Bible verses on Annihilation?

[DW1980]

Hi

I am curious about how people who support annihilation rather than an eternal conscious hell read the Bible. For example, a pastor of a Church I used to attend said while he believed in a conscious eternal hell, it was possible to read the Bible in a way that supported annihilation. I am curious about this.

There are a few threads on this already but a lot contain things like "I don't think that God would...". It would be good if we could keep this to the Bible with just brief explanations of relevant verses.

1. If you believe that hell is not a place of conscious punishment, what verses in the Bible teach this?
2. How do you understand verses that do seem to teach eternal conscious punishment?

There is a reason I am asking this, I'll explain - my dad was not a Christian when he died. Obviously I don't like the idea of my dad burning in hell for eternity - but I do trust God, I know He will do the right thing. I don't believe hell is literal fire, but I do think it is eternal and conscious. That said, annihilation seems kinder (by human standards) and I know some Christians do believe that. I'd like to understand how you get to that from the Bible, especially if you're an Evangelical Christian who holds that view.

Thanks

 

[Neostarwcc]

I don't know what to believe. I might believe in Annihilation I might believe in an Eternal hell. To me, there are verses in the Bible that could support both theories. A few verses that teach annihilation are John 3:16 and Matthew 10:28.

John 3:16

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his one and only son. That whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have Eternal life"

Matthew 10:28

"Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

To me, you cannot explain away those two verses that teach Annihilation. But, you also cannot explain away the verses that teach an eternal conscious torment like Matthew 25:46

Matthew 25:46:

"Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."


There's also the story of Lazarus and the rich man in which, Lazarus went to heaven and the rich man went to hell. And when the rich man was in hell he was tormented forever. It was a parable taught by Jesus but, it could have been the truth about what hell and the lake of fire is like. But, I think one thing is very clear from scripture. The Devil, The Antichrist, and the Beast WILL be tormented forever as it says in Revelation 20:10.

That could be because the devil, antichrist, and beast are all Ethereal beings and human beings are not. I don't know. But, scripture is clear on their fate. Scripture is also clear that the people who's names are not written in the lamb's book of life get thrown into the lake of fire. The belief in Annihilation doesn't deny that, they just think that the lake of fire will destroy both body and soul like it says in Matthew 10:28. Another thing that is clear, the Old testament never taught in an eternal hell and the belief in an Eternal hell comes from Greek Mythology. That's why the Jews deny an eternal hell as well as Jesus.

Like I said, either could be truth. There are evidences in the Bible supporting both theories. To me, it's kind of not important because, I know that I'm going to heaven when I die.

 

[A_Thinker]

Hi

I am curious about how people who support annihilation rather than an eternal conscious hell read the Bible. For example, a pastor of a Church I used to attend said while he believed in a conscious eternal hell, it was possible to read the Bible in a way that supported annihilation. I am curious about this.

There are a few threads on this already but a lot contain things like "I don't think that God would...". It would be good if we could keep this to the Bible with just brief explanations of relevant verses.

1. If you believe that hell is not a place of conscious punishment, what verses in the Bible teach this?
2. How do you understand verses that do seem to teach eternal conscious punishment?

There is a reason I am asking this, I'll explain - my dad was not a Christian when he died. Obviously I don't like the idea of my dad burning in hell for eternity - but I do trust God, I know He will do the right thing. I don't believe hell is literal fire, but I do think it is eternal and conscious. That said, annihilation seems kinder (by human standards) and I know some Christians do believe that. I'd like to understand how you get to that from the Bible, especially if you're an Evangelical Christian who holds that view.

Thanks

Matthew 3:11-12 King James Version (KJV)

11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will thoroughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

 

[messianist]

Another one:

And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

 

[DW1980]

Hi all

Thanks for the responses so far. I am aware of the "traditional" view, as I said

I do think it is eternal and conscious

What I am unclear on is how someone who is aware of this comes to an understanding that hell isn't eternal conscious punishment. Annihilation could be both punishment and eternal, but my understanding is that it isn't conscious? Hence thinking that Matt 3:12 quoted above would be consistent with that - the fire could be eternal, but the chaff would be burned up and destroyed. It wouldn't continue to exist?

 

[Neostarwcc]

Another one:

And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

That verse seems to be another verse supporting eternal torment. I don't think it teaches annihilation. I could be wrong though.

 

[messianist]

I would say that they would be conscious as that scripture states there will be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

 

[messianist]

That verse seems to be another verse supporting eternal torment. I don't think it teaches annihilation. I could be wrong though.

Yeah, it was in relation to the poster asking about being conscious in hell, I think that scripture verifies that.

 

[Neostarwcc]

Hi all

Thanks for the responses so far. I am aware of the "traditional" view, as I said


What I am unclear on is how someone who is aware of this comes to an understanding that hell isn't eternal conscious punishment. Annihilation could be both punishment and eternal, but my understanding is that it isn't conscious? Hence thinking that Matt 3:12 quoted above would be consistent with that - the fire could be eternal, but the chaff would be burned up and destroyed. It wouldn't continue to exist?

I've read a little bit on the subject of annihilation. I think what they believe is that when a person gets thrown into the lake of fire they are tormented from the heat but after a while of suffering their body and eventually soul gets destroyed by the flames. Like I said, scripture does teach this in several verses but it also teaches eternal punishment and torment at the same time. Scripture cannot contradict itself so there has to be a middle ground view. I don't know what that is but I've heard several explanations on what could possibly happen to people who reject their only hope for salvation. I think accepting Jesus is more preferable than finding out for yourself just what DOES happen if you reject Jesus. Either view is scary. I don't want to not exist after I die, nor do I want to be tormented forever. I want to live with Jesus.

 

[messianist]

eternal
ɪˈtəːn(ə)l,iːˈtəːn(ə)l/
adjective

1. 1.
   lasting or existing forever; without end.

 

[Neostarwcc]

Yeah, it was in relation to the poster asking about being conscious in hell, I think that scripture verifies that.

Oh okay. I wasn't sure. Yes, one thing is clear from scripture that the lake of fire is conscious. Like I said, people who support the view of annihilation don't deny that. They just deny the fact that the lake of fire is eternal torment.

 

[messianist]

Oh okay. I wasn't sure. Yes, one thing is clear from scripture that the lake of fire is conscious. Like I said, people who support the view of annihilation don't deny that. They just deny the fact that the lake of fire is eternal torment.

OK, I see where you're coming from, you have provided the scripture for that in your first post.

 

[tampasteve]

I do not hold to annihilationism, but could believe it is real. In the end it does not matter to me since I believe Christ has saved me. But a few verses used by SDA (probably one of the largest groups that believes in annihilation):

Rev. 21:8 “The cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death”

The wicked die the second death in hellfire. If the wicked lived forever being tortured in hell, they would be immortal. But this is impossible because the Bible says God “alone has immortality” 1 Timothy 6:16​

Rev. 20:9 “They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them”

​

Matt 10:28 “Rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell”

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul who sins shall die”

Devour them, destroy and die implies a annihilation, not an eternal torment​

“I turned you to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all who saw you. … You … shall be no more forever” Ezekiel 28:18, 19

Important views of SDA as well:
The Bible is clear that the wicket will be tormented, but they also believe it is not eternal. Further, they believe that many translations of "Hell" are incorrect and more related to other words and meanings:
IN THE OLD TESTAMENT
31 times from "Sheol," which means the grave."

IN THE NEW TESTAMENT
10 times from "Hades," which means "the grave."
12 times from "Gehenna," which means "the place of burning."
1 time from "Tartarus," which means "a place of darkness."

 

[1stcenturylady]

I don't know what to believe. I might believe in Annihilation I might believe in an Eternal hell. To me, there are verses in the Bible that could support both theories. A few verses that teach annihilation are John 3:16 and Matthew 10:28.

John 3:16

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his one and only son. That whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have Eternal life"

Matthew 10:28

"Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

To me, you cannot explain away those two verses that teach Annihilation. But, you also cannot explain away the verses that teach an eternal conscious torment like Matthew 25:46

Matthew 25:46:

"Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."


There's also the story of Lazarus and the rich man in which, Lazarus went to heaven and the rich man went to hell. And when the rich man was in hell he was tormented forever. It was a parable taught by Jesus but, it could have been the truth about what hell and the lake of fire is like. But, I think one thing is very clear from scripture. The Devil, The Antichrist, and the Beast WILL be tormented forever as it says in Revelation 20:10.

That could be because the devil, antichrist, and beast are all Ethereal beings and human beings are not. I don't know. But, scripture is clear on their fate. Scripture is also clear that the people who's names are not written in the lamb's book of life get thrown into the lake of fire. The belief in Annihilation doesn't deny that, they just think that the lake of fire will destroy both body and soul like it says in Matthew 10:28. Another thing that is clear, the Old testament never taught in an eternal hell and the belief in an Eternal hell comes from Greek Mythology. That's why the Jews deny an eternal hell as well as Jesus.

Like I said, either could be truth. There are evidences in the Bible supporting both theories. To me, it's kind of not important because, I know that I'm going to heaven when I die.

Hell is forever, but the question is, what about those who are thrown into that eternal hell. Are they burned up, or suffer forever.

 

[A_Thinker]

Hi all

Thanks for the responses so far. I am aware of the "traditional" view, as I said


What I am unclear on is how someone who is aware of this comes to an understanding that hell isn't eternal conscious punishment. Annihilation could be both punishment and eternal, but my understanding is that it isn't conscious? Hence thinking that Matt 3:12 quoted above would be consistent with that - the fire could be eternal, but the chaff would be burned up and destroyed. It wouldn't continue to exist?

My Bible study tells me that the most common Biblical expression of the fate of the lost ... is that they will die, ... while the saved shall live forever ... and are saved from death. This is expressed in the gospels and throughout Paul's teaching (which doesn't mention the familiar teaching of "hell"). Neither does the Old Testament express this teaching ... and Jews don't believe in hell today. The closest Jews get to such a belief is a belief by some that, after physical death, God's chosen may experience a purgation (like purgatory) ... of no more than 12 months.

The warning God gives to Adam/Eve is ... "in the day that thou shalt eat of the tree (of the knowledge of Good and Evil) ... thou shalt surely die."

As has been stated, ... the only "beings" of which it is explicitly stated that shall suffer "eternal conscious torment" ... are the Beast, the Dragon, and the False Prophet.

And though scripture does say that there shall be "weeping and gnashing of teeth" after the judgement, ... it doesn't say that it (the weeping and gnashing) shall last forever.

 

[messianist]

Hi

I am curious about how people who support annihilation rather than an eternal conscious hell read the Bible. For example, a pastor of a Church I used to attend said while he believed in a conscious eternal hell, it was possible to read the Bible in a way that supported annihilation. I am curious about this.

There are a few threads on this already but a lot contain things like "I don't think that God would...". It would be good if we could keep this to the Bible with just brief explanations of relevant verses.

1. If you believe that hell is not a place of conscious punishment, what verses in the Bible teach this?
2. How do you understand verses that do seem to teach eternal conscious punishment?

There is a reason I am asking this, I'll explain - my dad was not a Christian when he died. Obviously I don't like the idea of my dad burning in hell for eternity - but I do trust God, I know He will do the right thing. I don't believe hell is literal fire, but I do think it is eternal and conscious. That said, annihilation seems kinder (by human standards) and I know some Christians do believe that. I'd like to understand how you get to that from the Bible, especially if you're an Evangelical Christian who holds that view.

Thanks

I get where your coming from when it comes to family, most of my family can't stand it when I talk about god, that often brings me to similar thoughts you have, its tough at times but in yashua messiah we trust. Every blessing.

 

[A_Thinker]

Genesis 3:19 "By the sweat of your brow will you have food to eat until you return to the ground from which you were made. For you were made from dust, and to dust you will return."

 

[DW1980]

Hell is forever, but the question is, what about those who are thrown into that eternal hell. Are they burned up, or suffer forever.

Exactly! You said it better than I did over 2 posts lol

 

[Sorn]

Matthew 25:46:

"Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."

This can also be viewed as meaning that there is no coming back from the eternal punishment, ie the punishment is death (or second death) and it is forever.

 

[DW1980]

I've read a little bit on the subject of annihilation. I think what they believe is that when a person gets thrown into the lake of fire they are tormented from the heat but after a while of suffering their body and eventually soul gets destroyed by the flames. Like I said, scripture does teach this in several verses but it also teaches eternal punishment and torment at the same time. Scripture cannot contradict itself so there has to be a middle ground view. I don't know what that is but I've heard several explanations on what could possibly happen to people who reject their only hope for salvation. I think accepting Jesus is more preferable than finding out for yourself just what DOES happen if you reject Jesus. Either view is scary. I don't want to not exist after I die, nor do I want to be tormented forever. I want to live with Jesus.

I personally have no fear of death - I know where I'm going My dad however died, and wasn't a Christian... I have lost others too whom I know were not Christians. That's what's bugging me... I am struggling with the thought that people I love would suffer eternal conscious punishment. As I said, I do trust God, I know he is good, and I know that after judgement day I will be at peace with whatever He does. But here and now I am struggling with this.