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Ashamed of the Gospel?

Discussion in 'Dispensationalism' started by hid in him, Dec 23, 2018.

  1. hid in him

    hid in him New Member

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    I’m new to rightly dividing and new to being open about my faith in general.
    My awareness of Paul and his gospel of faith by grace not works is still very much a hyper awareness with all the joy of blessings, new understanding of the Bible as I read it with new eyes and enthusiasm for sharing it. (Which is such a high but I know I shouldn’t rely on my feelings for anything).

    Anyway with progress comes scorn and for really the first time in my life I’m facing contempt from those who claim to share our faith and it’s a little unsettling to say the least. I know not to take it personally as they insult our Lord Jesus Christ not me and they hated Him first of all. It’s a blessing in a way to experience this negative side it gives one a tiny slice of persecution which of course was promised and will build me up in training for His service. I was nieve to think all would welcome it, some have and I’ve found some like minded folk on here which too is a blessing.

    I was just really surprised to hear so much scorn from a Christian forum. It’s clear from scrolling through the many questions and blog posts here that God’s gospel of Grace for our Salvation is really needed here and I hope He can use me in this service. I also hope to observe other more advanced (in years) right dividers to learn quietly from.

    It’s so truly amazing that God wrote this book so long ago and yet all the attitudes and actions of people are exactly how He said they would be. I never really paid much attention to Paul or really understood what he meant about people being ashamed of his gospel. (I’ve read the whole Bible cover to cover but I admit to spending 90-95% of my time in the four gospels and completely forgetting my salvation is assured.) But now I understand and I see it on these boards and it’s so so sad. It was for my benefit so I count it as a blessing.

    When did you discover rightly dividing?
    Were those around you scornful of it?
    Do you think or find professing believers to be more scornful of rightly dividing then new or unbelievers?
    Were you ever ashamed of Paul’s gospel?
    If so how hard was it for you to reshape your faith?
    Are there any more weighty scriptures other than 2nd Timothy that you use when sharing right dividing with someone new?
    If you are a sister do you find more scorn coming your way from our brothers?
    If you are a sister I would also like to have fellowship with you because I don’t have many sisters in faith nearby let alone rightly dividing ones that I can comfort and be comforted by.

    Peace be with you.
    Let’s be gentle with each other.
     
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  2. Serving Zion

    Serving Zion Seek First His Kingdom & Righteousness

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    Well, I sure do know what scorn means, and I sympathise with what you've said here.. but as for the expression "rightly dividing", could you provide a point of reference, like an article, that explains what you mean by that?
     
  3. hid in him

    hid in him New Member

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    I don’t have any articles it’s still new to me and I’m not really sure where to look for these kinds of things or tested and approved things. I’m fine with Wiki and Google for basic things but religious things wouldn’t know who to trust. I did come across this video that briefly talks about it. I hope it plays from the time stamp I saved but if not skip the first 10 mins and play from 10:30ish.



    If anyone does have any literature on rightly dividing I’d appreciate it, for and against.
     
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  4. Southernscotty

    Southernscotty Well-Known Member Angels Team Supporter

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    Hello Friend and that would be 2 Timothy 2:15.
    Yes you are on tract and do not let people get you down. We can present the gospel, However we can't save them, that is God's job.
     
  5. Stone-n-Steel

    Stone-n-Steel Active Member Supporter

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    I'm sure my new friend will give you this verse:

    2Tim. 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

    Here is a link to a news letter by a man named Les Feldick. The site is old and he is older but his teaching grows on you. Enjoy Through the Bible with Les Feldick Newsletter
     
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  6. Southernscotty

    Southernscotty Well-Known Member Angels Team Supporter

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    Heb 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
    This shows God's various ways of dealing with people groups.
     
  7. Southernscotty

    Southernscotty Well-Known Member Angels Team Supporter

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    J Vernon Mcgee is but one of my favorite teachers. He is very easy to understand is a graduate of Moody bible Institute
    Robert Breaker Dispensations
     
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  8. Stone-n-Steel

    Stone-n-Steel Active Member Supporter

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    > When did you discover rightly dividing?

    2008

    > Were those around you scornful of it?

    yes

    > Do you think or find professing believers to be more scornful of rightly dividing then new or unbelievers?

    yes

    > Were you ever ashamed of Paul’s gospel?

    I have kept silent about Paul's gospel being afraid of persecution. However I have also been in situations where the people I fellowship with have committed murder so the stakes were high. I was not ready to be a martyr.

    > If so how hard was it for you to reshape your faith?

    I was fortunate to have spent most of my life as a heathen. It was soon after Christ apprehended me that I was exposed to right division and it cleared up much confusion.

    > Are there any more weighty scriptures other than 2nd Timothy that you use when sharing right dividing with someone new?

    You can follow up with:

    Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
     
  9. Southernscotty

    Southernscotty Well-Known Member Angels Team Supporter

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    Lol, Someday, We have to visit bro :]
    Dispensation is used 4 times in the bible
    [​IMG]
     
  10. Stone-n-Steel

    Stone-n-Steel Active Member Supporter

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    The TR has this verse also:

    Luke 16:3 Then the steward said within himself, What shall I do? for my lord taketh away from me the stewardship: I cannot dig; to beg I am ashamed.


    Stewardship is used the same way in the greek as dispensation in 1Cor 9:17, Eph 1:10, Eph3:2 & Col 1:25
     
  11. Romansthruphilemon

    Romansthruphilemon Member

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  12. Southernscotty

    Southernscotty Well-Known Member Angels Team Supporter

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    I was just watching this on Youtube as you sent it here lol. Bless you
     
  13. ItIsFinished!

    ItIsFinished! Jesus Christ is our only hope.

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    I'm 7 minutes into it.
    Sounds like a Baptist to me.
    :clap:
    Sounds.....
     
  14. mark kennedy

    mark kennedy Natura non facit saltum Supporter

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    First of all, 'rightly dividing', is used only once in the New Testament. It's the idea of cutting a straight line or following the right path. There's an old saying in carpentry, measure twice cut once, bad cuts waste material. Paul talks about building up the body of Christ, he uses the figure of a Temple being built up wherein the Holy Spirit lives. Each believer is seen as a skilled worker, when the Tabernacle was being built there were two very special workers gifted by God for the work.

    Then the Lord said to Moses, “See, I have chosen Bezalel son of Uri, the son of Hur, of the tribe of Judah, and I have filled him with the Spirit of God, with wisdom, with understanding, with knowledge and with all kinds of skills— to make artistic designs for work in gold, silver and bronze, to cut and set stones, to work in wood, and to engage in all kinds of crafts. (Exodus 31:1-5)
    We are called to such a work, only the project is the body of Christ (see 1 Corinthians 12)

    I don't know, perhaps the first sermon I listened to. I listened to a lot of the radio Bible teachers, to this day still very fond of John MacArthur on Grace to You.

    Often sound doctrine is seen as simplistic, generally people will raise objections. I didn't really face scorn until I started taking the Trinity or justification by faith. Creationism would become an issue much later but apologetics is a special area of study. With the Culture Wars raging it was an important issue, never shunned the scorn, always thought it went with the territory.
    No, just stick to the principles and take your stand on the gospel.
    No, but I never paid the price he did for preaching it.
    I was on the brink of reshaping my theology with regards to theistic evolution, it's all too easy. The problem is things won't line up with the New Testament and that makes all the difference.
    Measure twice, cut once. That's how I look at it regardless of the issue.

    Amen.

    Grace and peace,
    Mark
     
  15. Romansthruphilemon

    Romansthruphilemon Member

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    Mark,

    Please watch the first video in this thread and also the video that I uploaded in post 11. Rightly dividing is separating the parts of the Bible that are specifically written to us from the parts that are written to Israel and are there for our learning.

    John MacArthur is the biggest offender when it comes to not rightly dividing. He takes Israel’s doctrine and tries to apply it to us trying to put us under law and deceiving people into following a performance based salvation. Salvation is performance based...its based on Jesus’ performance, not ours like John MacArthur likes to preach.

    Please go back and give this area a lot more study. I may have just insulted your favorite preacher but remember am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?
     
  16. mark kennedy

    mark kennedy Natura non facit saltum Supporter

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    First of all, your not my enemy because you don't like my favorite radio teacher. Secondly, I have no interest in the video. Most importantly, if you think someone is not rightly dividing the truth then make your case, otherwise it's just another random post.
     
  17. Romansthruphilemon

    Romansthruphilemon Member

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    I’m not saying that you’re not rightly dividing but if John MacArthur is a teacher that you respect and think that he rightly divides the word of truth then this thread is for you and needs serious consideration.

    MacArthur constantly quotes Jesus in his earthly ministry. If you take the time to watch the video you will see how Jesus in his earthly ministry was dealing with Israel and they were under the law at that time. MacArthur preaches the gospel of the kingdom and tries to put us under law, he does not preach the gospel of the grace of God,
     
  18. mark kennedy

    mark kennedy Natura non facit saltum Supporter

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    MacArthur is a Calvinist, that's absurd, still not interested in the video. If you think he is in error then quote him and make your case.
     
  19. Serving Zion

    Serving Zion Seek First His Kingdom & Righteousness

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    Ok, well they have taken tge phrase "rightly dividing the word of truth" so as to say that the gospel is divided into different dispensations. I wouldn't speak that way, because God's law is unchanging. The same law applies today as it did before the resurrection, only what has changed is the relative standards of righteousness.

    Whenever God needs to judge, His judgement goes toward the righteous one (Matthew 5:20, Acts 10:34-35).

    That is why the Jews were "broken off" the vine when they went against Jesus Christ (Romans 11:20, Matthew 23:37-39).

    The doctrine that Gentiles do not need to keep the law of God, is one that prevents them from having the real living relationship with God (John 14:21), so that they have a blind faith - always hoping in God to save them one day, believing in signs as affirmation of their faith, but never really seeing Him.

    It appeals to a type of Christian who wants the benefits of the faith without walking the narrow road. It's not a new doctrine, but they are leveraging ignorance, where 2 Timothy 2:15 says there is a word of truth (eg: scripture), yet he suggests there is a right way to handle it compared to a wrong way, using the word in Greek "orthotomounta" "I cut straight", "I rightly divide"

    .. the word expresses the discernment of that which is valid and invalid, specifically saying there is a way that the word of truth can be used that is valid, whereas there also is an invalid way to use it (when you consider 2 Peter 3:16.. it is an ignorant and unstable one that twists the Word of truth .. to their own destruction).

    St. Peter is saying exactly the same thing as St. Paul, in those verses: study (don't be ignorant) to show yourself approved (stable), rightly dividing (not twisting) the word of truth ("his letters").

    Now what they have done by teaching that St Paul is naming a divisive doctrine, is heresy. It is the devil's work.

    St Paul writes in Ephesians 4 that the purpose of Christianity is to "come to the unity of the faith and the knowledge of the son of God" .. specifically to not have two classes of Christian: one Jewish and one Gentile (Ephesians 2:14).

    The fact is that "whenever two or three are gathered, I am there in the midst of them" and that means that He judges us. When we know Him personally, we know to discern His judgement from the judgment of a human ego. So whether a person believes his brother should not eat pork, it is neither his place to judge that brother, nor that brother's place to make up his own mind. But when The Lord does His work amidst us, there comes a time when that brother understands that pork is unclean for him (but it was not unclean for him before God made that judgement). So the brother who looks down on him for eating pork while he is sanctified to do so, is sinning and disobeying God - just as if the one who receives the conviction chooses to believe that the law doesn't apply to him - he has disobeyed The Holy Spirit and is cut off from Christ.

    In that way, He removes all our right to condemn each other according to law, while also being our personal savior who leads us and instructs us in the law of God, keeping us on the narrow path, righteous in God's sight because of our obedience (Romans 6:16, 1 Peter 3:21) until the end (Hebrews 7:12, Hebrews 7:23-25).
     
  20. food4thought

    food4thought Loving truth Supporter

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    I was receiving loosely dispensational teaching (Calvary Chapel) from the beginning of my walk with Jesus.

    I am fairly new to trying to figure out where exactly I stand between Acts 2 dispensationalism, Mid-Acts dispensationalism, and Acts 28 Dispensationalism... and I have not been around people who thought such distinctions were important. I have been leading a Bible study, mostly sharing from an Acts 2 viewpoint, and have not encountered scorn for my thoughts yet.

    Here on these forums, though, I have found professing believers to be the most vocal critics of Dispensationalism in general, but I have yet to encounter what I would call scorn, only rejection.

    There have been times when I should have shared my faith that I have not.

    Yes. It took some serious soul searching on my part before I was able to accept that most of what Jesus said is not primarily for the Church. I seriously wrestled with Matthew 5:18-20.

    I would say that getting them to truthfully confront Matthew 5:18-20 and all that means (if directed to the church) would be a way to help them understand the need for rightly dividing.

    God bless you in your continued walk with Jesus, and merry Christmas!
     
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