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Featured Are professed Christians who deliberately practice sin saved?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by Lily of Valleys, Jan 25, 2018.

  1. fhansen

    fhansen Oldbie

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    Well, I'm not sure I understand the question, but we need to rest in God, trusting that He's infinitely just, and knowing that, to the extent that we believe in and follow Him, have fruit in our lives, etc, we're with Him-and God will always do the right thing. And the more we come to love Him and neighbor, the greater our own justice, all of this being a work of His, a work of grace, in the end. But while we can have a strong level of assurance, we can't know with absolute, 100% certainty what God, alone, knows with perfect certitude: whose names are written in the Book of Life and whose are not.
     
  2. Jess Lee

    Jess Lee New Member

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    I don’t think that ‘love covers a multitude of sins’ means that christians could make up for being trapped in habitual sin by being extraordiarily charitable towars others...

    (Romans 13:9-10)
    For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
    Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.


    This let us know that when we do as Jesus Christ, our Lord, commanded us “to love one another”, we won’t be sinning.
    In fact, the whole Bible teach us not to sin.

    What habitual sin is there?
    Sexual thought? Homosexuality? drinking?

    (1 Corinthians 6:9-10)
    Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
    Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.


    Jesus said looking at another woman with lust is to commit adultery.

    When the new comes, what old goes away?

    (Colossians 3:7-10)
    In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
    But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.
    Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
    And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:


    (2 Corinthians 5:17)
    Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

    Our good work will not cover up for the wrong.
    Only through Christ, we are redeemed from sin.
    Who is the holy sacrifice, replacing the old sacrifice of the lamb.
    Only blood can redeem us (Leviticus 17:11).
    Sin leads to death while Spirit leads to life.
    The Spirit of God teach us and free us from sin.
    That is why Paul urged us to follow the Holy Spirit and not our sinful nature (Romans 8:4-5)

    (Romans 8:13-14)
    For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
    For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.


    Is there anything impossible for God?

    (Matthew 19:26)
    Jesus looked at them and said, "With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."

    We, who have received the Holy Spirit, do we trust God?
     
  3. Old Trapper

    Old Trapper Active Member

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    Not sure how "mixing genes" is perverting God's creation since mutation, a natural process, does the same as does hybrid (e.g Mule, dogs, etc.).

    Never heard that pigs have evil spirits save for the one example where evil spirits were cast into a herd of swine. Pigs, in the time of Christ, and earlier, did have trichina which could infect humans if the meat was not cooked properly. Most of that has been eliminated with the advancements in science, and technology.
     
  4. Alexpro

    Alexpro New avitar picture. Supporter

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    A Pig is an unclean animal that's why a lot of people don't eat it. If you look in the Old Testament there are certain foods the Israel light didn't eat commanded by God. They have unclean spirits we had this discussion at church. I will share some scripture. Pigs are unclean animals. A lot of people are committing sin by eating unclean meat and they don't even realize it. I use to be a vegetarian I might go back. I don't want to be Sining like the rest of the world.

    Leviticus 11:1-
    1And the Lord spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,
    2Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.
    3Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.
    4Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: as the camel, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    5And the coney, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    6And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    7And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you.
    8Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they are unclean to you.
    9These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat.
    10And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you:
    11They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination.
    12Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.
    13And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they are an abomination: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
    14And the vulture, and the kite after his kind;
    15Every raven after his kind;
    16And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
    17And the little owl, and the cormorant, and the great owl,
    18And the swan, and the pelican, and the gier eagle,
    19And the stork, the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.
    20All fowls that creep, going upon all four, shall be an abomination unto you.
    21Yet these may ye eat of every flying creeping thing that goeth upon all four, which have legs above their feet, to leap withal upon the earth;
    22Even these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind.
    23But all other flying creeping things, which have four feet, shall be an abomination unto you.
    24And for these ye shall be unclean: whosoever toucheth the carcase of them shall be unclean until the even.
    25And whosoever beareth ought of the carcase of them shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even.
    26The carcases of every beast which divideth the hoof, and is not clovenfooted, nor cheweth the cud, are unclean unto you: every one that toucheth them shall be unclean.
    27And whatsoever goeth upon his paws, among all manner of beasts that go on all four, those are unclean unto you: whoso toucheth their carcase shall be unclean until the even.
    28And he that beareth the carcase of them shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even: they are unclean unto you.
    29These also shall be unclean unto you among the creeping things that creep upon the earth; the weasel, and the mouse, and the tortoise after his kind,
    30And the ferret, and the chameleon, and the lizard, and the snail, and the mole.
    31These are unclean to you among all that creep: whosoever doth touch them, when they be dead, shall be unclean until the even.
    32And upon whatsoever any of them, when they are dead, doth fall, it shall be unclean; whether it be any vessel of wood, or raiment, or skin, or sack, whatsoever vessel it be, wherein any work is done, it must be put into water, and it shall be unclean until the even; so it shall be cleansed.
    33And every earthen vessel, whereinto any of them falleth, whatsoever is in it shall be unclean; and ye shall break it.
    34Of all meat which may be eaten, that on which such water cometh shall be unclean: and all drink that may be drunk in every such vessel shall be unclean.
    35And every thing whereupon any part of their carcase falleth shall be unclean; whether it be oven, or ranges for pots, they shall be broken down: for they are unclean, and shall be unclean unto you.
    36Nevertheless a fountain or pit, wherein there is plenty of water, shall be clean: but that which toucheth their carcase shall be unclean.wherein…: Heb. a gathering together of waters
    37And if any part of their carcase fall upon any sowing seed which is to be sown, it shall be clean.
    38But if any water be put upon the seed, and any part of their carcase fall thereon, it shall be unclean unto you.
    39And if any beast, of which ye may eat, die; he that toucheth the carcase thereof shall be unclean until the even.
    40And he that eateth of the carcase of it shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even: he also that beareth the carcase of it shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even.
    41And every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth shall be an abomination; it shall not be eaten.
    42Whatsoever goeth upon the belly, and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat; for they are an abomination.hath…: Heb. doth multiply feet
    43Ye shall not make yourselves abominable with any creeping thing that creepeth, neither shall ye make yourselves unclean with them, that ye should be defiled thereby.yourselves abominable: Heb. your souls, etc.
    44For I am the Lord your God: ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy; for I am holy: neither shall ye defile yourselves with any manner of creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
    45For I am the Lord that bringeth you up out of the land of Egypt, to be your God: ye shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.
    46This is the law of the beasts, and of the fowl, and of every living creature that moveth in the waters, and of every creature that creepeth upon the earth:
    47To make a difference between the unclean and the clean, and between the beast that may be eaten and the beast that may not be eaten.


    Learn More
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
  5. Alexpro

    Alexpro New avitar picture. Supporter

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    1And the Lord spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,
    2Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.
    3Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.
    4Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: as the camel, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    5And the coney, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    6And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    7And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you.
    8Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they are unclean to you.
    9These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat.
    10And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you:
    11They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination.
    12Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.
    13And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they are an abomination: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
    14And the vulture, and the kite after his kind;
    15Every raven after his kind;
    16And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
    17And the little owl, and the cormorant, and the great owl,
    18And the swan, and the pelican, and the gier eagle,
    19And the stork, the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.
    20All fowls that creep, going upon all four, shall be an abomination unto you.
    21Yet these may ye eat of every flying creeping thing that goeth upon all four, which have legs above their feet, to leap withal upon the earth;
    22Even these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind.
    23But all other flying creeping things, which have four feet, shall be an abomination unto you.
    24And for these ye shall be unclean: whosoever toucheth the carcase of them shall be unclean until the even.
    25And whosoever beareth ought of the carcase of them shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even.
    26The carcases of every beast which divideth the hoof, and is not clovenfooted, nor cheweth the cud, are unclean unto you: every one that toucheth them shall be unclean.
    27And whatsoever goeth upon his paws, among all manner of beasts that go on all four, those are unclean unto you: whoso toucheth their carcase shall be unclean until the even.
    28And he that beareth the carcase of them shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even: they are unclean unto you.
    29These also shall be unclean unto you among the creeping things that creep upon the earth; the weasel, and the mouse, and the tortoise after his kind,
    30And the ferret, and the chameleon, and the lizard, and the snail, and the mole.
    31These are unclean to you among all that creep: whosoever doth touch them, when they be dead, shall be unclean until the even.
    32And upon whatsoever any of them, when they are dead, doth fall, it shall be unclean; whether it be any vessel of wood, or raiment, or skin, or sack, whatsoever vessel it be, wherein any work is done, it must be put into water, and it shall be unclean until the even; so it shall be cleansed.
    33And every earthen vessel, whereinto any of them falleth, whatsoever is in it shall be unclean; and ye shall break it.
    34Of all meat which may be eaten, that on which such water cometh shall be unclean: and all drink that may be drunk in every such vessel shall be unclean.
    35And every thing whereupon any part of their carcase falleth shall be unclean; whether it be oven, or ranges for pots, they shall be broken down: for they are unclean, and shall be unclean unto you.
    36Nevertheless a fountain or pit, wherein there is plenty of water, shall be clean: but that which toucheth their carcase shall be unclean.wherein…: Heb. a gathering together of waters
    37And if any part of their carcase fall upon any sowing seed which is to be sown, it shall be clean.
    38But if any water be put upon the seed, and any part of their carcase fall thereon, it shall be unclean unto you.
    39And if any beast, of which ye may eat, die; he that toucheth the carcase thereof shall be unclean until the even.
    40And he that eateth of the carcase of it shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even: he also that beareth the carcase of it shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even.
    41And every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth shall be an abomination; it shall not be eaten.
    42Whatsoever goeth upon the belly, and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat; for they are an abomination.hath…: Heb. doth multiply feet
    43Ye shall not make yourselves abominable with any creeping thing that creepeth, neither shall ye make yourselves unclean with them, that ye should be defiled thereby.yourselves abominable: Heb. your souls, etc.
    44For I am the Lord your God: ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy; for I am holy: neither shall ye defile yourselves with any manner of creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
    45For I am the Lord that bringeth you up out of the land of Egypt, to be your God: ye shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.
    46This is the law of the beasts, and of the fowl, and of every living creature that moveth in the waters, and of every creature that creepeth upon the earth:
    47To make a difference between the unclean and the clean, and between the beast that may be eaten and the beast that may not be eaten.
     
  6. Alexpro

    Alexpro New avitar picture. Supporter

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    People are committing sin and they don't even realize it. I use to be a vegetarian. I might go back and stop eating meat because I think it's a sin. Here's some scripture.

    1And the Lord spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,
    2Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.
    3Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.
    4Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: as the camel, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    5And the coney, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    6And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
    7And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you.
    8Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they are unclean to you.
    9These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat.
    10And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you:
    11They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination.
    12Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.
    13And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they are an abomination: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
    14And the vulture, and the kite after his kind;
    15Every raven after his kind;
    16And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
    17And the little owl, and the cormorant, and the great owl,
    18And the swan, and the pelican, and the gier eagle,
    19And the stork, the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.
    20All fowls that creep, going upon all four, shall be an abomination unto you.
    21Yet these may ye eat of every flying creeping thing that goeth upon all four, which have legs above their feet, to leap withal upon the earth;
    22Even these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind.
    23But all other flying creeping things, which have four feet, shall be an abomination unto you.
    24And for these ye shall be unclean: whosoever toucheth the carcase of them shall be unclean until the even.
    25And whosoever beareth ought of the carcase of them shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even.
    26The carcases of every beast which divideth the hoof, and is not clovenfooted, nor cheweth the cud, are unclean unto you: every one that toucheth them shall be unclean.
    27And whatsoever goeth upon his paws, among all manner of beasts that go on all four, those are unclean unto you: whoso toucheth their carcase shall be unclean until the even.
    28And he that beareth the carcase of them shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even: they are unclean unto you.
    29These also shall be unclean unto you among the creeping things that creep upon the earth; the weasel, and the mouse, and the tortoise after his kind,
    30And the ferret, and the chameleon, and the lizard, and the snail, and the mole.
    31These are unclean to you among all that creep: whosoever doth touch them, when they be dead, shall be unclean until the even.
    32And upon whatsoever any of them, when they are dead, doth fall, it shall be unclean; whether it be any vessel of wood, or raiment, or skin, or sack, whatsoever vessel it be, wherein any work is done, it must be put into water, and it shall be unclean until the even; so it shall be cleansed.
    33And every earthen vessel, whereinto any of them falleth, whatsoever is in it shall be unclean; and ye shall break it.
    34Of all meat which may be eaten, that on which such water cometh shall be unclean: and all drink that may be drunk in every such vessel shall be unclean.
    35And every thing whereupon any part of their carcase falleth shall be unclean; whether it be oven, or ranges for pots, they shall be broken down: for they are unclean, and shall be unclean unto you.
    36Nevertheless a fountain or pit, wherein there is plenty of water, shall be clean: but that which toucheth their carcase shall be unclean.wherein…: Heb. a gathering together of waters
    37And if any part of their carcase fall upon any sowing seed which is to be sown, it shall be clean.
    38But if any water be put upon the seed, and any part of their carcase fall thereon, it shall be unclean unto you.
    39And if any beast, of which ye may eat, die; he that toucheth the carcase thereof shall be unclean until the even.
    40And he that eateth of the carcase of it shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even: he also that beareth the carcase of it shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even.
    41And every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth shall be an abomination; it shall not be eaten.
    42Whatsoever goeth upon the belly, and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat; for they are an abomination.hath…: Heb. doth multiply feet
    43Ye shall not make yourselves abominable with any creeping thing that creepeth, neither shall ye make yourselves unclean with them, that ye should be defiled thereby.yourselves abominable: Heb. your souls, etc.
    44For I am the Lord your God: ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy; for I am holy: neither shall ye defile yourselves with any manner of creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
    45For I am the Lord that bringeth you up out of the land of Egypt, to be your God: ye shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.
    46This is the law of the beasts, and of the fowl, and of every living creature that moveth in the waters, and of every creature that creepeth upon the earth:
    47To make a difference between the unclean and the clean, and between the beast that may be eaten and the beast that may not be eaten.
     
  7. woobadooba

    woobadooba Legend

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    Saved from what? If people haven't changed, then what have they been saved from? Just because a person calls Jesus Lord, it doesn't mean they are saved (see Matt. 7:21-23).
     
  8. Marvin Knox

    Marvin Knox Senior Veteran

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    Of course I agree.
    Of course I agree.
    Of course I agree.
    Note the portion I highlighted in your second statement above ("subsequent to salvation").

    As I have said - I agree with that.

    But she does not and that is the discussion I am having with her.

    She says that people give their life over the the Lord and then sometime later they are saved. She says that the time of salvation is when one is filled with the Spirit and not before.

    You and I agree on all of your statements. You and I both disagree with her.

    If you'll let me nail her beliefs down a little - perhaps we will see if we are correct in our assessment of her view of salvation.

    She apparently equates what you and I believe to be a secondary event with initial salvation itself.

    As a charismatic - she likely equates being filled with the Spirit to the time she spoke in tongues - but she hasn't said so. Hence my question for her.

    She also, in all likelihood, would use the term "baptism of the Holy Spirit" for being filled with the Spirit. While that particular term remains somewhat controversial between charismatic and non charismatic Christians - equating what is an event which is biblically "secondary" to being sealed with the Holy Spirit with "being saved" itself is wrong in my opinion and most charismatics would agree.

    That is the position of the "holiness" Pentecostals. While there is obviously an element of repentance involved in receiving Christ as Savior and Lord - achieving a certain degree of sanctification and holiness through repentence is not the way we get saved.

    To the contrary - any sanctification and holiness we are able to achieve is because we are already saved.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
  9. SBC

    SBC Well-Known Member

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    Matt 6:
    ...Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink...

    God Bless,
    SBC
     
  10. 1stcenturylady

    1stcenturylady Spirit-filled follower of Christ Supporter

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    This is exactly right, I love this post. But it is still important to note that the actual word is not 'practice.' Why? Because I could then say, "well, I don't practice fornication, so this one time won't matter." NO! We would say "I want to be pure and wait till we're married."
     
  11. Alexpro

    Alexpro New avitar picture. Supporter

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    Mathew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

    Exodus 20:8
    8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: 10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.


    Exodus 12:14
    And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.

    Exodus 12:17
    And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance for ever.

    Exodus 12:24
    And ye shall observe this thing for an ordinance to thee and to thy sons for ever.

    Exodus 31:17
    It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed

    I did research and found out it was a miss interpretation by urly Hebrew scholars forever in Hebrew means a generation or a time period. I could be wrong. I will do more research on the subject.

    I think your right it's an ordinance that should be kept thought a generation for ever. but some people will argue and say you must keep the Sabbath God said its forever.

    Thanks to the Holy Spirit he Guided me through that. A lot of people will argue with you about the law.

    I personally use to keep the Sabbath I think it's good for you. I felt more protected and more closer to God.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
  12. SBC

    SBC Well-Known Member

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    So if original sin is separation from God, requiring the Savior...

    And one becomes forgiven for being separated from God....

    And one become reconciled unto God...

    Then what is the mans Sin?

    God Bless,
    SBC
     
  13. SBC

    SBC Well-Known Member

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    It is amazing, how many people claim...
    They are born of God...and still sin.
    They are saved....and still sin.
    They are reconciled unto God....and still sin.
    They are a new man....and still sin.
    The old man is dead...and yet still sins.

    Why bother, if nothing CHANGED...weird.

    Ask what is their sin? Can't get one to say.

    Weird.

    God Bless,
    SBC
     
  14. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

    +2,515
    Non-Denom
    Single
    Hello Lily of Valleys.

    We are not talking about one or two obvious sins, rather, we are talking about the battery of sin that clouds our lives.

    For example, gluttony, selfishness, loving the world, not forgiving others, e.t.c.

    Gluttony is eating the wrong foods, and in such volume, fats, sugars, fast foods.

    Selfishness is the opposite of love, this afflicts most Christians.

    Loving the things of the world includes sport, fashion, real estate, e.t.c.

    It is the shear repetition of the sin in all it's sinful forms, that has shocked me the most.

    So where do we start if we are seriously going to stamp out sin?
     
  15. sdowney717

    sdowney717 Newbie

    +1,947
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    What about the Corinthian Christians who died eating the Lords supper in an unworthy manner?
    Paul says many were sick, and some had died, but it was the Lord's discipline over them so that, they would not perish along with the world.
    They the Lord judged, but not for spiritual death.

    27 Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks this cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy mannereats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body. 30 For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep. 31 For if we would judge ourselves, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we may not be condemned with the world.

    The principle is the same to all sin. God will not tolerate your sinning without a judgement, but it is not a judgement that condemns you along with the world.

    1 Peter 4:1-3New King James Version (NKJV)
    4 Therefore, since Christ suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves also with the same mind, for he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, 2 that he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh for the lusts of men, but for the will of God. 3 For we have spent enough of our past lifetime in doing the will of the Gentiles—when we walked in lewdness, lusts, drunkenness, revelries, drinking parties, and abominable idolatries.
     
  16. Marvin Knox

    Marvin Knox Senior Veteran

    +1,429
    Protestant
    Married
    "Weird" - perhaps. But none the less true to a person of faith.

    Like Adam and Eve before us -ours is not to fully understand before we believe and trust. Ours is to believe and trust even while we are a little hazy as to how these things can be.

    While it is a bit hard for us to comprehend at the present time, and the term might even be incorrect in some way - it seems that we have, at this time while in this bodyn two distinct "natures".

    The new nature (the new creation with the seed of God dwelling in him) simply cannot sin because he is united with God and God cannot sin.

    The old nature (the flesh) can do little else but sin.

    "No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God." 1 John 3:9

    "So now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me. For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not. For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want. But if I am doing the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me." Romans 7:17-20

    IMO - when a person insists that one must completely overcome sin in this life in order to be saved - that person is displaying a fundamental ignorance of the basics of salvation.
     
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  17. sdowney717

    sdowney717 Newbie

    +1,947
    Christian
    There is the old man which sins, and the new man which does not sin, no one abiding in Christ sins, that which abides in Christ is the new man and indeed can not sin as it is born of God.
    It is also why God will create a new earth and a new heaven, all the old sin tainted stuff is going to completely vanish, He will create all things new, for the believer we are new creations in Christ in the Spirit, but we wait for the redemption of the body at the resurrection. For now the body is dead because of sin, but the SPirit is life because of righteousness..and we are in the SPirit and not in the flesh from God's POV. Those who are in the flesh can not please God!


    Ephesians 4:17-26New King James Version (NKJV)

    The New Man
    17 This I say, therefore, and testify in the Lord, that you should no longer walk as the rest of the Gentiles walk, in the futility of their mind, 18 having their understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God, because of the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart; 19 who, being past feeling, have given themselves over to lewdness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.

    20 But you have not so learned Christ, 21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus: 22 that you put off, concerning your former conduct, the old man which grows corrupt according to the deceitful lusts, 23 and be renewed in the spirit of your mind, 24 and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness and holiness.

    Do Not Grieve the Spirit
    25 Therefore, putting away lying, “Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor,” for we are members of one another. 26 “Be angry, and do not sin”: do not let the sun go down on your wrath,

    Another example,

    2 Corinthians 5:16-18New King James Version (NKJV)
    16 Therefore, from now on, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer. 17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new. 18 Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation,
     
  18. SBC

    SBC Well-Known Member

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    Ya, sin doesn't disappear, it becomes COVERED, when one is Saved and Born again.

    That doesn't make sense.
    People do not overcome sin to Be Saved.
    People Become Saved to overcome sin.

    Fact- Jesus forgives and saves and it is permanent.

    Fact - Christ the Power of God, the Seed of God, births a mans new spirit. And the man becomes born of God, sins no more, by the Power of God, (not the man)
    1 John 3:9.

    God Bless,
    SBC
     
  19. SBC

    SBC Well-Known Member

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    Battery of sins? Like all the Mosiac laws?

    Gluttony....eating wrong foods, to much food,
    Is a sin? Scripture says to take no thought of what you eat.

    Loving things of the world...sports, fashion, real estate, is a sin? Scripture doesnt' say that. It says to love the Lord above all things.

    Where to start, if we are going to stamp out sin?

    We haven't the power to stamp out sin.
    Sin is overcome by Gods Power.

    God Bless,
    SBC
     
  20. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

    +1,648
    United States
    Charismatic
    Married
    .
    Then you do not identify yourself as a Christian, but a Sinner. :oldthumbsup:
     
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