Quid est Veritas?

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Firstly, consider what is meant by Health. Generally, we are healthy or something is healthy or in a state of health, when it is free of disease; or does not predispose or helps prevent disease or a pathological state. It is thus defined by what it is not. Humans have a wide variance of functioning though, so we have to assume an Ideal Man as it were. However to define this in practice, we have to take a bell curve and take cut-offs for the mean thereof - assuming that the high and low are both predisposing to something not within what we see as desirable.

So for instance, with blood pressure we know hypertension leads to strokes and infarcts, and low pressure is associated with shock and syncopal events. However, normal functioning for some people might be on the high end, even if in the long run, that might be harmful. Hence we assume a 'normal' blood pressure which we are aiming at, which seems to be the general state in man.

Now most medical diseases and such, work in like manner - especially Chronic ones. When an hypertensive has high blood pressure, this is usually secondary to something - an excessive sodium load or overcome renal vascular occlusion say, though often we don't actually know and term it idiopathic. For that person, it is 'normal' though, how his body's homeostasis works, but is unhealthy when measured against our concept of Health, an hypothetical ideal.

So let us review Atheism by these criteria. Clearly it is not the norm for humans, as universally all cultures have some form of religious belief historically. So already we are dealing with an outlier. Now hyper-religiosity is also used as a symptom of mental illness, but that is because it is one that is highly sensitive to being picked up - someone declares themselves a prophet or so. A hyper-atheism on this same spectrum of belief, would not have any overt symptoms beyond perhaps denying religion or maybe a lack of tolerance toward it. So its sensitivity is low as a symptom. Atheists though, are over-represented in mental health care use, and religion is protective. Numerous studies have demonstrated that religion is positively correlated with better mental, as well as physical, health. For instance:

Religion, Health, and Psychological Well-Being
Religion and health: Is there an association, is it valid, and is it causal? - ScienceDirect
Religious and Spiritual Factors in Depression: Review and Integration of the Research

Non-Religion is associated with poorer mental health outcomes. Beyond that, religious people tend to be healthier in general than their peers of the same diet, lifestyle and socio-economic class who are not. While clear causality has not been demonstrated beyond doubt, the correlation is definite, though a specific physiological mechanism for it has not been found, and psychological theories tend to cluster around ideas of 'certainty' or so, but even there, people with religious affiliation and strong devotion to their religious practices, outperform all on health parameters.

Secularity, religiosity, and health: Physical and mental health differences between atheists, agnostics, and nonaffiliated theists compared to religiously affiliated individuals - ScienceDirect
The Benefits of Religious Fundamentalism

To return to what is Healthy then, Atheism and non-religion clearly have worse ourcomes on measurable health factors and use of medical services. It is also not a natural position for humans to take, as the vast majority of humans throughout history have been religious. We are thus forced to conclude that it is an outlier on human functioning with potential factors predisposing to disease or undesirable outcomes, and our Ideal Man, our hypothetical examplar of health, would be religious.

What of Disease though? A disease is something which produces specific symptoms or a syndromic association of symptoms, that negatively affect health. It is defined by taking factors that deviate from the norm, and to cluster them together, as in my above example of Hypertension or associated sequalae like strokes. A lot hedges on definitions here, but the argument to label Atheism and Non-Religion unhealthy is strong; but are these symptoms of a presumably mental illness, or merely a predisposing malady such as being born with a less effective gene, or unhealthy human behaviour like smoking or a sedentary lifestyle? The argument to label it a disease itself can even be made, but of course, that hedges on what is termed desirable - if we cannot agree on basic desirable outcomes, then all bets are off, such can be seen with transgenderism vs gender identity disorder.

However, being religious is in general better for you. Sure, every now and then we'd have people going off the rails and declaring themself to be God or so, but in like manner, we have people with brittle bone diseases or the ilk, in which healthy exercise would be deleterious.

Encouraging Theism, and more than that, strong devotion, would be a public health benefit. Functionally, trying to advance atheism is akin to encouraging someone to take up smoking or to not have their kids vaccinated.


End Note: Nowadays it is difficult to assess these clearly, so read studies with care. For instance, a US study found the population of atheists they studied (which tends to be younger) to have better dietary practices and be more active, so consequently were 'healthier' than the more sedentary and older religious group. This is why meta-analyses and trying to correct for confounding factors are so important, on questions such as these.
Health and Well-Being Among the Non-religious: Atheists, Agnostics, and No Preference Compared with Religious Group Members

Further to note, most studies are done in the WEIRD countries (Western, Educated, Industrialised, Rich, Democratic), so the religious populations we are talking about, tend to be mostly Christian, with some Jews and Buddhists and Hindus vs the modern expansion of atheism and non-religiously affiliated, which may be a confounding factor.
 

zippy2006

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Encouraging Theism, and more than that, strong devotion, would be a public health benefit. Functionally, trying to advance atheism is akin to encouraging someone to take up smoking or to not have their kids vaccinated.

Interesting thread, Quid. This makes a lot of sense to me. It is what we would expect if God made man a religious being. Often the arguments claiming that atheism leads to better personal or societal health are either anecdotal or highly abstract, with little regard for empirical data.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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Firstly, consider what is meant by Health. Generally, we are healthy or something is healthy or in a state of health, when it is free of disease; or does not predispose or helps prevent disease or a pathological state. It is thus defined by what it is not. Humans have a wide variance of functioning though, so we have to assume an Ideal Man as it were. However to define this in practice, we have to take a bell curve and take cut-offs for the mean thereof - assuming that the high and low are both predisposing to something not within what we see as desirable.

So for instance, with blood pressure we know hypertension leads to strokes and infarcts, and low pressure is associated with shock and syncopal events. However, normal functioning for some people might be on the high end, even if in the long run, that might be harmful. Hence we assume a 'normal' blood pressure which we are aiming at, which seems to be the general state in man.

Now most medical diseases and such, work in like manner - especially Chronic ones. When an hypertensive has high blood pressure, this is usually secondary to something - an excessive sodium load or overcome renal vascular occlusion say, though often we don't actually know and term it idiopathic. For that person, it is 'normal' though, how his body's homeostasis works, but is unhealthy when measured against our concept of Health, an hypothetical ideal.

So let us review Atheism by these criteria. Clearly it is not the norm for humans, as universally all cultures have some form of religious belief historically. So already we are dealing with an outlier. Now hyper-religiosity is also used as a symptom of mental illness, but that is because it is one that is highly sensitive to being picked up - someone declares themselves a prophet or so. A hyper-atheism on this same spectrum of belief, would not have any overt symptoms beyond perhaps denying religion or maybe a lack of tolerance toward it. So its sensitivity is low as a symptom. Atheists though, are over-represented in mental health care use, and religion is protective. Numerous studies have demonstrated that religion is positively correlated with better mental, as well as physical, health. For instance:

Religion, Health, and Psychological Well-Being
Religion and health: Is there an association, is it valid, and is it causal? - ScienceDirect
Religious and Spiritual Factors in Depression: Review and Integration of the Research

Non-Religion is associated with poorer mental health outcomes. Beyond that, religious people tend to be healthier in general than their peers of the same diet, lifestyle and socio-economic class who are not. While clear causality has not been demonstrated beyond doubt, the correlation is definite, though a specific physiological mechanism for it has not been found, and psychological theories tend to cluster around ideas of 'certainty' or so, but even there, people with religious affiliation and strong devotion to their religious practices, outperform all on health parameters.

Secularity, religiosity, and health: Physical and mental health differences between atheists, agnostics, and nonaffiliated theists compared to religiously affiliated individuals - ScienceDirect
The Benefits of Religious Fundamentalism

To return to what is Healthy then, Atheism and non-religion clearly have worse ourcomes on measurable health factors and use of medical services. It is also not a natural position for humans to take, as the vast majority of humans throughout history have been religious. We are thus forced to conclude that it is an outlier on human functioning with potential factors predisposing to disease or undesirable outcomes, and our Ideal Man, our hypothetical examplar of health, would be religious.

What of Disease though? A disease is something which produces specific symptoms or a syndromic association of symptoms, that negatively affect health. It is defined by taking factors that deviate from the norm, and to cluster them together, as in my above example of Hypertension or associated sequalae like strokes. A lot hedges on definitions here, but the argument to label Atheism and Non-Religion unhealthy is strong; but are these symptoms of a presumably mental illness, or merely a predisposing malady such as being born with a less effective gene, or unhealthy human behaviour like smoking or a sedentary lifestyle? The argument to label it a disease itself can even be made, but of course, that hedges on what is termed desirable - if we cannot agree on basic desirable outcomes, then all bets are off, such can be seen with transgenderism vs gender identity disorder.

However, being religious is in general better for you. Sure, every now and then we'd have people going off the rails and declaring themself to be God or so, but in like manner, we have people with brittle bone diseases or the ilk, in which healthy exercise would be deleterious.

Encouraging Theism, and more than that, strong devotion, would be a public health benefit. Functionally, trying to advance atheism is akin to encouraging someone to take up smoking or to not have their kids vaccinated.


End Note: Nowadays it is difficult to assess these clearly, so read studies with care. For instance, a US study found the population of atheists they studied (which tends to be younger) to have better dietary practices and be more active, so consequently were 'healthier' than the more sedentary and older religious group. This is why meta-analyses and trying to correct for confounding factors are so important, on questions such as these.
Health and Well-Being Among the Non-religious: Atheists, Agnostics, and No Preference Compared with Religious Group Members

Further to note, most studies are done in the WEIRD countries (Western, Educated, Industrialised, Rich, Democratic), so the religious populations we are talking about, tend to be mostly Christian, with some Jews and Buddhists and Hindus vs the modern expansion of atheism and non-religiously affiliated, which may be a confounding factor.
Why does this matter if true? Many atheists want to know what is true and this does not give any good evidence that any religion is true.
 
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cvanwey

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Firstly, consider what is meant by Health. Generally, we are healthy or something is healthy or in a state of health, when it is free of disease; or does not predispose or helps prevent disease or a pathological state. It is thus defined by what it is not. Humans have a wide variance of functioning though, so we have to assume an Ideal Man as it were. However to define this in practice, we have to take a bell curve and take cut-offs for the mean thereof - assuming that the high and low are both predisposing to something not within what we see as desirable.

So for instance, with blood pressure we know hypertension leads to strokes and infarcts, and low pressure is associated with shock and syncopal events. However, normal functioning for some people might be on the high end, even if in the long run, that might be harmful. Hence we assume a 'normal' blood pressure which we are aiming at, which seems to be the general state in man.

Now most medical diseases and such, work in like manner - especially Chronic ones. When an hypertensive has high blood pressure, this is usually secondary to something - an excessive sodium load or overcome renal vascular occlusion say, though often we don't actually know and term it idiopathic. For that person, it is 'normal' though, how his body's homeostasis works, but is unhealthy when measured against our concept of Health, an hypothetical ideal.

So let us review Atheism by these criteria. Clearly it is not the norm for humans, as universally all cultures have some form of religious belief historically. So already we are dealing with an outlier. Now hyper-religiosity is also used as a symptom of mental illness, but that is because it is one that is highly sensitive to being picked up - someone declares themselves a prophet or so. A hyper-atheism on this same spectrum of belief, would not have any overt symptoms beyond perhaps denying religion or maybe a lack of tolerance toward it. So its sensitivity is low as a symptom. Atheists though, are over-represented in mental health care use, and religion is protective. Numerous studies have demonstrated that religion is positively correlated with better mental, as well as physical, health. For instance:

Religion, Health, and Psychological Well-Being
Religion and health: Is there an association, is it valid, and is it causal? - ScienceDirect
Religious and Spiritual Factors in Depression: Review and Integration of the Research

Non-Religion is associated with poorer mental health outcomes. Beyond that, religious people tend to be healthier in general than their peers of the same diet, lifestyle and socio-economic class who are not. While clear causality has not been demonstrated beyond doubt, the correlation is definite, though a specific physiological mechanism for it has not been found, and psychological theories tend to cluster around ideas of 'certainty' or so, but even there, people with religious affiliation and strong devotion to their religious practices, outperform all on health parameters.

Secularity, religiosity, and health: Physical and mental health differences between atheists, agnostics, and nonaffiliated theists compared to religiously affiliated individuals - ScienceDirect
The Benefits of Religious Fundamentalism

To return to what is Healthy then, Atheism and non-religion clearly have worse ourcomes on measurable health factors and use of medical services. It is also not a natural position for humans to take, as the vast majority of humans throughout history have been religious. We are thus forced to conclude that it is an outlier on human functioning with potential factors predisposing to disease or undesirable outcomes, and our Ideal Man, our hypothetical examplar of health, would be religious.

What of Disease though? A disease is something which produces specific symptoms or a syndromic association of symptoms, that negatively affect health. It is defined by taking factors that deviate from the norm, and to cluster them together, as in my above example of Hypertension or associated sequalae like strokes. A lot hedges on definitions here, but the argument to label Atheism and Non-Religion unhealthy is strong; but are these symptoms of a presumably mental illness, or merely a predisposing malady such as being born with a less effective gene, or unhealthy human behaviour like smoking or a sedentary lifestyle? The argument to label it a disease itself can even be made, but of course, that hedges on what is termed desirable - if we cannot agree on basic desirable outcomes, then all bets are off, such can be seen with transgenderism vs gender identity disorder.

However, being religious is in general better for you. Sure, every now and then we'd have people going off the rails and declaring themself to be God or so, but in like manner, we have people with brittle bone diseases or the ilk, in which healthy exercise would be deleterious.

Encouraging Theism, and more than that, strong devotion, would be a public health benefit. Functionally, trying to advance atheism is akin to encouraging someone to take up smoking or to not have their kids vaccinated.


End Note: Nowadays it is difficult to assess these clearly, so read studies with care. For instance, a US study found the population of atheists they studied (which tends to be younger) to have better dietary practices and be more active, so consequently were 'healthier' than the more sedentary and older religious group. This is why meta-analyses and trying to correct for confounding factors are so important, on questions such as these.
Health and Well-Being Among the Non-religious: Atheists, Agnostics, and No Preference Compared with Religious Group Members

Further to note, most studies are done in the WEIRD countries (Western, Educated, Industrialised, Rich, Democratic), so the religious populations we are talking about, tend to be mostly Christian, with some Jews and Buddhists and Hindus vs the modern expansion of atheism and non-religiously affiliated, which may be a confounding factor.

In a bazaar way, I almost agree with some of what you state, in part...

Many seem to 'need' to believe there exists some celestial, proverbial, utopian realm, to exist there-after. Many live, what they might consider bleak, unsatisfying, unfulfilled, lives; for whatever reasons(s). If many believe there exists some 'redemption' postmortem, it gives them something to 'look forward to.'

Example:

You have a job you hate, but have no choice because you need the cash. You also have a huge vacation planned a month from now. You go into work that morning. Your boss tells you to do something that day that you really do not want to do. When your boss hits you with the command, you likely would roll with it much easier, since you can think about your future vacation. However, if you later found out the vacation was cancelled indefinitely, your work cancelled all future vacations requests, how would you then take your boss's request(s)?

This kind of parallels 'life'. If we are programmed to believe 'things will be better after this life, because we will soon live in paradise on a permanent vacation', many can just go into auto-pilot, glaze over, not sweat the small stuff, state everything that happens to us is because God already willed it,' and maybe our stress levels might be lower.

BUT.... I'm kind of sick I guess... I'd rather know if it were actually true ;) Does any of this exist there-after, or am I deceiving myself, and when we die, we are simply dead?
 
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LoG

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Why does this matter if true? Many atheists want to know what is true and this does not give any good evidence that any religion is true.

Maybe not but it does point out that both the quality and quantity of life is better for the theist which is something promised to them and is statistically verifiable.
 
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Maybe not but it does point out that both the quality and quantity of life is better for the theist which is something promised to them and is statistically verifiable.
But entirely explicable without the need for an actual God to exist.
Delusions make people happier; happier people are healthier. Well, good for you.
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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Heaven rewards the faithful on earth, and punishes the apostate ?
God makes the rain fall on the just and the unjust. I would think it more a consequence of our actions, than of God rewarding or punishing. The human organism seems to naturally just function better in a religious context.
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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Interesting thread, Quid. This makes a lot of sense to me. It is what we would expect if God made man a religious being. Often the arguments claiming that atheism leads to better personal or societal health are either anecdotal or highly abstract, with little regard for empirical data.
The simple problem for any atheist, is explaining the prevalent religion of humanity. Usually, if a trait is universally present, we are happy to label it advantageous in some manner, but people are loathe to do so for religion. Consequently, they like to say it is a spandrel or unintended consequence of something useful like agenticity, or try and paint it as a sort of virus. This of course, does not fit the facts nor adequately explain why evolutionary method is so turned on its head here. Simply put, religion is more of a good than not, and in the past, atheists and deists acknowledged this - think of Voltaire's If God did not exist, we'd have to invent Him.

As a religious man, it makes perfect sense to me that the human organism works better when attempting to engage with God in some way, and that we would in essence be made to be so. An atheist regarding atheism to be a better state for a human to find themselves in, can only do so by circular argument, and not really by empiric means.
 
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But entirely explicable without the need for an actual God to exist.
Delusions make people happier; happier people are healthier. Well, good for you.

Is it really explicable? Did you realize when you became an atheist that you were going to be taking on a worldview that would lead you to be statistically more prone to depression and other mental health issues, more prone to substance abuse and higher rates of suicide? From what I have seen both on these sort of boards and in life is that atheists are under the delusion that they are the enlightened ones now that they no longer have the need to believe in a God. Should that not make them happier and therefore healthier?
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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Why does this matter if true? Many atheists want to know what is true and this does not give any good evidence that any religion is true.
How pray tell, can Atheism show anything true? We simply cannot absolutely do so, but the prevaling mechanism favoured by Atheists is an empiric or pragmatic approach - Science must be on to something, as planes fly and computers work - or somesuch argument. Here we have pragmatic evidence of religion as a boon to man.

But tell me, why would it matter what was true or not? Why are you valueing truth here, if the end result would be a more miserable life? Seems to me that if you are assuming a materialist existence, as most modern atheists are, chasing an ethereal invented human concept like Truth (in such a model of reality) really has no purpose and only deleterious effects. In essence, it is a delusion, a fixed false belief, to such. Invoking Paschal's wager, not only would it thus make sense to bet on religion for the afterlife, but even for the here and now, seeing pragmatic health benefits are evident.
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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But entirely explicable without the need for an actual God to exist.
Delusions make people happier; happier people are healthier. Well, good for you.
Delusions do not make people happier. A delusion is a fixed, false belief. It may be innocuous, it may be terrifying; but it is divorced from our shared intersubjective experience, and thus usually has negative effects mostly. If you are convinced you are the greatest driver but are poor at it, at some point you'll crash and burn when reality strikes. That is why it is a premiere psychiatric symptom.

Something which allows us to cope better, is usually treated as a real experience: Sight for instance, reflects our eyes picking up light, but what we 'see', the qualia we experience, is an altered and neurally mediated thing. It is thus not a direct observation, but by its utility and the usual intersubjectivity of it, we assume it reflects something 'real'. It may be false, as certainly occurs in hallucinations, though our experience would differ not one iota between one and the other. So here, religion is helping people to cope, is pragmatically useful, and it is intersubjective too; in that the majority of people acknowledge spiritual existence in some manner. A delusion can consist of not seeing something seen by others plainly too.

Further, are happier people healthier; or are healthier people happier? You are assuming too much here.
 
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God makes the rain fall on the just and the unjust. I would think it more a consequence of our actions, than of God rewarding or punishing. The human organism seems to naturally just function better in a religious context.
and vengeance and repayment are God's?

God does judge and punish sinners?

whereas everything works together for the benefit of the righteous (Romans 8:28)?
 
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Is it really explicable?
Completely.

Did you realize when you became an atheist that you were going to be taking on a worldview that would lead you to be statistically more prone to depression and other mental health issues, more prone to substance abuse and higher rates of suicide?
I guess I'll just have to eat healthily, then, and exercise my mind and body.

From what I have seen both on these sort of boards and in life is that atheists are under the delusion that they are the enlightened ones now that they no longer have the need to believe in a God. Should that not make them happier and therefore healthier?
In one sense, yes. Many atheists I have read speak of how liberating it is to be free from dogma. To no longer have to hate people. To no longer be burdened with the crushing fear of hell. O the other hand, if you are able to ignore the contradictions in the Bible and just focus on the warm fuzy feeling of having a Big Friend always with you, I imagine that can be quite comforting.
 
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Delusions do not make people happier. A delusion is a fixed, false belief. It may be innocuous, it may be terrifying; but it is divorced from our shared intersubjective experience, and thus usually has negative effects mostly.
If God is not real, then all of the people who believe in Him have a fixed, false belief. QED.
 
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But tell me, why would it matter what was true or not? Why are you valueing truth here, if the end result would be a more miserable life?

This is part of the problem with discussions on religion that assume the only valuable discussion is one focused solely on epistemic reasons for faith. If, for the sake of argument, we allow that God's existence can be neither proved nor disproved, then the discussion at some point should admit of non-epistemic reasons for faith. In other words, pragmatic reasons, like the one you have highlighted, should be on the table as legitimate points of discussion. I am reminded of William James reply to William Clifford (who insisted nothing should be believed without sufficient evidence):

"Believe truth! Shun error!—these, we see, are two materially different laws; and by choosing between them we may end by coloring differently our whole intellectual life. We may regard the chase for truth as paramount, and the avoidance of error as secondary; or we may, on the other hand, treat the avoidance of error as more imperative, and let truth take its chance. Clifford, in the instructive passage which I have quoted, exhorts us to the latter course. Believe nothing, he tells us, keep your mind in suspense forever, rather than by closing it on insufficient evidence incur the awful risk of believing lies. You, on the other hand, may think that the risk of being in error is a very small matter when compared with the blessings of real knowledge, and be ready to be duped many times in your investigation rather than postpone indefinitely the chance of guessing true. I myself find it impossible to go with Clifford. We must remember that these feelings of our duty about either truth or error are in any case only expressions of our passional life.

Biologically considered, our minds are as ready to grind out falsehood as veracity, and he who says, "Better go without belief forever than believe a lie!" merely shows his own preponderant private horror of becoming a dupe. He may be critical of many of his desires and fears, but this fear he slavishly obeys. He cannot imagine any one questioning its binding force. For my own part, I have also a horror of being duped; but I can believe that worse things than being duped may happen to a man in this world: so Clifford's exhortation has to my ears a thoroughly fantastic sound. It is like a general informing his soldiers that it is better to keep out of battle forever than to risk a single wound."

The Will to Believe - Wikipedia
 
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Firstly, consider what is meant by Health. Generally, we are healthy or something is healthy or in a state of health, when it is free of disease; or does not predispose or helps prevent disease or a pathological state. It is thus defined by what it is not. Humans have a wide variance of functioning though, so we have to assume an Ideal Man as it were. However to define this in practice, we have to take a bell curve and take cut-offs for the mean thereof - assuming that the high and low are both predisposing to something not within what we see as desirable.

So for instance, with blood pressure we know hypertension leads to strokes and infarcts, and low pressure is associated with shock and syncopal events. However, normal functioning for some people might be on the high end, even if in the long run, that might be harmful. Hence we assume a 'normal' blood pressure which we are aiming at, which seems to be the general state in man.

Now most medical diseases and such, work in like manner - especially Chronic ones. When an hypertensive has high blood pressure, this is usually secondary to something - an excessive sodium load or overcome renal vascular occlusion say, though often we don't actually know and term it idiopathic. For that person, it is 'normal' though, how his body's homeostasis works, but is unhealthy when measured against our concept of Health, an hypothetical ideal.

So let us review Atheism by these criteria. Clearly it is not the norm for humans, as universally all cultures have some form of religious belief historically. So already we are dealing with an outlier. Now hyper-religiosity is also used as a symptom of mental illness, but that is because it is one that is highly sensitive to being picked up - someone declares themselves a prophet or so. A hyper-atheism on this same spectrum of belief, would not have any overt symptoms beyond perhaps denying religion or maybe a lack of tolerance toward it. So its sensitivity is low as a symptom. Atheists though, are over-represented in mental health care use, and religion is protective. Numerous studies have demonstrated that religion is positively correlated with better mental, as well as physical, health. For instance:

Religion, Health, and Psychological Well-Being
Religion and health: Is there an association, is it valid, and is it causal? - ScienceDirect
Religious and Spiritual Factors in Depression: Review and Integration of the Research

Non-Religion is associated with poorer mental health outcomes. Beyond that, religious people tend to be healthier in general than their peers of the same diet, lifestyle and socio-economic class who are not. While clear causality has not been demonstrated beyond doubt, the correlation is definite, though a specific physiological mechanism for it has not been found, and psychological theories tend to cluster around ideas of 'certainty' or so, but even there, people with religious affiliation and strong devotion to their religious practices, outperform all on health parameters.

Secularity, religiosity, and health: Physical and mental health differences between atheists, agnostics, and nonaffiliated theists compared to religiously affiliated individuals - ScienceDirect
The Benefits of Religious Fundamentalism

To return to what is Healthy then, Atheism and non-religion clearly have worse ourcomes on measurable health factors and use of medical services. It is also not a natural position for humans to take, as the vast majority of humans throughout history have been religious. We are thus forced to conclude that it is an outlier on human functioning with potential factors predisposing to disease or undesirable outcomes, and our Ideal Man, our hypothetical examplar of health, would be religious.

What of Disease though? A disease is something which produces specific symptoms or a syndromic association of symptoms, that negatively affect health. It is defined by taking factors that deviate from the norm, and to cluster them together, as in my above example of Hypertension or associated sequalae like strokes. A lot hedges on definitions here, but the argument to label Atheism and Non-Religion unhealthy is strong; but are these symptoms of a presumably mental illness, or merely a predisposing malady such as being born with a less effective gene, or unhealthy human behaviour like smoking or a sedentary lifestyle? The argument to label it a disease itself can even be made, but of course, that hedges on what is termed desirable - if we cannot agree on basic desirable outcomes, then all bets are off, such can be seen with transgenderism vs gender identity disorder.

However, being religious is in general better for you. Sure, every now and then we'd have people going off the rails and declaring themself to be God or so, but in like manner, we have people with brittle bone diseases or the ilk, in which healthy exercise would be deleterious.

Encouraging Theism, and more than that, strong devotion, would be a public health benefit. Functionally, trying to advance atheism is akin to encouraging someone to take up smoking or to not have their kids vaccinated.


End Note: Nowadays it is difficult to assess these clearly, so read studies with care. For instance, a US study found the population of atheists they studied (which tends to be younger) to have better dietary practices and be more active, so consequently were 'healthier' than the more sedentary and older religious group. This is why meta-analyses and trying to correct for confounding factors are so important, on questions such as these.
Health and Well-Being Among the Non-religious: Atheists, Agnostics, and No Preference Compared with Religious Group Members

Further to note, most studies are done in the WEIRD countries (Western, Educated, Industrialised, Rich, Democratic), so the religious populations we are talking about, tend to be mostly Christian, with some Jews and Buddhists and Hindus vs the modern expansion of atheism and non-religiously affiliated, which may be a confounding factor.

There is nothing profound about any of this.

Firstly, humans are a social species. Religious people tend to be happier and healthier not because there is anything special about religion, but because religion is (usually) a socially participatory activity. Religious congregations also provide social support networks.

Secondly, people who are healthy and happy tend to be more socially active, so of course you are going to find higher rates of reported health and happiness when you study socially active people, such as those who are actively involved in a religious congregation.

Thirdly, none of the links you shared provide convincing evidence that there is anything special about religious social activity in particular, with regard to mental or physical health. Some of them directly contradict your thesis. You asserted 'Non-Religion is associated with poorer mental health outcomes' immediately before sharing a link to a study, 'Secularity, religiosity, and health', the abstract of which contains the following:

Results indicate better physical health outcomes for atheists compared to other secular individuals and members of some religious traditions. Atheists also reported significantly lower levels of psychiatric symptoms (anxiety, paranoia, obsession, and compulsion) compared to both other seculars and members of most religious traditions.

I don't feel the need to elaborate.

All this data tells me is that as society at large becomes progressively less religious, there will have to be secular communities and support networks to replace religious ones. I'm privileged to be part of one, but the need is big, and is going to get bigger.
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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If God is not real, then all of the people who believe in Him have a fixed, false belief. QED.
If Idealism is true, then all of the people who value empiric evidence have a fixed, false belief. Such If/then reasoning really adds nothing to any discussion. However, the group falling outside of standard intersubjective human experience is not the theists.
 
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zippy2006

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If God is not real, then all of the people who believe in Him have a fixed, false belief. QED.

That's a conditional statement, not a proof, and it has nothing to do with the substantial post you claim to be responding to. "Delusions do not make people happier. (...) That is why it is a premiere psychiatric symptom."

I don't feel the need to elaborate.

It is saying that although religiosity correlates to positive health outcomes, there is variance between different secular groups.
 
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Eight Foot Manchild

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It is saying that although religiosity correlates to positive health outcomes, there is variance between different secular groups.

Correct. Specifically, it says atheists have it better.

As in, the exact opposite of the thesis of this thread.
 
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