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BAPTISM

Discussion in 'Sacramental/Ordinance Theology' started by ilovejcsog, Dec 8, 2018.

  1. ilovejcsog

    ilovejcsog I am a Christian mutt. You can call me Rox

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    Can we get to heaven if we aren't baptized?
     
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  2. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

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    Why would one choose NOT to be baptized?
     
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  3. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Repartee Animal: Quipping the Saints! Supporter

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    @ilovejcsog, Do you want responses from the viewpoint of "believer's baptism," "infant baptism" or both?

    That question will affect the quality of discussion that you will get in this thread.
     
  4. StephenDiscipleofYHWH

    StephenDiscipleofYHWH Well-Known Member

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    Every point below is based on the person already being saved by faith.
    1. Do you believe on Christ but didn't have the ability to be baptized? Then you are justified by the works you are able to perform. So yes you ca get into heaven

    2. Do you believe on Christ, and have the ability to be baptized but adamantly reject it until your dying day? Then you are damned and cannot enter heaven because you refused to do a work(command of God) that you were able to perform until your last breath.

    3. Did you believe on Christ, and at a certain point had the Opportunity to be baptized but have since repented? Then you can be justified and enter into heaven so long as you repent and seek out someone true to the faith to baptize you. Thus fulfilling the command of God to be baptized.
     
  5. bcbsr

    bcbsr Newbie

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    Is salvation contingent upon your involvement in a religious ceremony in which something is done to your flesh? No, salvation is not by works, be it water baptism or circumcision, but by faith apart from works. Though those who have been saved get water baptized, water baptism is a work they do neither to obtain nor maintain their salvation status.

    While salvation by works Christians treat everything we are to do as if continually trying to satisfy conditions for salvation, those of us who have been saved by faith apart from works go on to do things just because they're the right things to do rather than having to be motivated out of fear of condemnation as if under the law of sin and death.
     
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  6. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like Jesus Himself said, NO.

    Mark 16:16
    He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

    John 3:3
    Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

    John 3:6-8
    6) That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
    7) Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
    8) The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
     
  7. Aspzan

    Aspzan Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I don't believe we need to be baptised to get to heaven

    Acts 16:31

    also

    Acts 15:11 - But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.


    and John 3:16 John 6:47 John 3:36

    I know there are verses which mention baptism but I don't believe they are saying that salvation is by baptism
     
  8. Hazelelponi

    Hazelelponi Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Baptism is your public confession of faith as well as when you join into the Christian felllowship, and as such very important... but if you die before your able to fulfill that, struck by a car or some catastrophic event happens, you will go to heaven as seen in the thief on the cross.

    The work of salvation is His, not ours.
     
  9. harko

    harko Active Member

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    What's the opinion of being baptised as a child? Would I still have to be baptised as my decision?
     
  10. Hazelelponi

    Hazelelponi Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I actually and honestly do not believe in infant baptism and answer your question as yes, a believers baptism is necessary to salvation so those baptised as infants need to have a believers baptism as God directs them to in adulthood.

    Not everyone agrees.
     
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  11. David Neos

    David Neos Catechumen

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    Lutherans believe in faith alone too, and they believe baptism is necessary.
     
  12. David Neos

    David Neos Catechumen

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    Baptism is for the remission of sins, but I believe in baptism of desire too. God can work outside the Mysteries.
     
  13. harko

    harko Active Member

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    Cool!
     
  14. mark kennedy

    mark kennedy Natura non facit saltum Supporter

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    Of course you can but in the early church conversion and baptism were so closely related they were nearly indiscernible. Baptism is just another remembrance of the death burial and resurrection of Christ. The Lord's Supper a remembrance of the cross. People who insist you must be baptized in water generally tell you that so they will seem like the agents of salvation. The Holy Spirit baptizes you into Christ upon hearing and believing the gospel.
     
  15. mark kennedy

    mark kennedy Natura non facit saltum Supporter

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    All the prophets testify about him that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.” (Acts 10:43)
    After that they receive the Holy Spirit, this is prior to being baptized in water.

    And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit. (Ephesians 1:13)​
     
  16. ilovejcsog

    ilovejcsog I am a Christian mutt. You can call me Rox

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    I would have loved to have been baptized but have not had the opportunity. Thus the question.
     
  17. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    Water is not a critical factor.

    1 Peter 3:21
    Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

    Mark 16:16
    Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.
     
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  18. bcbsr

    bcbsr Newbie

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    I'm not a Lutheran.
     
  19. David Neos

    David Neos Catechumen

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    I know but I am saying that "baptism for the remission of sins" is believed by Sola Fide folks too.
     
  20. StephenDiscipleofYHWH

    StephenDiscipleofYHWH Well-Known Member

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    In your case baptism is not a work you can perform since you do not have the opportunity. Then you are still saved by faith, and you are justified by the works you are able to perform.
     
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