This thread was an excellent experience. An atheist introduced a debatable topic on sin nature, politely requested sound argumentation against his opinion, and courageously disassembled fallacious reasoning. He worked hard to demonstrate logic for children and adults, and as a reward he got kicked out of the Christians Only section.
I've never been to a church or a house that was Christians Only.
It's like seeing a black person kicked off a white bus.
Reformationist, I'm talking to you. You have an attitude problem, and it shows. On page 2 you acted like you had never seen a logical debate before. You were asking dumb questions and making a bunch of smilies, but there's just one problem: you're 33 with a 12k post count. No one believes you're a stranger to argumentation.
You can fool kids who don't know any better, but not me. I can just imagine children thinking your behavior is acceptable, so I'm calling you out. Do you think you're funny? Cuz I'm laughing.
Kids,
Questions like Franklin's can be answered with reason. In apologetics, we use reason to tear up preconceived notions about God's nature and message. We refute (soundly argue against) biased statements like "Only an unjust God would flood the world."
And as Christians, we must always use reason like a careful scientist to refine our judgment and understanding of God and the Bible. If we do not strongly consider our doctrine for consistency, soundness, and validation in scripture, then we let our impressions shape our beliefs.
Calvinist "human depravity" is the theological term for the idea that people are born condemned to the lake of fire. I've never been fond of the idea that God condemns babies because that's a major insult to God's enormous character. Jesus Himself blows that possibility away in John 9:3 when He declares a blind man to have not sinned. Notice the Calvinists of Jesus's day asking the same dumb question to blame the poor blind man for his blindness, "Who sinned, the blind man or his parents?"
In the book of Jonah, God considers the children in the city He wants to destroy, so He sends Jonah to preach in that city. Does that sound like an all-condemning God to you, kids?
And if you don't understand why God flooded the world, read me loud and clear: the world was filled with violence. There were no kids. There were no schools. There were no video games or Disneylands. There was one big fight, and God saved the innocent before the storm...because He is a good God.
Jesus didn't come to save you from an enemy God out to destroy you. God is your friend. Jesus came healing and preaching God's word to convince stubborn people to change. He used the carrot-and-stick approach: the bad get punished; the good get rewarded.
And they murdered Him.
But before they murdered Him, Jesus cursed those hypocrites by letting everyone believe He intended to be their sacrifice. How'd Jesus do that? First Jesus understood the culture: violent, stupid people. Next Jesus understood the verbal limitations of violent, stupid people: they can't smell what the Rock is cooking. They were so dumb that they would've believed the Rock was cooking them dinner. Then Jesus spoke in a way that the sensitive hypocrites would interpret as vulgar in John 6; Jesus told everyone to eat His flesh and drink His blood, but in John 6:63 He made it clear: "...the words I speak to you..."
He meant that everyone would be saved if they followed his instruction to love good and hate evil. Just read John 18:37. Jesus didn't tell Pontius Pilate that He came to die; He said He came to preach the truth. Isn't that consistent with what God sent other prophets to do? And they didn't even have the power to heal people. Jesus confronted evil and rewarded good everywhere He went until the police nabbed Him.
And Jesus knew it was going to happen because stupid, violent people are very predictable. He knew His message would earn Him an execution, and He spread the word anyway.
And when the loonies interrogated Jesus, "Are you the Son of God mister smarty pants," Jesus sang a line from Enimem, "I am whatever you say I am. If I wasn't, then why would I say I am?"
The curse remains today because people continue to accept Jesus as their scapegoat instead of their leader. Why? Because when you have no responsibility, you have no reason to do good; you can sin all you want. That's what evil people want: no rules, no responsibility, equal wages, and no punishment.
And if you've read this far, then you probably understand that this is nothing like what you're taught about Jesus in church. Well guess what? Real life isn't like anything you're taught in school either.
Prepare for college, get your degree, get your presentation skills, don't be outspoken unless you're anonymous, and get to safety.
I'm done.