Are some vaccines made using fetal cell lines?

[God saves]

It seems that some vaccines are made using fetal cell lines. Is this true, and if so what are your thoughts on this? And is it true only in some countries or is it true worldwide?

This disturbs me greatly, especially as I am considering going into nursing or nursing-related careers (I have also considered jobs like personal care worker or home health aide, and do have alternative careers in mind such as working with children with additional needs in a school setting).

This article from Christian Medical and Dental Associations :https://cmda.org/article/am-i-my-brother states: "Are such alternative vaccines—vaccines not made with fetal cell lines—available? Yes, and all but two of those vaccines are licensed by the FDA, and thus obtainable in the U.S. The two not available here are the Hepatitis A and the rubella vaccines. The Kitasato Institute in Japan makes these two vaccines in cell lines derived from animal organs, but since they are not licensed by the FDA, a patient would have to travel to Japan to obtain them. That would be pricey, but that would be a way to satisfy one’s conscience while protecting one’s own health and the health of the public." From this it seems people have the choice (at least in the USA) of getting vaccines that do not use fetal cell lines, but I don't know what someone whose job duties include giving injections can do about this? I personally don't feel right about giving injections that were made using fetal cell lines. I guess a solution to this issue is to aim for jobs that don't require you to give vaccines that use fetal cell lines.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

It is good, great even, that already seeing as you see, you are disturbed by what they do and what they get away with.

A wide variety and opposing opinions are on the forum. You won't find consensus here.

Search the internet and medical libraries with books since before 1950, and health orientated stores/ books/ that show items not under the thumb(control) of pharmakeia.

It is a whole different world.

 

[LoricaLady]

I don't trust vaccines anyway. They have toxic things in them. There really is no scientific evidence that they even work - no control group studies for example. There are health care professionals, like medical doctors, who have studied them up close and in research and say they are often quite harmful, and often unnecessary to even consider.

As for fetal tissue, yes, I have heard that, too. They have also been caught selling fetal tissue for various, other, purposes.

 

[God saves]

I don't trust vaccines anyway. They have toxic things in them. There really is no scientific evidence that they even work - no control group studies for example. There are health care professionals, like medical doctors, who have studied them up close and in research and say they are often quite harmful, and often unnecessary to even consider.

As for fetal tissue, yes, I have heard that, too. They have also been caught selling fetal tissue for various, other, purposes.

So what do you think someone who is considering training for jobs in nursing should do?

 

[mnphysicist]

It seems that some vaccines are made using fetal cell lines. Is this true, and if so what are your thoughts on this? And is it true only in some countries or is it true worldwide?

Vaccine suppliers are not dependent upon a continuous influx of new fetal tissue from abortions in order to make vaccines for any type of vaccine in any part of the world. Thus, you would not be injecting aborted fetus cells when giving someone a chickenpox vaccine.

That being said, there is nuance with this as vaccine development did involve fetal tissue cells which did come from a couple aborted babies back in the 60's.

So a couple tough questions.

1. You have a major measles outbreak in your community, and you as a nurse, who normally doesn't give vaccines is called up to do so as your doctors office is short staffed. Would you as a nurse refuse to vaccinate your patients due to the historical link to abortion?

If you would refuse, and thus hang your patients out to dry, you have no business being a nurse. This doesn't mean that all nurses need to do so, or even be called to do so... but if an emergency arises, and you are the sole nurse available, you need to take care of your patients. if you see yourself refusing to do so, thats a huge problem.

2. Lets say your 5 year old kid is bitten by a stray dog. Said dog is then quarantined, and was determined to have rabies. Would you as a parent consent to have the rabies shot given to your child? Knowing that if you don't, your child will suffer and likely die. Knowing also that the rabies vaccine has a historical link to abortion? If you would do this to save the life of your child, why would you not give vaccines to save the lives of other peoples children?

I know the above are hard questions...

To learn more about the history and connection between vaccines and abortion. This is a pretty decent link. Human Cell Strains in Vaccine Development | History of Vaccines

To understand morality and ethics, this statement from the Vatican can be pretty helpful, bearing in mind its a challenging read.
Vatican Statement on Vaccines Derived From Aborted Human Fetuses

As far as debating a nursing career or not... there are tons of prolife nurses, and short of a tiny number, many find no ethical challenges when it comes to giving vaccines. Rather, most nurses would find it unethical to refuse to do so. Lastly, if you have nearly any type of role in a health care facility, its highly likely you will need to provide vaccination records, and it something is amiss, you will need to get it addresses prior to hiring... which means you must be vaccinated too.

 

[LoricaLady]

So what do you think someone who is considering training for jobs in nursing should do?

I am no expert but it seems to me that the nursing profession has a wide range of options for work You can work as anything like a midwife to a brain surgery nurse, or in ER. There are many areas of work where things like fetal cells and vaccines are no issue.

My first concern would be that the nurse, in school and elsewhere, would not be forced to get vaccinated. Now some are not worried about vaccines. I am! I have seen research showing they really can cause you to get sick instead of better. Where are the studies, with control groups showing they even work at all? Many doctors and nurses have horror stories to report about vaccines and what the real research on them reveals.

Last winter I didn't get any flu shot, as usual. My doctor got his as usual. I never got the flu. He had the flu for 3 weeks. People tend to be naive and trusting. Ask them what studies they have seen either way on vaccines and they will give you a blank look. Big Pharma makes big bucks off of vaccines and if you get sick from them, well great, they can sell you some more of their products.

What I would say to nurses is to do research on both sides of this issue, pray, and beware.

 

[God saves]

I do not think that I would have an issue with giving vaccines or injections if they were not derived from aborted fetal tissue AND if I was reasonably convinced that they were necessary, safe and effective in a particular situation as long as I was competent in giving vaccines and injections. The fact that I may be required to give a vaccine derived from aborted fetal cell ines and may possibly do so in an emergency situation were there no other alternative does not mean I feel comfortable about some vaccines derived from fetal cell lines (if true).

The issue I see is that I am against abortion and believe abortion is very wrong, and if I were to give vaccines that were derived from aborted fetal cell tissue to me it seems that my actions may be contradicting my position of being against abortion. I do not know a lot about the development of vaccines.

The question I think I should perhaps ask myself in any job and scenario is would my actions be pleasing to God and be for the benefit of others?

As far as possible, if I were to going into nursing or nursing-related careers I would try to look for a job where the job duties are ones I would be willing to do, or I could go for jobs other than nursing such as home health aide or careers related to working with children, social work, or special education.

@LoricaLady I did some research and I guess that it's true not all nursing positions require you to give vaccines, but what about during training to become an enrolled or registered nurse?

 

[Kaon]

It seems that some vaccines are made using fetal cell lines. Is this true, and if so what are your thoughts on this? And is it true only in some countries or is it true worldwide?

This disturbs me greatly, especially as I am considering going into nursing or nursing-related careers (I have also considered jobs like personal care worker or home health aide, and do have alternative careers in mind such as working with children with additional needs in a school setting).

This article from Christian Medical and Dental Associations :https://cmda.org/article/am-i-my-brother states: "Are such alternative vaccines—vaccines not made with fetal cell lines—available? Yes, and all but two of those vaccines are licensed by the FDA, and thus obtainable in the U.S. The two not available here are the Hepatitis A and the rubella vaccines. The Kitasato Institute in Japan makes these two vaccines in cell lines derived from animal organs, but since they are not licensed by the FDA, a patient would have to travel to Japan to obtain them. That would be pricey, but that would be a way to satisfy one’s conscience while protecting one’s own health and the health of the public." From this it seems people have the choice (at least in the USA) of getting vaccines that do not use fetal cell lines, but I don't know what someone whose job duties include giving injections can do about this? I personally don't feel right about giving injections that were made using fetal cell lines. I guess a solution to this issue is to aim for jobs that don't require you to give vaccines that use fetal cell lines.

Vaccines are perfect, safe and ethical. Always.

 

[God saves]

How can vaccines always be safe and ethical?

 

[Kaon]

How can vaccines always be safe and ethical?

Should I used a weaker modifier?

This is what is parroted on these forums. I figure I try being part of the majority to see how that works out for me.

 

[LoricaLady]

I do not think that I would have an issue with giving vaccines or injections if they were not derived from aborted fetal tissue AND if I was reasonably convinced that they were necessary, safe and effective in a particular situation as long as I was competent in giving vaccines and injections. The fact that I may be required to give a vaccine derived from aborted fetal cell ines and may possibly do so in an emergency situation were there no other alternative does not mean I feel comfortable about some vaccines derived from fetal cell lines (if true).

The issue I see is that I am against abortion and believe abortion is very wrong, and if I were to give vaccines that were derived from aborted fetal cell tissue to me it seems that my actions may be contradicting my position of being against abortion. I do not know a lot about the development of vaccines.

The question I think I should perhaps ask myself in any job and scenario is would my actions be pleasing to God and be for the benefit of others?

As far as possible, if I were to going into nursing or nursing-related careers I would try to look for a job where the job duties are ones I would be willing to do, or I could go for jobs other than nursing such as home health aide or careers related to working with children, social work, or special education.

@LoricaLady I did some research and I guess that it's true not all nursing positions require you to give vaccines, but what about during training to become an enrolled or registered nurse?

That is a very good question. I think an aspiring nurse should ask her college of choice to tell what the situation would be and ask, if it was concerning, if he or she had the option to not give any such shots. That would need to be in writing if so.

 

[LoricaLady]

Vaccines are perfect, safe and ethical. Always.

I don't know your qualifications, but there are doctors and nurses who say just the opposite, even write books on the dangers. They don't just say they are dangerous. They give data to back that up from research done over decades. Further, if they are always safe and perfect why have law suits been successfully won against them? Rhetorical Q.

Notice there isn't any list of ingredients on vaccine vials. In the past, don't know about the present for sure, vaccines have contained things like mercury. Again, if they make you sick in some way down the pike, that gives Big Pharma another opportunity to sell you more drugs.

 

[Kaon]

I don't know your qualifications, but there are doctors and nurses who say just the opposite, even write books on the dangers. They don't just say they are dangerous. They give data to back that up from research done over decades. Further, if they are always safe and perfect why have law suits been successfully won against them? Rhetorical Q.

Notice there isn't any list of ingredients on vaccine vials. In the past, don't know about the present for sure, vaccines have contained things like mercury. Again, if they make you sick in some way down the pike, that gives Big Pharma another opportunity to sell you more drugs.

Hi, likely you haven't seen me post on these forums before, or my qualifications (which I state occasionally on other threads).

However, let me say that that post was incredibly sarcastic. It was a way to beat the 20-page-ranters who worship modern medicine, trust humans over their Father, and trade their common and spiritual sense for obedience to another man's word.

See, if I had typed that above, I will get a plethora of people who will have no choice but to get offended (as I have offended their faith) - who are not mature enough not to argue with every phrase that makes them tingle with emotions for which they are unfamiliar and undeveloped. The thread would be filled with academic storm troopers and 30 pages of nonsense. Every possible part of the would be missed. However, a couple of people who genuinely so see about my position - subtly telling me I may be in error is much more of an intellectually optimistic sight considering how easy it would be to insult me.

Most people on here just like to debate, they don't care about the substance. So, for some things I know are emotionally and psychologically vampiric, it's better to behave differently in anticipation. Debating doesn't require someone to believe what they say - just that they defend the topic properly. Lots of people get off on arguing just to excite the other facets.



Tl;dr: I agree.

 

[LoricaLady]

Post deleted by poster.

 

[Kaon]

Oh, you were just being sarcastic. That's comforting. I have seen people saying just as outrageous things who weren't kidding, so I didn't know.

I am glad you entertained it even without knowing the context or believing/agreeing with me. I should be more careful not to squander your type of thinking by providing an appropriate caveat (I am serious).

 

[LoricaLady]

Post deleted by poster.

 

[God saves]

Lastly, if you have nearly any type of role in a health care facility, its highly likely you will need to provide vaccination records, and it something is amiss, you will need to get it addresses prior to hiring... which means you must be vaccinated too.

Well, I think in a few states in the USA students attending an institution are legally required to get certain vaccines and the only exemption legally allowed is a medical exemption.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Should I used a weaker modifier?

This is what is parroted on these forums. I figure I try being part of the majority to see how that works out for me.

As per this section of forum, "christian advice" (so-called) might 'always' be what the majority says.
But search all Scripture and see, Yahuweh (God) Does Not Go Along with that.

How many times does His Perfect Word Say that the majority is 'always' evil, death-dealing, wrong ?

So, then, for those who believe Yahuweh's Word, we refuse to go along with the 'majority', for good and true and perfect reasons. We remain abiding in His Word, by grace, trusting the Father in heaven to accomplish our salvation in this life and in the life to come.

 

[Kaon]

As per this section of forum, "christian advice" (so-called) might 'always' be what the majority says.
But search all Scripture and see, Yahuweh (God) Does Not Go Along with that.

How many times does His Perfect Word Say that the majority is 'always' evil, death-dealing, wrong ?

So, then, for those who believe Yahuweh's Word, we refuse to go along with the 'majority', for good and true and perfect reasons. We remain abiding in His Word, by grace, trusting the Father in heaven to accomplish our salvation in this life and in the life to come.

Yeah, but my reputation, and stuff...

[\sarcasm]

100% correct. However, will He find faith when He comes back?

I genuinely ask, because it is/has been so serious that I now understand why He said, "If it were possible..." the enemy would deceive the very elect. You keep alluding to simplicity that the lot of us fail to grasp with the Redeemer.

 

[Joy]

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