Beware of wrong teaching

[marke]

Hey prophesystudent, I hope your'e doing fine today, I'm new here hoping I can learn some things, I've been reading my KJV Bible a little less than a year and have yet to run across the Scripture that says 'God helps them that helps themselves,' could you please tell me where I can find it? Thank you, much appreciated.

"GOD HELPS THOSE WHO HELP THEMSELVES."

It's another one of those Pop Christianity fairy tales people want to believe, but have no substance in scripture.

Don't expect a reply. As you know, it's a myth and following myths and fairy tales won't save your soul.

God Bless.

 

[marke]

I agree, God has no political party - but then, God also doesn't live down here on earth... He doesn't drive a car to work, etc. But God does put all political leaders into power & takes them out. (often using us/people as His tool). So I'd say God has purposely put in and/or allowed some evil leaders to take power for His own purposes.

I do try to vote the people in who appear less corrupt than the others or who sit on the moral side of the issues - but that's not always a failsafe with politics. Democracy is our system, but I have little to no faith in MEN to fix anything at this point in time;

I think we're destined to see the Bible's end time prophecies fulfilled more & more rapidly no matter who we vote in (as Christians). And as I read things, NONE OF IT LOOKS GOOD for earth until Christ returns to restore it again & bring back truth & peace.

Ya did well with "W" and the other republicans.

Boy, you must be proud to have helped vote them in.

I'm glad I don't vote and especially for those who are just a little less corrupt.

Just as a reminder.

Pro 6:16 These six Jehovah hates; yea, seven are hateful (abominations) to his soul:

Pro 6:17 a proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
Pro 6:18 a heart that plots wicked plans, feet hurrying to run to evil,
Pro 6:19 a false witness who speaks lies, and he who causes fighting among brothers.
God Bless.

 

[Nadiine]

Ya did well with "W" and the other republicans.

Boy, you must be proud to have helped vote them in.

I'm glad I don't vote and especially for those who are just a little less corrupt.

Just as a reminder.

Pro 6:16 These six Jehovah hates; yea, seven are hateful (abominations) to his soul:

Pro 6:17 a proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
Pro 6:18 a heart that plots wicked plans, feet hurrying to run to evil,
Pro 6:19 a false witness who speaks lies, and he who causes fighting among brothers.
God Bless.

What was the alternative?? Al Gore?
A man who promotes nature worship/paganism? WHo's pro abortion?
& the prior election? A MAN WHO SAID HE WOULD SEEK TO HAVE SOCIETY PAY FOR ABORTIONS FOR THE POOR & was for partial birth abortion? A man who recently mocked the entire military that they were all stupid?

As far as I'm concerned, there were no other options.

So be careful who you judge. At least Bush signed a bill to fight abortion.
& has been pushing for other good causes (all war aside).
And Bush put in 2 or 3 conservative Supreme Court judges which were sorely needed!
It's only the WAR that's caused Bush's problems. Your hatred may be the bigger problem than my vote tho. Other than that, the economy is booming...

& your choice of verses don't fit me either; namely when you told us elsewhere that the Bible says we aren't to read the OT.

I guess it's good enough for you to quote for your own attacks, but not to read for truth? oh well

 

[nochurch]

How could anyone say or even suggest that we should not, as mature Christians, post the 10 commandments in our churches & in our schools & in our public buildings & instruct all to live by this Biblical code of conduct? If everyone, everywhere, made a conscious effort to keep & live by the 10 commandments, would not most of the problems of our land disappear as a result?

Would God not then bless us as a nation & make us a blessing to all nations? Are the 10 commandments the solution to all immorality & sin? The answer to all these questions is "NO"! It's been tried before, & it has failed everytime.

Ancient Israel said & thought that they could keep perfect lives by keeping God's 10 commandments. They failed miserably. The Pharisees thought that they could become righteous In the eyes of God by keeping the law & the 10 commandments. Jesus said that they will not be in the Kingdom of God. Modern Ireland, divided by Protestantism & Catholicism, are slaughtering each other under this same system.

Peter said it all when he called this law a YOKE "which neither are fathers NOR WE were able to bear" (Acts 15:10) But there is something better. In Hebrews 7:16 we are told that the commandment that established the Levitical priesthood & all that they represented & taught (including the ten commandments), was "carnal".

Even the most holy & solemn day of the entire year, when the high priest entered the holy place to sprinkle blood for all the sins of Israel, these ordinances are called "carnal". And we are told in no uncertain terms by the apostle Paul that, "to be carnally minded" is DEATH..." (Rom. 8:6). The laws were carnal; the priests were carnal; the people were carnal; & the result has always been, is now, & always will be, DEATH! The law of Moses is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless & disobedient (1Tim. 1:9).

I said the law [Moses law] is not made for a righteous man! There is however something better. Do not confuse the ten commandments of the old covenant with the law of God of the new covenant. When will we finally come to believe that there really is a new covenant with "new" laws, & that it is not fashioned after the old covenant? This "new" covenant is "not in accord" (Heb. 8:9) with the old covenant, & the old covenant was "...even ten commandments (Deut. 4:13) written upon two tables of stone.

But this "new covenant" does have laws indeed! Heb. 8:10-imparting my LAWS on their HEARTS..."The ten commandments were written on stones, not on hearts. The laws of the New Covenant are (1) NOT IN ACCORD with the laws of the old covenant, (2) Different from the old law from which we "died" & now are "exempted" (Rom. 7:4 & 6), (3) Spiritual laws (Rom. 7:14 & (4) they are written on their & [our hearts] Heb.8:10) The Spiritual laws of God are not the 10 commandments. Anything spiritual or spirit is "eternal". God's spiritual laws are eternal. The 10 commandments are temporal, "taken away" done away, not to continue.

The 4th commandment: "six days shalt thou labor and do all thy work..." (Exodus 20:9). Is anyone so ignorant as to suggest that we will work six days out of every seven for the rest of eternity? We are told that along with the change of the priesthood, there was also a necessity for a change in the law. There is no such thing as spiritually keeping a carnal law. Jesus wears a NEW garment & a new priestly robe. Not according to that of Levi, but according to that of Melchizedek.

Under the New Covenant we have a new priesthood, a New High Priest & new laws. None of them are reworkings or modifications of the old-they are NEW. They are the true High Priest & the true spiritual laws of God, not just the shadow. The physical priesthood & carnal laws of Israel were but a far inferior type of the spiritual & heavenly realities that we have in Christ Jesus. They are all NEW, they are all SPIRITUAL, & they are all far, far superior-giving LIFE & not death. Those who are now being regenerated & recreated into the very SONS & DAUGHTERS OF GOD, becoming a NEW CREATION, are fully aware of the need for laws-SPIRITUAL LAWS, & God has provided them for us.

The Law of God, the Law of Christ, the Law of the Spirit, the Law of faith, the Law of righteousness, the Law of liberty & the Law of life. All these must be in our minds & in our hearts, or we are "none of His." Thank God that we are free from the works of the carnal law, but we are anything but free from the works of God's spiritual laws. In fact it is through "good works" that we are, "His achievement" Eph.2:10. So let's avoid the proverbial swing of the pendulem, & submit ourselves to the perfect balance of God.

Nadine, throughout your posts, I can see & feel your love for our Father Jesus Christ, it is a very good & wholesome love. I spend alot of time in the Old Testament, I consider the Old Testament as a history book. I do not however apply it to my walk with Christ.
Jesus & His new laws are about His love for us, it's that love that keeps me nigh [near] to Him for He is an awesome God.

 

[holo]

How could anyone say or even suggest that we should not, as mature Christians, post the 10 commandments in our churches & in our schools & in our public buildings & instruct all to live by this Biblical code of conduct?

Because the ten commandments don't save, they don't bring life, they don't reconcile man with God - in short, they do nothing of the things Jesus did on the cross and when he rose from the dead.

If everyone, everywhere, made a conscious effort to keep & live by the 10 commandments, would not most of the problems of our land disappear as a result?

No. It would work if we were actually practically able to keep the commandments. But the commandment is the power of sin, and the law was given to make sin exceedingly sinful and expose man's efforts as futile. The law wasn't given to impart life or righteousness or to be a guide in everyday life. Nobody before Moses needed the law, and Abraham, who is our spiritual father, didn't have the law.

We're not to be guided by the law, but by the Spirit. It's a tragedy that people are still displaying the commandments instead of Jesus.

 

[nochurch]

Way to go Holo,

But I take it that you did not read the next paragraph.

 

[holo]

Heh, that's actually true. I was in a hurry and I didn't read the whole thing through, only skimmed it. Anyway, see it as commenatry and compliment, not a challenge of your views.

 

[Xcarvengerx]

Dear friends, I urge you, as aliens and strangers in the world, to abstain from sinful desires, which war against your soul. (1 Peter 2:11)

Get involved and change the world as much as you like but don't get indulged in the sins and love of the world for whoever loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him/her (1 John 2:15). Love God and love people instead.

 

[Zecryphon]

Because the ten commandments don't save, they don't bring life, they don't reconcile man with God - in short, they do nothing of the things Jesus did on the cross and when he rose from the dead.

No. It would work if we were actually practically able to keep the commandments. But the commandment is the power of sin, and the law was given to make sin exceedingly sinful and expose man's efforts as futile. The law wasn't given to impart life or righteousness or to be a guide in everyday life. Nobody before Moses needed the law, and Abraham, who is our spiritual father, didn't have the law.

We're not to be guided by the law, but by the Spirit. It's a tragedy that people are still displaying the commandments instead of Jesus.

"Because the ten commandments don't save,"

They just show why you need to be saved.

"they don't bring life,"

Why should they? How have you lost your life?

"they don't reconcile man with God - in short, they do nothing of the things Jesus did on the cross and when he rose from the dead"

The Ten Commandments help show why we need Jesus to die for us. They let us know why God needs to punish us if He is truly a holy, just and righteous God. When you apply the commandments to yourself you will see your need for a savior.

"But the commandment is the power of sin,"

Could you explain that?

"and the law was given to make sin exceedingly sinful and expose man's efforts as futile."

How does the law make sin more sinful? Sin is sin and God abhors sin. How do you define sin? What is sin?

"The law wasn't given to impart life or righteousness or to be a guide in everyday life."

No. It was given to show your need for a savior.

"Nobody before Moses needed the law, and Abraham, who is our spiritual father, didn't have the law."

Following that logic, Adam and Eve shouldn't have been thrown out of the Garden of Eden either, right? Since they didn't have The Law, they couldn't be guilty of breaking it right?

"We're not to be guided by the law, but by the Spirit."

That's funny Jesus said otherwise in Matthew 5:17-20

"Do not think that i have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. (18) I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, nor the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is acoomplished. (19) Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

"It's a tragedy that people are still displaying the commandments instead of Jesus"

I disagree. I think the more tragic thing is people who do not know the purpose of the Law and disregard it because they have been saved by grace. If you forget the Law or remove it altogether, how will you ever explain why people need to be saved and what they need to be saved from? In short, 'Why would God punish me? I'm such a "good" person." Remember Paul didn't know what sin was until he heard the Law.

 

[ThinkofHim]

To be a Christian is to seek to be Christlike in spirit. I have seen no account of Jesus killing another person for any reason.

I do know of him healing many-and bringing one back from the dead.

I know of no church which deserves the name-that does not also show the qualities of Jesus.

Sacrifice of self in the service of others.

Charity.

A love that allows all who heed and come with clean hearts to Him.

And adoration and respect for Heavenly Father that allows Him to penetrate deep within us-in this life and the next.

And an abiding awareness of exactly where the line between good and evil lies-and allows absolutely no compromise with the principalities of darkness.

 

[seekthetruth909]

"

"We're not to be guided by the law, but by the Spirit."

That's funny Jesus said otherwise in Matthew 5:17-20

"Do not think that i have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. (18) I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, nor the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is acoomplished. (19) Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

"It's a tragedy that people are still displaying the commandments instead of Jesus"

I disagree. I think the more tragic thing is people who do not know the purpose of the Law and disregard it because they have been saved by grace. If you forget the Law or remove it altogether, how will you ever explain why people need to be saved and what they need to be saved from? In short, 'Why would God punish me? I'm such a "good" person." Remember Paul didn't know what sin was until he heard the Law.

How many of the 613 Old Testament laws do you believe we should follow?
Could you please explain what the verses below mean?

Ephesians 2:15 “By abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace.”

Galatians 3:25 “Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law.”

2 Corinthians 3:6 “He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant–not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.”

Galatians 3:23 “Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed.”

Galatians 3:11 “Clearly no one is justified before God by the law, because, “The righteous will live by faith.” [ Heb. 2:4]

Hebrews 8:7 “For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another.”

Galatians 5:18 “But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.”

Galatians 2:21 “I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

Galatians 3:2 “ I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by observing the law, or by believing what you heard?”

Hebrews 10:8 First he said, “Sacrifices and offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not desire, nor were you pleased with them” (although the law required them to be made).

Galatians 5:3 “Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law.”

Galatians 3:10 “All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written:” “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”

Romans 7:2-4 “Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another -- to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God."

 

[holo]

"But the commandment is the power of sin,"

Could you explain that?

"When the commandment came, sin sprang to life - " The more commandments you give, the more people will sin, because sin takes advantage of the commandment. It's about the grass turning greener on the other side.

"and the law was given to make sin exceedingly sinful and expose man's efforts as futile."

How does the law make sin more sinful? Sin is sin and God abhors sin. How do you define sin? What is sin?

Sin is that which is not the will of God, I guess. Whatever is not of faith is sin.

"Nobody before Moses needed the law, and Abraham, who is our spiritual father, didn't have the law."

Following that logic, Adam and Eve shouldn't have been thrown out of the Garden of Eden either, right? Since they didn't have The Law, they couldn't be guilty of breaking it right?

They didn't have the law as we know it, the law was given to Moses. They had only ONE commandment, and they broke it. Hadn't they been commanded, the devil couldn't have tempted them and questioned God. The devil always tries to twist what God says. If God says one thing is bad for you, the devil will try to make it look attractive.

The commandment has been the power of sin from the very beginning. That's why the Lord didn't want us to even know about right and wrong.

"We're not to be guided by the law, but by the Spirit."

That's funny Jesus said otherwise in Matthew 5:17-20

"Do not think that i have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. (18) I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, nor the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is acoomplished. (19) Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

No, he didn't really say otherwise. He was instructing Jews from the law. Later he fulfilled and accomplished what the law and the prophets were only a shadow of. And Paul, who was assigned with "completing the gospel", says that it's the SPIRIT who is to guide and lead and teach us, and that it's the GRACE of God that makes us better, not the law.

"It's a tragedy that people are still displaying the commandments instead of Jesus"

I disagree. I think the more tragic thing is people who do not know the purpose of the Law and disregard it because they have been saved by grace. If you forget the Law or remove it altogether, how will you ever explain why people need to be saved and what they need to be saved from? In short, 'Why would God punish me? I'm such a "good" person." Remember Paul didn't know what sin was until he heard the Law.

Paul did know what sin was, but he didn't know the true power of it until the commandment came and empowered sin. The gentiles always had a sense of morality, as did the jews who lived prior to the law. And as saved people, as children of God, righteous, blameless, redeemed, holy, we don't need the law. We're not to eat from the law tree anymore, we're not to be guided by what's lawful, but by what's beneficial, by the Spirit, not by the letter.