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Biblical Headship and Submission

Discussion in 'Singles (Only*)' started by LaBèlla, Feb 6, 2019.

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  1. LaBèlla

    LaBèlla Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I would like to open a discussion on biblical headship and submission. This is not a debate. I am interested in hearing your point of view. There are no right or wrong answers. It's an opportunity for you to share your perspective and hear from other men and women. I will weigh in as well.

    The two question I'd like to focus on are:

    Q: What does biblical headship and submission mean to you?
    Q: What do you struggle with regarding headship or submission?

    I look forward to your comments. :)
     
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  2. David Neos

    David Neos Catechumen

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    It's a mutual submission based on respect and love.
     
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  3. LaBèlla

    LaBèlla Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Q: What does biblical headship and submission mean to you?

    I believe God's divine order finds its beauty in headship and submission. I'm reminded of the garden and His workmanship in creating each. I desire to exemplify those principles in my marriage through my willing submission to his leadership with respect and admiration.

    verse: I am my beloved’s and my beloved is mine.

    My perspective isn't wholly the result of the biblical mandate but also hails from a heartfelt adoration for his holiness and my own. Embodying the oneness He articulates requires a joyful lessening, much like Christ exhibited when washing His disciples feet. Its correlation may include acts we would deem unappealing or beneath us. But they're the hallmarks of servitude and surrender that find their fullness in our union.

    verse: She does Him good, and not harm, all the days of her life.

    In the course of its performance I am reminded of one passage, "Thy will be done." Whether they be domestic pursuits or performing a day's work instead. I am immersed with continued opportunities for His will to be made manifest. The ardor of its reverberation surrounds me and it is well with my soul.

    quote: His Will; my fate. ~Bella

    I delight in our position as the crown upon his head. It is indicative of royalty and commands a deportment which coincides with that role. Whether he professes the same or sees himself in that vain is no excuse to forsake opportunities for regard. We may be the lone source of positive reinforcement which benefits his psyche and self-esteem. His betterment is our reward. For we are bettered and so is the bond.

    verse: As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another.

    It is impossible to coalesce when the singular is in sight. To excel at oneness requires a shift in perspective. Our individual gains serve the whole. 'We' is a constancy that I recognize and respect. Much like we see exhibited in the relationship of the Godhead. This is possible through continued prayer and yielding.

    verse: Man is the head and woman is the crown upon it.

    I draw inspiration from Sarah, who called Abraham her Lord and Master. She was not oblivious to his imperfections and nor he of hers. But she respected the man and the station and did not allow his mistakes to move her from that position. If we desire holiness and sanctification in our marriage we must be willing to adhere to the tenets we've received. Obedience is better than sacrifice and that is the path I've chosen.

    quote: The greater your belief in Him; the deeper the kneel. ~Bella

    I wrote this mantra years ago. The words still hold true today.

    I endeavor to bear His reflection with the dignity and grace He deserves. May my words and countenance be an authentic reminder of all he holds sacrosanct and desires to possess.

    ~Bella
     
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  4. blackribbon

    blackribbon Not a newbie

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    I believe that once you are married, we are called to be a team with the husband taking the place of head of the family. However, the head is allowed to delegate decision making power and is not called to micromanage every aspect of the family. The wife may be given a budget to run the home and how she spends it is her individual decision. A child may be given the domain of his/her room as long as activity in that room falls under the household/family rules.

    I believe that submission is not something demanded, it something chosen to give. At times both parties will choose to submit to the other. The choice to submit is actually choosing to trust God and letting go of the power and allowing ones mate to make the decision...good or bad. And we don't get to determine whether or not it was good or bad, we just trust God to take care of us.

    I also think the choice of submitting is harder for women, which is probably why God put men as the head. It is a lesson for men, in learning how to stand up and put the good of the family over a person desire ... or a fear of confrontation. It is easy for a man to take orders from a woman, his life started by him being submissive to his mother..and he was under her leadership for years. It is a lesson for women, to learn to let go of the power and to learn how to trust God. Women like to be in power. It is hard to let go ... to a man or even God. A Christian marriage calls each party to become a better version of themselves and learning to partner together with each other and God.

    I married my husband because I believed in the man he was. However, reality was, it was a long hard lesson to learn how to trust God enough to let him find out how to be the man I knew he was. At work, he had to submit to his leadership. At his home, he was still expect to please his mother, even as a grown man. He married me because he admired how capable I was (not only reason). It was easier to void conflict when we didn't agree...and he either just did what he wanted or gave up and let me win. My job was to learn to step back and learn how to be leader and support him, even when he didn't make the decisions I would of made. As he got more comfortable in making the decisions and know that I'd support him, he become a more confident man...and in turn, I respected him even more. As I learned to let go and trust him and God, my level of internal peace increased and I was happier as a mom and wife.

    I was the delegated "head" in many areas that were important to me...either I cared more or he knew I was the one more prepared for these jobs.

    As a widow, I am missing his headship in the areas that definitely are not my strong suit and I am having to trust God will carry me through my mistakes and my bad decisions. He knows my weaknesses and my limitations.
     
  5. LaBèlla

    LaBèlla Well-Known Member Supporter

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    There are no feminists in my family. It is an apostasy to us. I was reared in a world that no longer exists.
     
  6. blackribbon

    blackribbon Not a newbie

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    You do not believe that a woman and man are made equal in the eyes of God? That is the real definition of feminism. Modern feminism ... well, that is another story and appears to want to put women over men.

    But where does it fit in your OP of headship and submission? Just that the woman is never the head?...not in any situation...or what?
     
  7. Sketcher

    Sketcher Born Imperishable

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    Our example of headship is to be found in Christ. Christ, in his Earthly ministry, did everything he told us to do, he led by example. A leadership principle known to the Romans was that a centurion needed to be more ready to do what he was telling his men to do than he was to tell them to do it. I believe that principle is at work in Christ's example. One such example is in taking on the humble task of washing his disciples' feet. He saw humility was lacking among the disciples, and he did something about it (Luke 22:24-27, John 13:2-17). Philippians 2:1-8 gives us the overall ethic from which we operate in either headship or submission:

    So if there is any encouragement in Christ, any comfort from love, any participation in the Spirit, any affection and sympathy,
    complete my joy by being of the same mind, having the same love, being in full accord and of one mind. Do nothing from rivalry or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves. Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others. Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.​

    This is a core principle from which all Christians, married or single, adult, or child, need to operate from. It is not optional for the Christian. In the male role in marriage, that humility manifests as servant leadership. In the female role in marriage, it manifests as submission.
     
  8. Miles

    Miles Away From Nowhere

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    The way I see it, it's about striving for harmony as a couple. About teamwork, rather than trying to boss each other around.

    I think it's possible to be egalitarian and for the man as the head of the household in the Christian sense.

    Apparently, this is one of those things where you either get it or you don't. People hear those words and understandably jump to all kinds of conclusions.
     
  9. LaBèlla

    LaBèlla Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I have no issue with God's institution. But please don't attempt to educate me on feminism. I am well versed in the subject and do not adhere to its tenets. I am not a feminist and don't befriend them. I prefer the company of women with a gentle and quiet spirit and it has served me well. If others choose differently, that's fine.

    Is Jesus the head of the Father? Is the Holy Spirit at the helm?

    I have little need to take the reins. I engage with gentlemen who are well prepared for that position. I do not consider a man I cannot follow. Ever.

    Years ago, my mentor told me something I never forgot. I will share it here.

    A woman meets a man
    He tells her who he is
    She believes in him
    And thus he becomes

    I don't elevate a falsity. I will never have someone who lacks the capacity to lead. I won't laud him or put him in a position he's incapable of assuming. I don't adhere to a guise of leadership. I choose men with vision. And because I am adept at leadership and vision. I know what that looks like.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2019
  10. blackribbon

    blackribbon Not a newbie

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    I was not trying to "educate" you on feminism. I was trying to get your definition of it. Like "racism", I believe the definition of it has become distorted and it means different things to different people. It has lost its real meaning. I suspect that we have similar view on what a Godly woman but I consider the Prov 31 woman to be the ultimate model of a feminist. She is smart and capable and that equality is what brings her husband and children honor. The sweetest gentlest servant Christian women I know I believe to be true feminists. I don't agree with the "Christians" who place the woman below the man in value. I have been told by many "Christian" men that I should submit to men in general. However, since my husband left me in God's timing with small children, I believe that God put me as head of my little family. I was put with a stranger to serve my family communion at a "family church" where only men of the households served communion to their own families. I have been left out of activities where the father parent was to attend suggesting that my son be represented by a grandfather or uncle (none of which who were Christians at the time nor had authority over me or my children). The command to submit was to my husband...and I believe that in his absence that I should not submit to someone else that has no commitment to me. I am guided by prayer and the vision we both had for our kids. But I believe that God equipped me with the personality and the strength to be the head long before I knew I would be thrust into that role...including knowing when to be meek and when to be bold.

    The praise that I get from my children is that they say something about my presence alone calms down a room full of chaos...for everyone I meet. I'd give everything I have to get my husband back and to not be the leader of my family...but I do not believe that his death left my family without a head...or that I should abdicate my role as parent to my children and let someone else have that power.

    God, all three persons, is the ultimate Head. But no man is head over me anymore. And I do not believe that it is unChristian nor unwomanly in any way. And I do believe that God created women to be equals as men or else they would not make good helpmeets at all. We just have our separate roles in this world and unfortunately, some of us have to expand our role beyond the traditional one.

    My mission before my husband died was to be a Godly wife and a Godly mother. My husband wanted basically the same thing. A happy marriage and children to love. We had that. The rest didn't really matter. You may not believe that is a good mission, but it was and still is my primary mission in life. I don't have the husband anymore but he died in my arms loving me. I am still a mother and that will continue to be my primary mission.

    My husband was a strong quiet boy/man when I met him. He only needed to be loved and believed in to become a man and leader. He also needed a strong wife...to stand beside him. A weak woman could never have done what I did for our marriage.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2019
  11. LaBèlla

    LaBèlla Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I appreciate the explanation. I do not use the descriptor. It is leaven and the negative associations around the concept are plentiful. I was reared in an environment with men who walked with God who were secure in their manhood. I have no examples of feminism in the home or with my extended relations. I do not apply any of its concepts towards myself.

    I have never engaged with a gentleman who did not wish to raise me and care for me in every way imaginable. One of the reasons I am afforded that treatment is because of my upbringing, disposition, and his certainty that exploitation is not my aim. There are too many godly references that I can make rather than one put forth by society. When I articulate loveliness or other virtues we're on the same page. Why would I introduce something divisive? That's unwise.

    I have never seen her in that guise. She exemplifies discipline and industry in my mind. Each acrostic articulates someone who uses her time wisely through productivity and care for her loved ones. She isn't idle. That's why she accomplishes much. She is driven by love and service. Duty if you want to be exact.

    Perhaps it's a reflection of my makeup or experience in finance, but there's rarely more than one person at the helm. Each person contributes to the success of the mission but the leader bears the responsibility for its accomplishment. My reference is the garden. God went to Adam. He bore the brunt of what occurred because rulership was assigned to him, not Eve.

    God created man and woman in His image, but much like there are functions within the trinity the same holds true in marriage. I don't need the title. I don't need to see my name on the door. What I require is someone yielded to the Lord who is willing to follow Him. That's where it begins and it's my responsibility to exercise discernment in my choice.

    There is nothing wrong with a man leading a woman who is yielded to God. Nothing. Feminism has done much to obliterate the beauty of God's design. Their toxicity and intention of diminishing his manhood and rendering him a neutered spectacle are evident. If I regarded him in any way, I could never align myself with a philosophy or bear its label in his presence. It is an affront for many, both Christian and secular and I won't add my name to the list.

    They are incorrect. You don't need to submit to all men. Those who hold that philosophy are errant in their understanding or male supremacists. Your obeisance is due to your spouse. You may offer a measure of consideration to men as warranted if you desire. But it's not a requirement.

    I am sorry for your loss. The Lord has entrusted you with an important role and I don't believe He'd do so if you were incapable. Your children are blessed to have a mother yielded to Him. It is my hope that your future companion will honor his responsibility with dignity and grace.

    I pray for my future spouse. I am uncertain of who he is or the challenges he's undergoing. But I know prayer works and I want to do my part. I was careful about dating when my daughter was younger and more so during her teens. It takes an incredible man to love another person's child. That isn't in the bible but it is a factor of the flesh I understand. What I hope most for you is that you encounter a man of that stature. They are one in a million but when you find him you've struck gold.

    There is no need to do so. It can create other issues that are best avoided. I don't believe in ladies behaving in this way without the proper channels in place. Exploitation is a possibility and I don't subscribe to being anyone's placeholder. If the gentleman desires a yielded woman he needs to pursue those aims. That's not your job.

    My disposition has its challenges. I didn't mention it in my original post but since we're conversing I'll say it here. I don't have a problem meeting men. They're drawn like magnets. However, I'm looking for character and fit and using God's barometer for each. Submission shouldn't be carelessly given and it should arise after the woman has discerned his leadership and character. The odor of lessening is appealing. It's one a man recognizes soon. Boundaries are a good way to protect yourself and avoid problems.

    I don't keep company with men. I'm happy to exchange discourse on occasion but that is not a right of access I grant with perpetuity. I limit my private dialogues to men who've expressed an interest in becoming better acquainted with the goal of companionship or those I'm dating. This alleviates a lot of headaches and prevents confusion.

    I am aware that isn't the case for many but it is usually my recommendation for those I've mentored. A woman's ladyship is precious and should not be partaken of by all. The privilege of her hand (and his) should be granted with discretion. As should her company. The freedom of access many provide coupled with emotive relating is errant. Her natural affinity for nurturing will fill a void that rarely leads to more.

    It is my consensus that when a gentleman desires a woman he'll make it clear. I have never encountered a man who didn't. Those who waver are on the fence or considering other options. It is unwise to tarry with them for long. I have assisted several women in securing permanent relationships. Much of this hinges on her willingness to say no and hold herself to a higher standard of engagement. Do not permit yourself to be moved from your position or place a man where he does not belong. When you meet the right person who warrants your submission you'll know it. He will draw it from you with his person. :)

    God has enabled me to achieve much. My capacity is part of my discernment. I require a companion who can complement what He's given without inciting competition or suppression. In spite of my proclivity for yielding I am not the right fit for most.

    While I recognize that positions of leadership are not available for all in the workplace, I think it's wise for a woman to select someone whose guidance is trusted. Whether that's on the job or through a charitable endeavor. It is better to consider someone whose faced challenges and weathered them with wisdom and self-control. Some are drawn to the notion of leadership which they errantly express as power. Persons of this stripe are best left alone and lifted up in prayer.

    Why would you think that? I have raised a child without support, overcome two illness, made my mark in finance, and returned home and started a business. She is my the best thing I've ever done. I am grooming her to follow suit and preparing her for marriage and motherhood. She is my legacy. Much of this is for her and my descendants. :)

    I believe that strength and weakness come in many guises. I will slay you in the boardroom and rest at my companion's feet at home. I am a lioness but that isn't required of me at all times. I prefer someone who provides a respite from that role. He is my sanctuary. I don't want to be the leader. I am a leader. I don't need the title. He's got it and that's okay.

    Oftentimes a woman relishes her strength because she's afraid to lower her blade. She's been fighting so long it's all she knows. The defenses have become a jailer and she can't let them down without struggle. But I have learned a better way.

    My Lord...Master...My King. He's all that and more. This is but a shadow of my yieldedness. If you allow the Lord to show you how to bend He will. I make no claims of strength. You'll rarely hear that from me. Humility is my bond. Surrender is my aim. When I am less I am more than I've been. He can be an instrument of God's will if you let him. :)

    ~Bella
     
  12. FreeinChrist

    FreeinChrist CF Advisory team Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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