'arsenokoitai' means 'temple prostitute' ?

[Stinker]

When this word is translated from the Koine Greek into the english New Testament translations, the translations never seem to give the precise meaning. It seems each translation (NASV), etc., etc., each have their own private meaning.

This word in the Koine Greek means arseno- male, koitai-bedder

Koitai, where we get the English word coitus.


After studying about the Corinthian problems from the former pagan worshippers converting to Christ, and bringing with them some of their pagan 'baggage' I think understand this word a little better than I used to.

This word does center around the practices of the pagan temples of worship.

In 1Cor.11 the women were to wear an artificial covering over their head if their hair was 'cropped' (Aphrodite worship) or shaved (Adonis worship). The male Christian converts were reminded that it was a 'shame' to have what they considered 'long hair' because that was evidence that he was a temple dog (Rev.22:15)

These 'dogs' were males who dressed in womens clothes and wore their hair long or wore long wigs. They would 'service' the men who came to the Aphrodite and other pagan temples, to 'worship' .

It makes sense that this word is applied to both the prostitite (1Cor.6:9) and their john (1Tim.1:10).

 

[dcyates]

When this word is translated from the Koine Greek into the english New Testament translations, the translations never seem to give the precise meaning. It seems each translation (NASV), etc., etc., each have their own private meaning.

This word in the Koine Greek means arseno- male, koitai-bedder

Koitai, where we get the English word coitus.


After studying about the Corinthian problems from the former pagan worshippers converting to Christ, and bringing with them some of their pagan 'baggage' I think understand this word a little better than I used to.

This word does center around the practices of the pagan temples of worship.

In 1Cor.11 the women were to wear an artificial covering over their head if their hair was 'cropped' (Aphrodite worship) or shaved (Adonis worship). The male Christian converts were reminded that it was a 'shame' to have what they considered 'long hair' because that was evidence that he was a temple dog (Rev.22:15)

These 'dogs' were males who dressed in womens clothes and wore their hair long or wore long wigs. They would 'service' the men who came to the Aphrodite and other pagan temples, to 'worship' .

It makes sense that this word is applied to both the prostitite (1Cor.6:9) and their john (1Tim.1:10).

I think you're by and large quite correct here, Stinker. Indeed, whereas it is possible that the term arsenokoites is to be applied to the active male partner in homosexual intercourse, the term that precedes it in the context of 1 Cor 6.9, malakos, likely refers to the passive male partner.

 

[daveleau]

I agree with the OP, but must point out a potential fallacy in your logic (again, you are totally correct, but...). Root fallacies can lead us to the wrong conclusions about words. We cannot rely to heavily on them. A good English example is pineapple. It is neither an apple or from a pine. Carson speaks at length about this in Exegetical Fallacies. Despite this, I think you are right on the money. Great job!

 

[PaladinValer]

St. Paul made up a lot of "composite" words. What they really mean is difficult to assertain, though you are right to look up the cultural significances; 100% so.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

It makes sense that this word is applied to both the prostitite (1Cor.6:9) and their john (1Tim.1:10).

Paul did not have a stuttering problem in his writing. He already lists prostitutes included in 1 Cor 6:9 as (inappropriate contentos) strongs 4205 from pernemi (to sell; akin to the base of 4097); a (male) prostitute (as venal), i.e. (by analogy) a debauchee (libertine):--fornicator, whoremonger. The LXX uses the word inappropriate contentos for sodomite in De 23:17 "There shall be no prostitute of the daughters of Israel, neither shall there be a sodomite of the sons of Israel." The temple prostitutes were inappropriate contentos not arsenokoites. Therefore, it is absurd to think that Paul says "inappropriate contentos will not inherit the kingdom of heaven neither will inappropriate contentos". The fact that Paul lists inappropriate contentos and then later in the list we find arsenokoites means these are not the same. Therefore arsenokoites is not a prostitute of anykind.

Arsenokoites means men having sex with men or simply homosexuals. It is a juxtaposition of arsenov and koites found in the LXX Lev 18:22 and 20:13 "And if a man lie with mankind, as with womankind, both of them have committed abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

 

[DevotiontoBible]

I agree with the OP, but must point out a potential fallacy in your logic (again, you are totally correct, but...). Root fallacies can lead us to the wrong conclusions about words. We cannot rely to heavily on them. A good English example is pineapple. It is neither an apple or from a pine. Carson speaks at length about this in Exegetical Fallacies. Despite this, I think you are right on the money. Great job!

We have quotes from around the first century of arsenokoites used in it's context from extrabiblical sources. It means homosexual.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Koite does not simply mean bedder, the idiom has the same meaning as when we say "go to bed with". It means sexual intercourse with...arsenov means men. It is a compound word meaning men having sexual intercourse with each other.

Here are other Greek words from the Septuagint. What a coincidence, they appear similar to Arsenov Koite meaning homosexual in v22



Leviticus 18:23 (NLT)

"A man must never defile himself by having sexual intercourse with an animal, and a woman must never present herself to a male animal in order to have intercourse with it; this is a terrible perversion.





** Tetrapous Koite**





Leviticus 18:20 (NLT)

"Do not defile yourself by having sexual intercourse with your neighbor's wife.





** Gune Plesion Koite **





Leviticus 18:22 (NLT)

"Do not practice homosexuality; it is a detestable sin.





** Arsenov Koite **

 

[daveleau]

We have quotes from around the first century of arsenokoites used in it's context from extrabiblical sources. It means homosexual.

That's a superb point. Carson doesn't say that this method is always wrong, but that other evidence should support the word's meaning.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

That's a superb point. Carson doesn't say that this method is always wrong, but that other evidence should support the word's meaning.

Absolutely, In addition to the juxtaposition of "arsenov koite" in the Leviticus prohibition of homosexuality in the Septuagint (LXX) we have these quotes:

Esubeus states: "But those who roam outside of these, they seek after pleasures against nature, desiring to [do what the arsenokoitai do]. " The context here shows that arsenokoites is "against nature" which would parallel Romans 1:26 (NLT)
That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other."

Another context is by an ancient writer Polycarp. He states, ""[l]ikewise also let the younger men be blameless in all things," and avoid "every lust." [v3] Then Polycarp quotes from 1Co6:9 three kinds of people who will not enter the Kingdom of God: the fornicators [inappropriate contentoi (inappropriate contentoi)], the effeminate [malakoi (malakoi)], and the sodomites [arsenokoitai (arsenokoitai)]. " He omits adultery because he is writing about young men who would not be married yet. But, most important to my observation is Polycarp is grouping arsenokoites with "lusts" that young men are to avoid not professions (as in a prostitute).

 

[Stinker]

Paul did not have a stuttering problem in his writing. He already lists prostitutes included in 1 Cor 6:9 as (inappropriate contentos) strongs 4205 from pernemi (to sell; akin to the base of 4097); a (male) prostitute (as venal), i.e. (by analogy) a debauchee (libertine):--fornicator, whoremonger. The LXX uses the word inappropriate contentos for sodomite in De 23:17 "There shall be no prostitute of the daughters of Israel, neither shall there be a sodomite of the sons of Israel." The temple prostitutes were inappropriate contentos not arsenokoites. Therefore, it is absurd to think that Paul says "inappropriate contentos will not inherit the kingdom of heaven neither will inappropriate contentos". The fact that Paul lists inappropriate contentos and then later in the list we find arsenokoites means these are not the same. Therefore arsenokoites is not a prostitute of anykind.

Arsenokoites means men having sex with men or simply homosexuals. It is a juxtaposition of arsenov and koites found in the LXX Lev 18:22 and 20:13 "And if a man lie with mankind, as with womankind, both of them have committed abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

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Therefore, it is absurd to think that Paul says "inappropriate contentos will not inherit the kingdom of heaven neither will inappropriate contentos". The fact that Paul lists inappropriate contentos and then later in the list we find arsenokoites means these are not the same. [DevotiontoBible]



It is interesting how the word inappropriate contenteia, inappropriate contenteuo, and inappropriate contentos, all have at their heading; prostitute. Then each word is explained how it went from 'to prostitute for money' to 'to prostitute for something else' . In Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament. Thayer's says at the beginning of the word inappropriate contenteia- 'of illicit sexual intercourse in general.' So DevotiontoBible, scholars understand this word to mean sexually immoral persons.

It follows then that all prostitutes are fornicators....but not all fornicators are prostitutes.

Therefore, the words arsenokoites(a john) and malekoites(a male who submits his body to unnatural lewdness) stand in order for the Apostle to differentiate between them and foricators in general.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

It is interesting how the word inappropriate contenteia, inappropriate contenteuo, and inappropriate contentos, all have at their heading; prostitute. Then each word is explained how it went from 'to prostitute for money' to 'to prostitute for something else' . In Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament. Thayer's says at the beginning of the word inappropriate contenteia- 'of illicit sexual intercourse in general.' So DevotiontoBible, scholars understand this word to mean sexually immoral persons.

It follows then that all prostitutes are fornicators....but not all fornicators are prostitutes.

Therefore, the words arsenokoites(a john) and malekoites(a male who submits his body to unnatural lewdness) stand in order for the Apostle to differentiate between them and foricators in general.

I agree that inappropriate contentos encompasses not only prostitutes, but sexually immoral persons as well. This would also include the john of a prostitute for Paul tells Christians that joining a prostitute in sex is not the act of arsenokoites but inappropriate contenteo (1 Cor 6:12-20).

Btw, there is no "koites" derrivative in the word malakos. It has the meaning for a sissy acting man. It applies to those men who act and dress like women. God told man to be joined to his wife, be fruitful, multiply and subdue the earth. The homosexuals and effeminate men are rebellious to that command. That is why they will end up in hell according to 1 Cor 6:9,10.

 

[Stinker]

Originally Posted by: Stinker

It is interesting how the word inappropriate contenteia, inappropriate contenteuo, and inappropriate contentos, all have at their heading; prostitute. Then each word is explained how it went from 'to prostitute for money' to 'to prostitute for something else' . In Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament. Thayer's says at the beginning of the word inappropriate contenteia- 'of illicit sexual intercourse in general.' So DevotiontoBible, scholars understand this word to mean sexually immoral persons.

It follows then that all prostitutes are fornicators....but not all fornicators are prostitutes.

Therefore, the words arsenokoites(a john) and malekoites(a male who submits his body to unnatural lewdness) stand in order for the Apostle to differentiate between them and foricators in general.

I agree that inappropriate contentos encompasses not only prostitutes, but sexually immoral persons as well. This would also include the john of a prostitute for Paul tells Christians that joining a prostitute in sex is not the act of arsenokoites but inappropriate contenteo (1 Cor 6:12-20).

Btw, there is no "koites" derrivative in the word malakos. It has the meaning for a sissy acting man. It applies to those men who act and dress like women. God told man to be joined to his wife, be fruitful, multiply and subdue the earth. The homosexuals and effeminate men are rebellious to that command. That is why they will end up in hell according to 1 Cor 6:9,10.

The prostitute of (1Cor.6:12-20) is worded as harlot in the KJV and is the Koine Greek word inappropriate contente #4204 and Thayer's says- 'any woman indulging in unlawful sexual intercourse, whether for gain or for lust.


It is significant that when Constantine was destroying the Aphrodite temples, he thought it incredible that the men in these temples resembled not men....but women.

 

[mannysee]

great post. Makes me want to read more about history and dig deep.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

The prostitute of (1Cor.6:12-20) is worded as harlot in the KJV and is the Koine Greek word inappropriate contente #4204 and Thayer's says- 'any woman indulging in unlawful sexual intercourse, whether for gain or for lust.

So what? it is not only a female prostitute but a male prostitute as well. The LXX confirms this:

De 23:17 There shall be no prostitute of the daughters of Israel, neither shall there be a sodomite [inappropriate contenteuo #4203] of the sons of Israel.

and a prostitutes john:

18 Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication [inappropriate contenteuo #4203] sinneth against his own body.

As you can see there is not a shred of evidence that a male prostitute or a john is anything close to the word "arsenokoites". There is very good evidence that it is a homosexual as ancient and modern bible translators conclude.

 

[Stinker]

As you can see there is not a shred of evidence that a male prostitute or a john is anything close to the word "arsenokoites". There is very good evidence that it is a homosexual as ancient and modern bible translators conclude. [DevotiontoBible post #14]
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DevotiontoBible: No, there is not very good evidence that this word means homosexual. Many, people wished that it did, and the reason for this should make each of us question our own conversion. Only in the last 15years or so has the common person been able to access critical ancient Biblical-secular information needed to objectively study this issue. Only lately can people see how many scholars helped perpetuate a self-righteous bigotry.....for centuries!

Where one's honesty will really be tested is in the study of two critical words.....arsenokoitai (1Cor.6:9) (1Tim.1:10) and malakoi (1Cor.6:9)

 

[DevotiontoBible]

As you can see there is not a shred of evidence that a male prostitute or a john is anything close to the word "arsenokoites". There is very good evidence that it is a homosexual as ancient and modern bible translators conclude. [DevotiontoBible post #14]
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DevotiontoBible: No, there is not very good evidence that this word means homosexual. Many, people wished that it did, and the reason for this should make each of us question our own conversion. Only in the last 15years or so has the common person been able to access critical ancient Biblical-secular information needed to objectively study this issue. Only lately can people see how many scholars helped perpetuate a self-righteous bigotry.....for centuries!

Where one's honesty will really be tested is in the study of two critical words.....arsenokoitai (1Cor.6:9) (1Tim.1:10) and malakoi (1Cor.6:9)

Let us see who is being honest here. The Latin Vulgate translated arsenokoites in the 4th century as concubinage among males. That is males living with one another as though married spouses with each other. Today we call it homosexual boyfreinds "shacking up" or "living together" as though married with the sexual intercourse implied. It is the same as the greek meaning men among themselves (arsenov) having sexual intercourse (koites). In the sixteenth century Martin Luther wrote in his work's vol 28 on 1 Timothy 1:10 re: arsenokoites "There is also that very shameful sin of males among the Gentiles, both slave and free". This sheds more light on what Martin Luther thought about that word as being more than a "boy defiler" as in his german translation of the Bible for he is not limiting this "sin" to any age group or class. In addition to the ancient works I have already provided in this thread by polycarp and Esubeus and the LXX, homosexual is the only logical conclusion as ancient and modern Bible translators have recorded. So we see the real bigotry is held by the homosexuals who are the intolerant and stubbornly hold to ignorance of the truth.

 

[Stinker]

Second word, "arsenokoitai" or "arsenokoites" - it literally means, "males having sex." Early commentaries on I Corinthians related "arsenokoitai" to male temple prostitutes and to men having sex with boys. (Idolatrous prostitution and pedophilia are always wrong for those seeking to honor God.)

Homosexual relationships were known in the Greco-Roman culture of Paul's day. The Greek word commonly used in reference to adult male same sex partners was "arrenokoites." Paul did not use this word. Instead, he created his own, "arsenokoitai." If Paul had intended to condemn all adult male same sex partners, he would have used the common word for it.

The first translation of the New Testament from Greek to another language was the Latin Vulgate. The "Latin Vulgate" translates "arsenokoitai" as "male concubines" or extramarital male sex partners.

It was not until many years later that a Roman Catholic Pope first assigned "malakos" and "arsenokoitai" a homosexual connotation. However, the Pope did not include "arsenokoitai" in I Timothy 1:10. Thus, I Timothy is sometimes translated without a homosexual connotation. I Timothy 1:8-10
Paul lists types of people who need to hear the law. His list includes "arsenokoitai." Again, it is significant that Paul did not use the Greek word "arrenokoites" which would have easily been understood to condemn all adult male same sex partners, had that been his intent. Evidently, it was not his intent!.
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The above info is priceless! Thank you whoever you are!

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Second word, "arsenokoitai" or "arsenokoites" - it literally means, "males having sex."

Wrong! it means males having sex with each other. It is like the greek word for incest metrokoites it means family members having sex with each other.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Early commentaries on I Corinthians related "arsenokoitai" to male temple prostitutes and to men having sex with boys. (Idolatrous prostitution and pedophilia are always wrong for those seeking to honor God.)

Homosexual relationships were known in the Greco-Roman culture of Paul's day. The Greek word commonly used in reference to adult male same sex partners was "arrenokoites." Paul did not use this word. Instead, he created his own, "arsenokoitai." If Paul had intended to condemn all adult male same sex partners, he would have used the common word for it.

Your sources?

 

[DevotiontoBible]

Thus, I Timothy is sometimes translated without a homosexual connotation.

Which translations?