Are the seven trumpets in Revelation literal?

[MidnightCry]

Does anyone believe the trumpets in Revelation are literal?

If the seven bowls will be poured out on the wicked, literally, then why aren't the seven trumpets literal as well?

I have a real problem believing the trumpets are symbolic. I am disappointed the SDA church doesn't preach about the seven trumpets more. It seems to me the next prophetic event that will affect everyone on earth, saved and unsaved, will be the fulfillment of the seven trumpets and our church doesn't even discuss them. At least my church doesn't. And the preachers on 3ABN don't seem to preach much about them either. Shouldn't we be warning people about what is coming next? Will God hold us accountable for not warning others? And what about people who will say, "You knew this was coming and you didn't warn us?"
How will we answer them?

 

[Pythons]

They are not literal - it's figurative language describing a series of actions which are initiated by an alarm of sorts...
...The following sort of folks take these things literal.

SDA Offshoot faction.

Inside a Cult | Video | | National Geographic Channel

Wayne Bent as seen with his spirit breeding stock.

 

[Matariki]

@ Pythons,
Wayne Bent is no longer a member of the SDA and hasn't been since 1987.

 

[MidnightCry]

OK, Pythons, you are saying the seven trumpets are symbolic? What exactly do they represent and how do you determine what they symbolize?

I could say they represent one thing and you could say another, so who is right and who decides who is right?

There can only be one correct interpretation. If the trumpets are symbolic, shouldn't the Bible itself give the meaning of the symbol?

Please tell me also: Why can't they be literal?

YSIC,
midnightcry

 

[Steve Petersen]

If it is allowed, I would like to post a possibility:

What if these trumpets are an allusion to the Feast of Trumpets that occurs on the anniversary of the creation of the world (according to one Jewish tradition)?

Seven trumpets, seven years?

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Does anyone believe the trumpets in Revelation are literal?

If the seven bowls will be poured out on the wicked, literally, then why aren't the seven trumpets literal as well?

I have a real problem believing the trumpets are symbolic. I am disappointed the SDA church doesn't preach about the seven trumpets more. It seems to me the next prophetic event that will affect everyone on earth, saved and unsaved, will be the fulfillment of the seven trumpets and our church doesn't even discuss them. At least my church doesn't. And the preachers on 3ABN don't seem to preach much about them either. Shouldn't we be warning people about what is coming next? Will God hold us accountable for not warning others? And what about people who will say, "You knew this was coming and you didn't warn us?"
How will we answer them?

It is a shame that our church no longer professes the understandings given to our pioneering forfathers... the understanding of the trumpets and more specifically the sixth trumpet, is what caused Josiah Litch to predict the fall of the Ottoman empire in 1840, which it did. This correct prediction, given in 1838, gave proof that the Millerite understanding of the trumpets was correct but also proved the day for a year theory that they were using to predict the end of the 2300 day/year prophesy in 1844.

Here's the early Adventist view on the meaning of the seven trumpets as written by James White

An Exposition of the Seven Trumpets by James White

It is a lengthy read but will give you a complete view of what God revealed through these early seekers of truth...

There are some that believe that there will be a secondary application of the trumpets in the last days but considering that we are still under the sounding of the seventh trumpet, I am doubtful.

 

[MidnightCry]

Hi Steve,

Thank you for your reply. It brings up an interesting point.

The Day of Atonement was the most important day in the Jewish year for the 10th day of the seventh month marked the close of Israel's judgment for that year.

To warn the Jews of this final and most important day of the year, the Feast of Trumpets began nine days earlier -- on the first day of the seventh month.
Each day, according to Jewish records, trumpets sounded throughout the camp announcing the closing of mercy. On the 10th day, the actual Day of Atonement, the trumpet sounded throughout the land to signify that probation had ended.

The Bible uses the trumpet as a symbol of warning or announcement. Since ancient times, the trumpet has not only been an instrument of music, it has been a means of communication.

Could it be the seven trumpets of Revelation are symbols of warning or announcement? I think their purpose is to awaken the world with the fact that Jesus is about to appear. Their message is, "Get ready!" The number seven is usually considered to be a full or comprehensive number, these trumpets have global application. God wants to awaken and arouse all people of earth that Jesus is coming back to earth to gather up those whose names are written in the book of life!

People on this earth are asleep. They don't pay attention to God, they are busy with their own lives, chasing things that don't mean anything. And the church, many churches, are asleep. They don't even preach on end time events that are soon to occur.

However, God has a plan to get everyones attention and to wake people up to spiritual issues. What better way then a global earthquake, burning hail, an astoroid, darkness; these seven warning plagues fall in response to unrestrained evil and hardness of heart. The trumpets are designed to arrest the attention of the world so that everyone can hear the gospel.

YSIC,
midnightcry

 

[MidnightCry]

Part of the problem with many churches is that truth keeps marching on and many churches refuse to accept new truth or to move forward. Many churches hold on to traditions, doctrines, and beliefs of the early pioneers. They don't want to admit that a long held tradition or belief is in error.

There are several obstacles to Dr. Litch's claim that the fall of the Ottoman Turkish empire fulfills the specifications of the prophecy of the sixth trumpet. The fact that something of political importance happened on an anticipated day in August, 1840, sent shivers among some prophetic students of that time. They were fully convinced that the sixth trumpet had been fulfilled. But was it? Were all details of the prophecy met?

The greatest obstacle to Dr. Litch's claim is that fulfillment of the first five trumpets cannot be demonstrated from history. If we follow the sequence of the seven trumpets, trumpet six can only occur after the first five trumpets have been fulfilled.

To his credidt, Dr. Litch withdrew his announcement that the sixth trumpet had been fulfilled in August, 1840. He became convinced that what had appeared to be a fulfillment, was not a fulfillment. By 1873, Dr. Litch published a book titled, A Complete Harmony of Daniel and the Apocalypse, in which he wrote, "the trumpets are yet future and will occur shortly before the second coming of Christ."

So, why can't the trumpets be literal?

YSIC,
midnightcry

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Part of the problem with many churches is that truth keeps marching on and many churches refuse to accept new truth or to move forward. Many churches hold on to traditions, doctrines, and beliefs of the early pioneers. They don't want to admit that a long held tradition or belief is in error.

Where do you get the understanding that truth marches on? Yes, there are new things revealed that were previously not known or little understood but that doesn't do away with the truth that had already been established. To think that the truth that the pioneers had is somehow not valid today is a dangerous place to plant your faith... is that practice built on the solid rock or on the shifting sands??

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

The greatest obstacle to Dr. Litch's claim is that fulfillment of the first five trumpets cannot be demonstrated from history. If we follow the sequence of the seven trumpets, trumpet six can only occur after the first five trumpets have been fulfilled.

Thats not true. Obviously, you have not read the pioneers understanding of the trumpets.... each trumpet was solidly backed by historical events, that is what gave the weight of the arguments to them. For example, it had to be understood when the fifth trumpet was in history and whom it was referring to, in order to be able to calculate the time prophesy of the sixth.

The argument you are using isn't based on fact and could be used to tear down any historically backed understating of prophesy we hold to... such as the 1260 or the 2300 days.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

To his credidt, Dr. Litch withdrew his announcement that the sixth trumpet had been fulfilled in August, 1840. He became convinced that what had appeared to be a fulfillment, was not a fulfillment. By 1873, Dr. Litch published a book titled, A Complete Harmony of Daniel and the Apocalypse, in which he wrote, "the trumpets are yet future and will occur shortly before the second coming of Christ."

I don't see this as to anyones credit... there have been many men throughout history that were given divine light to proclaim and afterward fell away from it... Miller, Litch, Edson, Smith, Kellog among many others. It doesn't negate the truth that they proclaimed, it just means they didn't stay with the light given them and were deluded to believe otherwise.

 

[MidnightCry]

Dr. Litch withdrew his announcement that the sixth trumpet had been fulfilled in August, 1840. He became convinced that what had appeared to be a fulfillment, was not a fulfillment.

Please show me where in history the first six trumpets have been fulfilled. When did hail and fire rain down and burn up a third of the earth, a third of the trees, and all the green grass?

Show me where in history something like a huge mountain (an asteroid, perhaps) was thrown into the sea. A third of the sea turned into blood, a third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed.

Show me where in history a great star, blazing like a torch, (a comet, perhaps)fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water and turned the water bitter.

I believe that on or before a prophecy is fulfilled, God makes it clear and He shines more light on His truth.

An example of this is the understanding of the importance of the 2,300 days of Daniel 8:14. As the year 1840 approached, a significant number of people in Europe and America came to understand this prophecy. William Miller had about 100,000 people of various denominations who subscribed to his prophetic conclusion that Jesus was about to return.

William Miller was not alone in his preaching. Great preachers of the era include Charles G. Finney, Dwight L Moody and Billy Sunday. These and many others contributed to the spiritual revival of America and Europe at that time.
I believe God gave them this light and understanding at the proper time. Even though they were not exactly correct in their understanding, obviously Jesus did not return in 1843 or 1844, they continued to study and discover that the cleansing of the heavenly temple, the investigation of the records of those who have died had begun.

I believe God gave them this light and understanding. And I believe before the trumpets take place, He will make it clear to His followers exactly what is coming.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

The signs you pointed out were all symbolic, like all prophetic signs are, and have been fulfilled. I am not going to make it easy on you by spending hours reacquainting myself with the specifics of the meanings of each symbol, but they are there if you chose to find them. Not only the book, which I gave a link to, explains these symbols... Daniel and the Revelation by Uriah Smith also sufficiently lays it out in the context of historical account.

The problem with thinking that these prophesies have not been fulfilled and are to be in the future as Mr. Litch suggests, is to get people looking for signs and fulfillments of things that have already happened, thus diverting the mind away from realizing the time we are living in and to distract us from our work in these last days.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

Does anyone believe the trumpets in Revelation are literal?

In the sense that they are what John literally saw in his vision, yes.

 

[MidnightCry]

EastCoastRemnent,

I looked at the link you provided. I have seen those explanations before. I don't believe them. I don't believe a person has to be a history scholar or a theologian to understand the Bible. The Bible was written for everyone. People in China, Germany, Africa -- anyone should be able to pick up the Bible, study it, ask for God's guidance from the Holy Spirit, and be able to make some sense of it.

You are holding onto a tradition of the church. A historical interpretation that hardly makes sense at all. The Bible interprets itself. Some guy in the 1800's decided what hail symbolizes? An asteroid isn't an asteroid -- it's whatever someone decides it symbolizes?? That doesn't make any sense. There are many different historical interpretations of Revelation and they don't all agree on the events. You can't even explain it in simple terms to me. It shouldn't be that difficult to understand or explain to someone else.

Did you know that scientists didn't believe a global earthquake was possible until recently? Now scientists believe it could happen. And we didn't know that asteroids actually hit this planet until fairly recently? Now some people want to build a weapon that will break up an asteroid that could be headed for earth. It's like the scientific community is ahead of the church. That shouldn't be.

You need to think outside the box. What if they are literal? What is the reason God would send these seven plagues? Everything God does has a purpose.

YSIC,
midnightcry

 

[NNSV]

My personal opinion is that everything in the bible is a paradox: paradoxically real and figurative. It sort of alludes to the son of man/Son of God human/spirit paradox we exist in. (The only one who was united as a perfect Son of man/God is Christ.)

With that said, I think all the trumps, vials and seals are literal. In Hebrew history, a seal was a written issue of something to come - a war, help, resources, calamity, etc. It is the messenger's job to deliver the seal without the seal broken.

The first four seals are the first four horsemen, which in my opinion are literal (conquerer, war monger, pestilence/famine, mass death.) It is not hard to see that these four things have either chronically occurred over two thousand years (with imperialism, Jesuit evangelicalism, inquisitions, torture, world wars since the 600s, etc,) or they will acutely occur in the future.

The fifth seal is what points us in a better time frame, as those in Heaven ask God how long will it be till He avenges them. God tells them that it will occur in a little season, when believers/saints are killed according to what should be fulfilled (Daniel 11:33-35.) This seal isn't a consequence of the other four, it is an informative seal giving us the time period and events showing the end.

The sixth seal, trump and vial are tied with each other (666,) and are characteristics of THE antichrist, and his advent. Similarly, the seventh seal, trump and vial (777) are characteristics of THE CHRIST'S, and His advent. Sixth seal is darkness, earthquakes, and the moon becoming red as blood.

The seventh seal is the end/information is given to the reader.



The trumps, in history, announced someone/something's arrival. The trumps, we see, are calamity.

The first is fire mingled with blood

The second is a great mountain burning cast into the sea.

The third trump is a star called Wormwood that comes upon the earth, killing a third of things.

The fourth trump is s third part of the moon, sun and stars were darkened.

The fifth trump is when a star/Angel Abaddon (Abaddon = The Destroyer) with the authority to open the bottomless pit falls unto earth.

The sixth trump is when the 200,000,000+ creatures are revealed by the bounded angels of the Euphrates (this reminds me of angelic creatures dropping onto world to torture men and terrorize women before Antichrist makes his heroic entrance, similar to the angels that fell in Genesis.)

Seventh trump - end/information given.


The Vials are bowls of judgment poured upon a rebelious people. In order for bowls of wrath of God to be poured out, Abaddon/The Beast/Antichrist/Satan-As-Man will need to be established on earth, and polluting it (this saturation of pollution will eventually lead to the abomination that causes desolation.) These vials are for the people that accept the Mark of the Beast: God isn't angry at His saints, the same way He wasn't angry at them during Exodus.

Bowl 1: Noisome and grievous sores befall those who have received the mark of the beast.

Bowl 2: Sea becomes blood; massive marine life die-off
Bowl 3: Rivers and fountains become blood
Bowl 4: "Power was given to scorch men with fire;" a super-solar x-flare, weakening magnetic field strength, ionizing radiation etc.
Bowl 5: This vial is poured onto the seat of the Beast. His kingdom becomes full of darkness, and the people gnash at their teeth
Bowl 6: Euphrates dried up to prepare a way for war
Bowl 7: It is finished. (Christ's Advent)



These bowls, trumps and seals seem VERY literal to me. Moreover, there are universal structures that fit the cosmic signs of the trumps, vials and seals (as well as terrestrial structures.) Specifically, the trumps sound exactly like what would happen if the earth is being affected by a very large gravitational and electromagnetic body.

Comet Elenin: Preview of a Coming Attraction - NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory

Wormwood (star) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Nemesis, Proposed Companion Star to the Sun and Mass Extinctions on Earth



Of course, these pose "no threat" to us...

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

EastCoastRemnent,

I looked at the link you provided. I have seen those explanations before. I don't believe them. I don't believe a person has to be a history scholar or a theologian to understand the Bible. The Bible was written for everyone. People in China, Germany, Africa -- anyone should be able to pick up the Bible, study it, ask for God's guidance from the Holy Spirit, and be able to make some sense of it.

You are holding onto a tradition of the church. A historical interpretation that hardly makes sense at all. The Bible interprets itself. Some guy in the 1800's decided what hail symbolizes? An asteroid isn't an asteroid -- it's whatever someone decides it symbolizes?? That doesn't make any sense. There are many different historical interpretations of Revelation and they don't all agree on the events. You can't even explain it in simple terms to me. It shouldn't be that difficult to understand or explain to someone else.

Did you know that scientists didn't believe a global earthquake was possible until recently? Now scientists believe it could happen. And we didn't know that asteroids actually hit this planet until fairly recently? Now some people want to build a weapon that will break up an asteroid that could be headed for earth. It's like the scientific community is ahead of the church. That shouldn't be.

You need to think outside the box. What if they are literal? What is the reason God would send these seven plagues? Everything God does has a purpose.

YSIC,
midnightcry

May the Holy Spirit reveal these things to you...

 

[MidnightCry]

EastCoastRemnant,

Your answer is a cop out. Is that the best you can do??

Don't forget, the first time Jesus came the religious leaders had it wrong. They didn't even recognize Him. They did n't even bother to go to Bethlehem when He was born. Some pagan kings from a foreign land had to figure out the prophecy concerning the birth of Christ.

Then when He was preaching and teaching, they still didn't recognize Him. And they had the old testament scriptures which pointed to Jesus.

It is better to be like the Bereans and study the scriptures for yourself. The religious leaders have it wrong again.

The time of the end will begin with a great earthquake when the censer is thrown down. (See Revelation 8). Then the trumpets will follow. Jesus needs to wake everyone up, so they will turn to Him and seek salvation before it is too late.

YSIC,
midnightcry

 

[tnp2140]

Midnight Cry,

You are correct. The 7 Trumpets are yet future. Those who are honest in their research will find that Uriah Smith and our other pioneers simply adopted the historic view of the Trumpets and Seals primarily from Anglican theologians of the 18th and 19th centuries. This was not light which was given to us directly from God. There is a great and important reason why the Creator has reserved certain truths, such as these, for the final generation.

Studying the book of Revelation in light of the sanctuary doctrine will reveal the truth about the trumpets with the greatest clarity. Remember however, that JEHOVAH has stated that 'only the wise shall understand', thus this subject is futile to discuss with nominal adventists who have not grown to love the Truth.

If you still use this website, feel free to reply here or message me privately and I will be more than happy to share what has thus far been revealed in regards to the Trumpets and the Seals, using the Bible and the Bible alone. The truths here are tremendous...

 

[MidnightCry]

Midnight Cry,

You are correct. The 7 Trumpets are yet future. Those who are honest in their research will find that Uriah Smith and our other pioneers simply adopted the historic view of the Trumpets and Seals primarily from Anglican theologians of the 18th and 19th centuries. This was not light which was given to us directly from God. There is a great and important reason why the Creator has reserved certain truths, such as these, for the final generation.

Studying the book of Revelation in light of the sanctuary doctrine will reveal the truth about the trumpets with the greatest clarity. Remember however, that JEHOVAH has stated that 'only the wise shall understand', thus this subject is futile to discuss with nominal adventists who have not grown to love the Truth.

If you still use this website, feel free to reply here or message me privately and I will be more than happy to share what has thus far been revealed in regards to the Trumpets and the Seals, using the Bible and the Bible alone. The truths here are tremendous...

Greetings TNP,

Happy Sabbath to you and thank you for your response to my post.

I am very interested to hear your thoughts on the seals, trumpets, and bowl judgments. I love the SDA Church, but I feel they are being left behind as truth continues moving forward. They are doing their members a disservice by not restudying parts of Revelation in light of advances in science, technology, and new knowledge of earthquakes, asteroids, etc.

I am afraid there will be many people who are so surprised and shocked at coming events that they may lose their faith. People are not prepared for what is about to occur. They are holding onto their church traditions and teachings so tightly they cannot even see any other possibilities. The blind are leading the blind.

I am looking forward to your response.

YSIC,
MidnightCry