Before you can follow Jesus

[Presbyterian Continuist]

That’s the law, not the gospel.

I agree. It doesn't matter whether through God's providence that a person is rich or poor. It all depends on the person's attitude concerning his or her possessions. A poor person can find contentment in the riches of faith in Christ that all his needs will be supplied, while a rich person has more to be able to give to those less fortunate.

It has more to do with on what basis is the person's faith is. The only faith that justifies is faith in Christ alone. Faith in riches, or the false humility of poverty, are both false faith that has no virtue with God at all.

A person who gives away all he possesses, so that his family starve, cannot pay the bills, evicted from their home, and are clothed in rags, is exhibiting a false religiosity in that he think that doing it is pleasing God, but in bringing suffering to the innocent members of his family proves him a hypocrite and his religion is false and will end him up in hell for it.

 

[devin553344]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

We had this same discussion some time ago. And we talked about how well you would serve the Lord being homeless these days. And how Jesus time was different than this day of civilization. Also how cities don't like homeless people and often find reasons to jail them.

It was a lengthy discussion. But in the end pay your tithing, and work as you have ability and make ends meet. That is a better way to serve in this day and age.

We're not all called to be Bishops, there are many out there already. But we can follow by attending church and serving the Lord under a church leadership.

 

[DamianWarS]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

Jesus was speaking to someone with a possession problem who was seeking to justify himself. If you think you have it all together then go ahead and ask christ "what next" and see what he tells you. (Most definitely it will be that you don't have it all together)

 

[GOD Shines Forth!]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

That's interesting, but He taught us--in the "dispensation of the grace of God", via Paul--to be content with much or with little. Godliness with contentment is great gain!

 

[NoahSK]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

The man was asking what he needed to do to be perfect. I'm not entirely sure and don't want to assume, but I think Jesus' goal here was to get the man to realize that he wasn't capable of being perfect, and that he needed Jesus just as much as everyone else.

 

[Wordkeeper]

I agree. It doesn't matter whether through God's providence that a person is rich or poor. It all depends on the person's attitude concerning his or her possessions. A poor person can find contentment in the riches of faith in Christ that all his needs will be supplied, while a rich person has more to be able to give to those less fortunate.

It has more to do with on what basis is the person's faith is. The only faith that justifies is faith in Christ alone. Faith in riches, or the false humility of poverty, are both false faith that has no virtue with God at all.

A person who gives away all he possesses, so that his family starve, cannot pay the bills, evicted from their home, and are clothed in rags, is exhibiting a false religiosity in that he think that doing it is pleasing God, but in bringing suffering to the innocent members of his family proves him a hypocrite and his religion is false and will end him up in hell for it.

The evidence that a person has entered the Kingdom of God is if people see the signs indicating that God is with a person:

John 3
1Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a leader of the Jews. 2He came to Jesus at night and said, “Rabbi, we know that You are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the signs You are doing if God were not with him.”

3Jesus replied, “Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.”

4“How can a man be born when he is old?” Nicodemus asked. “Can he enter his mother’s womb a second time to be born?”

5Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. 6Flesh is born of flesh, but spirit is born of the Spirit. 7Do not be amazed that I said, ‘You must be born again.’
.....................


In other words, Nicodemus wants to have what Christ has, the preence of God. Christ tells him that the Kingdom of God (God’s presence) can be received only by being inducted into revelation of God’s Way: picking up a cross and being resurrected.

The Kingdom of God is a state where it can be said the person is being a blessing to the world, through moving people to live, to stop being selfish and start following God.

Luke 7
18The disciples of John reported to him about all these things. 19Summoning two of his disciples, John sent them to the Lord, saying, “Are You the Expected One, or do we look for someone else?” 20When the men came to Him, they said, “John the Baptist has sent us to You, to ask, ‘Are You the Expected One, or do we look for someone else?’” 21At that very time He cured many people of diseases and afflictions and evil spirits; and He gave sight to many who were blind. 22And He answered and said to them, “Go and report to John what you have seen and heard: the BLIND RECEIVE SIGHT, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, the POOR HAVE THE GOSPEL PREACHED TO THEM.

In other words, Jesus picks up a cross whenever He does what he sees the Father do, says what the Father says, like Moses:

Exodus 4
1Then Moses said, “What if they will not believe me or listen to what I say? For they may say, ‘The LORD has not appeared to you.’” 2The LORD said to him, “What is that in your hand?” And he said, “A staff.” 3Then He said, “Throw it on the ground.” So he threw it on the ground, and it became a serpent; and Moses fled from it. 4But the LORD said to Moses, “Stretch out your hand and grasp it by its tail”—so he stretched out his hand and caught it, and it became a staff in his hand— 5“that they may believe that the LORD, the God of their fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has appeared to you.”

When people see that God is with the speaker, they are motivated to follow God, to stop being selfish and start using their lives to be blessings to others as well.

Jesus says people can't manifest what He manifests unless they themselves stops living selfishly and starts following God, surrenders all their possessions gained unrighteously, by exploiting others (your plumber exploited you! You exploited your plumber! All mammon is unrighteous, there is no righteous mammon!) and follows Christ:

Luke 14
33“So then, none of you can be My disciple who does not give up all his own possessions.

Luke 18
28Peter said, “Behold, we have left our own homes and followed You.” 29And He said to them, “Truly I say to you, there is no one who has left house or wife or brothers or parents or children, for the sake of the kingdom of God, 30who will not receive many times as much at this time and in the age to come, eternal life.”

 

[Strong in Him]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

And?

 

[Guojing]

That was Jesus' prescription for a particular person (due to his materialism). Applying it to everyone does not fit with the rest of the counsel of Scripture, such as Proverbs' advice on financial management.

But what do you think about Luke 12:33 then?

 

[JIMINZ]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

This is an example of what Jesus said to the rich young ruler.

Act 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.
Act 2:43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.
Act 2:44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
Act 2:45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.
Act 2:46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,
Act 2:47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Were these people breaking the Law?

 

[Yarddog]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

We all have something which God calls us out if, but we should never look back. Abraham was called out of Babylonia and he left and didn't look back. Lot was called out of Sodom and he didn't look back. Lot's wife looked back and was turned into a pillar of salt. Israel was called out if Egypt but looked back and was doomed to roam in the desert for 40 years.

Jesus called the rich man out from the world and he looked back upon his riches.

We don't look back upon what God calls us out of.

 

[Carl Emerson]

John 5
"46If you had believed Moses, you would believe Me, because he wrote about Me. 47But since you do not believe what he wrote, how will you believe what I say?"

I asked "Where is scripture does it say Jesus is the Law?

You replied as above.

Maybe try again... you are looking for a scripture that says Jesus IS the Law.

 

[Carl Emerson]

If Jesus commanded it, it’s the law.

Can you define which 'Law' you are referring to??

The Mosaic Law? The Law of Statutes and Ordinances? The Law of the Spirit? Something else...???

 

[GospelS]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

That is true. Jesus is asking everyone if they love Him to the point of even willing to loose everything else when asked to do so.

Jesus is saying that one must be willing to let go of what they love the most, even their very life, if anyone wants to have Him and find life. This is the test of faith and love for God.

This man loved his possessions more than God which is an obstruction to his salvation. Further in the passage Jesus said- For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

 

[Hammster]

Can you define which 'Law' you are referring to??

The Mosaic Law? The Law of Statutes and Ordinances? The Law of the Spirit? Something else...???

If Jesus (you know, God!) gives a command, it’s law. I don’t know how else to explain it.

 

[GOD Shines Forth!]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

"Instruct those who are rich in the present age not to be conceited and not to put their hope in the uncertainty of wealth, but in God, who richly provides all things for us to enjoy. Instruct them to do good, to be rich in good works, and to be generous and ready to share, treasuring up for themselves a firm foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life."

—1 Timothy 6

 

[GospelS]

That’s the law, not the gospel.

Are we still seeing the letter and not the spirit of it? There is a context but if you see the spirit of it, it still applies to all who wants to follow Christ.

Jesus is saying one must value Him above everything else to the point of even willing to loose what they love the most and let go everything else, even their very life, when asked to do so if they want to have Him and find life.

 

[Dave L]

In Acts the church practiced "Jerusalem Communism". Abraham Kuiper explains that Jerusalem "communism" says "what's mine is yours." Modern communism says "what's yours is mine."

So giving in love is good. But giving reluctantly and legalistically yields nothing.

“And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.” (1 Corinthians 13:3)

 

[Hammster]

Are we still seeing the letter and not the spirit of it? There is a context but if you see the spirit of it, it still applies to all who wants to follow Christ.

Jesus is saying one must value Him above everything else to the point of even willing to loose what they love the most and let go everything else, even their very life, when asked to do so if they want to have Him and find life.

It’s still the law. The gospel frees us to follow freely.

 

[Ken Rank]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

Perfect in that sense doesn't mean without error...it means complete, balanced, whole.

 

[Danielwright2311]

"Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me.”

Jesus told that guy to sell his possessions, just him.

Why?

Because he loved his money more then people, no treasures in heaven for him.

See? he was still going to heaven, But with no treasures.