform what He hath spoken? and what He hath said, can He not confirm it?

Tgm Onkelos And the Word from before the Lord met Bileam, and put a word in his mouth, and said, Return to Balak, and thus speak. And he came to him, and he was standing by his burnt offering, and the nobles of Moab with him. And Balak said to him, What hath the Lord spoken? And he took up his parable, and said:
Arise, Balak, and hear, Listen to my words, Bar Zippor: The word of Eloha is not as the words of men; The sons of men speak, but lie; Nor is it as the works of the children of flesh, Who decree to do, but repent, and change their counsels. What He hath said He will perform, And His every word is steadfast. Behold, I have received benedictions to bless Israel, And I may not turn my blessing from him.​
 
Upvote 0

nChrist

AKA: Tom - Saved By Grace Through Faith
Site Supporter
Mar 21, 2003
21,118
17,842
Oklahoma, USA
✟902,160.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Isaiah 40:2-5 KJV Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the LORD'S hand double for all her sins. 3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God. 4 Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low: and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough places plain: 5 And the glory of the LORD shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

Isaiah 40:2-5 AMP Speak tenderly to the heart of Jerusalem, and cry to her that her time of service and her warfare are ended, that [her punishment is accepted and] her iniquity is pardoned, that she has received [punishment] from the Lord's hand double for all her sins. 3 A voice of one who cries: Prepare in the wilderness the way of the Lord [clear away the obstacles]; make straight and smooth in the desert a highway for our God! [Mark 1:3.] 4 Every valley shall be lifted and filled up, and every mountain and hill shall be made low; and the crooked and uneven shall be made straight and level, and the rough places a plain. 5 And the glory (majesty and splendor) of the Lord shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together; for the mouth of the Lord has spoken it. [Luke 3:5, 6.]

***************

Isaiah 40:9-11 KJV O Zion, that bringest good tidings, get thee up into the high mountain; O Jerusalem, that bringest good tidings, lift up thy voice with strength; lift it up, be not afraid; say unto the cities of Judah, Behold your God! 10 Behold, the Lord GOD will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him. 11 He shall feed his flock like a shepherd: he shall gather the lambs with his arm, and carry them in his bosom, and shall gently lead those that are with young.

Isaiah 40:9-11 AMP O you who bring good tidings to Zion, get up to the high mountain. O you who bring good tidings to Jerusalem, lift up your voice with strength, lift it up, be not afraid; say to the cities of Judah, Behold your God! [Acts 10:36; Rom. 10:15.] 10 Behold, the Lord God will come with might, and His arm will rule for Him. Behold, His reward is with Him, and His recompense before Him. [Rev. 22:7, 12.] 11 He will feed His flock like a shepherd: He will gather the lambs in His arm, He will carry them in His bosom and will gently lead those that have their young.
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
By careful and deliberate manipulation of the text you try to make Num 23:18 say something it does not say. Num 23:5 is the first time Balaam appeals to the Lord. 23:16 is the second time. The words I am discussing are the words in vss. 16-20, the second time Balaam appeals to the Lord.
Gill - Num 23:18 - And he took up his parable,.... Pronounced the word put into his mouth:

and said, rise up Balak, and hear; not from his seat, as Eglon a successor of his did, Jdg_3:20 for he was now standing by his burnt offering; but the sense is, that he would raise his attention, and stir up himself with all diligence to hear what he was about to say:

hearken unto me, thou son of Zippor; or to his word,​
Sorry, but Gill and Henry do not agree:

Gill's Exposition of the Entire BibleAnd the Lord met Balaam, and put a word in his mouth,.... As he did before, Numbers 23:5.
and said, go again unto Balak, and say thus; the words which are expressed in Numbers 23:18.

When Balaam returned Balak was impatient to know what message he had: "What hath the Lord spoken? Are there any better tidings yet, any hopes of speeding?" This should be our enquiry when we come to hear the word of God. See Jer. 23:35.

v. 17), Balaam now addresses himself particularly to him (v. 18): Rise up, Balak, and hear.It was a message from God that he had to deliver, and it is required of Balak, though a king, that he attend (hear and hearken, with a close application of mind, let not a word slip), and also that he attend with reverence: Rise up, and hear. His successor Eglon, when he was to receive a message from God, rose out of his seat, Jdg. 3:20. Matthew Henry's Whole Bible Commentary
 
Upvote 0

Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old.
Site Supporter
Aug 21, 2003
28,578
6,064
EST
✟993,185.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Sorry, but Gill and Henry do not agree:[ . . . ]

Sorry but ignoring my posts and repeating the same post over and over and over cannot turn a blatantly false misrepresentation of the sources into the truth. I addressed this copy/paste the first time! I am not the only member here who is aware that you do NOT discuss anything, you ignore responses, copy/paste your answers and use irrelevant colors.

The only reason I am responding is to make other members aware of your non-responsive, repetitive answers.
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Sorry but ignoring my posts and repeating the same post over and over and over cannot turn a blatantly false misrepresentation of the sources into the truth. I addressed this copy/paste the first time! I am not the only member here who is aware that you do NOT discuss anything, you ignore responses, copy/paste your answers and use irrelevant colors.

The only reason I am responding is to make other members aware of your non-responsive, repetitive answers.
Ignatius does not share your biased opinion!

Epistle of Ignatius to the Tarsians: And that He Himself is not God over all, and the Father, but His Son, He [shows when He] says, "I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God."[18]
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old.
Site Supporter
Aug 21, 2003
28,578
6,064
EST
✟993,185.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Ignatius does not share your biased opinion!

Epistle of Ignatius to the Tarsians: And that He Himself is not God over all, and the Father, but His Son, He [shows when He] says, "I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God."
[18]

Ignatius does NOT share your biased opinions! The so-called epistle to the Tarsians is spurious. Ignatius did NOT write it! Would you care to address the two Targums I posted? You can say this or that guy disagrees with me until your keyboard falls apart and it will not change the Jewish translations which show that God did NOT say "God is not a man!"
 
Upvote 0

nChrist

AKA: Tom - Saved By Grace Through Faith
Site Supporter
Mar 21, 2003
21,118
17,842
Oklahoma, USA
✟902,160.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Isaiah 43:11-15 KJV I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. 12 I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God. 13 Yea, before the day was I am he; and there is none that can deliver out of my hand: I will work, and who shall let it? 14 Thus saith the LORD, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships. 15 I am the LORD, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.


Isaiah 43:11-15 AMP I, even I, am the Lord, and besides Me there is no Savior. 12 I have declared [the future] and have saved [the nation in times of danger], and I have shown [that I am God]--when there was no strange and alien god among you; therefore you are My witnesses, says the Lord, that I am God. 13 Yes, from the time of the first existence of day and from this day forth I am He; and there is no one who can deliver out of My hand. I will work, and who can hinder or reverse it? 14 Thus says the Lord, your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: For your sake I have sent [one] to Babylon, and I will bring down all of them as fugitives, [with] all their nobles, even the Chaldeans, into the ships over which they rejoiced. 15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the Creator of Israel, your King.

***************

Isaiah 44:6 KJV Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

Isaiah 44:6 AMP Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: I am the First and I am the Last; besides Me there is no God. [Rev. 1:17; 2:8; 22:13.]
 
Upvote 0

Hentenza

I will fear no evil for You are with me
Mar 27, 2007
34,437
3,872
On the bus to Heaven
✟60,078.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
My conclusion was in the beginning of my post.

John 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

Do you believe that Jesus is perfect?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

patience7

Regular Member
Oct 11, 2010
1,149
135
Louisiana
✟9,906.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Do you believe that Jesus is perfect?


Yes, I believe Jesus Christ was perfect. He had to be perfect in order to be the "sacrificial lamb without spot or blemish" in order to take away our sins. But just as Adam had a choice to obey God but failed, Jesus also had a choice and he chose to always do his Father's will.
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.