As I see it, how do you see it?

[Alonso_Castillo]

 

[Sword of the Lord]

It's not even close to being that black and white.

 

[MikeK]

There are a couple areas which are not quite exact, for instance, the Catholic Church argues for neither pacifism nor socialism, though she certainly has a fair amount in common with socialists and pacifists.

 

[Alonso_Castillo]

There are a couple areas which are not quite exact, for instance, the Catholic Church argues for neither pacifism nor socialism, though she certainly has a fair amount in common with socialists and pacifists.

It depends on the meaning of socialism and Pacifism, the Church is not pacifist as the one who will drop weapons but the Church evaluates many aspects in a case of Wars, Wars are undesirable and only in case of Defense Permited, and only if there is a chance of success.

In the case of Socialism, you must read the Utopia Book of Saint Thomas More, the whole book is a Christian Comunitarian Perspective of the Ideal society with no super rich and no poors. Everything is SHARED. As in the first Chapters of the Book of the Acts of the Apostles

 

[Alonso_Castillo]

The Church is not in favor of Absolute Free Market.

 

[Alonso_Castillo]

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church

From the Vatican Page.
Catechism of the Catholic Church - IntraText

Avoiding war

2307 The fifth commandment forbids the intentional destruction of human life. Because of the evils and injustices that accompany all war, the Church insistently urges everyone to prayer and to action so that the divine Goodness may free us from the ancient bondage of war.104

2308 All citizens and all governments are obliged to work for the avoidance of war.
However, "as long as the danger of war persists and there is no international authority with the necessary competence and power, governments cannot be denied the right of lawful self-defense, once all peace efforts have failed."105

2309 The strict conditions for legitimate defense by military force require rigorous consideration. the gravity of such a decision makes it subject to rigorous conditions of moral legitimacy. At one and the same time:
- the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain;
- all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective;
- there must be serious prospects of success;
- the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. the power of modem means of destruction weighs very heavily in evaluating this condition.

These are the traditional elements enumerated in what is called the "just war" doctrine.
The evaluation of these conditions for moral legitimacy belongs to the prudential judgment of those who have responsibility for the common good.

2310 Public authorities, in this case, have the right and duty to impose on citizens the obligations necessary for national defense.
Those who are sworn to serve their country in the armed forces are servants of the security and freedom of nations. If they carry out their duty honorably, they truly contribute to the common good of the nation and the maintenance of peace.106

2311 Public authorities should make equitable provision for those who for reasons of conscience refuse to bear arms; these are nonetheless obliged to serve the human community in some other way.107

2312 The Church and human reason both assert the permanent validity of the moral law during armed conflict. "The mere fact that war has regrettably broken out does not mean that everything becomes licit between the warring parties."108

2313 Non-combatants, wounded soldiers, and prisoners must be respected and treated humanely.
Actions deliberately contrary to the law of nations and to its universal principles are crimes, as are the orders that command such actions. Blind obedience does not suffice to excuse those who carry them out. Thus the extermination of a people, nation, or ethnic minority must be condemned as a mortal sin. One is morally bound to resist orders that command genocide.

2314 "Every act of war directed to the indiscriminate destruction of whole cities or vast areas with their inhabitants is a crime against God and man, which merits firm and unequivocal condemnation."109 A danger of modern warfare is that it provides the opportunity to those who possess modern scientific weapons especially atomic, biological, or chemical weapons - to commit such crimes.

2315 The accumulation of arms strikes many as a paradoxically suitable way of deterring potential adversaries from war. They see it as the most effective means of ensuring peace among nations. This method of deterrence gives rise to strong moral reservations. the arms race does not ensure peace. Far from eliminating the causes of war, it risks aggravating them. Spending enormous sums to produce ever new types of weapons impedes efforts to aid needy populations;110 it thwarts the development of peoples. Over-armament multiplies reasons for conflict and increases the danger of escalation.

2316 The production and the sale of arms affect the common good of nations and of the international community. Hence public authorities have the right and duty to regulate them. the short-term pursuit of private or collective interests cannot legitimate undertakings that promote violence and conflict among nations and compromise the international juridical order.

2317 Injustice, excessive economic or social inequalities, envy, distrust, and pride raging among men and nations constantly threaten peace and cause wars. Everything done to overcome these disorders contributes to building up peace and avoiding war:

Insofar as men are sinners, the threat of war hangs over them and will so continue until Christ comes again; but insofar as they can vanquish sin by coming together in charity, violence itself will be vanquished and these words will be fulfilled: "they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more."111

 

[Alonso_Castillo]

Catechism of the Catholic Church - IntraText

2425 The Church has rejected the totalitarian and atheistic ideologies associated in modem times with "communism" or "socialism." She has likewise refused to accept, in the practice of "capitalism," individualism and the absolute primacy of the law of the marketplace over human labor.206 Regulating the economy solely by centralized planning perverts the basis of social bonds; regulating it solely by the law of the marketplace fails social justice, for "there are many human needs which cannot be satisfied by the market."207 Reasonable regulation of the marketplace and economic initiatives, in keeping with a just hierarchy of values and a view to the common good, is to be commended.

 

[hsilgne]

Conservatives are about “WHITE IDENTITY” and “RACISM” ?

Seriously?

The DNC initiated the KKK as an intimidation tactic. Today it is groups like ‘OCCUPY’ and what not. Using violence to intimidate people.

The DNC supports PP which was founded by a bigot, Margerate Sanger.

The Nazis were all about socialism and big government programs and censorship and maligning the Jewish people. Sound familiar?

But conservatives are the ones who are racists and about white identity.

Yeah. OK.

 

[Alonso_Castillo]

Conservatives are about “WHITE IDENTITY” and “RACISM” ?

Seriously?

The DNC initiated the KKK as an intimidation tactic. Today it is groups like ‘OCCUPY’ and what not. Using violence to intimidate people.

The DNC supports PP which was founded by a bigot, Margerate Sanger.

The Nazis were all about socialism and big government programs and censorship and maligning the Jewish people. Sound familiar?

But conservatives are the ones who are racists and about white identity.

Yeah. OK.

Conservatives are about “WHITE IDENTITY” and “RACISM” ?

Seriously?

The DNC initiated the KKK as an intimidation tactic. Today it is groups like ‘OCCUPY’ and what not. Using violence to intimidate people.

The DNC supports PP which was founded by a bigot, Margerate Sanger.

The Nazis were all about socialism and big government programs and censorship and maligning the Jewish people. Sound familiar?

But conservatives are the ones who are racists and about white identity.

Yeah. OK.

Hail Trump:

 

[hsilgne]

Hail Trump:

LOOK: Video Shows KKK Grand Dragon Endorsing Hillary

WGBH American Experience . U.S. Grant: Warrior | PBS

 

[MikeK]

Uh, about that "Grand Dragon" who endorsed Clinton. You might want to look a little closer into that one.

White suppremecists today tend to align themselves with conservative politics. It is not fair to say conservatives are white suppremecists, but most current day white suppremecists are conservatives. The conservative movement has shown itself to be tolerant of these racists and also tends to harbor those who are not overtly racist but certainly would rather sit on their couch than work on bettering race relations in our country. If that bothers you - and it probably should - there are things you can do to help turn it around. Adopt or foster a minority child (like my brother and hopefully on end day, me) volunteer in a minority school district (like my sister), volunteer as an interpreter at a hospital (like my wife), etc.

 

[hsilgne]

The conservative movement has shown itself to be tolerant of these racists and also tends to harbor those who are not overtly racist but certainly would rather sit on their couch than work on bettering race relations in our country.

What an absurd and discriminatory statement! [Staff edit].
My ‘real life’ observation is one that see’s conservative Christians in my community adopting children, reaching out to minority groups in the area and offering themselves as foster parents. They are the ones who sponsor children abroad through groups like Compassion. They are the ones who volunteer to help people in need.

While the liberal atheist/agnostics in my community, the ones that I know, are the ones who are angry and mean spirited. Spewing insults and pointing their self righteous fingers. They do not do these things but rather spend their time, smoking pot, sharing inappropriate content and playing Facebook games.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Conservatives are about “WHITE IDENTITY” and “RACISM” ?

Seriously?

But conservatives are the ones who are racists and about white identity.

Yeah. OK.

I just noticed that. It's wrong. Conservatives do not share what is in the conservative circle. In a Venn Diagram all conservatives would then be in favor of 'WHITE IDENTITY', even Hispanic and Black and Asian conservatives. That does not fly. I say whoever came up with this diagram needs to go back to the drawing board. Clever idea, but very poorly done.

 

[Alonso_Castillo]

View attachment 190495


LOOK: Video Shows KKK Grand Dragon Endorsing Hillary

WGBH American Experience . U.S. Grant: Warrior | PBS

I am not a Democrat, but as far as I can see, democrats moved away from KKK and 82% of african Americans go democrat and the first black President reached USA Government by the Democrat Party.

I am Catholic. And I am not even US citizen, neither I live in USA, Nor want to.

 

[Fantine]

Conservatives are about “WHITE IDENTITY” and “RACISM” ?

I think that the chart the OP posted is talking about the present---not in the 1920's and 1930's. But I am glad you are disavowing those negative aspects of conservatism and hope you fight hard for the removal of Steve Bannon, [staff edit] from the NSC and the presidential staff.

If Democrats are the violent ones, how come Republicans are the ones carrying around deadly weapons that enable them to do violence? (This is a generalisation).

Gun Ownership Higher Among Republicans Than Democrats

Occupy Wall Street was not a violent movement. I am open to the possibility that random and occasional violent actions occurred, as they did in Trump rallies where reporters had to be protected by armed guards from rabid Trump supporters...

 

[Sword of the Lord]

True racists are vile and violent creatures.

 

[Antigone]

You're changing the goalposts, Hlsigne. Nobody here has claimed all conservatives are racists. The claim was that white supremacists most often identify as conservatives. That's not an outrageous claim, that is accurate. Nor does it say very much about the majority of all conservatives. Why do you protest so much? Did you think we were calling you racist?

 

[Paidiske]

MOD HAT ON

This thread has had a clean. ​

Please stay on topic, and discuss the content of posts rather than making personal comments about one another.​

MOD HAT OFF​

 

[Sword of the Lord]

You're changing the goalposts, Hlsigne. Nobody here has claimed all conservatives are racists. The claim was that white supremacists most often identify as conservatives. That's not an outrageous claim, that is accurate. Nor does it say very much about the majority of all conservatives. Why do you protest so much? Did you think we were calling you racist?

Most terrorists align with liberal Democrats. That's not to say that Democrats are terrorists, but most terrorists are or support or are supported by Democrats.

 

[MikeK]

Most terrorists align with liberal Democrats. That's not to say that Democrats are terrorists, but most terrorists are or support or are supported by Democrats.

I don't think most terrorists know what a liberal Democrat is. I see what you're trying to do, and I get that the truth is ugly regarding white supremacists overwhelmingly supporting Trump, but come on.