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Asking myself what I'm getting out of all this

Discussion in 'Deeper Fellowship' started by seekingmuch, Apr 30, 2018.

  1. seekingmuch

    seekingmuch Active Member

    United States
    For 25 years, I didn't even think God really cared about me at all. Just tolerated me. He never comforted me during times of trouble. I don't know even how he does that. So, it was no comfort. Recently I had things with my Blood Pressure and not once did he comfort me and tell me it was going to be okay.

    Finally, after 25 years of hell, I found out God isn't the jerk God pentecostals made him out to be. But, I still don't feel anything from him. Nothing. Maybe their is no feeling. Maybe the people that say, "I feel so love by God everyday" are just self-deluding themselves into thinking and feeling that stuff. I just don't feel like God is all that personal or anything. You got me believing you actually love me and I still feel nothing from you. It's like you are this void and that's.

    If God takes an interest in me, I have no clue how he does it, or if he does it. If he talks to me, I don't know when he does it, or how he does it. I asked God years ago to send someone to explain things. All the Bible did for me for 25 years was make me feel bad about myself. Sorry, God, I am not good at subtly. I was a very emotionally abused kid who has lived on the fringes of humanity never belonging anywhere. I'm sorry, God, you say you are this loving God and yet I don't ever feel anything from you. You said you were this refuge from life and I haven't found how you are this refuge. I still feel empty. It's not a good feeling. I need more. I deserve more than emptiness. Your churches don't offer any friendships outside of church. There are cliques and if you aren't in some family or a Yuppie, they don't invite you in.

    God, I'm glad you are up there "delighting in me".
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  2. gym_class_hero

    gym_class_hero Well-Known Member

    Hi Seeking. How have you blessed other people? Sometimes that's the best way to feel God's love, by serving others. God bless you.
  3. discipler7

    discipler7 Well-Known Member

    Heard Island And Mcdonald Islands
    As per EXODUS.20:5, ancestral sins can put us in negative or unfavorable circumstances, similar to how Adam's Original Sin has put us under sin and dominion by Satan.(ROMANS.5:12, JOHN.8:44) If so, we have to make do with our lot in life, accept our situation and do the best we can.
    ....... Who does not wish to be born as the child of good parents, like Bill Gates or Warren Buffett.?
    _ _ _ _ _ _ _

    Here's my summary of the Bible or Word of God.

    0. God is Omnipotent, Omnipresent and Omniscient. God has His throne in heaven.(EZE.1, REV.4) Satan and his demons rebelled against God.(ISA.14:12, EZE.28:17, REV.12:4-9)
    ....... God-in-heaven desired to replace the spiritual rebels with S'piritual humans. Earth is like a test-bed for this purpose.

    1. On earth, all humans are born sinful/evil/satanic because of Adam's Original Sin = unclean/dirty/unholy = bound for hell when they die.(ROM.5:12)

    2. No humans on earth can see the true face of God and live.(EXO.33:20, JOHN.1:18 & 5:37)

    3. To save fallen humans, God-in-heaven endeavoured to come down to earth in lesser forms as the invisible Spirit or as the visible human(= Angel of God or Jesus Christ). (JOHN.8:58/EXO.3:14, JOHN.1:1 & 14, 1TIM.3:16, 2COR.3:17, ISA.9:6)
    ....... As the Spirit, God-in-heaven gave His Law to Moses and the Jews, in order to curb humans' inborn tendency to commit sins/evil-deeds/satanic-deeds.(DEUT.28)
    ....... As Jesus Christ, God-in-heaven gave the apostles and Christians the sacrificial Lamb of God on the Cross(JOHN.1:29), in order to save them from hell when they die = the free gift of salvation or the kingdom of heaven through faith.(JOHN.3:16, MATT.4:17, GAL.2:16)
    . . . . . . .

    A good analogy of our One and Only God is our one and only sun.
    ... God-the-Father-in-heaven sends His invisible Spirit and His visible Son-Jesus to earth to sustain immortal life = the sun-in-outer-space sends her invisible warmth/heat and her visible light to earth to sustain mortal life.
    The Bible or Word of God can be broken down into 2 parts, the Old and New Testaments/Covenants, ie,

    (i) if you wanna have a good n long life on earth, you need to keep the Law/Word of God.(DEUT.28, MATT.19:21, ACTS.15:24-29, cf; 1COR.5:1-5 & 11:30, 1JOHN.5:16-19),

    (ii) if you wanna go to heaven when you die, you need to be saved from hell by Jesus the Christ/Messiah/Savior.(MATT.5:27-30, ROM.5:12, LEV.17:11, HEB.9:22, JOHN.3:16, 1COR.6:9-11, REV.22:12-15)

    Christians should aim to achieve both, ie to gain both blessings from God, eg MATT.19:23.
    Bc of our inherited Adam's Original Sin, we have the dual problems of INVOLUNTARY satanic/evil/sinful thoughts, eg immoral lust, hate, anger, greed, selfishness, jealousy, fear/worries, doubts, etc, ...and VOLUNTARY satanic/evil/sinful deeds, eg blasphemy, idolatry, murder, adultery/fornication/rape, stealing, lying/cheating/defrauding, etc.
    ....... The former resulted in being cursed/sent to hell when we die(GEN.3:14-16) and the latter resulted in being cursed by God with a sad and short life on earth. God's Law solved the latter and God's Son solved the former.
    ....... Usually, before someone committed murder, he/she had originally harbored hate or greed or lust or jealousy or etc in his/her heart and mind.(source is spiritually from Satan - JOHN.8:44, MATT.16:23 & 23:27, MARK.7:21, 1JOHN.3:8)) IOW, all humans are born satanic/evil/sinful/unclean, from their hearts to their feet.
    At ACTS.15:24-29, God/Jesus requires Gentile Christians to begin their born-again lives of the Spirit by keeping 4 easy or non-burdensome laws of Moses, ie avoid eating blood, strangled animals, foods sacrificed to idols and sexual immorality = minimum legal requirement. They r then given time to learn to gradually keep the other laws of Moses which are not a burden, esp morality laws, eg the Ten Commandments at EXODUS.20, LEVITICUS.10:9, DEUTERONOMY.18:9-14, etc.
    ....... In comparison, Jewish Christians are required by God/Jesus to continue to keep Moses Law, as many as possible, because it is not a burden to them.
    ....... Eg, Gentile Christians should still avoid homosexuality and continue to eat non-kosher foods because the former is not a burden but the latter is a burden(ie it's a burden for them to keep the food laws).
    ... Faith in God's Son, Jesus = faith in God's Word/Law/commandments because JOHN.1:1 says the Son is the Word and is also God.

    We need to properly differentiate between involuntary satanic/evil/sinful thoughts and voluntary sins/evil deeds, and between involuntary or inborn Gentile and Jewish Christians.

    Analogy about involuntary evil/satanic thoughts and voluntary evil-deeds/sins - black crows often squawks noisily over our heads but we should not let them build their dirty nests on our heads.
  4. Radagast

    Radagast comes and goes Supporter

    Jesus loves His people so much that he died on the Cross for them.

    The main way that God talks to you is through the Bible. Which is why you need to be in a church where the Bible is explained.
  5. dysert

    dysert Member

    Hi Seekingmuch,

    I can relate to part of what you're saying. Although I didn't have a bad childhood I still don't "feel" God. I think that some people are "feelers" and others aren't. You and I seem to be among those who aren't. Assuming you followed what Discipler7 said in .3, what you need to focus on is Jesus' offer of salvation to you. Once that has been secured, all the rest is just gravy. You (and I) may never feel God, but when we become saved we just need to trust that He'll take care of us when we die. Feeling would certainly be a nice-to-have, but after many years I've gotten used to trusting Him for my salvation without feeling anything. I do hope you can get to that same place.
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  6. Andrew77

    Andrew77 The walking accident Supporter

    United States
    You kind of sound like me. Yes, there are christian cliques, I agree.

    And like you, I don't get the magical revelations and divine Whatsapp messages from G-d, that others claim.

    Similarly, I didn't have a fantastic childhood, and I lived on the fringes to this day. I routinely have told people that my school years could be summed up "The outcast that outcasts picked on to feel better about themselves".

    So are we a pair or what?

    Um... I would challenge you in two areas. Keep looking for someone, or some people, who are like you in some way, but are Christian. One thing I learned is that the Family of G-d, is very large. The problem isn't that there are no people you can be friends with, but rather that those like you who relate to you, are simply the minority, because you are the minority.

    Also, you need to do your best to realize those people at those churches, generally it's not that they don't like you, or don't want you to come around.. it is simply that they don't relate to you real well. I had to learn this myself.

    Just because people simply don't understand your perspective, and where you have come from, and what makes you tick at a person, doesn't mean they have any ill-will towards. And it might even be that your yourself, are coloring how you act towards them because you assume they look down at you.

    Again... I had to learn this myself.

    That doesn't mean that some are not jerks. I'm sure there are some jerks. Jerks exist everywhere, including church.

    Lastly... this is going to sounds stupid, pointless, and cheesy.

    Just talk to G-d. Not long. Just 5 minutes. Literally talk, out loud. If you can, pretend the Lord is sitting in a chair in the room, or at the end of the bed. Just tell him whatever is on your mind. Tell him about how annoyed you were that the fries were cold at Wendy's. Tell him how cute that dog was you saw on the way to wherever. Tell him how you don't understand those crazy people at church.

    Just talk to him. Again, not long. Don't need to have a 3 hour marathon before bed, or something. Don't need to write out a four page detailed report, or type it in old English "oh dust thou knowest how thy servant feelest Lord".... none of that.

    Just talk to him, like you would anyone. Like you did right here on this forum.

    Do this for 2 weeks. 14 days. That's my challenge to you.

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  7. Heavenhome

    Heavenhome Well-Known Member Supporter

    I can relate very much so with a lot of what you have posted about feeling on the outside of many things.
    One thing I can say it that our feelings can be very deceptive and what you need, as I do also is to hold on to what God says regardless of what we feel. He is truth and is the only one who will NEVER forsake you.
    The Bible is where you will find all God's truth so I hope you continue to read it or else you will not really know God as that is how He reveals Himself to us.
    You have had many knocks in life but you are here and sharing with us which shows that you haven't given up on God.
    Now do you know why you feel you don't fit in? Like I once felt there was something really lacking in me because I never felt I fitted in. Do you know why?
    Because we don't fit into this world, our home is heaven where our loving Father is.

    I also want to commend you for coming out of somewhere which obviously was not a good place and may I say, you may not feel as if God was there but let me tell you He was with you all the way.
    Yesterday at the church I attend ( i have only been going to this church for six months)we had a lunch and I said to our ministers wife " I can honestly say this is the first time I have ever felt at home at a church function" ( in 31 years).
    Please take heart, you are very precious to God and regardless of how you feel or what others may say, He will never leave or forsake you. Hebrews 13:5b

    I apologise for the lengthy post but I hope you realise that others have also gone through these things.
    God bless you:)
  8. Heavenhome

    Heavenhome Well-Known Member Supporter

    Thank you for that post.Although I am not the OP I was so heartened by what you wrote and related and agreed to it all.
    God Bless you:exclamation:
  9. Noxot

    Noxot God is our neighbor Supporter

    United States
    it is a horrible thing to feel so cut off from God but I try to keep in mind that our life is such a thin sliver in eternity. who would have thought that a speck in our eye would torment us so much? especially to the soul that merely theorized possible outcomes in a world such as this. the experience of it is much different, but I am sure that we will find much use for it otherwise we would have never existed in this world to begin with.

    the potential that could fill the void of this world is there and probably won't be fulfilled like it could be but I think even tragedy, sorrow, and loneliness can have a place in Gods eternal kingdom, if only for a short while. how else could we ever be like this for God unless we became like this for God? can someone who has everything need salvation? do we only love God because God loves us or provides us with rewards or safety? must we feign love for God for the sake of fear of destruction or of torments in hell? we at least deserve a chance to try to be more than that. and in my estimation God deserves a lot too.
  10. God bless Joshua

    God bless Joshua Well-Known Member

    This is what God has to say regarding the people's attitude and behaviour :
    Romans 3:11 there is no one who understands; there is no one who seeks God.
    12 All have turned away; they have together become worthless; there is no one who does good, not even one.…

    Matt 7:7 Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.

    To seek God is not the same as seeking fish in the sea, you throw the bait and wait for sometimes to catch it. No way.

    People seek educational degree and they learn for years at universities.
    To seek God we need years of humility and meekness with forgiving hearts.

    Matt 22 14 For many are called, but few are chosen.
  11. Brian Mcnamee

    Brian Mcnamee Well-Known Member

    Hi God loves you as God loved all of us enough to be incarnated and be the Christ. The love of God is like a check that is in your possession but you must cash it or deposit it to get the value of it. Jesus promised to fill us with the Holy Spirit and that is done by committing your heart to Christ and believing upon Him. This is like crossing the line where it is different. Like the moment of conception life begins. You cannot experience Gods love apart from receiving His spirit. This is like making a wedding vow to God. He has already asked you to be His child. This is what being born again is. I was like you many years ago. And I know the love of God and the spirit of God and do hear from Him clearly now. Before I was isolated lonely lost and thought no one cared. The gospel is God has a standard of perfection to be in His presence. We are all far from this but Jesus as God incarnate demonstrated perfect love living a sinless life and took on for us all what was the death we deserved. His life is eternal and he gives life to all who are dead spiritually Jesus promised whoever comes to Him will never thirst again and fountains of living water will spring up out of your inner most being. This is how life is when you have Christ in your heart. It is true and I have been filled with this love for 30 years. There is power direction and destiny in Christ Jesus. You can call upon Jesus today and He will fill your life with His spirit and you can receive all the promises in Christ like the forgiveness of sins, the adoption into the family of God and the inheritance in the next life. We are here but a moment and eternity is forever. Many now get soulish and call on the universe which is an abomination we need to call on the creator of the universe who is either our savior or judge.
  12. Mark Landry

    Mark Landry New Member

    United States
    Wanted to chime in with my personal experience in the hopes that this might help. Please don't hear me presuming that you've never tried any of this - these are simply things that "work" for me.

    I suffered some abuse as a kid as well, so I can frequently feel myself angry, ending relationships, and judging people, a lot. Forgiveness is hard for me but gives me a ton of peace when I let people off the hook. I think God's there with me when I can manage it.

    I pray regularly for "comfort" God. Many Christians will choke on this, because we see ourselves as the heroes, always studying, doing, calling people out, witnessing, etc. When I'm feeling terrible, I ask Him to make me feel good. Most of the time I have to be cool with sitting still for 15 minutes feeling bad, but I usually find some peace here.

    I also regularly tell God he can have whatever He wants, do whatever He wants in life, take whatever He wants, etc. For me, this kind of trust and submission are fundamental. And I think there are deep spiritual things that happen when we surrender to Him.

    Anyway, these things came to mind as I read your post. I'm sorry this is difficult for you, but I appreciate you sharing.
  13. seekingmuch

    seekingmuch Active Member

    United States
    Noxout, "do we only love God because God loves us?" YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!

    Dysert, If I don't ever feel love from him, that's not enough for me. It's like being married and never in love with your wife. Sorry, God, it is not enough. I can't feel love for you if you don't let me feel love from you. I'm human. You're God. Get on it. Otherwise, do. not. waste. my. time. I will not waste yours. I didn't feel love from my dad and cut him off emotionally. I've cut others off for way less. As a kid, you learn to cut and run real quick when you are abused and ignored by someone that claims, "I love you."

    Andrew777, I'm over church. I've gotten, due to church abuse, to being sick of the very smell of churches. Churches in the south are so cliquish it is ridiculous. I literally have no interest in being in one not making one friend in 25 years and sitting alone 99% of that time. I'm also sick of hearing preachers and their "7 steps" to this and "nine steps" to that....Oh, for God's sakes, just shut up with your steps! The preachers that stand and yell about "Let's go to the mountain" and so forth...is that really necessary? How about explaining things rather than yelling! Then, there is the Joel Osteen types. "It's all wonderful rainbows and unicorns. Be blessed today....."

    Heavenhome, thank you.

    Mark, if God can't figure out I need comforting, sorry, is he really God? I don't know how God even comforts someone.
  14. Sal Robinson

    Sal Robinson Member Supporter

    God hasn’t failed you…church has failed you….Jesus makes it clear that we know God’s comfort and presence best through community….but I understand that sadly you’ve gone through a bad church experience.

    All it takes is a small group of people who care about one another….it sounds so easy, but reality is….people don’t think of others enough.

    I pray for you friend…..I pray a genuine Christianity finds its way into your life. Praying for you <3
  15. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Fading curmudgeon

    Hi; feeling can be deceptive, but what really count are the promises of God in His Word.
  16. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Fading curmudgeon

    Yes, feeling can indeed deceive, but it's good by faith to be able to concentrate on the promises which God makes in Scripture.
  17. mozo41

    mozo41 Well-Known Member

    United Kingdom
    God, I'm glad you are up there "delighting in me".

    this perception being the great deception of separation ....
  18. akaDaScribe

    akaDaScribe Well-Known Member Supporter

    United States
    Do you want God to prove to you that he loves you?
    Last edited: May 1, 2018
  19. Andrew77

    Andrew77 The walking accident Supporter

    United States
    So I have some deep arcane wisdom of the ages, which I cultivated from decades in the church, and reading my Bible daily for over 5 years of reading through the Bible each year, and from all that I have some advice.....

    This is going to be heavy. Ready?

    Don't go to Church.

    Worth becoming a sponsor of the forums for that, right? ...deeeeeeeep....

    None of us here, are wagging their fingers at you. We're not lecturing you like the SNL Church Lady skit, and saying 'now you better go to church, you heathen!'.

    We are only saying to you, what we hope will help you. My only hope is that sometime in the future you come to a forum like this, telling everyone how awesome your life has become.

    If right now, going to church is not what is best, then don't go to church.

    I hope you'll forgive me, but I'd like to tell you a little about my own experience, and maybe you'll get something from it. (it's going to be long)

    I never had much connection to my parents church, because none of the kids had much connection to my parents church. Few if any still go to that church. It wasn't bad, it just didn't connect much with the younger people.

    I went to several churches, and many were bonkers, a little like what you described. One, at the end of the service, my only thought was "What....... just happened? What is this place?".

    I joined another church, and things seemed to be ok. I then joined a small social group. Never had much luck with social groups at churches, but I determined for myself that I would give it 1 year, and then evaluate if I should keep doing it. I figured that was a safe bet. Dedicate to keep doing it for 1 year no matter what. If after 12 months it was terrible, I'd quit.

    Well about 14 months later, I wasn't entirely sure where I stood in the group. I couldn't figure out if I had friends there, or not. It seemed ok... and then...

    So one day the group, after church, decided to go to such-and-such location. A young lady in the group said in a cheery voice "If anyone doesn't know where this place is, you are welcome to ride with me! Just meet me at my car!"

    Now I had at a previous event, gotten lost. I am notably terrible with directions, and this was before every single smart phone was a perfect GPS mapping system.

    So I followed the woman, and two other guys towards her car. No kidding, this really happened, it was like a bad movie. About half way to the car, the two guys looked at each other, and then nudged her, and she spun around and put her hand up in front of me.


    "We're going to be playing some loud music that you won't like. You should probably find some other way to get there".

    I smiled, laughing to myself. I'd seen this look a million times. I knew what it meant. I spun on my heal, and walked to my car, and went home.

    Unwanted... Cruel... Normal. At the time I was a little hurt, but later thankful to the woman. She allowed me to see the reality of my situation, which happened 2 weeks later.

    So every Thursday, the group got together after a short Bible study, and watched TV at the pastor's house. I got there, pulled up a chair, and started watching TV with everyone. Then..... it hit me.

    Why was I there? To watch TV? I could do that at home, and the reason I didn't is because I didn't particularly care for the TV program we were watching.

    So why was I there? To socialized with my fellow Christians. Except, I wasn't socializing. I looked around the room, and realized no one was talking with me. No one was even near me. They were all talking with each other, but no one was there talking to me. No one had any intention of talking with me.

    I realized that if I were to grab my stuff, put the chair away, and walk out... even though we all just got there, no one would notice, and no one would care. I then made a bet with myself. If I leave the group and never see any of these people again, that I had been with constantly for the last almost year and a half, no one would even attempt to contact me for months.

    I put the chair away, grabbed my stuff, and walked out. No one said a word, no one even knew I had left. Which isn't surprising since I doubt they knew I had shown up. I won the bet too. It was 5 months before I got a single solitary email from one member of the group, which amounted to "Just checking in on you!". (as if he couldn't see me at church every Sunday, but apparently it's too hard to walk up and say 'hi').

    Now.... at this point you are likely thinking that if this is my argument for going to church, it's not very good. Why would I want to go to church, when clearly I've had such horrible experiences. (and these are only a two of them).

    I have an answer. My parents.

    My parents have always had their friends at church. Co-workers come and go. Our neighbors where my parents live, have all moved, or died. But their friends at church have always been there.

    When one of their church friends son died of a strange illness, it was my parents that went to them, and wept with them. When my parents had big problems, it was their church friends that came and prayed with them. When they started a new business, they called my parents to come and celebrate with them. When my parents finished renovating their little lake house, it was their church friends that sat drinking and eating s'mores around the fire pit in celebration.

    I've seen them do life with their Church friends. When my parents celebrated their 50th wedding anniversary, yeah they had a work friend, a neighbor, a few relatives.... but most were all their church friends, eating drinking, talking about all they had been through the last 30 years of them being in the church.

    And to be honest, I don't see many Christians getting the good christian life, when they don't go to church. Just being open with you, when I meet Christians that don't go to church, few if any are living out the joy of the Lord.

    Is it impossible to have the joy of a Christian life without church? I don't know. That's above my pay grade. But I can say, that I haven't seen it much if at all.

    So I keep trying. I keep believing that this is better than the alternative.

    Now does that mean I think you should throw yourself into the nearest church when you have been abused? No. I said that at the start. Don't go to church.

    If you are wounded by people at Church, then don't go to church. At least not right now.

    When I quit going to the old church, and before I started going to the one I'm at now, I found a solution that really helped me.

    I started going to online church.

    Seacoast Church
    Life.Church Online
    Celebration Church | Live

    These are just some options. I'm not lecturing you. I'm not wagging my finger at you.

    I really enjoyed the teaching and the people of Seacoast. I always went to the live teaching. If you want, you can talk to other people who are watching it live with you. If you don't, that's ok too.

    I went to SeaCoast church online, for about 6 months, and I am really glad that I did. It was... odd, that when I found a good local church to attend, that I somewhat felt badly for not going to Seacoast anymore, because I really liked those people at the online service.

    Anyway.... You need to do what is best for you. Remember, we all want to just help you. My advice might be useless to you, or maybe it will help. But never think I want anything else, than for you to be in a better place in the future, than where you are now.

  20. wayofthepromise

    wayofthepromise Member

    United States
    I hear a lot of different frustrations from you, and none of what I suggest can help you feel better. But I do know that God can instantly make himself known to you if you'll seek him.

    What do I mean by that? "Seek him? Yeah, right. I've sought him for 25 years," you might be saying. But look, God operates on precisely the opposite spectrum that you're operating on right now. You said it yourself. You're not subtle. Guess what. God is. He's so silky, buttery, smooth and subtle, that you will absolutely, 100% miss him if you walk around throwing your temper around like it's a pain in the ass ball and chain.

    Seek him. Humble yourself. Open up. Shut up. Crack open the word and give him an opportunity to introduce himself to you.

    I'm praying for you hardcore tonight. I have a feeling he's got something special in store for you. He loves you like you wouldn't believe. That much I know for sure. Oh, he delights. He's delighting in you right now if you'll open your eyes and see.