Are you squeamish about the word "catholic"?

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Catholicism came well after the apostles died.

Prove it.

Where and when did it start?

Forgive me...

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

I dont think EO or RC was ever head of the church. They both came after the true apostles died.

There is no head of The Church aside from Christ. That's what the argument was about.

Forgive me...

 

[W2L]

Prove it.

Where and when did it start?

Forgive me...

I dont need to pro0ve it. All i need to do is read scripture and i can see that neither denomination is the first church. There was no hail maries, or pope in the first church.

Also, the apostles didnt need armed guards like the pope does. God delivered the true apostles from peril

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

I dont need to pro0ve it. All i need to do is read scripture and i can see that neither denomination is the first church. There was no hail maries, or pope in the first church.

You're being obtuse again. Those are Rome only.

Your ignorance is showing.

Forgive me...

 

[W2L]

You're being obtuse again. Those are Rome only.

Forgive me...

The more i talk to you, the more content i am without religion.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

The more i talk to you, the more content i am without religion.

Well look... put me on ignore. That's where I'm putting you, and then we don't have to talk okay?

Forgive me...

 

[W2L]

Well look... put me on ignore. That's where I'm putting you, and then we don't have to talk okay?

Forgive me...

No, you're not that bad that i would ignore you.

 

[Rick Otto]

How do you feel about the word itself? Do your eyes glaze over?

One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church - OrthodoxWiki

Catholicity
"The Church is the fullness of Christ's body on earth. As a term, catholicity means fullness or perfection, wholeness. Only God is perfect wholeness, the fullness of being. God makes the Church to be catholic by its participation in his full, divine life.

Fr. Thomas Hopko:
The term "catholic" as originally used to define the Church (as early as the first decades of the second century) was a definition of quality rather than quantity. Calling the Church catholic means to define how it is, namely, full and complete, all-embracing, and with nothing lacking.

Even before the Church was spread over the world, it was defined as catholic. The original Jerusalem Church of the apostles, or the early city-churches of Antioch, Ephesus, Corinth, or Rome, were catholic. These churches were catholic -- as is each and every Orthodox church today -- because nothing essential was lacking for them to be the genuine Church of Christ. [They did not have nor need a Papacy]

God Himself is fully revealed and present in each church through Christ and the Holy Spirit, acting in the local community of believers with its apostolic doctrine, ministry (hierarchy), and sacraments, thus requiring nothing to be added to it in order for it to participate fully in the Kingdom of God.

Catholicity is sometimes confused with universality — the idea that the Christian faith is for all men. However, the word was originally used to denote the true Church among a growing horde of heretics who had removed elements from the faith which they disliked, refashioning Christian belief to their pleasure.

Catholicity is a qualitative mark: the quality of the whole faith handed down from the apostles."

Forgive me...

One's eyes should glaze over. It is a term of obfuscation. It enables identity theft for the purpose of domination and control. Nothing spiritually good about it.
I was raised Catholic (Roman). All these labels are prideful tools of malicious division.
....Just my humble opinion, bro.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

One's eyes should glaze over. It is a term of obfuscation. It enables identity theft for the purpose of domination and control. Nothing spiritually good about it.
I was raised Catholic (Roman). All these labels are prideful tools of malicious division.
....Just my humble opinion, bro.

Hey Rick,
I read that as "One eye should glaze over".

Took me a minute!

Forgive me...

 

[Monk Brendan]

Is the Melkite Church an Arab Church?

The Melkite Church is EXACTLY the same as the Antiochian Orthodox Church, except we make a mentania to Rome, and they make a metania to Constantinople.

All of the prayers, all of the Liturgy, everything--even down to the pastries that are served during coffee hour after Liturgy is the same. So yes, the Melkite Church is Arab.

I, on the other hand, am not an Arab. I was born in Rockford, Illinois. My mother's grandparents came from Germany, and they were Catholic. My dad's roots here in America stretch back to 1423 or so, when a shipwright named Drowne came from England to what is now Kittery Maine. I have ancestors that fought in the Revolutionary War against Great Britain. Have you ever seen Fanuil Hall in Boston? There is a rooster shaped weather vane on the top. This was built by Shem Drown, a coppersmith.

 

[W2L]

One's eyes should glaze over. It is a term of obfuscation. It enables identity theft for the purpose of domination and control. Nothing spiritually good about it.
I was raised Catholic (Roman). All these labels are prideful tools of malicious division.
....Just my humble opinion, bro.

Identity theft. That's how i feel, as if folks are trying to slap their label on me and steal my identity as a christian.. Its as if they are more interested in owning the scriptures than to share them. They want to own the church and the scriptures.

 

[Monk Brendan]

Ironically the question was about what part of the Creed i dont understand. I have been answering that question with my own question. I dont understand where catholic is in scripture. Thats the part i dont understand. I just noticed you referred to the trinity as well, but im more interested in the word catholic.

Forgive me for butting in and adding my two cents worth, but the Creed is NOT made by man. Every word of it is Scripture.

The Nicene Creed
We believe in (Romans 10:8-10; 1John 4:15)
ONE God, (Deuteronomy 6:4, Ephesians 4:6)
the Father (Matthew 6:9)
Almighty, (Exodus 6:3)
Maker of Heaven and Earth, (Genesis 1:1)
and of all things visible and invisible. (Colossians 1:15-16)
And in ONE Lord Jesus Christ, (Acts 11:17)
the Son of God, (Mathew 14:33; 16:16)
the Only-Begotten, (John 1:18; 3:16)
Begotten of the Father before all ages. (John 1:2)
Light of Light; (Psalm 27:1; John 8:12; Matthew 17:2,5)
True God of True God; (John 17:1-5)
Begotten, not made; (John 1:18)
of one essence with the Father (John 10:30)
by whom all things were made; (Hebrews 1:1-2)
Who for us men and for our salvation (1Timothy 2:4-5)
came down from Heaven, (John 6:33,35)
and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary, (Luke 1:35)
and became man. (John 1:14)
And was crucified for us (Mark 15:25; 1Cointhians 15:3)
under Pontius Pilate, (John 19:6)
and suffered, (Mark 8:31)
and was buried. (Luke 23:53; 1Corinthians 15:4)
And the third day He rose again, according to the Scriptures. (Luke 24:1 1Corinthians 15:4)
And ascended into Heaven, (Luke 24:51; Acts 1:10)
and sits at the right hand of the Father. (Mark 16:19; Acts 7:55)
And He shall come again with glory (Matthew 24:27)
to judge the living and the dead; (Acts 10:42; 2Timothy 4:1)
whose Kingdom shall have no end. (2 Peter 1:11)
And in the Holy Spirit, (John 14:26)
the Lord, (Acts 5:3-4)
the Giver of Life, (Genesis 1:2)
Who proceeds from the Father; (John 15:26)
Who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; (Matthew 3:16-17)
Who spoke through the prophets. (1 Samuel 19:20 ; Ezekiel 11:5,13) In one, (Matthew 16: 18)
holy, (1 Peter 2:5,9)
catholic*, (Mark 16:15)
and apostolic Church. (Acts 2:42; Ephesians 2:19-22)
I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins. (Ephesians 4:5; Acts 2:38)
I look for the resurrection of the dead, (John 11:24; 1Corinthians 15:12-49; Hebrews 6:2; Revelation 20:5)
and the life of the world to come. (Mark 10:29-30)
AMEN. (Psalm 106:48)

True, the word, "catholic," is, by itself, not in the Bible. It is a Greek word meaning, "of the whole," because at the beginning of the Church, back on the first Pentecost there was only ONE Christian Church. So the WHOLE Church was, BY DEFINITION, catholic. It was also Orthodox, in that everyone was worshiping in the correct manner.

But let's ask another question. Where in the Bible is, "invitation hymn?" How about "TULIP?"

 

[W2L]

Forgive me for butting in and adding my two cents worth, but the Creed is NOT made by man. Every word of it is Scripture.

The Nicene Creed
We believe in (Romans 10:8-10; 1John 4:15)
ONE God, (Deuteronomy 6:4, Ephesians 4:6)
the Father (Matthew 6:9)
Almighty, (Exodus 6:3)
Maker of Heaven and Earth, (Genesis 1:1)
and of all things visible and invisible. (Colossians 1:15-16)
And in ONE Lord Jesus Christ, (Acts 11:17)
the Son of God, (Mathew 14:33; 16:16)
the Only-Begotten, (John 1:18; 3:16)
Begotten of the Father before all ages. (John 1:2)
Light of Light; (Psalm 27:1; John 8:12; Matthew 17:2,5)
True God of True God; (John 17:1-5)
Begotten, not made; (John 1:18)
of one essence with the Father (John 10:30)
by whom all things were made; (Hebrews 1:1-2)
Who for us men and for our salvation (1Timothy 2:4-5)
came down from Heaven, (John 6:33,35)
and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary, (Luke 1:35)
and became man. (John 1:14)
And was crucified for us (Mark 15:25; 1Cointhians 15:3)
under Pontius Pilate, (John 19:6)
and suffered, (Mark 8:31)
and was buried. (Luke 23:53; 1Corinthians 15:4)
And the third day He rose again, according to the Scriptures. (Luke 24:1 1Corinthians 15:4)
And ascended into Heaven, (Luke 24:51; Acts 1:10)
and sits at the right hand of the Father. (Mark 16:19; Acts 7:55)
And He shall come again with glory (Matthew 24:27)
to judge the living and the dead; (Acts 10:42; 2Timothy 4:1)
whose Kingdom shall have no end. (2 Peter 1:11)
And in the Holy Spirit, (John 14:26)
the Lord, (Acts 5:3-4)
the Giver of Life, (Genesis 1:2)
Who proceeds from the Father; (John 15:26)
Who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; (Matthew 3:16-17)
Who spoke through the prophets. (1 Samuel 19:20 ; Ezekiel 11:5,13) In one, (Matthew 16: 18)
holy, (1 Peter 2:5,9)
catholic*, (Mark 16:15)
and apostolic Church. (Acts 2:42; Ephesians 2:19-22)
I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins. (Ephesians 4:5; Acts 2:38)
I look for the resurrection of the dead, (John 11:24; 1Corinthians 15:12-49; Hebrews 6:2; Revelation 20:5)
and the life of the world to come. (Mark 10:29-30)
AMEN. (Psalm 106:48)


True, the word, "catholic," is, by itself, not in the Bible. It is a Greek word meaning, "of the whole," because at the beginning of the Church, back on the first Pentecost there was only ONE Christian Church. So the WHOLE Church was, BY DEFINITION, catholic. It was also Orthodox, in that everyone was worshiping in the correct manner.

But let's ask another question. Where in the Bible is, "invitation hymn?" How about "TULIP?"

I dont see "catholic" in scripture

 

[W2L]

Neither do i see catholicism in scripture.

 

[Monk Brendan]

Not your tradition.

Forgive me, but you don't see the Bible as being TRADITIONAL? Where would you be without it? Lost in your sins, as would I. But the Tradition of the Bible comes down THROUGH the Catholic and Orthodox Churches. In Western Europe, there were always several thousand monks that spent their days copying, very precisely, letter by letter, by hand, the Bible. Those monks were all Catholic, so instead of beating the Catholic Church down, you had better start thanking and praising God for the GIFT of the Catholic Church, who, in the west, kept the word inviolate, without error, spot or wrinkle.

 

[W2L]

Forgive me, but you don't see the Bible as being TRADITIONAL? Where would you be without it? Lost in your sins, as would I. But the Tradition of the Bible comes down THROUGH the Catholic and Orthodox Churches. In Western Europe, there were always several thousand monks that spent their days copying, very precisely, letter by letter, by hand, the Bible. Those monks were all Catholic, so instead of beating the Catholic Church down, you had better start thanking and praising God for the GIFT of the Catholic Church, who, in the west, kept the word inviolate, without error, spot or wrinkle.

Catholicism is not biblical so it cannot be handed down by those who wrote the bible.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Forgive me, but you don't see the Bible as being TRADITIONAL? Where would you be without it? Lost in your sins, as would I. But the Tradition of the Bible comes down THROUGH the Catholic and Orthodox Churches. In Western Europe, there were always several thousand monks that spent their days copying, very precisely, letter by letter, by hand, the Bible. Those monks were all Catholic, so instead of beating the Catholic Church down, you had better start thanking and praising God for the GIFT of the Catholic Church, who, in the west, kept the word inviolate, without error, spot or wrinkle.

The gift of the catholic church belongs to all of Christianity. The gift of the Catholic church belongs to all of christianity.

 

[Monk Brendan]

I dont see "catholic" in scripture

If you had read the whole posting, you would have seen my assertion that the word "catholic" is NOT in the Bible. But neither are things like "invitation hymn," or asking Jesus into you heart to be your "personal savior," or any other of the various Protestant/Evangelical words that get used in your church. These are all TRADITIONS OF MEN, nothing more!

 

[W2L]

If you had read the whole posting, you would have seen my assertion that the word "catholic" is NOT in the Bible. But neither are things like "invitation hymn," or asking Jesus into you heart to be your "personal savior," or any other of the various Protestant/Evangelical words that get used in your church. These are all TRADITIONS OF MEN, nothing more!

I read it.

 

[W2L]

Ive had my fill of this discussion. Have a nice day everyone.