Biblical Battered Wife Syndrome
- Thread starter motherprayer
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razzelflabben said:
This. Right here.
This is the problem we face in today's world. I am no clinical expert, but I have spent a lot of time observing the way our youth think and behave, and working towards figuring the underlying state of mind that accompanies their behavior.
What interests me most, and Ive only just begun to grasp this in a way that I can express, is the idea that being "the victim" in any given situation gives one license to behave the wrong way. This extends WAY beyond DV, however. In any marriage, there will be times when one partner is hurt, when one partner is wrong and the other is right. Sometimes this scenario is a long term one, and in those times, it is very easy to become bitter, resentful, and willing to turn away from the harder truths in God's Word about how to respond when we are being victimized. Jesus said to forgive someone who hurts us seven times seventy seven times, and we are told to pray for AND love those who persecute and use us.
At these moments the inevitable question is asked, But how do we do that? Does forgiving mean I have to trust them to hurt me again? The answer: We do that by prayer, and by putting on the whole armour of God to protect our hearts from being hurt again.
Back to prevention: This is a very difficult thing to accomplish, with regards to marriage, because the ways to offer prevention are uncomfortable, and many don't have the wisdom to process those Truths. Like these verses:
Mark 10:1-9 - Here Jesus says, well, yea, you have this loophole from Moses' day about divorce, but guess what? God only gave you that because your hearts werent in the right place. But this is what God REALLY thinks: What God therefore put together, let no man put asunder.
Then, accompanying this verse:
Matthew 19:9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
Some instruction in the Bible is a bit unclear. This, however, is not. He is explicit here, no parable. This is also a command that the world makes very easy to break. Divorce is easy, even easier is to not get married in the first place:
"Why worry about a piece of paper when God knows we love each other and are committed to each other?"
"She defrauded me, so I went to a lawyer and got a divorce. Now I am with the woman God intended for me."
"He calls me names. That is abusive behavior. Im divorcing him before it can go any further."
"We didnt get married in the church, so that means the marriage was never valid anyway."
The core belief system behind these statements is so deeply ingrained into our thinking that preachers often validate them, without looking to the Word, or guiding couples who are struggling towards the Cross, which is the only True place of healing for any marriage. They are so deeply ingrained that people who realize the wrongness of them generally remain silent in their belief because they dont want to offend anyone.
I am not condemning those who may be in any one of these situations. Im just saying what the Word says, and my goal is not to make anyone think that I feel I am better than anyone or anything like that.
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razzelflabben
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I seldom meet someone who understands why we still spend time with my family...it's about forgiveness and love, even though the offense has been repeated time and time and time again....it's about taking my eyes off self and putting them on Christ, that is, like you said, not seeing myself as the victim, but rather seeing myself as God's servant, sent by Him to share with those who don't understand, just how powerful God Love really is. Bravo...
amen lol...I am sure I will be in trouble, been expecting the call all day. Have a friend who is on the verge of divorce due to an affair...pastor/counselor told her to do what's right for her, I told her no, do what's right in God's eyes...I'm sure that won't go well...oh well...I am so excited by your ability and determination to put God above yourself...
The way I see it, every situation is unique, but Gods' truths are universal. Just my opinion I guess.
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I do understand. That is awesome that you are willing to continue the relationship with them! Many people don't understand that Biblical forgiveness is total, without constraint.razzelflabben said:
One thing I have learned in regards to forgiveness is that God knows my good works and deeds better than any person, and His is the only recognition that I should strive for. This is hard for me, because my flesh tells me I need affirmation from people to feel worth. That is part of the human condition, but still something we should try to have victory over.
Recently, I raised a good bit of money for my church, for a memorial of one of our members. Our First Lady expressed her surprise that I never spoke of it in church, and I told her that the honor God gave me in using me to accomplish that was enough. What is hard, however, is that the mother of the woman who passed away is very negative towards me, always has been. More than once, I've had the urge to "throw in her face" what I did to help. That is when God humbles me, and reminds me that it isn't what "I" did to help, but what He did THROUGH me. Her attitude frustrates me, but I have to let God deal with her on His time, and just ignore it for now. (P.S. I hate having to ignore it lol)
Kudos for telling her the right thing! Sometimes the Truth does hurt, and therefore doesn't go over well, but we have to plant the seed, and just pray for God to open their eyes to the Truth. This is where so many have trouble, however, in allowing the Spirit to lead when to speak the Truth, but then also remembering that whether that person follows the Truth of not is out of our hands. But there is peace in giving up that responsibility to make the change to God, because then we no longer feel burdened by that person's decisions, as we are aware that it is not our responsibility.
I really enjoy talking with you
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razzelflabben
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been battling that ourselves. Ours comes in the form of a paid position in the church. My husband applied for the position. There were 3 candidates they decided to look at. One is qualified by scripture but was interested only in the money. My husband is qualified by scripture, didn't care about the money, was already doing a large portion of the job, and is trained to do it...the third was someone that wasn't qualified according to scripture and was making a huge deal about how he needed the money. Well, long story made real short, the church sinned by hiring the only guy that was not even qualified according to scripture. Things are now going really, really bad, and he isn't even doing the job with half an effort. In fact, my husband and I are outpassing him in things he claims as work related and we are trying like anything to pull out completely so he can do the job, but the people won't let us, they keep calling us. So we sit here, doing the job he was hired to do, don't know where our next meal is coming from, so that he can be paid twice what we make, and work on his house all day rather than doing his job. Every bone in my body wants to take this guy on in a big way, but instead, we pray for humility and love and in that, wait patiently for God. (Oh, just for clarity, we don't want the job, in fact, God has moved us forward in our ministry and that job would no longer fit, so there is no secret agenda, our desire is the church repent and in that lighten our load)
bravoKudos for telling her the right thing! Sometimes the Truth does hurt, and therefore doesn't go over well, but we have to plant the seed, and just pray for God to open their eyes to the Truth. This is where so many have trouble, however, in allowing the Spirit to lead when to speak the Truth, but then also remembering that whether that person follows the Truth of not is out of our hands. But there is peace in giving up that responsibility to make the change to God, because then we no longer feel burdened by that person's decisions, as we are aware that it is not our responsibility.
I really enjoy talking with you
I have had a lot of struggle lately with why to continue to pray for certain people who continue to harden their hearts...but I have come to understand several things about prayer for others, 1. as united in Love, I have to change as well, 2. hard heart or not, they need eyes to see and ears to hear, which is God's specialty if we consider Jesus miracles were more than just the flesh, but also they were a testimony to the physical, and 3. there are people watching, listening, and they can be reached often times, even if the one we are focused on remains hardened. (there are others but those three seem especially appropriate here)....btw, our conversations are a highlight to my day...thanks for being such an awesome sister...
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This is no different from people reporting sexual abuse and it being dealt with internally by the church.
As in the case of "Marleen", confessions of abuse or anything illegal to a person in authority within a church should be immediately reported to the police. This is a requirement of counsellors, psychologists and others involved in jobs where past or future illegal actions may be confessed. It over rides the usually confidentiality and they are required to report it for the safety of parties involved. I don't see why this should be different for church leaders.
As in the case of "Marleen", confessions of abuse or anything illegal to a person in authority within a church should be immediately reported to the police. This is a requirement of counsellors, psychologists and others involved in jobs where past or future illegal actions may be confessed. It over rides the usually confidentiality and they are required to report it for the safety of parties involved. I don't see why this should be different for church leaders.
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razzelflabben
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I personally see this statement "Keeping Laws Of The Land Inline With God's Word" backwards from what you seem to be saying. To me, this statement is saying that the law of the land needs to match the law of the church, not the law of the church match the law of the land....let me see, another way to explain it...wouldn't it be better if the law of God was in fact, the same law as the law of the land, rather than trying to fit the law of God/church into the law of the land, the law of the land would fit into the church, thus, situations like abuse would be addressed with (OT stoning)...not suggesting stoning, but suggesting that in a true understanding of the scripture, abusers would not be protected by confidentiality or anything else.
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willlowbee
Life Is Hard! Hug me!
I think pastors who would send a woman home to an abusive husband while condemning any out afforded by divorce or separation, are antichrists and an example of someone who doesn't live in the real world but would rather a woman be victim to the one that is long dead for 2000 years.
What good does it do a woman to pray for the terrorist in her bed when she's still there to be his punching bag? Where is God's protection from that? With each and every blow?
I had a dear friend who married three years ago. We've known each other since kindergarten. This man was perfect while they were dating. We all like him and he was quite the charmer. Gentle, soft spoken, polite, gentlemanly. Opening the door for her when seating her in his car, or walking into one of our homes, or into restaurants. We'd see his nice side when we all got together. And she adored him.
They were engaged a little over a year after meeting. Married six months later.
On the honeymoon he dropped the facade. She was a virgin and quite shy when it came time to consummate the marriage. We'll say he was rather gifted in certain areas and she having never seen a man naked was a bit afraid. That former polite man he had pretended to be come to find out, disappeared in a flash. And he raped her on their honeymoon.
He raped her every time they slept together. That was the first and only sex she ever knew. He beat her in those places that wouldn't show, he pulled her hair so much and ripped out handfuls at times that she, desperate to at least free herself of one weapon against herself, cut her hair very short so he'd not have that long raven locks handle to grab hold of and snap her around the floor of the house like a human mop.
Which he did once when he determined the kitchen floor wasn't clean enough. He grabbed the bucket she'd just put on the deck to dry after housecleaning, filled it with soapy water and then threw her into the puddle and bent down holding her mane of hair in one hand while putting his enormous foot into the front of her hips so as to push her about while scooting his other foot along behind him to push off and propel her across the floor. All the kitchen furniture that was movable was already moved out of the way for her own housework there. So he had a clear open floor to work on. And he did mop that entire kitchen using her body to do it.
She never told a soul.
Until one day when my then girlfriend was able to convince her to get out of the house he rarely let her leave, and go to the gym for a work out and sauna.
We were all so in the dark. When we met him they were together in those dating days. And whenever we say her we say him too. After the marriage of course we didn't expect that to change but we also didn't think she'd never be out and about on her own.
When I'd call to go for coffee she'd always have an excuse that revolved around her getting something ready when he was coming home, or that they had plans together and she couldn't make it.
On that rare day to the gym with Tammy, our friend after a 4 month marriage in Hell, walked into the sauna with a towel wrapped around her and confided to my girlfriend the whole mess.
Opening her towel she revealed the mark of the Devil. That's the only thing to call it. That footprint across the bones of her hips was still there in yellow green half moon shapes. The toe of his work boot on the left hipbone, the heel near the small valley just before her right one.
The bruises on her breasts where he'd punch her in the chest. The kicks to her thighs. The belt marks on her back.
She wouldn't make a police report. She thought prayer would change things. She counseled with her pastor because her husband would let her go to church while he sat in the car in the parking lot and timed the service so that when it let out he was right there at the door waiting to smile, act polite, and walk her to their car. But one Sunday she got the pastors private phone number from him and called from her house while her husband was at work.
And they typical remarks came forth. It's against God's will for the family to divorce. You took a vow at the alter till death us do part. Which would be fast accomplished considering with each beating he had the potential to kill her.
All the wicked evil advice that boiled down to; stay, take it, pray it stops.
When my girlfriend told me about her injuries after returning from the gym and coming to my house in a panic I'd never seen before, I called my friend. He answered. I turned all polite and invited them to dinner. I figured I'd confront the issue and she'd be in a place where she could find sanctuary and he'd be able to be kicked the heck out of my house.
Wrapping this up now because no one should just take abuse from someone who is intending to kill them every single time they strike.
That night of the dinner all was going well. Very gently I eased the conversation to the abuse and my fear for my long time friend.
Of course the denial arose. While my friend turned quiet and sat perfectly still beside her abuser. He placed his arm around her shoulders and pulled her to his side a bit and kissed her hair and said he was certain I was misunderstanding their relationship.
No, not hardly. She was shaking like a leaf instantly when he did that and tears, though she had her eyes squeezed shut and her head bowed, were slowly falling into her lap.
I'd had enough when his hand strayed to the collar of her blouse as he was rubbing his hand back and forth while holding her close across the shoulders so that I could see the bruise on the top of her clavicle as the shirt slipped down a bit on the last pass of his hand.
I am bigger than he is. Taller, more in shape after bodybuilding for most of my adult life, and I've trained in kick boxing and MMA, thinking I'd make the circuit one day in long years since past. The perfect candidate to save my friend from a demon bully ahole.
I stood and told him he'd have to leave my house now. And then I reached as he stood up shocked at my change in tone, and moved back from their chairs, and placed my hand on her head to get her attention.
She opened her watery eyes and looked up at me and mouthed, please.
Just then I knew. She was never going home again with this violent garbage she'd married. I knew she'd pay for what I'd said about him and noted about their relationship.
My girlfriend had made her way to the phone ready to dial 911 should he decide to show his colors in front of us.
And just then, after my friend mouthed please, her tormenter said that she was his property and no one steals what's his. And then he came at me.
I let him swing a few times, backing up and telling him this was my house and he didn't want to do this. I wanted no doubt, as my gf was dialing 911, that I'd given him every opportunity to avoid the whipping he was about to receive.
When he looked at my girl and called her a very unkind word and ordered her to put the phone down, which was now on PA so the operator could hear the whole room, I hit him.
Suffice to say by the time our fight was over he was in ICU in hospital and my friend was in the arms of my girlfriend crying uncontrollably.
Her demon, because he stopped being a true husband the moment he first hit her, was arrested at the hospital for domestic battery and other charges related to his conduct at my house.
She divorced, got a restraining order, got her life together in a very short time with our help, moved to a different State with no mention of her change of address to the court so that the order dropped, and has lived happily for the last year free of her abuser. She found sanctuary and healing in a Unitarian Universalist church in her new city and her demon is currently serving 10 years in our State's prison.
Where I hear, thanks to prison guards I've found my way to making friends with, that he's not a very happy camper what with the lifer inmates taking particular exception to a wife beater. They're considered to be cowards and are just a couple of rungs up from child murderers and rapists and those who rape/and or/murder women or the elderly.
Paybacks a ... well, you know.
God did not create women to be punching bags. Anyone that thinks he did isn't Christian. They're demons from the pits of Hell. And their advice should be considered to have come from there as well when they say, TAKE IT! Because God expects you to.
Funny thing is, those type demons never find their way to the funeral where their victim took it for the very last time.
What good does it do a woman to pray for the terrorist in her bed when she's still there to be his punching bag? Where is God's protection from that? With each and every blow?
I had a dear friend who married three years ago. We've known each other since kindergarten. This man was perfect while they were dating. We all like him and he was quite the charmer. Gentle, soft spoken, polite, gentlemanly. Opening the door for her when seating her in his car, or walking into one of our homes, or into restaurants. We'd see his nice side when we all got together. And she adored him.
They were engaged a little over a year after meeting. Married six months later.
On the honeymoon he dropped the facade. She was a virgin and quite shy when it came time to consummate the marriage. We'll say he was rather gifted in certain areas and she having never seen a man naked was a bit afraid. That former polite man he had pretended to be come to find out, disappeared in a flash. And he raped her on their honeymoon.
He raped her every time they slept together. That was the first and only sex she ever knew. He beat her in those places that wouldn't show, he pulled her hair so much and ripped out handfuls at times that she, desperate to at least free herself of one weapon against herself, cut her hair very short so he'd not have that long raven locks handle to grab hold of and snap her around the floor of the house like a human mop.
Which he did once when he determined the kitchen floor wasn't clean enough. He grabbed the bucket she'd just put on the deck to dry after housecleaning, filled it with soapy water and then threw her into the puddle and bent down holding her mane of hair in one hand while putting his enormous foot into the front of her hips so as to push her about while scooting his other foot along behind him to push off and propel her across the floor. All the kitchen furniture that was movable was already moved out of the way for her own housework there. So he had a clear open floor to work on. And he did mop that entire kitchen using her body to do it.
She never told a soul.
Until one day when my then girlfriend was able to convince her to get out of the house he rarely let her leave, and go to the gym for a work out and sauna.
We were all so in the dark. When we met him they were together in those dating days. And whenever we say her we say him too. After the marriage of course we didn't expect that to change but we also didn't think she'd never be out and about on her own.
When I'd call to go for coffee she'd always have an excuse that revolved around her getting something ready when he was coming home, or that they had plans together and she couldn't make it.
On that rare day to the gym with Tammy, our friend after a 4 month marriage in Hell, walked into the sauna with a towel wrapped around her and confided to my girlfriend the whole mess.
Opening her towel she revealed the mark of the Devil. That's the only thing to call it. That footprint across the bones of her hips was still there in yellow green half moon shapes. The toe of his work boot on the left hipbone, the heel near the small valley just before her right one.
The bruises on her breasts where he'd punch her in the chest. The kicks to her thighs. The belt marks on her back.
She wouldn't make a police report. She thought prayer would change things. She counseled with her pastor because her husband would let her go to church while he sat in the car in the parking lot and timed the service so that when it let out he was right there at the door waiting to smile, act polite, and walk her to their car. But one Sunday she got the pastors private phone number from him and called from her house while her husband was at work.
And they typical remarks came forth. It's against God's will for the family to divorce. You took a vow at the alter till death us do part. Which would be fast accomplished considering with each beating he had the potential to kill her.
All the wicked evil advice that boiled down to; stay, take it, pray it stops.
When my girlfriend told me about her injuries after returning from the gym and coming to my house in a panic I'd never seen before, I called my friend. He answered. I turned all polite and invited them to dinner. I figured I'd confront the issue and she'd be in a place where she could find sanctuary and he'd be able to be kicked the heck out of my house.
Wrapping this up now because no one should just take abuse from someone who is intending to kill them every single time they strike.
That night of the dinner all was going well. Very gently I eased the conversation to the abuse and my fear for my long time friend.
Of course the denial arose. While my friend turned quiet and sat perfectly still beside her abuser. He placed his arm around her shoulders and pulled her to his side a bit and kissed her hair and said he was certain I was misunderstanding their relationship.
No, not hardly. She was shaking like a leaf instantly when he did that and tears, though she had her eyes squeezed shut and her head bowed, were slowly falling into her lap.
I'd had enough when his hand strayed to the collar of her blouse as he was rubbing his hand back and forth while holding her close across the shoulders so that I could see the bruise on the top of her clavicle as the shirt slipped down a bit on the last pass of his hand.
I am bigger than he is. Taller, more in shape after bodybuilding for most of my adult life, and I've trained in kick boxing and MMA, thinking I'd make the circuit one day in long years since past. The perfect candidate to save my friend from a demon bully ahole.
I stood and told him he'd have to leave my house now. And then I reached as he stood up shocked at my change in tone, and moved back from their chairs, and placed my hand on her head to get her attention.
She opened her watery eyes and looked up at me and mouthed, please.
Just then I knew. She was never going home again with this violent garbage she'd married. I knew she'd pay for what I'd said about him and noted about their relationship.
My girlfriend had made her way to the phone ready to dial 911 should he decide to show his colors in front of us.
And just then, after my friend mouthed please, her tormenter said that she was his property and no one steals what's his. And then he came at me.
I let him swing a few times, backing up and telling him this was my house and he didn't want to do this. I wanted no doubt, as my gf was dialing 911, that I'd given him every opportunity to avoid the whipping he was about to receive.
When he looked at my girl and called her a very unkind word and ordered her to put the phone down, which was now on PA so the operator could hear the whole room, I hit him.
Suffice to say by the time our fight was over he was in ICU in hospital and my friend was in the arms of my girlfriend crying uncontrollably.
Her demon, because he stopped being a true husband the moment he first hit her, was arrested at the hospital for domestic battery and other charges related to his conduct at my house.
She divorced, got a restraining order, got her life together in a very short time with our help, moved to a different State with no mention of her change of address to the court so that the order dropped, and has lived happily for the last year free of her abuser. She found sanctuary and healing in a Unitarian Universalist church in her new city and her demon is currently serving 10 years in our State's prison.
Where I hear, thanks to prison guards I've found my way to making friends with, that he's not a very happy camper what with the lifer inmates taking particular exception to a wife beater. They're considered to be cowards and are just a couple of rungs up from child murderers and rapists and those who rape/and or/murder women or the elderly.
Paybacks a ... well, you know.God did not create women to be punching bags. Anyone that thinks he did isn't Christian. They're demons from the pits of Hell. And their advice should be considered to have come from there as well when they say, TAKE IT! Because God expects you to.
Funny thing is, those type demons never find their way to the funeral where their victim took it for the very last time.
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razzelflabben
Contributor
I was gonna ignore this, but I think I need to respond...1. I agree pastors should not send woman home to an abusive husband, I think that was agreed upon by everyone who posted if I remember right. 2. as to divorce, there are other options than sending a woman back to an abusive husband and telling them to get a divorce, as motherprayer testified to, so this is a bit off balance if you ask me, because it only offers two options, when more options are available. and 3. part of your problem might be that you think that Jesus is still dead...He is the risen Savior, the living King, the God that neither sleeps nor slumbers, which is exactly why motherprayers testimony is so powerful.
now we are back to two options, 1. stay and be abused, and 2. divorce...what about the option of separation? prison for the abuser? to name just a couple...
as I said, I think everyone here is in agreement that the battered should not return to the abuser....
but pay backs are not for us, they are for God, and as you demonstrated in your story, there are other options, in fact, in this story, jail was another option. I'm not saying an abused person shouldn't get a divorce...what I am saying, is that there are other options to be considered as it all applies to what scripture tells us.
Look at it this way, I was the child of abuse. At one point, my father tried to kill me with throat and tongue swelling and asthmatic allergic reactions, and just laughed when I couldn't breath. I couldn't just leave, I was a kid, but God was still there, still working, still being God. To me, this argument isn't about divorce or not divorce, it's about what God wants for your specific situation. If divorce is what He wants by all means divorce, if He has a different way for you (you here meaning anyone being abused) then so be it, He is still God, in fact, our lack of belief or blind faith either one, doesn't stop Him from being God. Without doubt, get somewhere safe and stay there as long as you need to, but to say, don't divorce or do divorce is in my opinion missing the point of letting God, in His wisdom, tell us what to do in our given situation.
don't think anyone here is advocating an abused to stay in the abusive situation...I think often we allow our emotions to cloud our eyes of what others are saying.
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Sorry badly written heading. What I was trying to say was "We Should Be Keeping To The Laws Of The Land As We Are Instructed To By God's Word".
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razzelflabben
Contributor
as long as those laws do not violate God's law...agreed. Obedience to God overrides obedience to any of man's laws
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I read it and was looking for it but didn't see it.
I was in an abusive marriage. I stayed because it wasn't physical and I had no way to go and support myself. I'm disabled.
God took him out. He died.
I got the house, the cars, and the survivor's benefits.
But that took a lot of prayer, a lot of perseverance.
I don't remember whether it was Christianity Today or Christian Woman but they had an article on abuse in Christian marriages and got so many replies that they dedicated an entire year to it.
It's out there. It's real.
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Haha... in some places down south, the women shoot back!
Husband will only hit his wife once and will learn a valuable lesson... that may put him in the grave which is where a guy that does this belongs if he refuses to repent and stop the violence against his wife.
Husband will only hit his wife once and will learn a valuable lesson... that may put him in the grave which is where a guy that does this belongs if he refuses to repent and stop the violence against his wife.
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My ex/deceased wanted to buy a gun and I told him yeah, go for it! You keep the bullets and I'll keep hold of the gun. LOL!
He was in planning mode for killing me and I knew it. Even told some people that if anything happened to me to make sure and tell the police it wasn't an accident.
Anyway, long story short, he prayed curses against me (cancers and tumors). God told me to bind and rebuke them and the third time I commanded them to go back where they came from and stay there.
He admitted, smugly, that he had prayed curses against me.
He died of three different types of cancer. I hated seeing him die that way but I was grateful to be free. It was really difficult not to pray for his healing and deliverance.
Cancer has to be the most horrible way to die, but he had had congestive heart failure a decade prior to that and I prayed that God would heal him. God did! He had died in the emergency room, was dead for three minutes and God brought him back to life.
God told me, when the abuse got really bad that He had wanted to deliver me and I had prayed for him. God answered. I told the Lord that if He ever decided to take him out again I wouldn't stand in the way.
I learned the hard way to let evil people die. It's the Christian thing to do to pray for mercy and healing of someone, but sometimes, it is God's will or God's answer to someone else's cries for help to take them out.
Anyway, I can literally say he died of meanness.
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Do people read the scriptures and discern it properly. LOVE people...LOVE! We love in a manner that is respectful and clearly concise with doctrine of JESUS CHRIST!!
Abusive relationships are NOT loving relationships. If the scenario as described was true with blatant abuse then why would a pastor deny loving aid to the women. "Why would any person deny assistance of another person if they are danger?!"
I do believe in submission, but what is the definition of submission in accordance with JESUS CHRIST's doctrine in a marriage. "Isn't the spouse deserving of respect?"
Let us look......
Ephesians 5:24-28
New International Version (NIV)
24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing[a] her by the washing with water through the word, 27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28 In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself.
Perception is a peculiar thing, and I believe discernment is a better approach to any situation...a truthful discernment provided by not our own understanding , but by leaning on GOD for understanding in following his son lord JESUS CHRIST.
The world is saturated with all kinds of evils that permeate our lives. We must hold onto faith and lean on GOD when the trials come, for the enemy is roaring around us like a lion.
Many a man have stumbled, because they stand not in righteousness, but in iniquity and shame. They lean not on GOD and his son JESUS, but on their own interpretations. The pastor should have got involved because of love for another persons welfare.
"Not everyone that call themselves Christians are Christians, not everyone that think highly of themselves are elevated, and not all those that appear to be sheep are sheep!!"
You will recognize them by their fruit and that is of..........love, charity, humility, humane, and kind hearted; which are those dwelling in JESUS CHRIST.
Praise be to GOD the heavenly father and his son lord JESUS CHRIST forever>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Abusive relationships are NOT loving relationships. If the scenario as described was true with blatant abuse then why would a pastor deny loving aid to the women. "Why would any person deny assistance of another person if they are danger?!"
I do believe in submission, but what is the definition of submission in accordance with JESUS CHRIST's doctrine in a marriage. "Isn't the spouse deserving of respect?"
Let us look......
Ephesians 5:24-28
New International Version (NIV)
24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing[a] her by the washing with water through the word, 27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28 In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself.
Perception is a peculiar thing, and I believe discernment is a better approach to any situation...a truthful discernment provided by not our own understanding , but by leaning on GOD for understanding in following his son lord JESUS CHRIST.
The world is saturated with all kinds of evils that permeate our lives. We must hold onto faith and lean on GOD when the trials come, for the enemy is roaring around us like a lion.
Many a man have stumbled, because they stand not in righteousness, but in iniquity and shame. They lean not on GOD and his son JESUS, but on their own interpretations. The pastor should have got involved because of love for another persons welfare.
"Not everyone that call themselves Christians are Christians, not everyone that think highly of themselves are elevated, and not all those that appear to be sheep are sheep!!"
You will recognize them by their fruit and that is of..........love, charity, humility, humane, and kind hearted; which are those dwelling in JESUS CHRIST.
Praise be to GOD the heavenly father and his son lord JESUS CHRIST forever>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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Additionally, If we look at scriptures we see how GOD rescued those whom entrusted him into their lives from danger many times, from unrighteous, unloving people; the Isrealites from the Egyptians, and Lot from the wickedness of Sodom and gehmorrahs society, and believers from persecutors and heathens. With GOD's will all things are possible through his son lord JESUS CHRIST.
If we pray with a humble and righteous heart our prayers will be answered if it is his will. The answering of a prayer is the first steps of discernment and many of us don't understand or listen. Our receptors are misaligned and confusion for most is a blinding aspect that we must as Christians learn to overcome. Many times in the scriptures believers were sent messengers or told in some fashion to flee due to dangers unfolding or unfurling. We start becoming encompassed with our own personal scenario and forget or ignore the spirit and the messages from GOD. then we stumble and fail to listen to true genuine warning signs and sometimes trouble starts.
We overcome by JESUS CHRIST and prayer. Not only for our welfare and that of others, but of deliverance from the enemy and it's roaring and devouring schemes.
Praise be to GOD the heavenly father and his son lord JESUS CHRIST forever>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
If we pray with a humble and righteous heart our prayers will be answered if it is his will. The answering of a prayer is the first steps of discernment and many of us don't understand or listen. Our receptors are misaligned and confusion for most is a blinding aspect that we must as Christians learn to overcome. Many times in the scriptures believers were sent messengers or told in some fashion to flee due to dangers unfolding or unfurling. We start becoming encompassed with our own personal scenario and forget or ignore the spirit and the messages from GOD. then we stumble and fail to listen to true genuine warning signs and sometimes trouble starts.
We overcome by JESUS CHRIST and prayer. Not only for our welfare and that of others, but of deliverance from the enemy and it's roaring and devouring schemes.
Praise be to GOD the heavenly father and his son lord JESUS CHRIST forever>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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I told my pastor and his wife about what was going on with my husband. Not every little thing, but enough. And this went on over the years. I would continue to ask for prayer.
One day, they decided they were going to come up and visit. Quit a trip as we had moved out of state by then.
My husband had decided that they were no longer welcome in our home. Or, at least the pastor's wife.
Since I was the one that invited them, I'm the one that was left to tell them that my husband didn't want them to come.
They became irate. And somehow, made this all my fault.
They accused me of murmuring and complaining and whining.
And I asked, "So all these years I've been asking for prayer your attitude is that I've been complaining and whining?"
My Pastor's answer was, "Yes".
I called her parents after my husband died and let them know what went down and how he died, because they refused to accept mail or phone calls after that.
We are called to peace. I made every attempt that I could even though I know they were in the wrong.
But with some people, I suppose there is no hope for peace.
One day, they decided they were going to come up and visit. Quit a trip as we had moved out of state by then.
My husband had decided that they were no longer welcome in our home. Or, at least the pastor's wife.
Since I was the one that invited them, I'm the one that was left to tell them that my husband didn't want them to come.
They became irate. And somehow, made this all my fault.
They accused me of murmuring and complaining and whining.
And I asked, "So all these years I've been asking for prayer your attitude is that I've been complaining and whining?"
My Pastor's answer was, "Yes".
I called her parents after my husband died and let them know what went down and how he died, because they refused to accept mail or phone calls after that.
We are called to peace. I made every attempt that I could even though I know they were in the wrong.
But with some people, I suppose there is no hope for peace.
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Great thread, with so much information in one place. Persecution happening internally -- within the churches, within the homes -- is just as valid as houses being burned in distant lands.
I would like to mention that wife-submission did not used to be taught so aggressively as it is now, and couples did just fine.
I don't mean there weren't troubles, but at least the offenses weren't defended with religious vigor. The abused were not confused by extra dogma that pulled them away from reporting the crimes. These ARE crimes. Abuse is sin, not "godly order of the household."
When one verse is accentuated, it often leads to theological error. Look at all the church movements that were considered off-base, cults and sects that twisted scriptures to increase loyalty and submission. This imbalance creates distortion of truth, while it shouts out how much it promotes truth.
This phenomenon is not rare, and is not limited to small sectors of the church. I have witnessed it locally and in spiritually-intense churches.
It is true that Moses' law provided for divorce, so we have no right broadcasting dogmatically that God disallowed divorce. That is simply not true. Not scriptural. If we neglect to look to the Torah, we misunderstand what Jesus taught -- that was His premise for explaining the nuances of the Law of Moses.
The New Testament church had female leaders, couples that team-led, females that were over men. The letters gave provision for divorce of Jewish couples who found irreconcilable differences with their faith. What is being taught in many churches today is very slanted and distorted.
Within the teachings throughout the Bible, there is also an emphasis on the community defending justice, protecting the innocent, providing for the downtrodden, and helping bring out truth. The church is in a place right now, generally, where members would rather float on coattails of popular figures, than protect an abused person.
I am for Apollo, I am for Cephas, that woman wants to bring him down ...
We need to listen to ourselves talk.
I would like to mention that wife-submission did not used to be taught so aggressively as it is now, and couples did just fine.
I don't mean there weren't troubles, but at least the offenses weren't defended with religious vigor. The abused were not confused by extra dogma that pulled them away from reporting the crimes. These ARE crimes. Abuse is sin, not "godly order of the household."
When one verse is accentuated, it often leads to theological error. Look at all the church movements that were considered off-base, cults and sects that twisted scriptures to increase loyalty and submission. This imbalance creates distortion of truth, while it shouts out how much it promotes truth.
This phenomenon is not rare, and is not limited to small sectors of the church. I have witnessed it locally and in spiritually-intense churches.
It is true that Moses' law provided for divorce, so we have no right broadcasting dogmatically that God disallowed divorce. That is simply not true. Not scriptural. If we neglect to look to the Torah, we misunderstand what Jesus taught -- that was His premise for explaining the nuances of the Law of Moses.
The New Testament church had female leaders, couples that team-led, females that were over men. The letters gave provision for divorce of Jewish couples who found irreconcilable differences with their faith. What is being taught in many churches today is very slanted and distorted.
Within the teachings throughout the Bible, there is also an emphasis on the community defending justice, protecting the innocent, providing for the downtrodden, and helping bring out truth. The church is in a place right now, generally, where members would rather float on coattails of popular figures, than protect an abused person.
I am for Apollo, I am for Cephas, that woman wants to bring him down ...
We need to listen to ourselves talk.
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A decent response? That would have been laughable. They lived in FL and I lived in VA. I don't know anybody that is willing to drive all that way just for a cup of coffee.
Besides, the situation became volatile as soon as I told them that my husband didn't want her to come.
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