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Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary!

Discussion in 'One Bread, One Body - Catholic' started by KC Catholic, Aug 15, 2001.

  1. KC Catholic

    KC Catholic Everybody's gone surfin'...Surfin' U.S.A

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    Don't forget folks..its a Holy Day of Obligation!

    But, its no "obligation" celebrating the mass of our blessed Mother!

    God bless Mary, mother of God and all of you!

    KC
     
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  2. onesheep

    onesheep Sheep that looks like Bob

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    Yep, done gone to church KC!

    God bless you guys!
     
  3. KC Catholic

    KC Catholic Everybody's gone surfin'...Surfin' U.S.A

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    Going with the family at 12:00pm!
     
  4. ZooMom

    ZooMom Thanks for the memories...

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    AACK!! We forgot!! We were at the doctor all morning and have come home to get ready to go to the hospital.


    Do you think the doc will write me a note? ;)
     
  5. onesheep

    onesheep Sheep that looks like Bob

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    :lol: Sandy, I think a doctor's note, if legitimate, will work. ;)
     
  6. KC Catholic

    KC Catholic Everybody's gone surfin'...Surfin' U.S.A

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    Mary knows what you're going through. You'll be fine!

    I think this is one of those few "exceptions" to attending Mass or a Holy Day.

    Prays and Blessings!
     

  7. Can anyone here explain to me why such a miraculous event didn't rate a mention in the Scriptures?
     
  8. Wolseley

    Wolseley Beaucoup-Diên-Cai-Dāu

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    But it IS in the Scriptures, recovering. Revelation 12:1 clearly describes a woman clothed with the sun, wearing a crown of 12 stars. She is obviously in heaven, and she is obviously the mother of Christ. So it's there. You just didn't look far enough. ;)

    Blessings,
    ---Wols.
     
  9. To say that Rev 12:1 has anything to do with the Assumption of Mary is stretching Scriptural Interpretation to the breaking point.

    1. Even if the woman is Mary (it might be Israel), what does this have to do with the Assumption?

    2. V.6 When did Mary flee into the wilderness for 1260 days?

    3. I thought the RCC didn't take any literal meaning from Revelation, what goes?

    RecoveringCatholic

    p.s. I have read it all, especially Chs. 3 and 17.
     
  10. Wolseley

    Wolseley Beaucoup-Diên-Cai-Dāu

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    The doctrine of the Assumption says Mary went to heaven. If you take the view that the woman in Rev, 12 is Mary, she is depicted as being in heaven. Q.E.D.......

    The numerology is symbolic, of course, but how about the Flight into Egypt? (Mt 2:13-15).

    We don't. But I thought it might be fun to tweak ya just a little. ;)

    Blessings,
    ---Wols.
     

  11. I have thought about it and obviously it happened during the playoffs. . . .

    RecoveringCatholics



     
  12. KC Catholic

    KC Catholic Everybody's gone surfin'...Surfin' U.S.A

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    Please tell me you day job is not "Comedia" or "Pithy Commentator". While the cats are away - the mice play.
     

  13. . . . no, I was just really bored and surfed over. . . .

    RC
     
  14. danWeasel

    danWeasel Guest

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    one can scarely equate Egypt with the wilderness...even in the most stretched of metaphors. egypt was (at that point in time, earlier, and throughout most of biblical symbolism) characterized by culture, learning, intellectuallism. the symbolic meaning of Egypt and the symbol "the wilderness" are complete opposites.

    find another explanation.
     
  15. Wolseley

    Wolseley Beaucoup-Diên-Cai-Dāu

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    So when the Israelites left Egypt, they also left behind culture, learning, and intellectualism?

    No wonder they spent 40 years wandering around in the desert. ;)

    Blessings,
    ---Wols.
     

  16. The Assumption of Mary is a nice assumption, but hardly to be considered a major point of faith. . . .

    Is this maybe a Catholic invention so that they aren't praying to [intercessing with?] the dead?

    Let's examine it with Scripture, and reason, and not take it as a given. . . .

    RC
     
  17. Wolseley

    Wolseley Beaucoup-Diên-Cai-Dāu

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    Nobody ever said that it was a major point of faith, recovering. The Assumption is a dogma, to be sure, which means that a faithful Catholic is required to believe it; but in the overall scheme of Catholic theology, the Assumption, like many Marian topics, is relatively small potatoes. However, many Protestants, as they do with many things concerning Mary, tend to place a lot more emphasis on it than it really merits; ironically, Protestants make more out of Mary than Catholics do. :)
    I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "intercessing with", since "intercessing" is not a word. However, if you mean "conversing with", that'd be accurate; if you mean "interceeding with", that'd be accurate, too.

    When you pray to someone, you are conversing with that person (even if they are just plain old human beings; "pray", after all, means "to ask" or "to bessech or implore". (Shakespeare's "I prithee" {"I pray three"} is applied by men to other men. Look it up in Webster's and see if I'm incorrect.) So if you're praying to Mary or a saint, you are indeed conversing with that person.

    If you mean "interceeding with", the Catholic doctrine of the Communion of Saints stipulates that what a saint does is intercede for other members of the Body of Christ---those on Earth. So if you're praying for Aunt Emma to get out of the hospital with, and Mary or a saint is praying for the same thing, then yes, you are indeed "interceeding with" Mary or a saint.

    However, the tone of the question you posed leaves little doubt that you consider this to be an improper, suspicious practice at best, so my guess would be that what you actually meant was the practice of necromancy, forbidden in Deuteronomy 18:10-11. Two points here: Number one, necromancy is the attempt to tell the future by consulting the dead (again, consult Webster and see if I'm wrong). Catholic doctrine states that the only reason you pray to Mary or a saint is to ask them to intercede for you or for another, not to try to tell the future. Necromancy does not apply here. (You are, of course, not required to agree with me.) Number two, Mary, like all other saints, is not dead, but very much alive in heaven. God is not the God of the dead, but of the living (Mark 12:26). If conversing with a departed saint is necromancy, then Jesus was practicng necromancy by speaking with Moses and Elijah on the Mount of Transfiguration. (Mark 9:4.)
    This very likely won't work; "reason" is usually meant to be "that which is an accordance with my particular interpretation"---and that which is contrary is unreasonable. In addition, the Roman Catholic Church has always interpreted its doctrines in the light of the Tradition which predates Holy Scripture. Within about 50 to 60 years of the establishment of the Church, some of this began to be written down, and it became Holy Scripture; but the doctrines came first. When the Reformation came along, this method of interpretation was jettisoned, and in its place came the idea of interpreting Scripture all alone by itself. Attempting to do this is rather like trying to translate a foreign language without benefit of a grammer and syntax guide and a dictionary of the language in question, and it can lead to some novel interpretations---around 30,000 interpretations or so, one for each Protestant denomination, as I recall. :)

    In any event, Catholics interpret Scripture and Tradition in light of each other, and Protestants interpret Scripture in light of itself; so by saying "Let's examine it with Scripture" simply will not work from the Catholic viewpoint; it's akin to saying, "Let's walk a mile on one leg". The doctrine of the Assumption pre-dates all Protestant interpretations by 1,000 years. I realize that you will counter this by saying that the Church was hijacked by pagans in (pick one) 90 A.D./100 A.D./312 A.D./325 A.D., and all these "un-Christian" practices introduced. If that's what you believe, that's your prerogative. As I said, you are not required to agree with me, or with the Catholic Church or its doctrines, dogmas, teachings, traditions, or interpretations.

    Catholics are expected to agree with the Church; Protestants are not. :)

    Blessings,
    ----Wols.
     
  18. LouisBooth

    LouisBooth Well-Known Member

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    "In addition, the Roman Catholic Church has always interpreted its doctrines in the light of the Tradition which predates Holy Scripture. "

    Hmm....just throwing in my 2 cents..this is probably the ONLY reason I'm not catholic ;) That and all that neiling..hehehe..
     
  19. Romans 13:3

    Romans 13:3 Newbie

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    Thought I would bump up a time appropriate thread from the past. Seems the arguments never change...
     
  20. Rhamiel

    Rhamiel Member of the Round Table

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    mass was so nice today
    I really like our new priest, he has a very friendly and congenial manner about him

    May our Mother pray for us and lead us to her Son
     
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