AstraZeneca/Oxford Announce Positive results for their vaccine

Dave G.

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While I try to sample a wide variety of nightmares while I sleep (last night was actually vampires with chainsaws!) I have never managed one about dry ice, perhaps because I've used it so routinely in my career. I suspect pretty much everyone in the US can get stuff frozen in dry ice shipped to their door. I wonder if dry ice might actually better than refrigerated in less developed countries also. You don't need a refrigerated truck, for instance.
Hah ! Since you're a prolific dreamer dry ice is up and coming now that it's lock trapped into your memory banks !!
 
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chevyontheriver

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Trump didn't make this vaccination. And Democrats are smart enough to know this. I know plenty of Democrats plan to take this vaccine, When it's available. People are being lied to or believing un educated people, that know nothing about politics. I know plenty of Trump supporters and Conservative Christians that wont take this vaccine or any.
It's been made a political disease. And there are anti-Trumpers who will put their politics ahead of public health. Just like the anti-vax crowd puts their phobias ahead of public health. Now I don't like needles but I'll take this one. I'm going to ask for a morally produced vaccine though. The Catholic hospital I would get the vaccine through had better be able to handle that.
 
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Tanj

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chevyontheriver

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Correction: Some are developed using 2 foetal cell lines that came from 2 abortions 60 years ago.

I get this may have the same moral issues, but lets try for some accuracy.

Use of fetal tissue in vaccine development - Wikipedia.
Which brings up the way one might use Nazi medicine. It's old, so is it OK to use his research? Doctor Joe Mengele learned a lot of interesting things about human physiology. For example, he learned a lot about freezing people to death. Most doctors won't touch that work. Eh, maybe these days it's all OK.
 
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Tanj

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Which brings up the way one might use Nazi medicine. It's old, so is it OK to use his research? Doctor Joe Mengele learned a lot of interesting things about human physiology. For example, he learned a lot about freezing people to death. Most doctors won't touch that work. Eh, maybe these days it's all OK.

Like I said, it might well have the same moral issues, I mean, I explicitly said that.. Regardless, the use of present tense... "Some are developed using fetal cell lines obtained through abortions" is misleading. It was my understanding your religion frowned on falsehood and confusion. But I guess I could be wrong.

Have you seen what the Catholic Church has to say on the matter?

"The Pontifical Academy for Life, concluded in 2005 that parents may allow their children to receive vaccines made from fetal tissue if no alternative exists and there is a grave health risk."
 
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chevyontheriver

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Like I said, it might well have the same moral issues, I mean, I explicitly said that.. Regardless, the use of present tense... "Some are developed using fetal cell lines obtained through abortions" is misleading. It was my understanding your religion frowned on falsehood and confusion. But I guess I could be wrong.
You could be wrong, particularly about my supposed spreading of falsehood and confusion. Some are being developed (in the present) using fetal cell lines obtained through abortions (at some point in time). If you wish to challenge that you are free to do so. But there is no intent on my part to mislead or spread falsehood or confuse.

The current known moral status of the various Covid vaccines is found here: https://cogforlife.org/wp-content/uploads/CovidCompareMoralImmoral.pdf
"The Pontifical Academy for Life, concluded in 2005 that parents may allow their children to receive vaccines made from fetal tissue if no alternative exists and there is a grave health risk."
That is true, but it is a moral 'low pass' and then only if, as you quoted, 'no alternative exists'. Looks like there will be alternatives.
 
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mindlight

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I wont be taking it. Maybe in several years time. Not now. These things usually take years to make sure they are safe, long term.

The Oxford research is based on a project that predates covid19 explaining how they have come up with the best vaccine so far from a global distribution point of view. It can be stored in a fridge and is much cheaper than the alternatives. Efficacy of 90% with the proper dosage regime means it is also as effective as the alternatives.
 
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Whyayeman

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I expect to be offered the Oxford vaccine some time after Christmas and I will jump at the chance. I trust the Oxford team to provide a safe vaccine; I trust the very extensive testing that has taken place. Why should I trust them? One reason would be that there are more Nobel Laureates per square mile in Oxford than anywhere else in the world. I certainly trust their word over cockamamy conspiracy theory inventors.

Nano-technology? Absolute idiocy! If you carry a mobile phone, go on social media or buy something on a card you leave an easily read trail of your movements and your lifestyle. And people use the data. I think the conspiracy theory goes something like this: give everybody a disease or trick them into thinking they have a disease; pretend to find a miracle cure and sell it, thereby injecting nano-technology into them.

Mwa-ha-ha-ha! (Strokes white cat on lap.)
 
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Lost4words

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The Oxford research is based on a project that predates covid19 explaining how they have come up with the best vaccine so far from a global distribution point of view. It can be stored in a fridge and is much cheaper than the alternatives. Efficacy of 90% with the proper dosage regime means it is also as effective as the alternatives.

I will still stay clear of it..
 
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MyOwnSockPuppet

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I expect to be offered the Oxford vaccine some time after Christmas and I will jump at the chance. I trust the Oxford team to provide a safe vaccine; I trust the very extensive testing that has taken place. Why should I trust them? One reason would be that there are more Nobel Laureates per square mile in Oxford than anywhere else in the world. I certainly trust their word over cockamamy conspiracy theory inventors.

Nano-technology? Absolute idiocy! If you carry a mobile phone, go on social media or buy something on a card you leave an easily read trail of your movements and your lifestyle. And people use the data. I think the conspiracy theory goes something like this: give everybody a disease or trick them into thinking they have a disease; pretend to find a miracle cure and sell it, thereby injecting nano-technology into them.

Mwa-ha-ha-ha! (Strokes white cat on lap.)

I'm not sure where I'd be in the priority list, my immune system treats most ilnesses as very small sources of extra protein, but my wife's medical history has more red flags on it than the Labour Party conference.
I'd imagine that she'll be in the first wave and I (on the guilt by association theory) will be somewhere between that and the normal place in the queue for a forty-something white male.

As far as the tinfoil hat nanosurveillance brigade, you're right, plus in the UK if you go out in any town or city centre there'll be cctv cameras anyway.
 
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Aaron_Bethlhm

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I will still stay clear of it..
How about "an offer you maybe can't refuse? " .... like FOR FREE - FORD F150 -
'guaranteed' to get over 8mpg (downhill anyway) , might have bad transmission. might have 2 spark plugs missing. might have sugar in the gass. might have toxic exhaust leak into the cab ....
but the government will giver it to you for free, paying 18,000 out of taxpayer money , so free , but for you maybe a $500.00 handling charge ? and no refunds, no suing for liability if anything happens, perhaps subject to a court gag order .... and so on....
 
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sesquiterpene

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How about "an offer you maybe can't refuse? " .... like FOR FREE - FORD F150 -
'guaranteed' to get over 8mpg (downhill anyway) , might have bad transmission. might have 2 spark plugs missing. might have sugar in the gass. might have toxic exhaust leak into the cab ....
but the government will giver it to you for free, paying 18,000 out of taxpayer money , so free , but for you maybe a $500.00 handling charge ? and no refunds, no suing for liability if anything happens, perhaps subject to a court gag order .... and so on....
What are you babbling about? I don't think you are in the right thread - please double-check.
 
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Aaron_Bethlhm

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What are you babbling about? I don't think you are in the right thread - please double-check.
I've seen dozens if not hundreds of people, and possibly many thousands referred to, who will glibly, naively, and happily, take a pill without having any idea what it does to them. (like trusting a used-car (or new?) salesman) ...
Even without ever searching for what really happens or why and how, and what to honestly do about that.
Thus as God says in His Word - those who put their trust in mankind/ the flesh/
God curses.
 
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Lost4words

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How about "an offer you maybe can't refuse? " .... like FOR FREE - FORD F150 -
'guaranteed' to get over 8mpg (downhill anyway) , might have bad transmission. might have 2 spark plugs missing. might have sugar in the gass. might have toxic exhaust leak into the cab ....
but the government will giver it to you for free, paying 18,000 out of taxpayer money , so free , but for you maybe a $500.00 handling charge ? and no refunds, no suing for liability if anything happens, perhaps subject to a court gag order .... and so on....

Nope
 
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sesquiterpene

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You can look up the actual side effects if you want to. I just posted this in another thread:
the Grade 3 events were fatigue in 9.7% of patients, myalgia (muscle pain) in 8.9%, arthralgia (joint pain) in 5.2%, headache in 4.5%, and just “pain” in 4.1%. I would assume that there is overlap in these categories. The company says that these were “generally short lived”. The FDA’s guidance on event reporting would class these as “significant, prevents daily activity”, but not requiring hospitalization. So my read now with the data we have is that up to 10% of people taking the shot will spend the next day or so in bed, feeling like they’ve been hit with a really bad flu.
That was about the Moderna vaccine, not the Astrazeneca one, but neither was your link and it didn't seem to bother you. So yes, about 10% will want to stay home the next day. I am indeed worried that that will be too much for people who couldn't be bothered to even wear a mask, but I think the efficacy figures might persuade quite a few of them.
https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/11/16/modernas-vaccine-efficacy-readout
want more?
No, I've had enough antivaxx idiocy for one day, thanks.
 
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