Australian Royal Commission finds 7% of Catholic priests are/were pedophiles

[Davidnic]

That isnt consistent with research that Ive read. Do you have a source for your stats that I can review? Bear in mind that in 2004 we had no idea of the massive scale of child sexual abuse within the church. Thus your reference may no longer be relevant.

Actually the numbers have not varied much on what we knew about the Church in 2004 except in some areas. In fact a 7-10% rate in places that have access to children seem, as a synthesis, about the norm.

As far as the original 2004 report, the 156 page report and the existing literature and studies it cites bears out the data. So to follow up reports from insurance companies and states like California.

But as far as the original report: http://www.wrightslaw.com/pubs/sex.misconduct.doe.2004.pdf

Now, it does not matter if someone else has higher numbers. All Churches have to be held accountable. So no matter what, what we need to do is address it as an epidemic problem and look for similarities in places where it happens. Then look for unique factors that make some places more appealing to abusers.

There are many angles that need to come into play. But the problem is vast.

 

[Dave-W]

Nurses Doctors and teachers are required by law to report child sexual abuse or reasonable suspicion of same.... what is your view of extending that to clergy.

I think that would be very sensible.
It should be extended to lawyers also.

It already does. Failure to disclose is a criminal offence for every adult in Victoria regardless of profession. I have acted in accord with that legislation before.

Not the case here in the US.

 

[Tallguy88]

Doing away with attorney-client privilege would be a horrible precedent. It could prevent accused people from getting a fair trial and would likely be ruled unconstitutional by the Courts.

 

[Waggles]

Maybe this latest revelation will cause the church to look at itself and change and become more Christ-like.

No. This will not happen. The spiritual corruption of Rome and the Papacy is in its very history of usurping and replacing the original Apostolic gospel with a worldly religious government.
The political power of the Roman Catholic Church is part of the hypocrisy and sinfulness of this world's pursuit of worldly riches and power over others.

As to homosexual priests and clerics in the RC church that is a product of several factors:
1: the "church" being a haven for homosexuals (as the arts are) in a society that condemned homosexuality as a perversion and as a moral evil.
2: religious orphanages and schools provided sexual fodder to wicked men who had control over these poor unfortunate children; and thereby abused their trust to morally care for them.
3: the closed society of RC communities. And it is not only the RCs at fault here. Some cults are also guilty of such abominable abuses against children. Closed communities, not open to public interaction, are always a source of dangers to their members and to children.
4: forbidding to marry - this is in direct violation of Christian teaching. It underlies the dangers of the closed single sex communities that the RC church is comprised of.

Rome is way past any possibility of reform. Roman Catholicism is an unrepentant child and even though she is guilty of the martyrdom of millions of 'heretics' and protestants, Jews and Muslims over the centuries she still adheres to her blasphemies; and espouses herself as the Mother Church - inviting all wayward denominations to come and return back to Rome.

3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.
Revelation 18:3-5

 

[Waggles]

1 Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Timothy 4:1-3

 

[Waggles]

What percentage of the general population are paedophiles?

I think it is a matter of opportunity. And adults having sex with underage children is much more rife than most western societies' want to admit to.
Rock'n'roll songs have promoted having sex with underage girls in many a song.
And definitely one of the rewards of being a famous band or rock singer are "groupies" - young girls who desire the fame of having slept with one of the famous / celebrity rockers.

Freud came across molestation and rape when he started psychoanalysis treatment of respectable Viennese women; who recalled interference from fathers, uncles, cousins and so on.

Child marriages in Europe's royal families to secure an heir were not uncommon.

The "Gay Liberation" movement of the 1970s promoted boy love and the right for boys to discover their sexuality through sexual involvement with older men.

inappropriate contentography is rampant with sexualizing youth and children. Internet inappropriate contentography is the biggest outlet for the perverse voyeurism of adults seeking children.
Then there is also the sex tourist trade to South-East Asia (Cambodia, etc.). Big business and well catered for by respectable travel agencies and airlines.

Children are sexualized these days through pop culture, advertising and clothing fashions.

How many paedophiles are there in today's society? Children have become a sexualized marketed commodity aided and abetted by un-Godly parents and social workers.
It is no longer just a small warped minority, but part of our fallen western consumerism.

 

[Zoii]

While much focus has been on the Catholic Church, The Royal Commission this year will turn an increasing level of attention to other churches including the Uniting, Anglican and Pentecostal churches.

A quote from the commission on Church of England Boys Society review:
"In the 1990s and 2000s a number of people involved in or associated with CEBS in the Anglican Dioceses of Tasmania, Sydney and Brisbane were convicted of child sexual abuse offences. These people included:


Louis Daniels, a member of the clergy in the Diocese of Tasmania
Garth Hawkins, a member of the clergy in the Diocese of Tasmania
John Elliot, a lay CEBS leader in the Dioceses of Tasmania and Brisbane and later a priest in the Diocese of Brisbane
Simon Jacobs, a lay CEBS leader in the Diocese of Sydney.

In addition, Mr Robert Brandenburg, a lay CEBS leader in the Diocese of Adelaide, was charged with a large number of child sexual abuse offences. He took his own life before the charges came to trial"

http://www.childabuseroyalcommissio...-9ce3-c36253cc96de/Report-of-Case-Study-No-36

 

[Dave-W]

While much focus has been on the Catholic Church, The Royal Commission this year will turn an increasing level of attention to other churches including the Uniting, Anglican and Pentecostal churches.

I think that is a good approach. It is not limited to Catholics.

 

[loveofourlord]

I think that is a good approach. It is not limited to Catholics.

yeah, but the catholic church has the far far larger problem because they are the ones covering it up and making sure the priests don't go to jail, lets not pretend that, that isn't why they are in hotter water.

I don't blame the catholic for the pedophiles, I blame them for allowing them to molest children for decades by shuffling them around.

 

[Zoii]

yeah, but the catholic church has the far far larger problem because they are the ones covering it up and making sure the priests don't go to jail, lets not pretend that, that isn't why they are in hotter water.

I don't blame the catholic for the pedophiles, I blame them for allowing them to molest children for decades by shuffling them around.

It would appear through the commissions initial investigations, that systematic cover-up and lying about crimes committed within their ranks, is certainly NOT confined to the Catholic church but is equally endemic in the anglican, pentacostal, jewish, hindu, uniting church, salvation army and a host of orphanages and schools.

I agree the catholic church was, and still is reprehensible. But do not translate that to mean that other religions are not just as bad. That level of belief and complacency has contributed to the scale of the problem. I would recommend you read some of the work of the commission who outlines just how endemic this is in institutions of all types that care for children. In essence I am saying...its probably in your church too!!

 

[Zoii]

AND just in case you thought paedophilia and sexual crime wasn't continuing in YOUR church, this report [albeit 2 1/2 years old] shows the prevalence NOT with Catholics but with protestant pastors for just ONE month
"25 MORE SHOCKING ARRESTS": Pastors Charged With Sex Crimes - Horus Gilgamesh | Born-Again Heretic

 

[SolomonVII]

Churches, and especially Catholic churches, provide the kind of enviornment that hebephiles, and hebephiles of the homosexual variety in particular , are in a positon to satiate their sexual needs..
They are in a position of trust, in a position with open access to teenagers, and in a position where not being married to a woman is not suspect.

It is not an accident that seminaries had become a bathhouse culture at the height of the scandals.

 

[Dave-W]

AND just in case you thought paedophilia and sexual crime wasn't continuing in YOUR church, this report [albeit 2 1/2 years old] shows the prevalence NOT with Catholics but with protestant pastors for just ONE month
"25 MORE SHOCKING ARRESTS": Pastors Charged With Sex Crimes - Horus Gilgamesh | Born-Again Heretic

Indeed. But for some reason the (married) protestant ministers seem to do this with little or no publicity.

 

[Tallguy88]

Churches, and especially Catholic churches, provide the kind of enviornment that hebephiles, and hebephiles of the homosexual variety in particular , are in a positon to satiate their sexual needs..
They are in a position of trust, in a position with open access to teenagers, and in a position where not being married to a woman is not suspect.

It is not an accident that seminaries had become a bathhouse culture at the height of the scandals.

Why would not being married make you suspect of being a pedophile? Most child molesters are married.

 

[SolomonVII]

Why would not being married make you suspect of being a pedophile? Most child molesters are married.

Calling the priest sex scandal a pedophile scandal was a misnomer.
Most of the priests were hebephiles, and went after teen-aged boys. Marriage is not simply an interest for this type of person.
Now in terms of pedophilia, the break down of marriage, and the advent of a lot of single mothers with young kids is a field day for this kind of man. Grateful mothers and kids without fathers present to protect them is a great opportunity for pedophiles.

 

[Dave-W]

Most of the priests were hebephiles,

Never heard of that word before.

 

[Waggles]

Most of the priests were hebephiles, and went after teen-aged boys.

I think you will find that many were homosexual / bisexual and used the in-house population of (mostly) boys as a source
of sexual gratification.
Predatory behaviour that came about through the construction of large institutions housing numerous children.
Same-sex institutions both in the Catholic Church and their "homes" and orphanages.
And doctrines, both Catholic and Protestant, that allowed for lust and wickedness in the flesh by false teachings that the
perpetrators could simply confess their sins through ritual prayers and be forgiven for every trespass.

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light,
because their deeds were evil.
For every one that does evil hates the light, neither comes to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
John 3:19-20
Hence the enormous effort into covering up their wickedness and denying the complaints of the abused children.

 

[Paidiske]

There's a well-established distinction between people who have a sexual attraction to pre-pubescent children (paedophiles), pubescent teens (hebephiles), and those who have a degree of physical maturity but are not yet adults (ephebophiles). Generally speaking the age ranges of the children targetted sits at 10 and under, 11-14, and 15-16, respectively.

 

[Waggles]

The sin is in the wickedness, not the labels.
1> the betrayal of Jesus and the gospel. Discrediting righteousness before the world.
2> predators feeding upon children and teenagers trapped within the walls of homes and institutions
that ought to have been sanctuaries of safety; but where cesspools of lasciviousness.
3> terrible consequences to the emotional and psychological health of the victims.
Lives destroyed.
4> destruction of the moral and spiritual lives of many young people who went on to reject
Christian faith due to the wickedness of priests, monks, brothers etc. who betrayed them.
5> rather than Christian love and mercy to the victims these predators, their superiors and the
churches guilty of all this, put so much effort into protecting the reputation of their churches and institutions
at the expense of justice for the young people who were molested, raped and abused.
6> giving ammunition to the un-Godly and the world to condemn the gospel as phony and that those
as unbelievers not guilty of such wickedness must be OK and even better than Christians.

 

[SolomonVII]

I think you will find that many were homosexual / bisexual and used the in-house population of (mostly) boys as a source
of sexual gratification.
Predatory behaviour that came about through the construction of large institutions housing numerous children.
Same-sex institutions both in the Catholic Church and their "homes" and orphanages.
And doctrines, both Catholic and Protestant, that allowed for lust and wickedness in the flesh by false teachings that the
perpetrators could simply confess their sins through ritual prayers and be forgiven for every trespass.

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light,
because their deeds were evil.
For every one that does evil hates the light, neither comes to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
John 3:19-20
Hence the enormous effort into covering up their wickedness and denying the complaints of the abused children.

This is a pretty good summary.
The false teaching especially in the 1960's and 1970's was according to the secular wisdom of the ages too, and that spiritual growth would come through unconditional love and acceptance. There was no real recognition of how untreatable that these sexual conditions, or any sexual conditions for that matter, would be.
Institutional cover-ups are totally predictable, and are the bane of any and every institution. Authoritarian institutions that have not put into place checks and balances, and competing interests that help censure each other are especially prone to cover-ups.
In terms of pedophile cases, the data for Catholic priest and incidents of this behavior follow the percentages of society as a whole. But in terms of hebephile cases, adolescent boys and priest, these incidents were occurring at higher rates that the population at large. It was a bathhouse culture that took over the seminaries, and went on to take advantage of the wayward boys homes and orphanages as sexual opportunities.
And there were just no checks and balances in place.